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View Poll Results: Code Geass R2 - Episode 25 Rating | |||
Perfect 10 | 791 | 63.74% | |
9 out of 10 : Excellent | 163 | 13.13% | |
8 out of 10 : Very Good | 95 | 7.66% | |
7 out of 10 : Good | 67 | 5.40% | |
6 out of 10 : Average | 17 | 1.37% | |
5 out of 10 : Below Average | 18 | 1.45% | |
4 out of 10 : Poor | 7 | 0.56% | |
3 out of 10 : Bad | 7 | 0.56% | |
2 out of 10 : Very Bad | 4 | 0.32% | |
1 out of 10 : Painful | 72 | 5.80% | |
Voters: 1241. You may not vote on this poll |
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2011-07-13, 14:04 | Link #5761 | |||||||||
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Join Date: Dec 2008
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Moreover, he could be logically resurrected, like in the middle of the fanfic Dirge of Daedalus. Last edited by azul120; 2011-07-13 at 14:15. |
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2011-07-13, 14:58 | Link #5762 | |
Shameless Fangirl
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Germany
Age: 33
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Zero Requiem was not perfect by any means, but I feel it was not portrayed as something (mainly) bad or a sign that Lelouch was unstable in the show. If anything, he seemed to have overcome a lot of his issues towards the end, though that still doesn't make him infallible.
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2011-07-13, 22:32 | Link #5763 | ||||||||||
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2009
Location: classified
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I think there is plenty of romantic development between Kallen and Lelouch to imply that he at least is interested in her sexually. Quote:
He was obsessed with her. Heck he even went so far as to say he was going to chop her up with a chainsaw so he could smuggle her out of Japan. That's not love Tactics and that's obvious. Lelouch never treats her that way in either S1 or R2 and in fact in the episode "Cheering Mao" there is another important exchange between CC and Lelouch. It's at the end of the episode at 21:05 (using the official Bandai ENT Eng Sub): In that exchange Lelouch promises her "I'll try to fulfill both your wish and my own" at 21:56. After that CC asks him directly "Is this you comforting me? Taking pity? Or is it...obsession?" Her only worry at that moment is Lelouch becoming obsessed with her. After this is when Lelouch says "It's a contract. This time from me to you." CC puts her hand out and says "Very well. I accept your contract," and then they take hold of each other's hands. After that the episode ends. Now, what does ep 15 of S1 have in common with ep 15 of R2, and by extension ep 25 of R2. Simple. In ep 15 of S1 Lelouch vows to fulfill CC's wish. In ep 15 of R2 Lelouch learns her true wish, to be loved as stated at the end of the episode. And in ep 25 CC, in the back of the cart, says, "the Power of kings brings isolation...that's not quite right is it Lelouch?" If you follow the events logically it is possible to come to the conclusion that Lelouch is alive. It was Okouchi that ended any possibility of Lelouch being alive at the end of ep 25 of R2, not the anime itself. Quote:
That's called metaphor and it was very clear what Okouchi and Taniguichi were saying in the cave scene. Remember, Lelouch is the only person that knows CC's true name. We, the viewers, aren't even told, so it's a secret that only they share. Quote:
Because I went through Turn 13 again and didn't find it. Although, eps 13, 14, and 15 of S1 show firmly Lelouch's love for Shirley. Quote:
However, there are many people who do not agree. While I have no problem with Lelouch dying, I found the entire Zero Requiem to be poorly executed. Since he died, and thus escaped punishment in my opinion, he took the easy way out (suicide) and that cheapened the character immensely making him look like a coward in my eyes. Quote:
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Suzaku tell's Lelouch to "become a hero" at the Kururugi shrine in R2. We really don't know what he means by that. It could very well mean that Lelouch is watching over the world he created rather than running away via death. It's all a matter of world view really. Neither is wrong or right per se, which is why I saw this anime as having had an open ending until Okouchi made his comment in Continue #42. It was Okouchi that shut the door on Lelouch being alive at the end of ep 25 of R2, not the anime by itself. Quote:
Otherwise people might come looking for you. Quote:
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In fact. Suzaku actually does have a grave and a tombstone, yet he's alive. Quote:
I'm taking the postion of a member of the Cart Driver's Club even though I don't agree with them. The reason I'm taking their postion is because they are the largest number of Code Geass fans online. Here are three pretty interesting articles/blogs about why these people think Lelouch is alive. Code Geass R2 25 For Dummies, or It’s not the horse cart, stupid: The ending explained Code Geass R2 – 25: So is Lelouch dead or not? And the absolute MASTER of the Cart Driver Club, who makes my arguments look pathetic in comparison, is the dreaded Zongetsu. Here's his argument on MAL (it's actually quite good, wrong, but good). My Analysis of Lelouch living (by Zongetsu, master of Codes )
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2011-07-13, 23:36 | Link #5764 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
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It's pretty safe to say that had he known she was alive, he would have never started ZR in the first place. Which, along with the betrayal, is one reason why I like the fanfic Changing Course, where the betrayal still happens, but an OC saves him and reunites him with Nunnally. And of course no one gets off easy. |
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2011-07-14, 05:13 | Link #5766 | |||
Shameless Fangirl
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Germany
Age: 33
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2011-07-14, 14:19 | Link #5768 |
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: U.S.A.
Age: 35
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Here's the problem with that theory: Even if Lelouch did somehow geass millions of people into believing he committed mass atrocities, there'd be no physical evidence to back it up. Eventually people would figure it out.
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2011-07-14, 14:42 | Link #5769 | |||
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
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As for C. C., she isn't always the best judge, as she's been rather detached. |
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2011-07-14, 16:19 | Link #5770 | |||
Shameless Fangirl
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Germany
Age: 33
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And yeah, C.C. isn't always the best judge, but I think she's lived long enough to recognize bullshit on that scale when faced with it, and although she was biased in favor of Lelouch, I believe she's not naive or optimistic enough to be happy about something that was nothing but proof of how pitiful he had become.
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2011-07-14, 21:57 | Link #5772 |
Spinning Lotus
Join Date: Jul 2008
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It wouldn't be possible, much less feasible, to fake a mass atrocity. Bodies take up a lot of space no matter where you put them. Someone will know if they were or weren't killed. It would be downright impossible for one man to brainwash the amount of people required to orchestrate such a fraud without missing someone. The fraud would become obvious the second a "dead" man popped up alive somewhere else. People need to go somewhere, dead or alive.
If they said he committed horrible atrocities, then he did. Rumors are one thing, like families being killed off, but the bigger things couldn't be faked.
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2011-07-14, 22:16 | Link #5773 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2008
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As for Okouchi, they had Lelouch preform a Jesus pose, I simply don't agree with them on how they view Lelouch. |
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2011-07-14, 22:44 | Link #5774 | |
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Join Date: Mar 2009
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Alternately, they could be jailed in conjunction with actual criminals and all of them could just be given life sentences, with Lelouch "randomly" selecting some people to be immediately executed for his entertainment every few days. To be a bit more elaborate, he could fake some evidence and use Geass to make some real criminals look innocent in order to bolster the idea that he really didn't care who he killed. This would create the image of a tyrant who killed innocent people on a whim, without Lelouch having to trully stoop to such a level. That said, I can't say I believe this is actually the case, as it would have been explained in the show or supplemental material if it were. |
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2011-07-14, 22:56 | Link #5775 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
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It is worth mentioning we are talking about a show where a million people could dress up as Zero and ride an iceberg ship to China.
See, the creators wanted to involve only ten thousand, initially, but after some discussion they ended up deciding to go all out with the stunt. Obviously even the staff knew the idea was ridiculous and unrealistic but after the fact they simply justified it by openly saying "this would only work in anime" in the commentary track. Why am I bringing this up? If that applies to what was probably the most logistically unrealistic event in the show, I'll let you figure out what that means for any unrealistic logistics in the finale. Quote:
If he had been crucified, I'd probably be more willing to share your annoyance, but c'mon...you'd really need to stretch things out and block out all the differences to call that a true "Jesus pose" in the most literal and accurate fashion. At most I'd call it a brief "Jesus moment" but devoid of any equivalent significance (Lelouch is not innocent or sinless, on the one hand, and his sacrifice merely brought a semblance of peace rather than salvation, on the other). And that's perfectly acceptable in modern visual art. Besides, Jesus is not the only martyr figure in world history, let alone fiction, and even that pose has been universally employed for years and years in both TV and cinema without necessarily having any related meaning for decades. The similarity is only meant to be fleeting, if that much, in most cases. |
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2011-07-15, 00:10 | Link #5776 | ||
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2011-07-15, 01:56 | Link #5777 | |
Spinning Lotus
Join Date: Jul 2008
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2011-07-15, 12:00 | Link #5778 | |
Haven't You Heard?
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: South-east Asia
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Most of the Geass characters is killed through KMF battle or massacre at some degree. I'm taking those because their death is the death that changed CG lines at most aspect ( from my POV ) As well as showing similar symptomps. A blackened eyes and no scene showing they're resurrected after their death. Spoiler for Thank you:
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2011-07-15, 12:27 | Link #5779 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Age: 35
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2011-07-15, 16:17 | Link #5780 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
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The reason I feel Lelouch did not commit any real atrocities is because he felt very bad as it is just to use Geass to make people suicide ( most of them were combatants anyway ) so I have difficulty thinking the same Lelouch doing real atrocities. |
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