Fate/ Series Q&A

[Archer]

Originally Posted by Kanzaki Urumi

okay, Archer

Spoiler:

So the HG was never able to fullfill Saber's wish or any other's wish in the first place?

Another thing, the HG (corrupted) now is only capable of causing the fire, rite?

Based on what you said, in the other HGW in other part of the world, there are no Servants that were summoned. The HGW is special however due to certain changes that summoning the Servant (miracles) was possible, rite?

I am sorry, but what is a third magic and what is the purpose of having the Servants summoned?

there's another question that i thought of yesterday but i somehow forgotten of it, dang. Sorry to bother you by asking this load of questions, i am pretty curious about everything in FSN now. =P thx for the reply before.

Spoiler:

Hmm, I phrased it wrong. The Holy Grail of Heaven's Feel actually can grant wishes because of its infinite amount of mana, but that's not its primary purpose.

In Saber's case, the Holy Grail could indeed fulfill her wish. In fact, it's probably the only thing that really could. The Third Magic is, to quote the Fuyuki Wiki:

The turning of a soul into a living being to bring it onto the next step as a life form. Resurrection of the soul. A soul materialized by the third can and will reshape itself into the "form of the soul" completely if put in a vessel with similar enough properties as a human being based on the "genes from the soul". According to Rin, the "organic" soul itself is moving the body by remote-control. Of course, putting that soul back into the body, while getting the benefits of reenacting the soul through the body, means it's also going to be anchored into it. Meaning that you know who will get sick, bleed, age, and die like a normal human being.

Through a very complicated process that I'm not going over here (and for reasons that I'm not going to go over now), Saber can go back to her past self and put her own soul back into the body.

In other parts of the world, there are no such things as Holy Grail Wars at all. There's no need for battles to obtain those Holy Grails. The reason why Servants exist in the Heaven's Feel is because the gate to obtain the Third Magic can only be obtained by the power of great spirits. Because of their inability to work with each other, the three families decided to fight for the control of the Holy Grail, thus creating the setting for the Heaven's Feel.

The Holy Grail as it is now can still grant wishes (as the Holy Grail is still a Holy Grail, even with all that Third Magic stuff. However, like I said earlier, that's not its primary purpose.), but it is unknown what exactly would happen if somebody wished upon it. You do remember what Kotomine said to Shirou in the anime, when they were in Kotomine's basement?

[Kanzaki Urumi]

Originally Posted by Archer

Spoiler:

Hmm, I phrased it wrong. The Holy Grail of Heaven's Feel actually can grant wishes because of its infinite amount of mana, but that's not its primary purpose.

In Saber's case, the Holy Grail could indeed fulfill her wish. In fact, it's probably the only thing that really could. The Third Magic is, to quote the Fuyuki Wiki:



Through a very complicated process that I'm not going over here (and for reasons that I'm not going to go over now), Saber can go back to her past self and put her own soul back into the body.

In other parts of the world, there are no such things as Holy Grail Wars at all. There's no need for battles to obtain those Holy Grails. The reason why Servants exist in the Heaven's Feel is because the gate to obtain the Third Magic can only be obtained by the power of great spirits. Because of their inability to work with each other, the three families decided to fight for the control of the Holy Grail, thus creating the setting for the Heaven's Feel.

The Holy Grail as it is now can still grant wishes (as the Holy Grail is still a Holy Grail, even with all that Third Magic stuff. However, like I said earlier, that's not its primary purpose.), but it is unknown what exactly would happen if somebody wished upon it. You do remember what Kotomine said to Shirou in the anime, when they were in Kotomine's basement?

Spoiler:

if i remember right, he wished for everything to be destroyed other than him or that he just touched the HG and everything blow up. If it was capable of granting wishes like Saber's, why the change of mind that she wanted it to be destroyed? hmm, i am getting confused.

[Archer]

Originally Posted by Kanzaki Urumi

Spoiler:

if i remember right, he wished for everything to be destroyed other than him or that he just touched the HG and everything blow up. If it was capable of granting wishes like Saber's, why the change of mind that she wanted it to be destroyed? hmm, i am getting confused.

Spoiler:

You have to know that Saber, like all the other heroes, just doesn't follow a single timeline. If a hero is summoned in one war, it doesn't mean that a hero can only be summoned in the wars following it. A hero can be summoned to another war in another timeline.

With that said, Saber destroyed the grail because it was tainted. A tainted grail like that isn't really suitable to grant wishes. In Fate, Saber goes back to her own time because she comes to accept her life.

In direct contrast, Archer's Saber, after destroying the Holy Grail, decides to try her hand again at the Holy Grail. She continues to pursue her mission of redoing her life, even against Archer-Shirou's wishes.

[Kanzaki Urumi]

thx, Archer for answering my questions =P

In the anime, when did Archer realise that he is Shirou ?

i have read ppl saying that he actually knew who he was but he was just hiding his identity from Rin since the start.

edited

[Question]

Source regarding how archer's saber decides sto try her hand again at the holy grail? This is an alternate time line shirou we are talking about.

[Archer]

Originally Posted by Question

Source regarding how archer's saber decides sto try her hand again at the holy grail? This is an alternate time line shirou we are talking about.

The game.

Archer's not going to be so hard on Saber if he experienced otherwise.

[mlai]

Regarding the question of whether Saber did what she wanted to do or what she had to do... there was a big discussion on that.

The discussion was "If the HG wasn't tainted and didn't have to be destroyed, and Saber had free choice of staying with Shirou or going back to her own time to die, what would she choose?"

A lot of ppl felt that she'd still go back to her own time (to die), for many reasons pertaining to her character makeup. I tend to agree, because she is not a girl. That part of her character is actually not very central to her, as much as a human being can deny it, that is.

[Kanzaki Urumi]

1.why didnt saber just hide in the building when Rider used her hougu? No way Rider can ride a horse in that building and Saber have the advantage of a smaller area to fight in. She can also save herself from using the excalibur if she did that.

2.Why did Archer shut the light's in Illya's house? Is it to buy him some time to complete the UBW incantation?

3.Oh yea i still didnt know have the answer, did Archer have knowledge of his identity since the start when he was summoned (he didnt tell Rin so she wont freak out) or half way of the anime?

[Archer]

Originally Posted by Kanzaki Urumi

1.why didnt saber just hide in the building when Rider used her hougu? No way Rider can ride a horse in that building and Saber have the advantage of a smaller area to fight in. She can also save herself from using the excalibur if she did that.

2.Why did Archer shut the light's in Illya's house? Is it to buy him some time to complete the UBW incantation?

3.Oh yea i still didnt know have the answer, did Archer have knowledge of his identity since the start when he was summoned (he didnt tell Rin so she wont freak out) or half way of the anime?

1) The horse can easily destroy the building in one hit.

2) Obviously.

3) It's not clear if he knew at the very beginning, but it was clear he remembered by the third day.

[Question]

Originally Posted by Archer

The game.

Archer's not going to be so hard on Saber if he experienced otherwise.

Which route?UBW?

[Kanzaki Urumi]

i have always thought of it but never asked. HGW suppose to have 7 master/servants so
1. Emiya - Saber
2. Shinji - Rider
3. The teacher ( lol ) - Caster/Assasin
4. Rin - Archer
5. IIya - Berserker
6. Kotomine - Lancer/Gil
7. ?

So whos the 7th? I refering to the anime, not the game.

[mlai]

The unshown Masters are:

(1) The dude who originally summoned Caster but wasn't bishounen enough so Caster capped him.

(2) Bazett Fraga McRemitz, a member of the Mages' Association and Lancer/Cuhulainn's original Master. Kotomine cut her arm off and she died in the anime. She looks like Vanessa in King of Fighters.

[Kanzaki Urumi]

i see, so its
1. Emiya - Saber
2. Shinji - Rider
3. The teacher ( lol ) - Caster/Assasin
4. Rin - Archer
5. IIya - Berserker
6. Kotomine - Gil
7. Bazett - Lancer

i first thought Kotomine/Gil forced themselves into the war, this means that they are actually originally inducted into this HGW.

[Archer]

Technically speaking, it's more like this:

1) Emiya/Rin(UBW) - Saber
2) Sakura/Shinji - Rider
3) Bazette/Kirei - Lancer
4) Rin - Archer
5) Ilya - Berserker
6) Unknown Magus/Souichirou - Caster
7) Ryuudouji Temple/Caster - Assassin
8) Zouken - True Assassin
9) Kirei - Gilgamesh (They're partners, not actually Master/Servant)

[mlai]

I think the original question is, "Assuming there is a supernatural importance/requirement to having only 7, and exactly 7, magi in the HGW, where are the proper 7?"

To which, I would say:

1. Shirou - Saber
2. Sakura -> Shinji - Rider
3. Bazette -> Kirei - Lancer
4. Rin - Archer
5. Ilya - Berserker
6. Unknown magus -> Souichirou - Caster

The "improper" ones are:
1. Caster - Assassin
2. Nobody - Gilgy (who is technically not part of this HGW)

So, I'm assuming, because there were only 6 proper Masters, and 6 proper Servants, it is how Zouken managed to butt in and get himself a Servant. If there were already 7, the HG would not have allowed him to summon an 8th Servant.

Otherwise, theoretically speaking, uninvited magi could just keep streaming into the city, bump off the "proper" Masters and their Servants, and summon their own, new Servants. Which would not make much sense.

[Archer]

Originally Posted by mlai

I think the original question is, "Assuming there is a supernatural importance/requirement to having only 7, and exactly 7, magi in the HGW, where are the proper 7?"

To which, I would say:

1. Shirou - Saber
2. Sakura -> Shinji - Rider
3. Bazette -> Kirei - Lancer
4. Rin - Archer
5. Ilya - Berserker
6. Unknown magus -> Souichirou - Caster

The "improper" ones are:
1. Caster - Assassin
2. Nobody - Gilgy (who is technically not part of this HGW)

So, I'm assuming, because there were only 6 proper Masters, and 6 proper Servants, it is how Zouken managed to butt in and get himself a Servant. If there were already 7, the HG would not have allowed him to summon an 8th Servant.

Otherwise, theoretically speaking, uninvited magi could just keep streaming into the city, bump off the "proper" Masters and their Servants, and summon their own, new Servants. Which would not make much sense.

Technically speaking, that's still seven Servants. Avenger, who was definitely not a proper Servant, was counted amongst the seven Servants in the Third Heaven's Feel (replacing Berserker). Zouken, instead of summoning a brand new Servant, instead summoned True Assassin from a previously existing Servant (Assassin). If he had tried otherwise, he probably would've failed (but don't hold me on that).

Also, note that Assassin's real master is technically the temple itself. He's bound to the temple, just like how Servants are bound to their Master.

[Myname]

Caster: Grrreat...a Caster who can't cast spells...Shirou's mystic in the story is actually a leak of his reality marble. Shirou's origin is 'swords' (For more information on 'origin' please read Kara no Kyokai or pm me for details)

Ok, so a mystic is like a magical attack while magic is like transcending worlds, ressing people, summoning things and stuff like that?

What exactly is a "Phantasm"? I hear alot of these "Phantasms" from people that play melty blood. Noble Phantasm? Broken Phantasm?

What exactly is a "Marble"? I think theres something else besides a reality marble...

And lastly, Shirou's origin is swords? Explain please.

[Archer]

Originally Posted by Myname

Ok, so a mystic is like a magical attack while magic is like transcending worlds, ressing people, summoning things and stuff like that?

What exactly is a "Phantasm"? I hear alot of these "Phantasms" from people that play melty blood. Noble Phantasm? Broken Phantasm?

What exactly is a "Marble"? I think theres something else besides a reality marble...

And lastly, Shirou's origin is swords? Explain please.

Mystic - Otherwise known as sorcery. What you pretty much see everybody using in the war. The effects of sorcery can be replicated by current science. http://fuyuki.pbwiki.com/Magic#Thaumaturgy

Magic - Miracles. Magic allows people to do things that are impossible with current science. Anything that can be done with an infinite amount of time and resources with current science is not Magic. There are currently only 5 Magics left in the world, with even fewer amount of users. No participant of the Fifth Heaven's Feel was a true magic user. http://fuyuki.pbwiki.com/Magic#Magic

Noble Phantasm - A legendary artifact, crafted after other people's perceptions of it. Essentially, a legend given form. The attack strength of a Noble Phantasm is based upon how strong legends and other people perceive it to be. http://fuyuki.pbwiki.com/Artifact#NoblePhantasms

Broken Phantasm - Raising the attack value of a Noble Phantasm by essentially blowing it up. What you see Archer doing when he fires Caladborg II at Berserker.

Marble Phantasm - The ability to do anything that is possible within the realms of reality. If the chance of an event happening is not zero, then the Marble Phantasm can allow it to happen. Not seen in Fate/Stay Night.

Reality Marble - A "reality" that overrides the true reality. It is essentially the materialization of the user's soul. Everything within the Reality Marble must follow the rules within it, though that rule is often limited. However, it can even allow people to do things that are impossible in the true reality. Whenever a Reality Marble is deployed, the true reality tries to crush it, allowing the user only a few minutes to use it. Only a few sorcerers were able to obtain this sorcery. An imitation of Magic. http://fuyuki.pbwiki.com/Spells#RealityMarble

Origin - http://fuyuki.pbwiki.com/Magic#Origin Shirou's foundation is swords. The direction that his life will take is dependent on his foundation. Even if he can't do any other sorcery to save his life, he will at least be able to use sorcery regarding swords. This becomes rather obvious when you look at his Reality Marble, Unlimited Blade Works.

[mlai]

So Archer was using Broken Phantasm on his little boomerang scimitars and that's why they blew up when they hit Berserker?

So Shirou's "foundation" is kinda like his horoscope or spirit totem or something?

[Archer]

Technically, they're not meant to be used in that manner (oh, silly DEEN). There's several things in the anime that go against what is said in the game (Hello Avalon, Ea, Gilgamesh, God Hand, etc.). Personally, I have no idea whether those were Broken Phantasms or not. (I would think that they were, though.)

Here's what Fuyuki Wiki has to say on the matter:

Originally Posted by Fuyuki Wiki

Archer's normal use of it is meant to be through 2 series of X-shaped slashes overlayed over each other (and not thrown either) followed by a reinforced version of Kanshou and Bakuya in the final projection. This would be the winged version seen in the anime, Kanshou and Bakuya Overedge.

For Shirou's origin: It's kinda like a horoscope, as it represents the types of actions that Shirou will take. In a way, it does predict one's future, but not really.

And I forgot about one other Phantasm:

Last Phantasm

Originally Posted by Fuyuki Wiki

The greatest of Noble Phantasms. Excalibur falls into this category.

There's also the Artifical Phantasm, but the definition is pretty vague as to what it is. (It refers to Shirou using Archer's Arm)