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Frontier · 2023-02-20, 12:05

Einar and Arnheid are getting pretty chummy! He can make her laugh, she thinks he's a good person, and they seem to genuinely enjoy each others' company. Even Thorfinn can read the room a little

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Of course Arnheid gets a more frost (and violent) reception from the mistress of the house...although beyond not immediately fulfilling her obligations as a slave, there's probably more than one reason the mistress doesn't like Arnheid

.

Einar praying so hard for the harvest...the man is nothing if not enthusiastic (especially with the prospect of freedom and maybe, if he's lucky, buying Arnheid's freedom too). Then he even ropes Thorfinn into praying. Like, what even is Thorfinn's belief system at this point? The Norse Gods? Although Einar is surprisingly progressive insofar as you just pray for whatever gets them rain. And a deer is watching them act like idiots the whole time

.

So the master has another son, Thorgil, who seems like the warrior Olmar wishes he was. He's even chummy with Snake, who apparently helped train him or sharpen his skills. Although as jovial and open a man as he is, he's pretty hardcore and dangerous too. Like when he makes a necklace of the ears of Englishmen he's killed or seemed to get off on beating Sture up. Definitely not someone who you want to get on the bad side of

.

Nothing pretty much sums up how much it sucks to be a woman in this era than seeing a naked woman desperately clinging to herself as two men fight each other over who gets to sell her and/or rape her

.

These poor kids...I mean, their dad is gone and probably dead, their mom is sick, and they have a baby sibling. Can you really blame them for trying to steal to provide for their family? Although this isn't the kind of setting where you can get a slap on the wrist for that due to extenuating circumstances, and Pater did the best he could to come up with a solution that basically saves the kids and saves face for the farm. Not even Snake wanted them to cut the poor kids' arms off

.

I had a feeling "Iron Fist Ketil" was an exaggeration just for how ridiculous it sounded and Ketil seems far too weak-willed and compassionate to have been the kind of beast in combat his legend makes him out to be. He was basically strung along in deciding the fate of the kids and probably had to muster all that he had just to hit Sture, and that was for Sture's sake

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Sture...you were a very good big brother in this episode

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So Arnheid is also Ketil's personal assistant in the more intimate, physical, sense...because he's so desperate for affection and someone who understands him, and is kind to him, that he craves Arnheid. So, yeah, Einar is crushing on the boss' main squeeze. That should end well

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Kanon · 2023-02-20, 19:41

In case there were any doubts, this episode should put them to rest. Yes, Ketil is as nice as he appears to be. If it were up to him alone, he would have let the kids get away scot-free and even offered help. Unfortunately, he has to keep up appearances and to make things worse, his eldest son who terrifies him just happened to be visiting. And I think he's right to be terrified, I doubt Thorgil would hesitate to kill his father if he were to learn how soft he is.

Master_Yoma · 2023-02-20, 21:45

Ketil just putting up a front but have to do what needs to be done with those thieves but at less that boy really stepped up to protect his sister

Amarantine · 2023-02-21, 09:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanon

In case there were any doubts, this episode should put them to rest. Yes, Ketil is as nice as he appears to be.

In one sense, yes. Certainly towards the children. But I would say the end of the episode revealed he too has a darker side. While he poured his soul to Arnheid, even though she gave him words of comfort (since he is, after all, her master), she looked absolutely dead inside when he wasn't looking at her, which I doubt would be the case if their relationship was truly and fully consensual. The truth is she is not just his slave, but also his sex slave, regardless of how resigned to the role though she may appear to be. This also further contextualizes the abuse she received earlier in the episode from Ketil's wife, who probably knows about it and unsurprisingly isn't pleased with it.

Speaking of that last scene, in the manga Arnheid was actually stark naked, but it's not surprising that would have to be censored in an anime adaptation. And it was a very powerful scene regardless.

Frontier · 2023-02-21, 10:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amarantine

In one sense, yes. Certainly towards the children. But I would say the end of the episode revealed he too has a darker side. While he poured his soul to Arnheid, even though she gave him words of comfort (since he is, after all, her master), she looked absolutely dead inside when he wasn't looking at her, which I doubt would be the case if their relationship was truly and fully consensual. The truth is she is not just his slave, but also his sex slave, regardless of how resigned to the role though she may appear to be. This also further contextualizes the abuse she received earlier in the episode from Ketil's wife, who probably knows about it and unsurprisingly isn't pleased with it.

And stands in stark contrast to how Arnheid is with Einar

.

Quote:

Speaking of that last scene, in the manga Arnheid was actually stark naked, but it's not surprising that would have to be censored in an anime adaptation. And it was a very powerful scene regardless.

I was thinking to myself "wait, wasn't she originally naked in this scene?"

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I guess they hit their naked lady quota with the poor girl in the battlefield scene...

serenade_beta · 2023-02-21, 17:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amarantine

Speaking of that last scene, in the manga Arnheid was actually stark naked, but it's not surprising that would have to be censored in an anime adaptation. And it was a very powerful scene regardless.

Kinda weird censor, since during his son's flashback of two guys killing each other for a girl, the girl was naked (covered in a blanket) so that's okay
They could have made it a bit more obvious he was having fun with her at night than just a nightgown

Guardian Enzo · 2023-02-21, 18:01

I don’t think it was any less than completely obvious.

Kanon · 2023-02-21, 18:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amarantine

In one sense, yes. Certainly towards the children. But I would say the end of the episode revealed he too has a darker side. While he poured his soul to Arnheid, even though she gave him words of comfort (since he is, after all, her master), she looked absolutely dead inside when he wasn't looking at her, which I doubt would be the case if their relationship was truly and fully consensual. The truth is she is not just his slave, but also his sex slave, regardless of how resigned to the role though she may appear to be. This also further contextualizes the abuse she received earlier in the episode from Ketil's wife, who probably knows about it and unsurprisingly isn't pleased with it.

Speaking of that last scene, in the manga Arnheid was actually stark naked, but it's not surprising that would have to be censored in an anime adaptation. And it was a very powerful scene regardless.

I wouldn't call her his sex slave, since he genuinely seems to love her and seeks emotional comfort from her as well. Of course, the very fact she's his slave makes it impossible for the relationship to be consensual since she'd be too afraid to say no, but Ketil strikes me as naive enough to think she actually loves him and not realize what he's actually doing.

Wandering Soul · 2023-02-21, 20:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kanon

I wouldn't call her his sex slave, since he genuinely seems to love her and seeks emotional comfort from her as well. Of course, the very fact she's his slave makes it impossible for the relationship to be consensual since she'd be too afraid to say no, but Ketil strikes me as naive enough to think she actually loves him and not realize what he's actually doing.

Sorry, but the fact that Ketil cares for her doesn't change the fact thst she can't consent and is his property in everyway. Sex slave seems accurate to me regardless of what Ketil wants to believe.

Mad Pierrot · 2023-02-22, 06:37

The moral in this episode confused me. Like who are supposed to care. Ketil is the one using the slaves but Snake and the others are not positive influences either. In fact, the child abuse was made by these guys together.

Kanon · 2023-02-22, 07:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wandering Soul

Sorry, but the fact that Ketil cares for her doesn't change the fact thst she can't consent and is his property in everyway. Sex slave seems accurate to me regardless of what Ketil wants to believe.

Oh, what he's doing is definitely wrong, whether he realizes it or not. I think sex slave is not accurate because he doesn't just use her for sex, but maybe I have a warped definition of it.

Amarantine · 2023-02-22, 10:05

Yeah, semantics aside, that was really my main point, that even Ketil has a darker side to him because he is doing something very wrong. Largely because Arnheid is his slave and therefore can't consent, of course, but even if she wasn't, he'd still be cheating on his wife. And probably not even trying very hard to hide it, which is why she almost certainly knows about the affair, as was hinted by her "shipping" Arnheid with Einar earlier in the episode.

Frontier · 2023-02-22, 12:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mad Pierrot

The moral in this episode confused me. Like who are supposed to care. Ketil is the one using the slaves but Snake and the others are not positive influences either. In fact, the child abuse was made by these guys together.

Snake was just doing his job. He advocated for a lighter punishment for the kids too.

Guardian Enzo · 2023-02-22, 18:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frontier

Snake was just doing his job. He advocated for a lighter punishment for the kids too.

I see Snake as a smart and practical man, and unsentimental. I don't blame him for what happened with the kids. I will say, though, that his seemingly close relationship with Thorgil (who seems to be monstrous) made me rethink my initial positive assessment of Snake to a degree.

Kanon · 2023-02-22, 18:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo

I see Snake as a smart and practical man, and unsentimental. I don't blame him for what happened with the kids. I will say, though, that his seemingly close relationship with Thorgil (who seems to be monstrous) made me rethink my initial positive assessment of Snake to a degree.

His men being rather horrible and Snake himself being laid-back gave the false impression he was a good guy. If he had been ordered to kill the kids, he might have protested but he would have ultimately done it and wouldn't have lost any sleep over it. He has a cool attitude but he's still a warrior.

Guardian Enzo · 2023-02-22, 20:52

I’m not sure we can blame him for his men being scoundrels. Even at the best of times mercenaries are a rough lot, and these were hardly the best of times. The recruiting pool is basically men who would rather kill for money than country. Of course, Snake is a mercenary himself…

The thing is, Snake is at the very least not a mass-produced model. He’s literate, a rarity for the day. He’s close with the Old Master, who we can pretty reliably say is among the wiser and more trustworthy figures in the cast.

Frontier · 2023-02-22, 21:00

He's probably decent as far as the typical men or trained combatant of this era goes...not someone on the level of, say, Thors as far as character but he's just someone making his living for himself and his men and not looking too far past that.

He's at least not someone who seems to relish or revel in violence or the battlefield like Thorgil seems to be, despite how chummy they are.

Guardian Enzo · 2023-02-22, 21:11

He could just be chummy with Thorgil because he’s the master’s son, I suppose. It’s good politics.

Frontier · 2023-02-23, 00:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo

He could just be chummy with Thorgil because he’s the master’s son, I suppose. It’s good politics.

I dunno, it seemed more genuine to me. And that they actually trained together.

Though just because they're chummy doesn't mean Snake approves of Thorgil's viciousness.

Guardian Enzo · 2023-02-23, 05:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frontier

I dunno, it seemed more genuine to me. And that they actually trained together.

Though just because they're chummy doesn't mean Snake approves of Thorgil's viciousness.

No, it doesn't. And I don't think they trained together - I think Snake trained Thorgil. At least that's how I read the situation.

2023-02-20, 12:05	Link #121
Frontier Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2013	Einar and Arnheid are getting pretty chummy! He can make her laugh, she thinks he's a good person, and they seem to genuinely enjoy each others' company. Even Thorfinn can read the room a little . Of course Arnheid gets a more frost (and violent) reception from the mistress of the house...although beyond not immediately fulfilling her obligations as a slave, there's probably more than one reason the mistress doesn't like Arnheid . Einar praying so hard for the harvest...the man is nothing if not enthusiastic (especially with the prospect of freedom and maybe, if he's lucky, buying Arnheid's freedom too). Then he even ropes Thorfinn into praying. Like, what even is Thorfinn's belief system at this point? The Norse Gods? Although Einar is surprisingly progressive insofar as you just pray for whatever gets them rain. And a deer is watching them act like idiots the whole time . So the master has another son, Thorgil, who seems like the warrior Olmar wishes he was. He's even chummy with Snake, who apparently helped train him or sharpen his skills. Although as jovial and open a man as he is, he's pretty hardcore and dangerous too. Like when he makes a necklace of the ears of Englishmen he's killed or seemed to get off on beating Sture up. Definitely not someone who you want to get on the bad side of . Nothing pretty much sums up how much it sucks to be a woman in this era than seeing a naked woman desperately clinging to herself as two men fight each other over who gets to sell her and/or rape her . These poor kids...I mean, their dad is gone and probably dead, their mom is sick, and they have a baby sibling. Can you really blame them for trying to steal to provide for their family? Although this isn't the kind of setting where you can get a slap on the wrist for that due to extenuating circumstances, and Pater did the best he could to come up with a solution that basically saves the kids and saves face for the farm. Not even Snake wanted them to cut the poor kids' arms off . I had a feeling "Iron Fist Ketil" was an exaggeration just for how ridiculous it sounded and Ketil seems far too weak-willed and compassionate to have been the kind of beast in combat his legend makes him out to be. He was basically strung along in deciding the fate of the kids and probably had to muster all that he had just to hit Sture, and that was for Sture's sake . Sture...you were a very good big brother in this episode . So Arnheid is also Ketil's personal assistant in the more intimate, physical, sense...because he's so desperate for affection and someone who understands him, and is kind to him, that he craves Arnheid. So, yeah, Einar is crushing on the boss' main squeeze. That should end well . __________________

2023-02-20, 19:41	Link #122
Kanon Kana Hanazawa ♥ Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: France Age: 36	In case there were any doubts, this episode should put them to rest. Yes, Ketil is as nice as he appears to be. If it were up to him alone, he would have let the kids get away scot-free and even offered help. Unfortunately, he has to keep up appearances and to make things worse, his eldest son who terrifies him just happened to be visiting. And I think he's right to be terrified, I doubt Thorgil would hesitate to kill his father if he were to learn how soft he is. __________________

2023-02-20, 21:45	Link #123
Master_Yoma Nekokota Festival Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Lost in the Fairy Forest	Ketil just putting up a front but have to do what needs to be done with those thieves but at less that boy really stepped up to protect his sister __________________

2023-02-22, 06:37	Link #130
Mad Pierrot Corrupted fool Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Would you be my girlfriend? Age: 32	The moral in this episode confused me. Like who are supposed to care. Ketil is the one using the slaves but Snake and the others are not positive influences either. In fact, the child abuse was made by these guys together. __________________

2023-02-22, 21:00	Link #137
Frontier Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2013	He's probably decent as far as the typical men or trained combatant of this era goes...not someone on the level of, say, Thors as far as character but he's just someone making his living for himself and his men and not looking too far past that. He's at least not someone who seems to relish or revel in violence or the battlefield like Thorgil seems to be, despite how chummy they are. __________________

2023-02-22, 10:05	Link #132
Amarantine Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2014	Yeah, semantics aside, that was really my main point, that even Ketil has a darker side to him because he is doing something very wrong. Largely because Arnheid is his slave and therefore can't consent, of course, but even if she wasn't, he'd still be cheating on his wife. And probably not even trying very hard to hide it, which is why she almost certainly knows about the affair, as was hinted by her "shipping" Arnheid with Einar earlier in the episode.