Macross Frontier (Macross 25) general discussion [No Spoilers]

[Cadorna]

Originally Posted by Onizuka-GTO

Macross does that.It CHANGES you, comrade.

I personally blame protodevils and Macross 7, its all that flying and speaker podding.

*grumble while he sings to some sunflowers*

jajajaja you are my priest

[ThoHell]

GTO....religious...devotion....TO THE SERIES? LOL, too much. Hey I said I liked the first episode of Frontier. Just not going to watch the older ones because I can't stand old animation. Sorry but not religious devotion here!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Westlo]

At least watch Plus! It may be 14 years old (after typing that out I can't believe it's 14 years old....) but it still very impressive to look at since it was way ahead of its time.

[ahmad]

The old animation does not bother me. If the characters and story is good, you will want to keep watching the show regardless. And as you watch, you will get used to it.
I am trying to find the original show now, I feel like watching the very first macross .

[Onizuka-GTO]

Originally Posted by Westlo

At least watch Plus! It may be 14 years old (after typing that out I can't believe it's 14 years old....) but it still very impressive to look at since it was way ahead of its time.

heh. i still remember watching it, when i was a 12-13, my cousin had it on VHS, it was a fansubbed (something i realised now) and this was just after i watched Venus Wars. I knew it was Macross, yet it was so different! (no green blood! or the "cartoon" like animation)

it was just so...so..gorgeous... Macross plus really stands the test of time, a bit like Wings of Hommenise.

Glad i got the Directors Cut version box set, that had all the individual OVA's and the full movie. Personally i liked the Guld death in the OVA, more open ended. But at the same time, still like the movie version, if only because of Guld's sheer

GARLOCK-SACRIFICE-FOR-LOVE-AND-COMRADESHIP!!!

Macross banzai!

[SuperKnuckles]

Speaking about Gundam and its apparent pessimism, I somewhat disagree. Sure, Tomino went through his depressions and help kill off a healthy number of its characters, but ultimately they were able to mend together in the end. That's sort of the entire theme of Gundam shows:

-Major, major, space war that has already decimated millions or even billions of people
-A crucial struggle involving a small group of elite/lucky pilots
-Everything pans out in the end.

(Maybe with the exception of 'pans out in the end', Macross isn't all too different either)

With Macross, it still feels like a feeler in terms of what humanity has to go through and even by the time of Frontier, I doubt they were able to fully reconcile with all of the Zentraedi no less how they're going to lead the future of their species.

The message of hope is there by the way the Macross crews struggle through, but both Gundam and Macross does have their own spin on the ideal of hope.

[Onizuka-GTO]

Originally Posted by SuperKnuckles

Speaking about Gundam and its apparent pessimism, I somewhat disagree. Sure, Tomino went through his depressions and help kill off a healthy number of its characters, but ultimately they were able to mend together in the end. That's sort of the entire theme of Gundam shows:

-Major, major, space war that has already decimated millions or even billions of people
-A crucial struggle involving a small group of elite/lucky pilots
-Everything pans out in the end.

(Maybe with the exception of 'pans out in the end', Macross isn't all too different either)

With Macross, it still feels like a feeler in terms of what humanity has to go through and even by the time of Frontier, I doubt they were able to fully reconcile with all of the Zentraedi no less how they're going to lead the future of their species.

The message of hope is there by the way the Macross crews struggle through, but both Gundam and Macross does have their own spin on the ideal of hope.

that is true, the remains of the Supervisor Army still lurks in the Galaxy, at the start of Macross Plus, we see the "rebels" those Zentradi's that initially joined with the humans after Space War I, but became dissatisfied in the post war re-construction became pirates, rebels who hung around the inhabitants of UN Federation colony outposts and worlds.

its never plain sailing, and yes i can agree that in gundam it does at the end have the same ending theme in that despite it all, human morality and strength will prevail.

But the sheer homogeneous of the conflict of human upon human really does put a more darker atmosphere on the whole series.

Macross on the other hand, simply shift the theme between two different specie thus making the appearance of a united front. At leased Macross gives the illusion that ALL humans can put aside there differences for survival.

While Gundam seems to determined to show that only a small number of humans are willing to settle their differences and unite against even larger number of humans who cannot do that, and wish to destroy humanity.

I suppose the difference in threats are the same,

But it is more VISUALLY impressive seeing 2 BILLION Zentradi against one "little" gunship with less then a billion humans aboard.

[SuperKnuckles]

I think that difference is what makes them unique onto themselves. Macross battles has always had that space epic feel while Gundam shows are mostly about guerrilla tactics (even if it involves the lives of billions in the process) and even boils down to one on one battles in the very end.

[Westlo]

Frontier AD with Triangler playing, surprised no one posted this yet or did I miss it?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=x5svQhg4pVk (CM1 from the 8th)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=zBt3nQ-PuI4 (CM2 from the 14th)

Need to listen to the OP to make a proper judgment but it sounds alright from that snippet. Also I missed like 20 pages of this thread but is it common knowledge that May Nakabayashi is singing all the Sheryl songs?

[Onizuka-GTO]

eh? dunno.

but we do know the great singer Maaya Sakamoto is singing for this series and even better she'll be back together with Yoko Kanno, the legendary anime and all round music composer.

I swear kanno music makes good anime, EPIC.

just like Ghost in the Shell series

[Shiroth]

Originally Posted by Onizuka-GTO

I swear kanno music makes good anime, EPIC.

just like Ghost in the Shell series

Escaflowne was already a brilliant series, though her music adds some much more enjoyment to the series. All the more epic.

[Onizuka-GTO]

Oh certainly, I don't think Macross Plus would of lived up to the hype of being the first auccessful sequel, especially after the sad reception of Macross II. (which i liked, for the diffferent non-military perspective you know)

Yoko Kanno, really rocketed the Macross series, it what gave the momentum to drive forward all the quality Macross manga that M7 was made into a aniamtion, although while it was good from a causal point of view, i would of prefer Macross Trash to be animated as well.

that is one neglected set of manga that should be on the list, in all this retcon they seem to pull out now and again.

[SuperKnuckles]

Originally Posted by Onizuka-GTO

eh? dunno.

but we do know the great singer Maaya Sakamoto is singing for this series and even better she'll be back together with Yoko Kanno, the legendary anime and all round music composer.

I swear kanno music makes good anime, EPIC.

just like Ghost in the Shell series

As good as Kanno is, I disagree that she really added all that much to the Macross lore in itself. I was perfectly fine with the oldschool Macross tunes to begin with.

Also, GiTS was just way too tame and laid back so the infusion of great music really helped things with that particular anime (though I still think GiTS is a bundle of techno/politico babble with minuscule action and LOTS of posturing). On the other hand, I don't think Macross really NEEDed the background music to keep it going. It was strong as is. It just gets a new touch with Kanno. Also, there's tons of other anime BGM music composers who would've been just as good if not better than Kanno at a space epic such as Naoki Sato (Heroic Age, Eureka 7).

[Westlo]

I was utterly underwhelmed by Naoki Sato's score for Heroic Age, by far my biggest anime music related disappointed of 2007 along with Yoko Kanno's Darker Than Black score.

[aardvark]

I thought her Darker Than Black score was very good. There were some incredible moments in the music and how it connected with the show. It truly captured whatever the show was portraying at any moment and the overall feel.

Aquarion was just Escaflowne 2.0. She might as well have composed the music for any other show too, it was totally disconnected from the majority of Aquarion.

[SuperKnuckles]

Originally Posted by Westlo

I was utterly underwhelmed by Naoki Sato's score for Heroic Age, by far my biggest anime music related disappointed of 2007 along with Yoko Kanno's Darker Than Black score.

I disagree with both, but by far, pretty vehemently with Heroic Age.

Underwhelmed? Do we have the same types of ears here?

As for Darker than Black, I thought it was satisfactory but definitely not as melodic and memorable as some of her earlier works.

As for Naoki Sato, I haven't heard ONE soundtrack that was ever disappointing. Not even close.

[Shiroth]

Originally Posted by Westlo

I was utterly underwhelmed by Naoki Sato's score for Heroic Age, by far my biggest anime music related disappointed of 2007 along with Yoko Kanno's Darker Than Black score.

I can understand why you would say something along those lines regarding Kanno's DtB score, though not for one minute can i understand why you would say such things about Sato's Heroic Age score. Not only was it my favorite score from last year (along with Toward the Terra), it's quite possibly the best score i've heard from the man. There are a good number of powerful tracks in that score, the main one for me being the titled track Heroic Age.

I dunno, hearing you say that about the score makes me doubt something.

As for Kanno's DtB score, it was everything i expected it to be --- i guess the people that are not fans of it are the ones who wanted more from Kanno like you always would. My only complaint about the score is the fact that a good half of the score did not appear in the first soundtrack.

[Westlo]

Well I've only listened to the first ost for Darker Than Black as well as watching the first 14 episodes (what can I say, Spring 07 was stacked and Summer was surprisingly good). I guess the second half/ost can improve a lot, it's happened before like with Sahashi Toshihiko Gundam SEED score which went from avg to excellent from the midpoint/OST1 to end/ost3. The track I enjoyed the most from DtB which was generally played while they were watching the "stars" fall was missing from the OST, I believe it was played for the first time in episode 5 and wanted that track, was very disappointed it wasn't on the first ost.

I've only heard 4 Naoki Sato scores those being X TV, Eureka Seven, Heroic Age and Moyashimon, swap X and E7 around and that's the order I would rank them in. I think you guys are seeing my saying Heroic Age was a disappointment and thinking I didn't like it, that's not true. It's just X and E7 I was expecting big things from Sato and instead of getting a top 5 for the year score I got something that was somewhere in the 11-20 range.

The HA score complimented the show nicely (I really need to watch 26 sometime soon) but apart from what seems to be the main theme of the show nothing really stood out to me. Nothing compared to X's Sadame, no battle theme got me as pumped as E7's The End, I actually haven't downloaded the osts so this is just based off the use of music in the show.

Originally Posted by SuperKnuckles

Underwhelmed? Do we have the same types of ears here?

You tell me. My fav score from 06 is Simoun, my fav 3 scores from 2005 are Noein, Aquarion and Eureka Seven, my fav 3 Kanno works are Macross Plus, Escaflowne and Brain Powered. My fav Minmay song from the tv series is Watashi no kare wa pilot (My Boyfriend is a Pilot) and I consider Ai Oboete Imasuka (Do You Remember Love?) to be one of the greatest insert songs used in anime period.

[SuperKnuckles]

Toshihiko was always amazing in Seed. People can bash Seed all they want, but not its all around outstanding OST.

To me, Naoki's better works actually came from Precure. Yes, that Pretty Cure. Some of his tracks are just filled with a natural sense of wonderment (like some of the Heroic Age ones). Then there are those delicious sentimental tracks in Precure as well as the rousing action scores. Also, I think some of the best Heroic Age tracks were in the second OST where they fully feature all the vocals that was featured in the few Golden Tribe montage scenes in the show (only a few times they ever used that for dramatic effect). You mentioned X TV and I think X TV had some of the best all around OSTs around. I actually rate Naoki Sato a bit above Yoko Kanno personally, since he seems to show more effective range while Kanno sometimes hits and misses here and there, IMO. Though when she does hit, it's usually incredible.

Then there's the relatively newcomer in anime music in Noriyuki Asakura (mostly did videogame stuff, now does the awesome Major OSTs), Yuki Kajiura (Mai Hime/Otome), Kou Otani (Outlaw Star, Gundam Wing) and others.

As for Kanno, I'd say her best stuff were in some of her more obscure stuff including Napple Tale and Turn A Gundam. I already think the Macross Frontier theme is engraved into my head so I think she already did a good job on it.

[Shiroth]

Originally Posted by Westlo

was very disappointed it wasn't on the first ost.

Like i said before, i was rather disappointed with how much material was missing out from the soundtrack release, and still no information regarding a second soundtrack release. There's easily enough material for one o happen. Kanno has let me down this time.

Originally Posted by Westlo

I actually haven't downloaded the osts so this is just based off the use of music in the show.

I believe that if you purchase the two soundtracks and have a good listen, you'll see the mistakes that you've made from saying what you have done. There's some beautiful pieces of music within the two soundtracks, but my favorite shall always be the main theme.

Originally Posted by SuperKnuckles

Toshihiko was always amazing in Seed. People can bash Seed all they want, but not its all around outstanding OST.

The absolute truth. Toshihiko SEED score is pretty breath taking. You have your perfect epic battle themes, along with some emotional tracks that really make you feel for Kira and what is happening to him as a character. One of my favorite scores, for sure.

Originally Posted by SuperKnuckles

As for Kanno, I'd say her best stuff were in some of her more obscure stuff including Napple Tale and Turn A Gundam. I already think the Macross Frontier theme is engraved into my head so I think she already did a good job on it.

Funny enough, Kanno's Turn A Gundam score is not only my favorite work by her, it's pretty much my favorite score of all time. Just like the series, and how much it means to me.

Anyway that's enough off-topic i believe. I'm very much looking forward to hearing more of Kanno's work for Frontier. I don't think it's going to be the type of score that'll reach such a high place like her Macross Plus work, though i'd love to be proven wrong. Can't wait.