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Old 2015-05-11, 08:30   Link #101
itachi-san314
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Believe whatever you want to believe if it makes you feel better Itachi. I've said my piece.
OK. I'll believe that you think exactly what you said in your posts

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Originally Posted by hai_san View Post
So lets spin a tale from the useless "who is the strongest clan" forth.

I suppose Uchiha and Senju "were" the strongest clan in their "primetime". Atm the strongest clan in Konaha should be the the Hyuugas. The 3rd did said the Hyuuga are the strongest clan in Konoha, because Senjus are few and Uchihas was annihihated by Itachi... atm Naruto and Sasuke are the only one from the respective clans... they might be the strongest Ninja but they are not the strongest clan...
I think the point of this new generation is that the clan system in Konoha is going to be irrelevant soon and that they are all going to be completely intermixed within a couple generations. Naruto said himself that he would end the oppression of the Hyuuga. What better way than breeding it out?

If we're going complete history, then it was said countless times that the Senju and Uchiha were the strongest clans. And if we're going by prestige or royalty, I'd give it to the Hyuuga simply because of Kaguya's Byakugan.
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Old 2015-05-11, 08:39   Link #102
Avalon64
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lol yeah kinda what I already was stating before...you can discuss whose the strongest or are they equal or not but at the end of the day if your clan doesn't survive and you're reduced to a handful or even just a single member, kinda can't argue the point anymore, the world of ninjas is hand in hand with Darwinism, only the strong can survive and while you may argue the point that it was stated so and so was the strongest of all clans of all times...it matters not if they aren't around anymore right? While you can say well this clan only earned its strongest title by default...sadly that's how history shows tells it (I myself am a fan of reading Sengoku history) ALOT of clans earn the strongest title only to lose it all due to bad fortune such as the leader dying at a bad time and their successor sucked, it happens

And "sloppy writing" or not, it got Kishimoto 700 chapters, and a chance to write this mini series not to mention earn a long running anime series and spin offs...are we really in the position to judge his intentions or not? If so why are people still reading? Lol i say this in jest so don't take me seriously here

Oh and lets not forget said Genin Naruto Sexy No Jutsu'ed said Hokage, got past him and stole a "Forbidden Scroll" these things CAN happen lol

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Originally Posted by itachi-san314 View Post
I think the point of this new generation is that the clan system in Konoha is going to be irrelevant soon and that they are all going to be completely intermixed within a couple generations. Naruto said himself that he would end the oppression of the Hyuuga. What better way than breeding it out?

If we're going complete history, then it was said countless times that the Senju and Uchiha were the strongest clans. And if we're going by prestige or royalty, I'd give it to the Hyuuga simply because of Kaguya's Byakugan.
As I said Were the Strongest doesn't cut it if you don't ultimately survive the changing era...just saying...and I think you're giving Naruto WAY too much credit here, the oppressive Hyuuga? Um...sorry no they weren't...breeding out the Hyuuga? He might have had plans to change the Hyuuga but it was more of the Branch and the Main system he wasn't trying to remove their prestige or standing from Konoha or remove them you know, cause I am sure even Naruto knows at the end of the day, some of their rules might be dumb, but they are still a loyal clan to Konoha, sides given his own wife is from the Hyuuga would probably be more reason NOT to remove them, also falling in love with Hinata wasn't part of his so called plan for the Hyuuga it was something that happened that will work out for everyone in the end...

And remove the clan system? Um where are you getting this idea? Clans are ultimately like divisions in a military you don't remove them, especially more so since most clans are families and relations to each other, even clan members intermarry they'll just sort out where the children go based on their abilities, there is no reason to remove clans as a whole cause I am sure this is not the first time clans have intermarriage
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Old 2015-05-11, 10:25   Link #103
itachi-san314
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Originally Posted by Avalon64 View Post
the world of ninjas is hand in hand with Darwinism
if that is your criteria then the strongest clans are Uchiha and Namikaze/Uzumaki since both Sasuke and Naruto can wipe out entire clans just on their own.

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Oh and lets not forget said Genin Naruto Sexy No Jutsu'ed said Hokage, got past him and stole a "Forbidden Scroll" these things CAN happen lol
apples and oranges

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the oppressive Hyuuga? Um...sorry no they weren't...
I have to ask if you are serious as well here. Do you really think keeping slaves isn't oppressive?

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And remove the clan system? Um where are you getting this idea?
from the manga we are reading. tell me which clans the new generation of kids belong to please.
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Old 2015-05-11, 10:33   Link #104
Avalon64
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Originally Posted by itachi-san314 View Post
if that is your criteria then the strongest clans are Uchiha and Namikaze/Uzumaki since both Sasuke and Naruto can wipe out entire clans just on their own.

apples and oranges

I have to ask if you are serious as well here. Do you really think keeping slaves isn't oppressive?

from the manga we are reading. tell me which clans the new generation of kids belong to please.
An individual is not a clan, no matter how strong, even if he wipes out other clans the moment he dies so does the last of his clan...as a great man once said nothing is forever...while a group will live on longer...

Slaves? Seriously? Dude man, the Branch is the lesser house yes its a flawed system but it is NOT slavery, slavery would be beating them down, not letting have the right to talk, etc...the Hyuuga are jerks because of tradition no question but they are not "oppressive" as you are putting them

simple they belong to the clans of whomever they want them to belong to (I am NOT listing them out just for you)...but your point was the extreme the removal of clans altogether and I am saying that is simply not going to happen, a clan is still a family...so does my family end just because my daughter decides to marry another person's family? no it does not...this is simply history speaking
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Old 2015-05-11, 10:39   Link #105
itachi-san314
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An individual is not a clan, no matter how strong, even if he wipes out other clans the moment he dies so does the last of his clan...as a great man once said nothing is forever...while a group will live on longer...
if you reread your own quote here you should hopefully see that you are contradicting yourself

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Slaves? Seriously? Dude man, the Branch is the lesser house yes its a flawed system but it is NOT slavery, slavery would be beating them down, not letting have the right to talk, etc...the Hyuuga are jerks because of tradition no question but they are not "oppressive" as you are putting them
hmm. you don't seem to remember Part 1. Not much I can do to help you out there except suggesting you reread it. The branch family was indeed beaten down into submission if they opposed the main family. Do you even remember the caged bird metaphor?

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simple they belong to the clans of whomever they want them to belong to...but your point was the extreme the removal of clans altogether and I am saying that is simply not going to happen, a clan is still a family...so does my family end just because my daughter decides to marry another person's family? no it does not...
like I suggested you can't answer what clans they belong to because they don't belong to specific clans anymore. If Kishi wanted to keep the clan system going then he would have had Shikamaru marry a Nara, Hinata marry a Hyuuga, etc... I think you're completely missing this thematic point of the story.
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Old 2015-05-11, 10:42   Link #106
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so yeah you're right there is no conclusive evidence that says the four clans are equals but likewise it goes both ways, there is nothing saying that they weren't
Yes there is, its said more than once that the Senju and Uchiha were on top of the ninja world in regards to power, renown and prestige. There are two main flashbacks that cover the great ninja wars, and in both of them the Senju and Uchiha are described as the most famous and most powerful; not to mention comments about these clans from characters all throughout the manga supporting this.

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and lets be real sometimes fans need their own "fanfic" ideas to fill in the holes in their own heads to make more sense of the story as a whole every series has it, I mean lord knows how many fanfic ideas I need to make sense of the Megaman X series
What "plot-hole" does the clans being equal resolve?
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Old 2015-05-11, 10:45   Link #107
Avalon64
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if you reread your own quote here you should hopefully see that you are contradicting yourself

hmm. you don't seem to remember Part 1. Not much I can do to help you out there except suggesting you reread it. The branch family was indeed beaten down into submission if they opposed the main family. Do you even remember the caged bird metaphor?

like I suggested you can't answer what clans they belong to because they don't belong to specific clans anymore. If Kishi wanted to keep the clan system going then he would have had Shikamaru marry a Nara, Hinata marry a Hyuuga, etc... I think you're completely missing this thematic point of the story.
No you are not reading me, no matter what the individual does eventually his family name is going to end when his time comes, no matter how powerful Naruto is he's not immortal...I have no idea what you are claiming I am misinterpreting cause I'm pretty clear

There was great resentment because of the Branch house system but it is not slavery...ALOT of clans had servant classes amoung their clans, its nothing different from history, and coming at the Main Branch members with a "killer's aura" was the shown times they ever deploy the Caged Bird, you're making them sound like the Main Branch will do it if they spill milk or something...

and no I am NOT listing them out because I don't want to waste my time, clans have intermarriage it happens quite ALOT more then you think...clans are still a family so the children will belong to the clans their personal ability most resemble...so no, they are not removing clans and there is nothing to state that they are except what you are imagining

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Yes there is, its said more than once that the Senju and Uchiha were on top of the ninja world in regards to power, renown and prestige. There are two main flashbacks that cover the great ninja wars, and in both of them the Senju and Uchiha are described as the most famous and most powerful; not to mention comments about these clans from characters all throughout the manga supporting this.



What "plot-hole" does the clans being equal resolve?
Look I am not trying to prove or disprove you or anything, my original point is I am just saying let people think what they want, whats the point in trying to convince others whether the clans are equal or not? Nothing comes out of it
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Old 2015-05-11, 11:27   Link #108
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[...] I think you're giving Naruto WAY too much credit here, the oppressive Hyuuga? Um...sorry no they weren't... [...]
The clan is divided into a royal class and a servant class, where it is mandatory that the servant's heads are branded with the symbol of the clan's current heir, giving said heir control over them by being able to kill their brain cells via activating the seal. And, no matter how talented a servant member may be, he/she is condemned to the life of a servant, sans the superior training and resources of a main house member : /

Can you explain how this practice is not oppressive?
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Old 2015-05-11, 11:34   Link #109
Avalon64
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The clan is divided into a royal class and a servant class, where it is mandatory that the servant's heads are branded with the symbol of the clan's current heir, giving said heir control over them by being able to kill their brain cells via activating the seal. And, no matter how talented a servant member may be, he/she is condemned to the life of a servant, sans the superior training and resources of a main house member : /

Can you explain how this practice is not oppressive?
there is varying degrees of course its a system that can be abused and its extremely flawed, as is any Royal and Servant division in Clans but that doesn't make it slavery and while anyone has power it can be potentially abused but Itachi-san314 was stating that Naruto would end the oppression of the Hyuuga by "breeding them out" (essentially stating Naruto would remove the Hyuuga) which is not WHAT he said, he told Neiji that when he becomes Hokage he would change that system...I never stated the system was beneficial, just that even if the system WERE to change, I doubt they do away with the Main and Branch families just change the system that caused so much tension and hatred between them...

of course they could probably do away with the Bird Seal and work relations amoung the family better, recognize talent can come form both families, things like that but my problem was the choice of word "oppressive", they are assholes sure but they are not true tyrants, afterall you can criticize what they are doing the fact they still remain strong and Hiashi as much as I rag on him saw it was pointless to sacrifice his brother in a false appeasement (servant or not, REAL oppressors wouldn't care about the cannon fodder family or not) , true oppression would be that the Hyuuga would never see the need to change but yes I do admit it required the lesson of Part 1 Naruto to point out that what you're doing? REALLY causing tensions between both families and they were trying to change a little
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Old 2015-05-11, 12:06   Link #110
itachi-san314
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No you are not reading me, no matter what the individual does eventually his family name is going to end when his time comes, no matter how powerful Naruto is he's not immortal...I have no idea what you are claiming I am misinterpreting cause I'm pretty clear
You're directly refuting a point you make later in your post about the new generation still being members of specific clans. Do you consider Naruto's children as part of his clan or not? What is his clan even? Note that I don't consider any of this a clan and I think you are reaching by saying these kids somehow belong to one clan now even though they have completely mixed heritages.

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There was great resentment because of the Branch house system but it is not slavery...ALOT of clans had servant classes amoung their clans, its nothing different from history
they are born into servitude, lesser status, and are expected to die for the main branch... they are even given a curse seal to ensure they stay in line. What is your definition of slavery? try looking it up in the dictionary

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and no I am NOT listing them out because I don't want to waste my time
the reason is because you can't do it. you obviously have enough time to write lengthy posts so why not name a couple clans while you're at it?

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clans have intermarriage it happens quite ALOT more then you think...clans are still a family so the children will belong to the clans their personal ability most resemble...
can you site a source for this?

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Originally Posted by Avalon64 View Post
Itachi-san314 was stating that Naruto would end the oppression of the Hyuuga by "breeding them out" (essentially stating Naruto would remove the Hyuuga) which is not WHAT he said, he told Neiji that when he becomes Hokage he would change that system...
you're misquoting me. if you look at my post that you are referencing, I said 'breeding them out' in the same thought as all the clans eventually just being one unified Konoha. I could have just as easily mentioned the Nara or Akamichi but I chose Hyuuga since they are the only clan in Konoha that Naruto has a major problem with.

I do hope Naruto does something politically to quickly end the oppression of the Hyuuga, but my point is that in a couple generations it won't matter since there will be so much inter-marriage between clans.
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Old 2015-05-11, 12:24   Link #111
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You're directly refuting a point you make later in your post about the new generation still being members of specific clans. Do you consider Naruto's children as part of his clan or not? What is his clan even? Note that I don't consider any of this a clan and I think you are reaching by saying these kids somehow belong to one clan now even though they have completely mixed heritages.

they are born into servitude, lesser status, and are expected to die for the main branch... they are even given a curse seal to ensure they stay in line. What is your definition of slavery? try looking it up in the dictionary

the reason is because you can't do it. you obviously have enough time to write lengthy posts so why not name a couple clans while you're at it?

can you site a source for this?

you're misquoting me. if you look at my post that you are referencing, I said 'breeding them out' in the same thought as all the clans eventually just being one unified Konoha. I could have just as easily mentioned the Nara or Akamichi but I chose Hyuuga since they are the only clan in Konoha that Naruto has a major problem with.

I do hope Naruto does something politically to quickly end the oppression of the Hyuuga, but my point is that in a couple generations it won't matter since there will be so much inter-marriage between clans.
And YOU are mixing up two TOTALLY different points I am making an individual cannot be a powerful clan cause he's not a clan that has nothing to do with my later points of the new generation stop mixing them up together

Like I said I didn't want to write it out for you, cause you're probably not even going to take me seriously or find a way to throw it back at me saying I'm wrong no matter how I say it, but fine Shikadai the Naru, Chou Chou the Akimeichi, Inoichi the Yamanaka cause I don't think Sai has a family...they stated numerous time Boruto is the Hyuuga's prodigy and so on so forth, what you are stating is impossible they'll never intermarry that many times to remove clan...cause we don't see them but a whole clan means there's alot of DIFFERENT people, and because clans are family and they will always be different clans

Yes no matter how many times you throw it in my face I will not call it slavery, its wrong, its flawed yes, but slavery would indicate the Main Branch members would use that curse seal at a drop of a hat to punish the Branch members, like I said a grown man inflicting a KILLING aura at a KID just for being a heiress I don't consider that a minor offense, but perhaps that can change given events after the war and hopefully with Hinata being the head

Hashirama Senju and Mito Uzumaki...there intermarriage, telling you it happens, and from Minato and Kushina, Naruto had alot of Kushina's blood hence he could host Kurama, that's basically what I meant...if the kid has the ability of the parents clan then they'll fit in that clan I don't see how you can say just because they are marrying outside of their clans suddenly that aspect of different clans with different abilities will ever change, bloodlines are removed because usually clans are actively hunted and killed not because of intermarriage cause for THAT to work then the next breed of kids must be born completely normal with no powers, cause if they have ANY power of their parent, they will keep the bloodline going
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Old 2015-05-11, 12:30   Link #112
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And "sloppy writing" or not, it got Kishimoto 700 chapters, and a chance to write this mini series not to mention earn a long running anime series and spin offs...are we really in the position to judge his intentions or not?
What got him 700+ chapters is that readers liked his manga despite the bad writing, not because of it. That in itself has its merits, but it's a separate issue. And we definitely are in a position to judge his intentions. Well, maybe not "we" because we're not the one who pay for it, but the Japanese audience who does pay for it is in a position to criticize it if they want to.

That been said, after 700+ chapters of sloppy writing, I do think it's kinda meaningless to complain now.

Let's just take things as they come.
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Old 2015-05-11, 12:35   Link #113
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And "sloppy writing" or not, it got Kishimoto 700 chapters, and a chance to write this mini series not to mention earn a long running anime series and spin offs...are we really in the position to judge his intentions or not?
I don't really get what you're trying to say. We are in no position to criticize Naruto? Bashing and hating is, of course, stupid but all of us are allowed to give our constructive criticism. Kishimoto's intentions are quite clear, he has a great cash-cow and he will milk it. This is the same logic Anime adaptation follows.

Naruto's popularity decreased a lot in Japan in the last 5 years, as well as on the internet. And I am certain that the people who remained as fans are those who have been following this series for a long time.
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Old 2015-05-11, 12:40   Link #114
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I don't really get what you're trying to say. We are in no position to criticize Naruto? Bashing and hating is, of course, stupid but all of us are allowed to give our constructive criticism. Kishimoto's intentions are quite clear, he has a great cash-cow and he will milk it. This is the same logic Anime adaptation follows.

Naruto's popularity decreased a lot in Japan in the last 5 years, as well as on the internet. And I am certain that the people who remained as fans are those who have been following this series for a long time.
that's why I said in that post I wrote "I say this in jest"...meant I was joking around about the subject
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Old 2015-05-11, 12:41   Link #115
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@Avalon64

Agree to disagree on what a slave is I guess... keep in mind your original point was that the Hyuuga aren't even oppressive.

I'm not saying everyone will inter-marry into one clan. It would be one village. What happens in the next generation when a Hyuuga/Uzumaki/Namikaze marries an Akamichi/whatever or whatever 4-6 clan hybrid ninjas are born next? When does the line blur enough for you? I'm not saying the clans are gone right now. I'm saying that it will happen within a couple generations.

Clans come and go all the time. It all started from one person anyway so it's not like they always existed. Something that hasn't always been there can just as easily be gone one day. If you take a step back and look at the unification theme of the manga you will see my point. It's evident in the villages all wearing the same headband during the war. Forming and keeping clans is the opposite of that ideology.
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Old 2015-05-11, 12:49   Link #116
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Yes as I said true oppression is when you tell yourself, yes we have this system and we're hated for it but lets not change it...recognizing there is a problem and trying to do something different is not oppression yes it required a trigger to get the ball rolling but I have not been presented that the Main Branch has abused the system yes they made use of it and some Branch members hate their position for it but see the way I see it you can't have a WHOLE family of people hating the system otherwise eventually there would have been rebellion, which to me tells me there were members who were ready to lay down their lives for the good of Konoha

Like I said it was never once presented in the story proper that marrying other clans presented the problem of clan extinction only when people FEARED the clan enough to hunt them down I am certain clans have measures to ensure their family and skills will live on like I said the true problem will only come when kids start being born with no powers of ninjitsu whatsoever

And yes I am aware of the fact they come from the same village it is not going to change the need for a ninja's individual skill, there will be times sending a bug user will be useful or needing a soul telepath to read minds, or a shadow user to mimic the enemy, the reason they are so unified is because the different clans pool their unique talents to keep Konoha alive and well
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Old 2015-05-11, 12:53   Link #117
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What got him 700+ chapters is that readers liked his manga despite the bad writing, not because of it. That in itself has its merits, but it's a separate issue. And we definitely are in a position to judge his intentions. Well, maybe not "we" because we're not the one who pay for it, but the Japanese audience who does pay for it is in a position to criticize it if they want to.
I think part one was great, sure had some flaws, but overall was really enjoyable. Part two also had some great moments, e.g. Pain invasion and the circle of hate thematic. But overall it was far inferior to part one. I guess I followed it to the end to see in what kind of train wreck it ends. Now looking back at the first fight, Zabuza and Haku, to the boss fight, a dimension shifting rabbit goddess, I guess I wasn't disappointed, or was I?

Because I'm want to see the world burn:
The last canon thing about the Senju was their domination over Konoha and how the once proud Uchiha became their lap dog. Now the Hyuuga became the new Uchiha in Konoha. Does this mean they are the new Senju's lap dogs? *runs away*
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Old 2015-05-11, 13:48   Link #118
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Y'now when it comes to the debate on the power of each clan, i feel like none of this was helped by Kishi's narrative writing. I mean in the beginning in seemed like the Uchiha and the Hyuuga were the top 2 clans in the village because of their history and prominance... but then out of nowhere late into part 2, kishi introduces the Senju clan which was apparently the equal of the uchiha clan and placed a HEAVY focus on those two despite the complete lack of ninjas carrying on the Senju name. And then we got the uzumaki clan tacked on later... But the focus remained heavily on the Senju and the uchiha; not only were they paraded around as the most important founding members of kohona, but the entire narrative seemed revolved around the legacy of those two clans.

Really if kishi wanted all these clans to be equally important he should have found time for them. Heck, He could have easily played up the on the importance of the Hyuuga clan by simply adding Hinata to the story and making her an important part of the narrative; it wouldn't have been hard to do considering Kaguya had the Byakugan, and Naruto's team was constantly in need of extra team members, a hole which hinata could of filled... it would have also given Hinata and naruto enough panel time together for their ship to actually work well, instead of being tacked on at the very end as an after thought.

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If Kishi wanted to keep the clan system going then he would have had Shikamaru marry a Nara, Hinata marry a Hyuuga, etc... I think you're completely missing this thematic point of the story.
Not really. That sort of internal marriage is only necessary if you want to maintain bloodline purity (which was the case for the Hyuuga), it is however not needed for maintaining a clan system. When it comes to clans/tribes/noble families and what not, intermarriage would happen all the time. The way the clan name would be preserved however is that one of the partner's would drop their family name and thus marry into the other family... That's more or less how it worked amongst noble families in real life. Usually the females would drop their name and marry into another family while their husband kept the family name alive; the exception being when their was no males to keep the family name alive. For instance, when Temari married Shikimaru and moved to Kohona, she left her old ties behind and became a member of the nara clan. That is how the nara clan would be preserved... Heck since Naruto took on the Uzimaki name, you could even claim that Minato became part of the uzumaki clan when he married his mother.

Interestingly enough, when you look at it, with most of the pairings, there is no conflict over clans. Most of those who are part of a clan either married someone with no surname (temari, Karui, and sai) or someone whose family isn't really a clan like Sakura. This could be kishi's way of trying to preserve the clan structure


However, i'm not sure Kishi actually cares or put that much thought into it... Naruto and Hinata for instance should have caused some conflict. For a clan system to remain, Naruto would either have to give up his uzimaki name, or Hinata would have to give up her hyuuga name. Can't really have both; one must leave their family clan to join the other clan... i bring this up because in Book of Thunder(the side story about Kiba and his dog), its mentioned that Hinata is indeed heiress to the Hyuuga clan. This does not make much sense as it causes all kinds of clan confusion. Is Boruto an uzumaki or a hyuuga? If Hinata kept her place as heiress of the clan, would that make Boruto UZUMAKI the next heir of the HYUUGA clan? If Kishi wants Naruto to keep his Uzumaki clan alive AND wants Hinata to be the hyuga heiress then he really is ignoring all the family clan politics involved... Really it would be simpler if he had Hinata marry into the uzumaki's and just have Hanabi take the heiress title.
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Old 2015-05-11, 14:08   Link #119
Avalon64
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Originally Posted by Slayerx View Post
Y'now when it comes to the debate on the power of each clan, i feel like none of this was helped by Kishi's narrative writing. I mean in the beginning in seemed like the Uchiha and the Hyuuga were the top 2 clans in the village because of their history and prominance... but then out of nowhere late into part 2, kishi introduces the Senju clan which was apparently the equal of the uchiha clan and placed a HEAVY focus on those two despite the complete lack of ninjas carrying on the Senju name. And then we got the uzumaki clan tacked on later... But the focus remained heavily on the Senju and the uchiha; not only were they paraded around as the most important founding members of kohona, but the entire narrative seemed revolved around the legacy of those two clans.

Really if kishi wanted all these clans to be equally important he should have found time for them. Heck, He could have easily played up the on the importance of the Hyuuga clan by simply adding Hinata to the story and making her an important part of the narrative; it wouldn't have been hard to do considering Kaguya had the Byakugan, and Naruto's team was constantly in need of extra team members, a hole which hinata could of filled... it would have also given Hinata and naruto enough panel time together for their ship to actually work well, instead of being tacked on at the very end as an after thought.



Not really. That sort of intermarriage is only necessary if you want to maintain bloodline purity (which was the case for the Hyuuga), it is however not needed for maintaining a clan system. When it comes to clans/tribes/noble families and what not, intermarriage would happen all the time. The way the clan name would be preserved however is that one of the partner's would drop their family name and thus marry into the other family... That's more or less how it worked amongst noble families in real life. Usually the females would drop their name and marry into another family while their husband kept the family name alive; the exception being when their was no males to keep the family name alive. For instance, when Temari married Shikimaru and moved to Kohona, she left her old ties behind and became a member of the nara clan. That is how the nara clan would be preserved... Heck since Naruto took on the Uzimaki name, you could even claim that Minato became part of the uzumaki clan when he married his mother.

Interestingly enough, when you look at it, with most of the pairings, there is no conflict over clans. Most of those who are part of a clan either married someone with no surname (temari, Karui, and sai) or someone whose family isn't really a clan like Sakura. This could be kishi's way of trying to preserve the clan structure


However, i'm not sure Kishi actually cares or put that much thought into it... Naruto and Hinata for instance should have caused some conflict. For a clan system to remain, Naruto would either have to give up his uzimaki name, or Hinata would have to give up her hyuuga name. Can't really have both; one must leave their family clan to join the other clan... i bring this up because in Book of Thunder(the side story about Kiba and his dog), its mentioned that Hinata is indeed heiress to the Hyuuga clan. This does not make much sense as it causes all kinds of clan confusion. Is Boruto an uzumaki or a hyuuga? If Hinata kept her place as heiress of the clan, would that make Boruto UZUMAKI the next heir of the HYUUGA clan? If Kishi wants Naruto to keep his Uzumaki clan alive AND wants Hinata to be the hyuga heiress then he really is ignoring all the family clan politics involved... Really it would be simpler if he had Hinata marry into the uzumaki's and just have Hanabi take the heiress title.
Indeed there was huge wasted potential by not exploring the Hyuuga clan especially after the initial build of them...woudl have definitely moved Hinata's role and made her more prominent to the story (now I am not suggesting she replace Sakura mind you jsut make her more important to the story in the grand scheme), which I am sure that was something all her fans would have wanted, her character to have grown with the story...but oh well, I mean I guess ultimately I am thankful Hinata got the consideration she did, her big scenes still being some of my favourite I mean she could have easily disappeared anywhere in the whole manga and became an after thought character...

Anyway knowing Naruto I don't think he'd mind too much about Bolt using the Hyuuga name, afterall he married Hinata, he has the utmost respect for Neiji the one who gave his life to ensure their union, yeah I don't he'd mind if there is any problems I am sure it can be all worked out...you know unless the Hyuuga did something stupid and MADE it a problem for Naruto somehow lol

while I can see the fact keeping Hanabi the Heiress would seamlessly iron out political problems...from a narrative standpoint its kinda unfair to Hinata, she worked so hard gave up so much, won the man she loved and while that is good enough for some of her fans...I think the majority of her fans wish to see her story come full circle and reclaim her Birthright again and show that she worked for it all...not to mention Hanabi only seemed to be there to pose the initial problem for Hinata the whole lost her birthright to her younger sister, given she NEVER appeared again in canon in the manga until the Last movie seems that every sign was pointing that Hinata would by the Heiress to the Clan as being her conclusion, the fact Boruto is that successor only adds to that

Heh I feel Boruto is destined for greatness...lol
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Old 2015-05-11, 15:51   Link #120
itachi-san314
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Originally Posted by Slayerx View Post
Not really. That sort of internal marriage is only necessary if you want to maintain bloodline purity (which was the case for the Hyuuga), it is however not needed for maintaining a clan system. When it comes to clans/tribes/noble families and what not, intermarriage would happen all the time.
Not just the Hyuuga by a long shot. That tradition is for pretty much any clan with a secret ability. Sure, inter-marriage happened from time to time, but the villages are only a few generations old. I find it hard to believe that there was a lot of inter-marriage back when the clans were isolated and essentially fought for themselves. I also find it hard to believe that that tradition of keeping within one's own clan was let go of that quickly. Living together in a village is one thing, but inter-marriage is another step to that. Like you said, the Hyuuga (and Uchiha) seemed to still be very isolated in Konoha and inbred essentially. Any clan with a Kekkai genkai was mostly like that. And then the villages as a whole kind of absorbed all the random ninja whose clans were mostly extinct.

Like you said though, the writing did get sloppy so it's kind of hard to follow exactly what the clan structures are since I don't think Kishi even knows. Especially when it comes to the Senju. That clan history is just a mess.
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