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Old 2020-09-16, 11:44   Link #261
Metaneo
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That was actually just Emilia's mind breaking and regressing thanks to a lack of Subaru and Puck + Roswaal's bullshit.

I also like Roswaal's implication at the end. Every time Subaru has gotten a Dead End, THAT timeline simply continues on without him.
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Old 2020-09-16, 11:47   Link #262
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Originally Posted by Metaneo View Post
That was actually just Emilia's mind breaking and regressing thanks to a lack of Subaru and Puck + Roswaal's bullshit.

I also like Roswaal's implication at the end. Every time Subaru has gotten a Dead End, THAT timeline simply continues on without him.
So Emilia is just one really bad day away from thinking more like Satella ?

It's definitely a very tragic reading of Return By Death...
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Old 2020-09-16, 12:30   Link #263
Klashikari
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Jeez, they couldn't leave Frederica and Petra alone, including the rest of the village? Why do they need to take everybody out ?
It is because of Elsa and Maylie contract. Their client ordered them to kill 2 maids, a hikki and a spirit (Ram was never considered to be part of that and it was an irregular for that specific loop).
Considering how Elsa described her info back then and this time, there is little to no doubt Roswaal did that. Since he knows about Subaru's ability, he probably went super heavy handed to "motivate" Subaru.
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I was about to take some solace that at least they killled Elsa, but even that didn't stick. Jeez, what's it going to take to beat her ?
My guess is that they can't do anything except figuring out how she revives herself or restrict her movements completely.
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Old 2020-09-16, 12:37   Link #264
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It is because of Elsa and Maylie contract. The person who hired them ordered them to kill 2 maids, a hikki and a spirit.
Considering how Elsa described her info back then and this time, there is little to no doubt Roswaal did that. Since he knows about Subaru's ability, he probably went super heavy handed to "motivate" Subaru.
Jeez, that's sadistic. But I guess not out of character for what we know Roswaal is willing to do to achieve his dream .
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My guess is that they can't do anything except figuring out how she revives herself or restrict her movements completely.
Well, Subaru knows now that just killing her body isn't enough to finish her, so he can probably let somebody know that can do something about it...I'm not sure if that's Beatrice .
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Old 2020-09-16, 12:40   Link #265
Irenesharda
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Everything that can go wrong, goes wrong this episode. Everybody dies. Roswall is a horrible bastard. Emilia went nuts. And Subaru is having a really, really, really bad day.
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Old 2020-09-16, 12:44   Link #266
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Originally Posted by Klashikari View Post
Considering how Elsa described her info back then and this time, there is little to no doubt Roswaal did that. Since he knows about Subaru's ability, he probably went super heavy handed to "motivate" Subaru.
Roswaal doesn't seem to understand other humans very well nor does he seem to understand Subaru all that well. Sure, everything he just revealed to Subaru is definitely going to motivate him, but I doubt it's going to be in a way Roswaal wants. Roswaal's tactics inspire defiance more than they do motivation.
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Old 2020-09-16, 12:58   Link #267
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I used quotes since it was probably not what he meant to do.
Rather, I suspect Roswaal pushing Subaru to his limits with very high stakes back to back hoping Subaru would give his all, just like how things went absolutely bonkers with his domain and the witch cult (most likely documented by the book too).

However, it is interesting to note that Roswaal was surprised by Subaru figuring out about the snow and regretted that, which also means he never intended to be exposed at all. Additionally, it seems Roswaal didn't know that Subaru has to die to reset time, thus his comment when he was still kicking Subaru. So even if it is the original book of wisdom, it seems Roswaal and Beatrice's books don't go in great details. This might also explain why Roswaal used such extreme methods.

My only assumption is that Roswaal is doing it for Echidna considering how he corrected Emilia regarding the "witch of greed" name, but I have no idea how it is connected to the dragon.
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Old 2020-09-16, 13:18   Link #268
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I'm wondering if Echidna was Roswaal's Emilia? That Roswaal was in Subaru's shoes originally? Or perhaps he still is? Perhaps Roswaal has his own return by death process so that whatever new line Subaru is on, Roswaal's mind advances as well.
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Old 2020-09-16, 13:22   Link #269
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Roswaal "state" doesn't get any update according to his last statement.
He cannot reset which is probably why he accepts his death every time (be it engulfed by the shadows or eaten by the rabbits). So he just knows Subaru can reset and plan accordingly. That's why Subaru is so baffled because there is no guarantee Subaru's actions could be in line with Roswaal's objectives.
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Old 2020-09-16, 13:32   Link #270
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My goodness...this went from a "good" route of a bad one in no time...is no loop safe?

So, Beatrice has been waiting all this time for the person to set her free...for 400 years. Man, that's hard...no wonder she behaves the way she does.

Maylie is revealed to be the girl in Arc 2 that misteriously disappeared. According to what Elsa previously said, Maylie has "quantity", and she has "quality" which I suppose it means between the two of them, she's the bigger threat...this is quickly proven when she somehow survived/regenerated(?) from being frozen and broken to pieces. Geez.
For a moment I thought Elsa was going to block the magic with her cloak like she did in Arc 1, but apparently it was unable to cancel Beatrice's magic.

Even though Beatrice protects Subaru from a fatal blow, he still gets injured before she activates what I assume is the magic stone pendant he was carrying, which warped him back to some ruins in Sanctuary.

Snow again, which was already a bad sign in a previous loop, and surely enough, when Subaru arrives at the tomb...Emilia was acting strange. Very strange...she was oddly clingy, acting cute and even saying she loves Subaru. He immediately noticed something was wrong and when to the main suspect: Roswaal.

Unfortunately, things don't go as planned, Roswaal was ready, he's always been. Even with Garfiel in tow, Roswaal seized the oppotunity when Ram got in the way, and killed them both...talk about ruthless.
As for the last words Roswaal said to Ram, and considering the world they're on...I think there was somekind of contract/bet between Roswaal and Ram, in which should he "lose", he would offer his soul to Ram...which I assume meant he'd dedicate his life to her.

The, Roswaal proceeds to "spill the beans", it was him all along, he set the stage in a way that would advance his secret agenda, all the allies, agreements and appointments, all for his ultimate goal...even Subaru is a piece in his plan. Probably the most important piece, because of his Return by Death, except Roswaal doesn't know how Subaru can "redo" events, and ironically intended to keep Subaru alive.

And just like the last time it snowed...the Great Rabbit showed up. Roswaall gave Subaru some uncanny advice and just...gave up, knowing the him in the next loop will do his job.

Somehow, Subaru manages to return to the tomb...but is badly injured, meanwhile Emilia is completely oblivious of his condition and continues to act cute, even giving him a lap pillow...and then, just as Subaru gave his last breath, she kissed him.

...This was quite the messed up loop. Things started well, but derailed in an instant.
I think we can safely assume Roswaal is the one who hired Elsa and Maylie...that should be obvious by now. But I think we can go even further and assume Arc 1 + 2 happened because Roswaal was pulling the strings behind the scenes...he could do it because of the perfect gospel he owns.
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Old 2020-09-16, 13:41   Link #271
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Maylie...that should be obvious by now. But I think we can go even further and assume Arc 1 + 2 happened because Roswaal was pulling the strings behind the scenes...he could do it because of the perfect gospel he owns.
Roswaal himself confirmed that in Episode 30 (S2 ep5). Subaru figured out Roswaal could have prevented the situation to go haywire since absolutely everyone but Emilia and Subaru knew that the cultists would attack her the moment she competes for the throne. By his own admission, Roswaal stated he let that happen so Emilia and Subaru could be seen as good guys.
Since we know about the book, it also explains why Roswaal "suddenly" decides to leave the mansion when Subaru had to deal with the puppy, then going MIA when they go to the capital, forcing Subaru and Rem to be on their own.
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Old 2020-09-16, 15:53   Link #272
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So I guess the main question I have right now is whether or not he got a new save point at any time or if he'll have to redo some of those great starting points of this loop again.

Also, what happened to the letter? Roswaal seemed to not know what Subaru was talking about there.
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Old 2020-09-16, 16:31   Link #273
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Everything that can go wrong, goes wrong this episode. Everybody dies. Roswall is a horrible bastard. Emilia went nuts. And Subaru is having a really, really, really bad day.
And the things Subaru needs to accomplish to clear this loop just keep piling on and on:

- Free Sanctuary by passing the Trials.

- Keep Emilia sane.

- Figure out what to do with all the Ryuzu clones.

- Figure out Garfiel's deal and his connection to Echidna.

- Figure out what Roswaal is up to and be wary of him, because if he thinks Subaru isn't on the ball he's fine with everyone dying if it means Subaru has a better chance in the next loop.

- Give Beatrice a reason to live.

- Stop Elsa.

- Stop Maylie. Elsa's dangerous enough but Maylie's seemingly got a bunch of Mabeast's under control and that was enough to defeat Frederica.

- Defeat the Great Rabbit.

This is starting to make fighting the White Whale and Petelgeuse look like a cakewalk...

I guess Subaru might focus his efforts on Sanctuary now since going to the mansion just seems to escalate things to where everybody dies. Now he knows what Beatrice's deal is and about Maylie, so the only thing he could really change by going to the mansion is telling Beatrice what Roswaal told him to tell her.
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So I guess the main question I have right now is whether or not he got a new save point at any time or if he'll have to redo some of those great starting points of this loop again.

Also, what happened to the letter? Roswaal seemed to not know what Subaru was talking about there.
I don't think Emilia got the letter. Roswaal didn't seem to know about it so I guess he wasn't the reason she didn't read it.
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Old 2020-09-16, 16:46   Link #274
Metaneo
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I doubt they can beat the Great Rabbit right now. That goal is probably more along the lines of:

- Get the fuck out before everyone is eaten alive
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Old 2020-09-16, 17:05   Link #275
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Or just prevent the snow from happening in the first place. If that's Roswall doing it to push Subaru ahead then Subaru just needs to do whatever he has to before Roswall has to resort to making it snow.
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Old 2020-09-16, 17:22   Link #276
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Or just prevent the snow from happening in the first place. If that's Roswall doing it to push Subaru ahead then Subaru just needs to do whatever he has to before Roswall has to resort to making it snow.
The only thing I can think of that Subaru could do to prevent Roswaal from interfering is making it look like Emilia can actually pass the Trials since he seems to be doing this to push them forward.
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Old 2020-09-16, 17:23   Link #277
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So... we got a "nice boat" ending this time
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Old 2020-09-16, 17:38   Link #278
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I doubt they can beat the Great Rabbit right now. That goal is probably more along the lines of:

- Get the fuck out before everyone is eaten alive
Though, considering Subaru declared to Daphne that he'd defeat the Great Rabbit...the plot will probably be heading that way
Not to mention that that feat would improve Emilia's standing in the royal selection...which is probably part of Roswaal's plans.
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Old 2020-09-16, 18:52   Link #279
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I very much doubt Subaru's save point was updated since it's clear leaving Sanctuary was a mistake. He was teleported back there by Beatrice and everything was already completely fucked. And here we thought he was off to a great start this time.

Roswaal is completely twisted. I wasn't expecting him to kill Ram in cold blood. Other than that, nothing too surprising. His end goal is most likely Echidna's resurrection.

This loop is hard. All I know is that Subaru needs to start with helping Emilia pass the trials.
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Old 2020-09-16, 18:54   Link #280
Irenesharda
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Though, considering Subaru declared to Daphne that he'd defeat the Great Rabbit...the plot will probably be heading that way
Not to mention that that feat would improve Emilia's standing in the royal selection...which is probably part of Roswaal's plans.
I'm not so sure that's part of the plan anymore. I don't think making Emilia go totally insane would help that any.
I feel like this whole royal selection whatever is just one of many cogs in Roswaal's plan and honestly he doesn't care at all about Emilia, the selection, or anything like that. The way he was talking at the end suggests that he's thrown away everything and everyone except one person (I'm guessing Echidna?) in order to fulfill his wish and desire, whatever it is.
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