Mahouka - Episode 18 Discussion / Poll

[cyberdemon]

Originally Posted by SigUp

Only it isn't my quote.

And why do I need evidence, even if it was my quote. We as viewer saw what happened. That's more than enough proof we need as viewer to be able to call it murder.


I doubt an organised human society will ever get rid of laws banning murder.


For a live action version of Mahouka ... Timothy Dalton as Shiba Tatsuya.

How Naive you are. Governments all around the world permit specific murder for domestic safety. The fact these men were from a country that they were recently at war with and hold no true peace agreement with means a lot. Even the death penalty is nothing but government sanctioned murder.

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by cyberdemon

How Naive you are. Governments all around the world permit specific murder for domestic safety. The fact these men were from a country that they were recently at war with and hold no true peace agreement with means a lot. Even the death penalty is nothing but government sanctioned murder.

I'm not naive. I know fully well that governments don't care when it's about "national security". Just look at what NSA, CIA are doing in the name of anti-terrorism. But it doesn't change the fact that it is unlawful. The government can't turn on or turn off the law as it desires. Only, nobody is going to put them to trial. It's like in a dictatorship. There in theory the law is also above the government. Only nobody's in a position to enforce this.

Oh, and the death penalty isn't "government sanctioned". It is sanctioned by the law. The government alone can't make laws.

And where do you know that they had no true peace agreement? Where was that stated?

[Hiss13]

So...can somebody explain to me what No Head Dragon was after? It was so damn vague that I have no real idea and in the end, I feel like it was just something that was thrown into the story to create some tension (and put Tatasuya into a match) since the NSC had no tension on its own.

On another note, Tatsuya acting as Masaki's wingman was definitely something that put a smile to my face after the poor CGI dancing...

[andy]

Originally Posted by SigUp

I'm not naive. I know fully well that governments don't care when it's about "national security". Just look at what NSA, CIA are doing in the name of anti-terrorism. But it doesn't change the fact that it is unlawful. The government can't turn on or turn off the law as it desires. Only, nobody is going to put them to trial. It's like in a dictatorship. There in theory the law is also above the government. Only nobody's in a position to enforce this.

Oh, and the death penalty isn't "government sanctioned". It is sanctioned by the law. The government alone can't make laws.

This post make no sense people make that law and it's in the same way the law can be broken by them if they see fit.
How do think laws come about in the first place , people make them depending on current state \wants of there country\world .
Also you must take into account the law does not apply to everyone the same way depending on your job .

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by andy

This post make no sense people make that law and it's in the same way the law can be broken by them if they see fit.
How do think laws come about in the first place , people make them depending on current state \wants of there country\world .

There is something called "legislative procedure".

[GreyZone]

Originally Posted by SigUp

I'm not naive. I know fully well that governments don't care when it's about "national security". Just look at what NSA, CIA are doing in the name of anti-terrorism. But it doesn't change the fact that it is unlawful. The government can't turn on or turn off the law as it desires. Only, nobody is going to put them to trial. It's like in a dictatorship. There in theory the law is also above the government. Only nobody's in a position to enforce this.

If you want to argue if something is against the law, you need to present law texts that clearly state "Action 'X' is against the law", which makes it quite easy in most cases. If this is applied, then you can call it "unlawful". I guess the action of deliberatly causing another's life to end is defined as "murder" (depending on method and context, the word may be different). This even applies to U.S. Soldiers killing Osama Bin Laden (unless you go with the local laws of his death place, which may be different).

But of course this is all pure theory and does not hold up to reality. In reality you must find sufficient proof that someone actually DID commit the murder and even then there are some cases, where the consequences of a sufficiently proven murder are ommited, for example if it is the thing that represents the law, that wants the murder to happen, i.e. the government.

[andy]

Originally Posted by SigUp

There is something called "legislative procedure".

And who does this legislative procedure ?

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by GreyZone

If you want to argue if something is against the law, you need to present law texts that clearly state "Action 'X' is against the law", which makes it quite easy in most cases. If this is applied, then you can call it "unlawful". I guess the action of deliberatly causing another's life to end is defined as "murder". This even applies to U.S. Soldiers killing Osama Bin Laden (unless you go with the local laws of his death place, which may be different).

But of course this is all pure theory and does not hold up to reality. In reality you must find sufficient proof that someone actually DID commit the murder and even then there are some cases, where the consequences of a sufficiently proven murder are ommited, for example if it is the thing that represents the law, that wants the murder to happen, i.e. the government.

Huh? I know that. But again, why do I need proof to call what Tatsuya did murder? We saw what happened.

Originally Posted by andy

And who does this legislative procedure ?

Not the government by itself.

[Eclipze]

Originally Posted by Hiss13

So...can somebody explain to me what No Head Dragon was after? It was so damn vague that I have no real idea and in the end, I feel like it was just something that was thrown into the story to create some tension (and put Tatasuya into a match) since the NSC had no tension on its own.

They were just after money from bets for the competition. The favored candidate was obviously First High, so they attempted to sabotage them for that purpose.

Which, honestly, is a really dumb motivation considering they're the second set of "antagonists" in the story so far. At least now they've revealed the whole Magic Enhancers deal that No Head Dragons are responsible for, but otherwise they have been as disappointingly incompetent as ever.

[Hiss13]

Originally Posted by Eclipze

They were just after money from bets for the competition. The favored candidate was obviously First High, so they attempted to sabotage them for that purpose.

Which, honestly, is a really dumb motivation considering they're the second set of "antagonists" in the story so far. At least now they've revealed the whole Magic Enhancers deal that No Head Dragons are responsible for, but otherwise they have been as disappointingly incompetent as ever.

So, basically, what I pieced together by the end of last episode. That is such a boring motivation. It's basically people just trying to make a quick buck. While I understand that happens in real life, this is a freaking fantasy/sci-fi anime. Go with the damn ideological terrorists like you did with the first arc. Even they were more interesting antagonists, albeit incompetent.

[cyberdemon]

Originally Posted by Hiss13

So, basically, what I pieced together by the end of last episode. That is such a boring motivation. It's basically people just trying to make a quick buck. While I understand that happens in real life, this is a freaking fantasy/sci-fi anime. Go with the damn ideological terrorists like you did with the first arc. Even they were more interesting antagonists, albeit incompetent.

Basically they weren't doing it under No Head Dragon's orders. NHD was against it because of the risk. This group decided to do it anyways and they started panicking when 1st High was winning because failure would mean they would either be killed or turned into those human generators. The enemies were pretty weak but it was more about the competition anyways.

[karice67]

Originally Posted by SigUp

Huh? I know that. But again, why do I need proof to call what Tatsuya did murder? We saw what happened.

You're missing the point.

You can call it murder. We can all call it murder. But whether it is against the law depends on what the laws say. Unless you know what the laws of Japan in the Mahouka universe are, you can't actually say that what Tatsuya did was against the law.

GDB and everyone else's point was about 'murder and the law', whereas the point you keep trying to make is only about 'murder'. Please try to understand that difference, at least.

======

Originally Posted by GDB

I forgot everything that happened in the episode. The CGI dancing was just so atrocious it broke my brain.

I miss the days when studios just used a panning still shot instead of awful crap like this.

*agrees* When the episode ended, 'underwhelming' was the first word that came to my head...then I remembered that I quite enjoyed seeing Tatsuya deal with No Head Dragon...

[cyberdemon]

Originally Posted by SigUp

I'm not naive. I know fully well that governments don't care when it's about "national security". Just look at what NSA, CIA are doing in the name of anti-terrorism. But it doesn't change the fact that it is unlawful. The government can't turn on or turn off the law as it desires. Only, nobody is going to put them to trial. It's like in a dictatorship. There in theory the law is also above the government. Only nobody's in a position to enforce this.

Oh, and the death penalty isn't "government sanctioned". It is sanctioned by the law. The government alone can't make laws.

And where do you know that they had no true peace agreement? Where was that stated?

But it can make said laws. After 9/11 Bush made a law that allowed any means necessary to capture or kill the likes of Osama Bin Laden and the people or countries that worked with him to attack the US.

The world of Mahouka is technically only in a state of a ceasefire after WW3. No peace treaties were ever signed. They would've made laws allowing for force like this to be used in the case of a national security threat to avoid going back to war. These were foreigners from an enemy nation that they had been following and gathering data on before the 9SC. They had been committing terrorist acts on the competition (even if they didn't kill anyone) which would give the government authority to use force to fight and kill them.

[rladls2121]

Was Masaki seriously unaware that Miyuki and Tatsuya are siblings the whole arc?
To marry Mayumi? For what?
Tatsuya already gone through suffering because of his family in the past and now being told to involve with other high ranking family to suffer more in the future?
These family business.

[bietchie11]

Originally Posted by HandofFate

The insert song was so bad lol.
Laughed at the FF8-ish dance scene at the end.

I get that even though its modeled as a gun, its not an actual gun, but expected Tatsuya to snipe with a rifle CAD.

I feel bad for No Dragon Head.

Get me some "Eyes on me" #Faye Wong.

[bietchie11]

Originally Posted by SigUp

Huh? I know that. But again, why do I need proof to call what Tatsuya did murder? We saw what happened.

No, it's not murder my friend.
We call it "threat neutralizing".

Beside, what law forbid us from shooting the attackers that harm your family? It's self-defense.

[bakato]

Originally Posted by SigUp

Huh? I know that. But again, why do I need proof to call what Tatsuya did murder? We saw what happened.


Not the government by itself.

But this was sanctioned by the government at the highest levels.

[Lexxus]

Originally Posted by rladls2121

Was Masaki seriously unaware that Miyuki and Tatsuya are siblings the whole arc?
To marry Mayumi? For what?
Tatsuya already gone through suffering because of his family in the past and now being told to involve with other high ranking family to suffer more in the future?
These family business.

Well, Saegusa and Juumonji don't know he's from Yotsuba or from a ten master clan. That's why he's telling him to marry Saegusa to be part of Ten master clan. Looks like the Ten master clan were quite alarmed that a guy from a no name clan just defeated someone from one of the Ten master clan which is the best among the best in Japan.

[rladls2121]

Really? Did not Tatsuya said himself to Junmonji that he is not any of those ten families?
Sensitive that a "nobody" defeated one of the ten high families aren't they?

[Lexxus]

Originally Posted by rladls2121

Really? Did not Tatsuya said himself to Junmonji that he is not any of those ten families?
Sensitive that a "nobody" defeated one of the ten high families aren't they?

I guess that's the weight of defeating the next head of the Ten master clans (at least what Juumonji said). No wonder they were quite alarmed about it that a nobody defeated Masaki Ichijo.