Suisei no Gargantia - Episode 9 Discussion / Poll

[Finre]

İn first episode GHA Soldiers were saying that this was going to be the last time they will be able to wage war right ?. Does that mean they lost against Hideauze and maybe their capital is suffering right now ?.

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by Finre

İn first episode GHA Soldiers were saying that this was going to be the last time they will be able to wage war right ?. Does that mean they lost against Hideauze and maybe their capital is suffering right now ?.

I don't remember that and I don't think so. They wouldn't have retreated so easily if that was their last chance.


Anyway I still maintain that the Hideauze are wrong.

If you have the technology to mix humans with some kind of animal then you should engineer catgirls! Anything else is blasphemy!

Who's with me?!

[Libros]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

If you have the technology to mix humans with some kind of animal then you should engineer catgirls! Anything else is blasphemy!

How about Bunny girls like Kuro Usagi from Mondaiji?

[Shinhwa]

Originally Posted by bastek66

Hideuze were humans

My mind is full of fuck.

How the hell are those things humans... jesus christ...

[taofd]

I find it amusing you guys are already so quick to jump to conclusions about the limited amount of information provided in this episode. I sort of expected this, so this episode was a bit of a letdown for me, although I didn't expect the Hideaze to share a similar ancestor (I simply expected them to be borne of some genetic meddling, perhaps an experiment gone awry).

I suspect there is a third, more neutral group to this conflict, that will soon show themselves. Clearly, humans survived the Ice Age on earth. I suspect some Human-Hideaze hybrids survived as well.

I also expect Chamber to potentially be a problem. If you guys haven't noticed the theme yet, individualism and the non-aggression principle are strong themes in SnG. Mark my words, Ledo will ultimately have to choose peace vs force, and ultimately whether or not to embrace individualism vs collectivism.

You guys really need to stop lumping everyone in the GA or the main Hideaze force into their separate categories. It is conceivable to me (and has been mentioned) that not all Humans agree with the GA propaganda, and I suspect the same is true for the Hideaze.

Some of the "Evolvers" may have performed atrocious experiments on unwilling participants, but that doesn't mean that this was common practice or embraced by every single individual in the group.

At this point, I don't think anyone else has asked this question:
Who was the individual Chamber murdered at the end? I suspect there are varying classes of Hideaze who perform different duties, with the highest functioning being similar to humans--- I suspect whoever died, was potentially someone important enough to plunge Gargantia into War.

[Hamster]

The catgirls are probably extinct due to the discussions of physics in anime technology in this thread and others.

Squidgirls it is!

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

If you have the technology to mix humans with some kind of animal then you should engineer catgirls! Anything else is blasphemy!

Who's with me?!

I prefer Captain America’s “super-soldier serum”. The ones who get it must be certified good like Steve Rogers. If bad people get it, they’ll end up like Red Skull (nobody wants that). Don’t you think it’s the best humanity-filter to decide who will survive the great 5th ice age?

[ReddyRedWolf]

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

I prefer Captain America’s “super-soldier serum”. The ones who get it must be certified good like Steve Rogers. If bad people get it, they’ll end up like Red Skull (nobody wants that). Don’t you think it’s the best humanity-filter to decide who will survive the great 5th ice age?

The Hulk also has its origins with the Super Soldier Serum.

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

The Hulk also has its origins with the Super Soldier Serum.

It's different. The Hulk used Gamma-ray, but Cap used Vita-ray. So, as long as you use Vita-ray, you won't become Hulk (unless you really want it) .

[Finre]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

I don't remember that and I don't think so. They wouldn't have retreated so easily if that was their last chance.

Hmm checked the first episode again. Ledo's supervisor Commander Kugel says:

''In 300 seconds, the entire fleet will be entering the wormhole's ergo region. We'll be swinging out right next to a Hideauze nest.
This is a surprise attack, with everything the Alliance has to throw at them.
If we fail here, consider this war over.''

and so they lost. Also Kugel says Hideauze nest not something like their main nest. This makes me think if there are other nests and if Hideauze's standing in the universe is far better than GHA.

[Forever]

Excuse me while I search for my jaw....

Gen did it again.

It almost feels like zerg vs terran. All there is left is for Hideaze to eat and turn people into hideaze.

[Tempester]

Originally Posted by taofd

Who was the individual Chamber murdered at the end? I suspect there are varying classes of Hideaze who perform different duties, with the highest functioning being similar to humans--- I suspect whoever died, was potentially someone important enough to plunge Gargantia into War.

That could be true. Or it could just be a juvenile form of Hideauze before reaching the more squid-like adult form seen in the rest of the episode. Notice how the Hideauze "larvae" look more human than everything else.

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by Hamster

The catgirls are probably extinct due to the discussions of physics in anime technology in this thread and others.

Squidgirls it is!

Well damn, at least make them cute like Ika-musume!

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

I prefer Captain America’s “super-soldier serum”. The ones who get it must be certified good like Steve Rogers. If bad people get it, they’ll end up like Red Skull (nobody wants that). Don’t you think it’s the best humanity-filter to decide who will survive the great 5th ice age?

See you get my point. Transhumanism shouldn't just come with superpowers but also with improved aesthetic factors!
When you only value efficiency and disregard everything else, you know that there's something wrong.
And it's not just a matter of aesthetic. What makes humans great is their artistic sense and their ability to enjoy life and play. Anything that would diminish that is bad in my book.

I wonder if Kaoru Chujo realized that Elaine Matsumoto has not mouth. Just what kind of improvement he sees in a transhumanism that completely prevents an individual to become one of the voice actors that he loves so much?


This reminds me of texhnolyze where in the end some people completely forego their flesh body with the exception of their head and some internal organs.

I like how Shinji commented that: "What's the point in having a body like that, if you can't even have fun with a woman?"

Originally Posted by Finre

Hmm checked the first episode again. Ledo's supervisor Commander Kugel says:

''In 300 seconds, the entire fleet will be entering the wormhole's ergo region. We'll be swinging out right next to a Hideauze nest.
This is a surprise attack, with everything the Alliance has to throw at them.
If we fail here, consider this war over.''

I question that interpretation of Kugel's last sentence.
What he actually says is: "ato wa nai to omoe" literally "think that there won't be an after this".

This could be just a motivational speech.

Anyway at worst this would mean that the Alliance doesn't have any more ideas on how to win the war, not that they will be exterminated. The war isn't lost as long as you can fight. Kugel sacrificed his life to prevent Hideauze from following them in the wormhole, which means that they normally can't get to where humans are.

Besides when You watch that battle and you analyze what went wrong it seems that the plan could have worked if only they could recharge the dimenstrion faster. So... it's only a matter of bringing more dimenstrions along.
Of course we don't know how much it takes to create one...

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

Well damn, at least make them cute like Ika-musume!

And don't forget the awesome tentacles!!

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

The Hideauze are no longer Human Transhumanists but parasites chasing their prey. The symbiont has taken over their psychology and are no longer human intellect in anyway.

We don't know that. People in this thread seem to be making a lot of assumptions based on the minimal information we got. Ledo and the Alliance's information are completely unreliable, and most likely outright lies. We have literally no clue what the current situation is like on the Hideauze side. The only thing we know for sure is that the Alliance and them are stuck in an eternal war. Both sides are probably at fault.

[aohige]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

Well damn, at least make them cute like Ika-musume!

[Jan-Poo]

Still, we need to consider that the information that Ledo acquired is from the main base of the Evolvers. So if those info are biased, they are biased in favor of the Evolvers and not in favor of the continental union.

[ReddyRedWolf]

Originally Posted by Kanon

We don't know that. People in this thread seem to be making a lot of assumptions based on the minimal information we got. Ledo and the Alliance's information are completely unreliable, and most likely outright lies. We have literally no clue what the current situation is like on the Hideauze side. The only thing we know for sure is that the Alliance and them are stuck in an eternal war. Both sides are probably at fault.

Hideauze can't make wormholes but the Galactic Alliance can. Wherever the Alliance goes they go. Hence it is a parasitic existence for the Hideauze.

The Galactic Alliance on the other hand has dedicated their society so much in defending themselves and destroying the Hideuaze if there are no enemies no longer they do not know what to do.

[Folenfant]

LOT of praise for Gen Urobuchi this thread. I wonder if there would be this much positive talk about the writing and singling out one individual for it if it weren't that ever popular individual. I've often found when it comes to anime a select few individual entities, usually only 2 or so for each area of media (writing, production, music, animation etc.) always seem to get very heavily praised and singled out when they deliver something above average, but rarely is it unknowns when they write a solid script or good composition or make an obvious and significant contribution to making an episode or piece of work stronger. It's kind of something I wish would change so anime and it's community would open up more for other newer creators.

This is why I want to focus on the episode script writer a little here. Strangely the script for this episode was handled by Norimitsu Kaihō who wrote the much maligned episode 6 which was IMO fairly criticized for not really treading much new ground over episode 5. I'm glad they gave him this opportunity to show he's a little better than what we saw from him previously and can be given the task of penning a key episode even if Gen Urobuchi is likely to get sole credit and praise for it because he's the big popular and well liked name. I'm someone who appreciates the contributions of the lesser knowns so I appreciate the redemptive effort here even if the plot twist didn't catch me off guard since I'd factored in that contingency a few episodes back considering where a lot of the "smart" sci-fi has been going lately.

As for the second thing I feel needs to be pointed out, I find it sort of curious how people were down on the show when it was having that slow period during the middle (this is really something I especially hate by the way with anime and find it unfortunately happens a lot with 12 episode series, and that's when the middle of a show feels poorly utilized and uneventful and all the strong fleshed out portions are packed into the very beginning and ending arcs of shows), but act like everything is fixed now off of one stronger episode. I'm not so sure if that's the case yet. Yes we have eventfulness again finally, but I don't find that especially praise worthy considering a lot of shows I've been watching right now (Titan, Valvrave, Hunter x Hunter) have felt eventful all throughout give or take maybe one episode. Rather I want to see where things go from this better effort of an episode and whether they can build on it with a few more interesting surprises, developments and turns. Truth be told I'm a little skeptical if there's enough time left for anyone other than Ledo to reach a satisfying and interesting character arc conclusion. If this series ends up having a key flaw I'm still thinking it's going to be that other than Ledo and possibly Riget (who has probably already reached the end of her arc) none of the cast has felt really well developed or stands out much.

[LystAP]

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

Hideauze can't make wormholes but the Galactic Alliance can. Wherever the Alliance goes they go. Hence it is a parasitic existence for the Hideauze.

The Galactic Alliance on the other hand has dedicated their society so much in defending themselves and destroying the Hideuaze if there are no enemies no longer they do not know what to do.

Again however, that's a major assumption. It's been thousands of years since that day, and the Hideauze could have since then developed their own way of making wormholes. Just because the Union managed to make it first, doesn't mean that Evolvers haven't been able to replicate it using their bio-technology. We haven't seen any evidence that the Hideauze do not have any wormhole generators of their own, and thinking on it, the Galactic Alliance wouldn't be in such a threatened position if the Hideauze could only hijack the Alliance's wormholes. The United States was the first to explode an atom bomb, but that doesn't mean the world leeches off the U.S. nuclear material.

The Evolvers attacked because the Union managed to come up with the technology and was planning to leave the Evolvers behind to die with the Earth. It is my suspicion that neither sides plan really went accordingly; the battle between the sides may have damaged the wormhole generator and it sucked the majority of both sides into it, and fling them across the galaxy, with pockets of both sides spun off here and there (leading to the so-called wandering tribes Ledo thought the Gargantians were at start; the Hideauze probably had their own version of a wandering tribe, but the Alliance probably lumps them in together with the main Hideauze force). This also may explain why the information regarding Earth's location was lost, especially if the damaged wormhole generator spat them out at a random location, as Chamber and Ledo was. Those left behind were left with a destroyed wormhole generator and no way to escape the planet, those remnants may have ended up as the ancestors of the surface fleets and whalesquids.