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View Poll Results: Critique of Episode 28 | |||
10: Amazing... | 4 | 8.33% | |
9 out of 10: Excellent... | 4 | 8.33% | |
8 out of 10: Very Good... | 13 | 27.08% | |
7 out of 10: Good... | 12 | 25.00% | |
6 out of 10: Average... | 7 | 14.58% | |
5 out of 10: Below Average... | 5 | 10.42% | |
4 out of 10: Poor... | 3 | 6.25% | |
3 out of 10: Bad... | 0 | 0% | |
2 out of 10: Very Bad... | 0 | 0% | |
1 out of 10: Torturous... | 0 | 0% | |
Voters: 48. You may not vote on this poll |
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2012-04-22, 14:24 | Link #61 |
Goat Herder
Author
Join Date: Jun 2008
Age: 36
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Nah, I don't think Kio will end up killing Zeheart. If he does it'll probably be an accident. Zeheart feels more tolerant of Earthers on account of living among them and befriending four of them. I think he'd be willing to negotiate otherwise.
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2012-04-22, 14:30 | Link #62 | |
Knightmare
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Nederland
Age: 36
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Quote:
In order to have any form of peace their all parties need to want it, before Flit was in any situation where he could influence politics the Earth Fed. already made (non)public offers for peace. After refusing those offers any form of negotiation is pointless unless the peace offer comes from Vagan and not from the Fed. And again you don't know the current political situation Flit is in, he could be literately arresting a person that is/was working with Vagan at that moment and letting him escape could mean ton of information being passed that could destroy everything he has been fighting for all this time(extreme scenario but you just don't know). |
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2012-04-22, 14:46 | Link #63 | |
Crazy Devout Fanboy
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: 1st Ra Cailum-class battleship Ra Cailum, port-side officer's bunks
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It's black-and-white, pure and simple; mass-murder/genocide/extermination = bad/evil. If you honestly believe otherwise, you have fanboy blindness. I'm sorry, but it's true. There's nothing good, at all, about genocide. And try to stay on topic; Flit's crystal-clear declaration that he wants to wipe out the Vegan. The current political situation has nothing to do with that, nor does it excuse any desires for extermination. Genocide = bad. There's no buts, thoughs, or howevers. You know the only kind of guys that want to erradicate a whole race? Bad guys. In anime, including Gundam, they're called such. In our world, guys similar to this exist. They do things called ethnic cleansing. They're not exactly looked upon in a good light. A guy named Hitler had this thing called the "Final Solution" back around the 1940's that was similar. People don't think very well of that either. Whatever happened to guys who want to continue wars to the point of extermination being the bad guys? The fascist Titans, the New EF and Space Rebellion, the Alliance and Plant? Flit gets a pass because he was the main character of the first arc? Because he's a badass pilot? I don't think so.
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Last edited by Shinji103; 2012-04-22 at 14:57. |
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2012-04-22, 14:54 | Link #64 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Wow, just wow, Zant has a giant mobile suit and the chance to kill Flit Asuno, and what does he do? He takes the time to target a single person.
I've complained before about the perceived incompetence of the Vagan, but this is a whole new low, even for them. And I don't care if letting Flit lives for now turns out to be part of Ezelcant's plan. As far as I'm concerned, this war has been going on this long (and will continue to go on much longer) due primarily to Vagan (Ezelcant's?) incompetence, and not just because Mars is far away or the Vagans having less resources. As for the rest of the episode, meh. Just bring on Kio. Third time's the charm? I hope so, got high hopes for him. Times skips are great. Defeat them and force them to surrender, just like it has been done in history. No one is saying that Earth shouldn't defend itself from attacks, but that's not to say that they should just annihilate their entire enemy population either. |
2012-04-22, 14:55 | Link #65 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
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Haven't watched the Chapter, waiting for English Subs.
But in the Flit Debate... the whole situation and how he become more and more extremist with the Veigan is not more how the things have unfold to him... First his mother was killed in the Second Colony Attack, his 'guardian' and friend who was Bruzar die in the third when found about the gundam, the whole mini.war he fight in the First Generation make him think low about them.... and them the Yurin Incident and all, that was the last straw in his psyche as a child. Now as Adult, Figthing for more than 25 years, the Veigan Refuse any chance of peace, them Grodek tell him about a conspiracy and result to be true and kill another of his friend, them found that the high goverment was involved as a way to burry their mistakes... I can Understand the Flit fall into darkness even if now become worse than ever... at least in S2 he only want them to return back their hole in Mars. now... i can't read him. About Asemu Wedding... what if that happen at the moment of the 'Coup D'Etat? |
2012-04-22, 15:05 | Link #66 | |
Crazy Devout Fanboy
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: 1st Ra Cailum-class battleship Ra Cailum, port-side officer's bunks
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Doesn't matter. He doesn't have the right to wipe out a whole population because he had bad things happen to him. Is he suddenly the only person in the world who has suffered?
Your post actually made me realize another fault he has; he's selfish. This whole grudge is selfishness and ego. What makes his suffering so special that he's allowed to wipe out a whole race? Lots of people suffer, Flit. Some suffer even worse than you, but you don't see them all taking up arms and making other peoples' lives miserable, much less desiring genocide. You're not that special by any means. Quote:
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2012-04-22, 15:11 | Link #67 |
Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
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The Federation Strikes BACK!!!
It is a dark time for the Rebellion. Emperor Flit and his right hand Darth Asemu succeed in consolidating Federation Supremacy by weeding out government officials sympathetic to the Rebellion, Han Zeharto is locked in carbonetic sleep by the evil gangster Ezcalant the Hut. Things could not look worse for the Vagan Rebellion.
Stay tuned for Episode VI Return of the Vagan seriously...well beam sabers were inspired by Star Wars IIRC. RomaryXAsemu lame pairing. Sure it was implied since the beginning of the arc, but it sure wasn't developed well at all. When I saw them sitting apart on the bench i was like: sweet dump her! They totally copped off the her siding with Zehart, oh I just admired the two of you! At least she was right in admitting she was unfairly projecting her impressions of them. But throughout the arc she rarely showed any actual concern for Asemu at all. The real loss goes out to Obright though, reverse death flagging someone really tugs at the heart strings. |
2012-04-22, 15:16 | Link #68 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
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Quote:
Zant's main objective was to kill that prime minister. It's not just an attack just because he wants to. |
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2012-04-22, 15:27 | Link #69 | ||
The Dark Knight
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: From the deepest abyss in the world, where you think?
Age: 38
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Your are pretty much excusing all of the Vagan's actions due to a decision a government CENTURIES ago made. Quote:
And how exactly would one annihilate the population when it's at Mars to begin with? I find it hilarious you guys go to great lengths to defend the Vagans and paint them as the victims when it's them that are using civilians as human shields and massacring colonies to begin with. Then when they have no use for their spies they simply execute them. I mean it's okay for the Vagans to play dirty and talk about how they're the superior species to humans but not Flit for moving in to clean it up? The Federation has zero choice but to stay on the defensive. To send an actual expedition to Mars wouldn't be productive at all. This is WHY they were trying to negotiate peace with the Vagans to begin with. Since it failed it was up to Flit to prepare for their attacks which he has done succesfully so far. You guys are trying so hard to paint Flit as some evil genocidal maniac is just sad and pathetic. He's the main character. It's not going to happen. What's going to happen is that Kio may serve as the bridge to resolving the crisis with the Vagans. What doesn't make any sense is if the Prime Minister was in cahoots with the Vagans why did the negotiations failed? He could've steered to a peace treaty that would be favourable to them (Give them portions of Earth for re-settlement) yet that didn't happen. Last edited by SoldierOfDarkness; 2012-04-22 at 15:41. |
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2012-04-22, 15:28 | Link #70 | |
Knightmare
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Nederland
Age: 36
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Quote:
At this point it seems to me that the majority of the people form Vagan are extremist that will literally fight till the last breath or until they accomplished their goals. And judging from Vagans actions (no desire for peace even if they get everything they want) it seems that their goal is to exterminate every human on Earth, at least this is what Flit would think because their is no logical reason to not aim for peace when it is proposed by the puppet government you control. And Flit's actions and the actions of organizations like Titans and Blue Cosmos is hardly on the same level (excluding Plant because they can justify most of their actions except destroying earth), till now we have never seen Flit to use methods that are unethical, at best he did what has to be done in order to protect innocent people (even the colony thing during Age 2 arc), up till now the soldiers of Vagan are the trigger happy that like to fight in places where their are allot of civilians. |
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2012-04-22, 15:44 | Link #71 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
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You're Right Altim and Soldier of Darkness. Shinji103, The veigan are not Zeon, heck even Zeon wasn't that cool.
Here is when AGE is a truly Gundam series... even if the bad guys are bad guys(as Zeon was Nazi Germany in Space), we still root for them somehow... Tomino Would have been Proud...XD In general my original feeling was than Flit want the Veigan to return that red sphere of them and forget about the Earth...as a defeated people, much like ww2 germany or Japan, but the Veigan Action only push him more and more to a more radical way. In fact we've been pretty 'clean' in this war... we are the nukes? with not a little mission ala Seed and send several nuclear cruiser to Veigan Homeworld to crush them... that is a simple solution but never have happen... for now If is true than Kio is Uso 2.0... them after Elzecant reveal his pyscho weapon and all.. maybe peace will achive |
2012-04-22, 15:46 | Link #72 | ||
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
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The diiference is Flit won't even leave room for the idea that they would be able to have come to terms with the Vagans in the future.
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But seriously, Flit said it himself that he was planning to annihilate all Vagans all along. As far as Flit's concerned, Vagans are evil itself. Quote:
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2012-04-22, 15:46 | Link #73 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
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Quote:
(You can see how corrupted Flit has become. The First Generation was all light and placing all hopes on saviour!Flit. Now that he has been in the battle for too long, he's become tainted and all he can think about is wiping out the enemy. And he can't turn back now; those who had died and placed their hopes on him would have died for nothing.) I don't think that's the point. The poster is against Genocide, which what Flit declared he wants to do with clear voice and glaring eyes. |
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2012-04-22, 15:52 | Link #75 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
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Quote:
But Flit is not the target. The prime minister and the government being humiliated by the enemy has more blow to the EF's morale than killing someone that can be replaced. |
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2012-04-22, 15:52 | Link #76 | ||||||||
Crazy Devout Fanboy
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: 1st Ra Cailum-class battleship Ra Cailum, port-side officer's bunks
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Quote:
*sigh* I guess some people just can't give up being die-hard fanboys.......There is NO excuse for commiting genocide. You're wrong. Period. As wrong as if you were defending a guy proven to have commited murder with concrete, unedited proof. Quote:
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They did the same with several elements of Code Geass (like Suzaku's connection to C.C. that was indicated in the end of season 1) and they abandoned their original plans for the end of R2. They retconned and tossed out a bunch of things between Gundam 00 S1 and S2; they hastily closed and dismissed the Feldt/Lyle conflict that they'd been building through Feldt's feelings for Neil, they replaced it with the worse-than-FlitxEmily SetsunaxFeldt, and they tossed out SetsunaxMarina, which they'd been building up since before halfway through S1, only to bring it back a bit at the end of the movie. So who knows, maybe they will just do away with that problematic genocide line of Flit's for arc 3. But in lieu of that....... He's still wrong. There is nothing right about genocide. Quote:
I see lots of Flit/Gundam AGE fanboy talking and no justification for genocide. Of course, since there iasn't any justfication for it....... Quote:
b) Nobody in the EF had ludacrice genocidal desires until now. c) Flit never made any genocidal desiring statements until now. Quote:
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I know you're not supporting Flit's genocide statement, but that's what that would end up as if Flit continues on. Just piling more bodies on the bodies he's already piled. I'm not going to argue this anymore, because there's no point. Genocide is wrong. Period. End of story. I don't care what you say, and anybody else with their head screwed on straight knows this. There's nothing anybody can say or do to change thw wrong-ness of genocide.
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2012-04-22, 15:57 | Link #78 | |
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Quote:
Let me explain this again: 1. Zant has a giant mobile suit. 2. Flit is standing right next to the prime minister. 3. Zant could have killed them BOTH. Did he do that? No, he did not. Did he even kill the prime minister? No, not even that. My verdict: Incompetence |
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2012-04-22, 16:00 | Link #79 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
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Lets put it this way. To Flit negotiating with the Vegans is moot as their actions and ideology they are cult of personality fanatics out to genocide the rest of humanity. Essentially they are doing this for their leader Ezelcant. You know what that sounds like? Several names comes to mind. Hitler, Stalin, Mao etc... A lot of blood would be spilled for their utopia.
Given Zeheart heard Ezelcant and Zant saw the same vision as Zeheart I can venture to guess much like Decil taking over MS using the Mu Zell helmets of X-Rounders Ezelcant brainwashes his own people to subservience. Thus it now makes sense some Vegan operators on Ambat were like zombies. Their brains were fried. This war will only end if someone kills Ezelcant. Freeing Vegans from his influence. |
2012-04-22, 16:01 | Link #80 | ||
Crazy Devout Fanboy
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: 1st Ra Cailum-class battleship Ra Cailum, port-side officer's bunks
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LOL at how the only way the Flit fanboys can attack the anti-genocide-ers is by accusing us of defending the Vegans' actions when we absolutely are not. Quote:
Okay. Now I'm done.
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