[Game] Umineko - Spoilers, Theories, Interpretations

[DaBackpack]

Originally Posted by Judoh

Unless you use the Kanon personality was turned off trick this is impossible. Also the detective not seeing something is not a reason for them to pretend it's a reason to be suspicious that they do.

episode 2
Kanon was killed in this room

They definitely would not mistake any different person for Kanon!

Among the five people in Kyrie's group, he was the first to die.
In short, he was the 9th victim. (it's impossible for him to be the 9th victim in episode 4 and die at the start of all games)

I like your theory, Linkin Battler, but there's just a few things that interfere:

As mentioned before, Battler's sin does not involve Beatrice. I think this applies even if her name wasn't Beatrice at the same time.
Example: My name is Chris. I kill a man and change my name to Dave.
The statement Chris killed someone is as true as Dave killed someone

And, as was also mentioned before, there's the Kanon is already dead theory.

There can not be any other people named Kanon, since Kanon's name is exclusive or something like that.

Since Kanon is actually alive, doesn't this break the rule about the number of people on the island when the game starts?

Otherwise, your theory is very well thought out
Just need to iron out some of the inconsistencies is all.

[Laserworm]

Originally Posted by DgBarca

it was rude, I acknowledge it. But damn! Ryu07 is just messing around with us.
For me, if Kinzo corpse exist, Kinzo exist, but he is dead. I hate when people are messing aroud too much with definition of a term.
So for Ryu07 'existing' means 'alive', and I don't like that.

Also, is there any red truth that says that Kyrie's group has even been in Kuwadorian ? and that they even get into the underground secret path ? This part is suspicious to me, maybe they were killed before going into Kuwadorian ?

What happens to Kanon's corpse then? Battler looks everywhere but he can't find Kanon's corpse.

Japanese mysteries normally play around with words like that. Just read Detective Conan and you will see what I mean.

[Linkin Battler]

Originally Posted by Judoh

Unless you use the Kanon personality was turned off trick this is impossible. Also the detective not seeing something is not a reason for them to pretend it's a reason to be suspicious that they do.

episode 2
Kanon was killed in this room

They definitely would not mistake any different person for Kanon!

Among the five people in Kyrie's group, he was the first to die.
In short, he was the 9th victim. (it's impossible for him to be the 9th victim in episode 4 and die at the start of all games)

1st red text: There is no problem if she has been killed in Jessica's room, what's the matter?
2nd red text: Yes, in fact they did not mistake anyone for Kanon, they just lied! They said they saw Kanon while they did not!
3rd red text: ... well, you have a point for this xD I have to revise this point...

[MasterAlucard]

Originally Posted by DaBackpack

There can not be any other people named Kanon, since Kanon's name is exclusive or something like that.

I think it means Kanon TRUE name, and the kanon on rokkenjima never says his name.

[DgBarca]

Originally Posted by Laserworm

What happens to Kanon's corpse then? Battler looks everywhere but he can't find Kanon's corpse.

Japanese mysteries normally play around with words like that. Just read Detective Conan and you will see what I mean.

The place where the gold is hidden ? Well hiden in a bed of roses in the rose garden ? Thrown to the sea ? In th forest ? In Kinzo study ?
(Oh please don't go in a checkFINISHEDFINISHEDFINISHEDFINISHEDFINISHED please T_T)

[Laserworm]

Originally Posted by DgBarca

The place where the gold is hidden ? Well hiden in a bed of roses in the rose garden ? Thrown to the sea ? In th forest ? In Kinzo study ?
(Oh please don't go in a checkFINISHEDFINISHEDFINISHEDFINISHEDFINISHED please T_T)

Not like this point matters much.. Kanon is dead, we don't need to know more than that really. And he was the 9th victim..

[Judoh]

Originally Posted by MasterAlucard

I think it means Kanon TRUE name, and the kanon on rokkenjima never says his name.

Nope. This was a response to Battler's theory about someone mistaking Kanon for someone else not his true name.

Originally Posted by Battler

Then, just like the heredity of Kinzo's name, there is a possibility that Kanon's name was inherited by someone. You could suppose that Kanon-kun succeeded that name, and that this person attacked them!!

Originally Posted by Lambdadelta

The only one who can claim Kanon's name is the person himself!

[MasterAlucard]

Originally Posted by Judoh

Nope. This was a response to Battler's theory about someone mistaking Kanon for someone else not his true name.

Right, my bad. I really need to replay the question arc :/

[Linkin Battler]

Originally Posted by DaBackpack

I like your theory, Linkin Battler, but there's just a few things that interfere:

As mentioned before, Battler's sin does not involve Beatrice. I think this applies even if her name wasn't Beatrice at the same time.
Example: My name is Chris. I kill a man and change my name to Dave.
The statement Chris killed someone is as true as Dave killed someone

And, as was also mentioned before, there's the Kanon is already dead theory.

There can not be any other people named Kanon, since Kanon's name is exclusive or something like that.

Since Kanon is actually alive, doesn't this break the rule about the number of people on the island when the game starts?

Otherwise, your theory is very well thought out
Just need to iron out some of the inconsistencies is all.

Well, remember there are two Battler, so even if Battler2 has committed murder I can say both
Ushiromiya Battler has committed murder!
and
Ushiromiya Battler has not committed murder!

As it regards Kanon... well, I have to think about it D:

[Judoh]

Originally Posted by DgBarca

The place where the gold is hidden ? Well hiden in a bed of roses in the rose garden ? Thrown to the sea ? In th forest ? In Kinzo study ?
(Oh please don't go in a checkFINISHEDFINISHEDFINISHEDFINISHEDFINISHED please T_T)

LyricalAura has already raised the point that it's possible that Kinzo's corpse in episode 4 was actually Kanon's. And that Beatrice set the game up like that as a troll to Battler.

[DgBarca]

Originally Posted by Judoh

LyricalAura has already raised the point that it's possible that Kinzo's corpse in episode 4 was actually Kanon's. And that Beatrice set the game up like that as a troll to Battler.

A question.
Who exactly planned EP4 ?
I am talking about EP5 OP here, you know, Virgilia portrait in 4th (u_u).

[Judoh]

Originally Posted by DgBarca

A question.
Who exactly planned EP4 ?
I am talking about EP5 OP here, you know, Virgilia portrait in 4th (u_u).

The Virgilia portrait isn't actually canon. It's from a fanart somebody made.

[DgBarca]

Originally Posted by Judoh

The Virgilia portrait isn't actually canon. It's from a fanart somebody made.

Then EP5/6 EP is not canon ? How would Ryu07 put something like this here ?

[Linkin Battler]

Well... maybe I found something: it could be that it isn't always Kanon to be dead before the starting of the game, Beatrice is able to choose if killing Kanon or Shannon before the start of the game, in fact she takes always a long time to "prepare the game" (that should be the time she spend arranging everything with the humanBeato)...
In the first arc she killed Kanon, in the second it was the same, while in the third I don't think it makes any difference, while in the fourth she decided to kill Shannon, but I have to check the reds to see whether it is in contrast with something or not... However with the point of the two Battler I meant Beatrice could say
It is not something between Beatrice and Battler even though it was! But I think it is not for this, it is that Beatrice is the title of the witchBeato while the sin regarded humanBeato (whose name wasn't Beatrice probably)... However there are a lot of ways out for this, the thing that worries me the most is the Kanon problem...

@Judoh: I love the picture of your avatar *__* Can you give it to me? XD *loves Natsuhi*

[Judoh]

Originally Posted by DgBarca

Then EP5/6 EP is not canon ? How would Ryu07 put something like this here ?

No the episodes are canon. He just used a closeup on a fanart picture to get that in the opening. It's not actually his art. He probably just likes being flashy.

[Marion]

The Virgilia portrait seen in the EP 5 OP comes from the EP 4 DVD boxart. It was created by the same person who did all the other witch portraits.

Spoiler for large image:

Ryukishi never got a portrait of Virgilia made, but wanted to include her since she's obviously one of the Endless Witches.

[DgBarca]

So, in fact, it's Ryu07 trolling us again ?

[Laserworm]

Originally Posted by Linkin Battler

Well... maybe I found something: it could be that it isn't always Kanon to be dead before the starting of the game, Beatrice is able to choose if killing Kanon or Shannon before the start of the game, in fact she takes always a long time to "prepare the game" (that should be the time she spend arranging everything with the humanBeato)...
In the first arc she killed Kanon, in the second it was the same, while in the third I don't think it makes any difference, while in the fourth she decided to kill Shannon, but I have to check the reds to see whether it is in contrast with something or not... However with the point of the two Battler I meant Beatrice could say
It is not something between Beatrice and Battler even though it was! But I think it is not for this, it is that Beatrice is the title of the witchBeato while the sin regarded humanBeato (whose name wasn't Beatrice probably)... However there are a lot of ways out for this, the thing that worries me the most is the Kanon problem...

Then the whole thing about Battler's sin is about the other Battler... which makes things pointless. The red only effects character's relevant to the story. And if the red doesn't effect all names the character has, it is pointless. Sayo and Yoshida killed everyone they are never mentioned in the red...

[Marion]

Originally Posted by DgBarca

So, in fact, it's Ryu07 trolling us again ?

I don't see how Ryukishi is trolling just because he put an image of Virgilia in the EP 5 OP, that came from the EP 4 boxart.

[DgBarca]

Originally Posted by Marion

I don't see how Ryukishi is trolling just because he put an image of Virgilia in the EP 5 OP, that came from the EP 4 boxart.

Well, it's just plain WEIRD !
Hum, so tomorrow I will work on Erika's case. Bye for now.