[Game] Umineko - Spoilers, Theories, Interpretations

[AC-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Klashikari

Belphegor is called sloth, but that doesn't mean she is lazy herself.
She is actually the most serious among the 7 sisters, trying hard so her master doesn't do anything and turns slowly into a lazy pig.

There are descriptions of all sisters in Episode 2- => 4.

Actually, you can say she is the only demon among the 7 sisters that does her job properly. The other girls don't exactly affect others with their own sin, except perhaps Belzee with her nonstop talk about food, and Asmo with her dream for the perfect boyfriend.

I can't completely agree on that.
it might be true for Belphagor, but the other girls do fit their sin

Other 4:

Lucifer: Has far too much pride to admit that she is actually really weak, also backs off immediately when she felt humiliated

Mammon: Well she is greedy, even her profile says it.

Satan: Easy to provoke/ or at least always acts like she is angry

Lev: See her conversation withy Kyrie

Originally Posted by blitz1/2

I say it's more that Erika lost faith in herself and that resulted in her existence being erased (and Bernkastel wasn't present herself)

Well, my theory still would fit.
Ah yeah, I made a typeo there. It was supposed to be 'brought' there by [...]. - I didn't mean that Bern was there herself.


My understanding of defeating Umineko witches(in this case Bern) :

The miracle Bern brought forth got denied by the red truth, so that miracle never occured and Berns Spell has therefore lost its power. Resulting in Erika becoming what she should have been from the start. - A dead body washed up on the shore.
Of course the red truth didn't deny Berns existance, just Erika's, so she was the only one affected.
I won't say Bern couldn't have saved her easily if she had been there.


To summerize:
You have to somehow deny what they stand for. I can't give an example for Bern though, I also wouldn't want to be in the position where I had to do that...

Examples for Lamda are easier, but still hard...

Well it's not really good, but it proves my point:
Maybe a bulb? It is certain that it will gie off light as soon as you trigger the switch, yet there is a possibility that it won't happen.

So Lamda says the bulb will certainly give off light, then Bern counters with a red truth that the bulb is already broken --> Not a kill but at least a red spear through her body

Well I'm drifitng off... So back to Erika:

Lets recap Battlers and Beato's words:
'even if you join us, there are still only 17 people on Ro[..]

There are several red thruths about name-misleadings, so there really are 17 persons on the island.

[Klashikari]

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

I can't completely agree on that.
it might be true for Belphagor, but the other girls do fit their sin

Other 4:

Lucifer: Has far too much pride to admit that she is actually really weak, also backs off immediately when she felt humiliated

Mammon: Well she is greedy, even her profile says it.

Satan: Easy to provoke/ or at least always acts like she is angry

Lev: See her conversation withy Kyrie

I never said they don't match their sin. I said: Belphegor is the only one that actually does her "job", as in: perverting humans with their associated sin.

[Renall]

As things roll in, it does appear that...

Spoiler for vague spoilers but spoilers all the same:

ryukishi is trying to confirm just about every single popular "fan theory" at once. It's a mess, obviously, and the more it happens, the more suspicious I get as to whether that was the intention behind the whole "Bernkastel GM" thing all along. I would not be surprised if all of it is bunk, but if it is, there ain't many theories left standing.

[Tyabann]

Originally Posted by Renall

As things roll in, it does appear that...

Spoiler for vague spoilers but spoilers all the same:

ryukishi is trying to confirm just about every single popular "fan theory" at once. It's a mess, obviously, and the more it happens, the more suspicious I get as to whether that was the intention behind the whole "Bernkastel GM" thing all along. I would not be surprised if all of it is bunk, but if it is, there ain't many theories left standing.

It only looks like a mess because no one on 4chan understands Japanese as well as they think they do.

[Renall]

They're also cross-purposes lying to each other, but those are somewhat more obvious.

EDIT: Also yaoi pairings.

[Tyabann]

Originally Posted by Renall

EDIT: Also yaoi pairings.

I'm not even convinced that Lion's actually a guy.

Also from 4chan:

EVA

ANGE

LION

EVANGELION

[blitz1/2]

Originally Posted by AC-Phoenix

I can't completely agree on that.
it might be true for Belphagor, but the other girls do fit their sin

Other 4:

Lucifer: Has far too much pride to admit that she is actually really weak, also backs off immediately when she felt humiliated

Mammon: Well she is greedy, even her profile says it.

Satan: Easy to provoke/ or at least always acts like she is angry

Lev: See her conversation withy Kyrie




Well, my theory still would fit.
Ah yeah, I made a typeo there. It was supposed to be 'brought' there by [...]. - I didn't mean that Bern was there herself.


My understanding of defeating Umineko witches(in this case Bern) :

The miracle Bern brought forth got denied by the red truth, so that miracle never occured and Berns Spell has therefore lost its power. Resulting in Erika becoming what she should have been from the start. - A dead body washed up on the shore.
Of course the red truth didn't deny Berns existance, just Erika's, so she was the only one affected.
I won't say Bern couldn't have saved her easily if she had been there.


To summerize:
You have to somehow deny what they stand for. I can't give an example for Bern though, I also wouldn't want to be in the position where I had to do that...

Examples for Lamda are easier, but still hard...

Well it's not really good, but it proves my point:
Maybe a bulb? It is certain that it will gie off light as soon as you trigger the switch, yet there is a possibility that it won't happen.

So Lamda says the bulb will certainly give off light, then Bern counters with a red truth that the bulb is already broken --> Not a kill but at least a red spear through her body

Well I'm drifitng off... So back to Erika:

Lets recap Battlers and Beato's words:
'even if you join us, there are still only 17 people on Ro[..]

There are several red thruths about name-misleadings, so there really are 17 persons on the island.

Well, to me, it's just like when Battler's existence was denied by Beato in Ep4. For a moment, he didn't exist anymore.
Well, if you also go by Kinzo = Battler as well as Shkanon, then you can fit Erika in there.

But I am more thinking on the points of "Even though we invite you," it's just Beato/Battler way of saying "you aren't in our game" since there is also no timeframe involved, which may also mean EP1-4.

@Kaisos: Ryu's up to something, maybe giant mecha is possible afterall. xD

[Renall]

Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon

I'm not even convinced that Lion's actually a guy.

Whoever it is certainly isn't doing much to correct that misunderstanding.

Anyway, even if every word of every supposed spoiler were true, Bernkastel is still the GM. If I accepted every single thing said was in ep7, I'd still wonder if it isn't all going to come crashing down at the end of the story or one of the tea parties.

[TheWitch0fDivinty]

Also from 4chan:

EVA

ANGE

LION

EVANGELION

:,D That was awesome...

[Judoh]

Originally Posted by Renall

As things roll in, it does appear that...

Spoiler for vague spoilers but spoilers all the same:

ryukishi is trying to confirm just about every single popular "fan theory" at once. It's a mess, obviously, and the more it happens, the more suspicious I get as to whether that was the intention behind the whole "Bernkastel GM" thing all along. I would not be surprised if all of it is bunk, but if it is, there ain't many theories left standing.

I thought you weren't convinced that the spoilers so far weren't fake?

Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon

I'm not even convinced that Lion's actually a guy.

Also from 4chan:

EVA

ANGE

LION

EVANGELION

I suppose it could also come out as "Evangeline".

However Evangelion is 11 characters. Epitaph key maybe? j/k.

[Renall]

Originally Posted by Judoh

I thought you weren't convinced that the spoilers so far weren't fake?

I'm not, the point is at this point you could say "this happened in ep7" and be telling the truth and I'm not entirely sure it isn't itself "fake" because Bernkastel is Bernkastel.

If Bern wants to portray Gohda as a secret assassin with amazing stake-throwing powers and x-ray vision, and that actually happens in ep7, it wouldn't be a fake spoiler, but it might as well be if it isn't actually true. We might have had that assurance before Chiru, but now I'm not so sure anymore.

Not many people seem to have gotten to the end, so which parts are gospel and which parts are Bern being Bern I don't know.

[Judoh]

Question, probably not true, but is the Kanji for "Rion" the same as the "Raian" In Toraian, Kuwadorian, etc?

[Escargotage]

From 2ch, and found it a bit interesting, possibly the end credits roll or just a scene towards the end.

Spoiler for EP7:

"Kinzo: Massacred his family by setting up a bomb
Krauss: Concealed his father's death
Natsuhi: Dropped Lion off a cliff
Eva: Carelessly killed her elder brother's wife in a scuffle
Hideyoshi: Carelessly killed his brother-in-law in a scuffle
Rudolf: Killed for pleasure (?)
Kyrie: Massacred
Rosa: Killed her sister-in-law
Jessica: Love on the brain
George: Love on the brain
Battler: Incompetent
Maria: Delusional
Ange: Delusional

This family is hopeless."

And original

金蔵：一族皆殺し爆弾を仕掛ける
蔵臼：父親の死を隠蔽
夏妃：りおんを崖から突き落とす
絵羽：取っ組み合いでうっかり兄嫁を殺す
秀吉：取っ組み合いでうっかり義兄を殺す
留弗夫：快楽殺人に目覚める
霧江：みなごろし
楼座：腹違いの姉を殺す
朱志香：恋愛脳
譲治：恋愛脳
戦人：無能
真里亞：電波
縁寿：電波

駄目だこの一族

[AC-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Renall

Whoever it is certainly isn't doing much to correct that misunderstanding.

Anyway, even if every word of every supposed spoiler were true, Bernkastel is still the GM. If I accepted every single thing said was in ep7, I'd still wonder if it isn't all going to come crashing down at the end of the story or one of the tea parties.

Thats my point, if you really want to have Erika existing on the island...


But well we should be able to figure out the EP1 cultprint after just 4 episodes...

Until know we learned that

closed rooms:
- No murder has happened
- Never was a closed room to begin with

Murderer:
- Definitely had an accomplice

Oct 6,
- Explosion of some kind, the only save place:
Where the gold is hidden (imho the hidden mansions basement)

All for EP 1

Important stuff:
- ALL servants are said to posess a master key, because Natsuhi thought they would get sloppy if they exchancged the keys during a shift changeover
- An unknown number X of total Master keys exists
- Neither Battler nor the player has a way of knowing how many keys were on the island (Supported by Beato's EP 2 statement that the unknown number of keys put her at a disadvantage)


The shed:

Things to think about:

- was it really locked?
- where all of them really dead? (only 5 bodies in Battler's vision)

Reds: The identity of all the dead is confirmed(?)

solution:

- the murderer wanted to put the servants under suspision and therefore returned the key to the servant quarters, so it never was a closed room. The distortion of the faces happened to hide the true reason for their deaths

Eva-Hideyoshi

Questions:
- how could the murderer set the chain
- are both really dead or is one just a natural actor?

reds:
Both were killed by other people
The only way to enter the room is through the door

solution:

- Shown by Battler in EP 6, the cultprint was hiding somewhere and escaped while the rest wasn't watching, probably in the closet or behind the door.


Genji, Nanja Kuwasawa- room:

reds:
all were killed by other people
Maria, who was with them is not the cultprint

questions:
- how did the cultprint get in
- why was maria so obedient
- how could the cultprint create this closed room

solution:

The room never was a closed room to begin with, there are several possibilities how the cultprint could have come in the room, for example maria letting him in or hiding there, knowing that the parlor was the safest room after the study.
There is no proof that Maria really had to face the wall the whole time.

A sidenote: All rooms the rooms have a common feature:

You need a key to lock/unlock them from outside, but you don't need one to lock/unlock them from inside.

Natsuhi's semi-closed room:

I say semi-closed becausethe chances that Natsuhi locked the parlor herself are pretty high. The 'room' itself was open from nearly every ankle.

Reds:
Natsuhi was killed by another person, a real one who pulled the trigger
The bullet in Natsuhi's forehead was not shot from her gun

possible solutions:
- Someone placed a letter at point x, where they wanted her to stand. They could therefore use a remote trigger to kill her. This way the red is not violated.

- The perpetrator was still outside the room and waited for Natsuhi to return, hiding in the shadows


The explosion:

Reds: ?

Solution:
- A bomb
- The boiler (very unlikely imho, just look at the Myth busters boiler exploion results... It would have to be an enormous boilder to archieve such a result...)
- Battler accidentally hit a gas tube while shooting at the Beatrice picture.
A gas explosion is more likely to cause such a huge explosion than a boiler. I have to admit that I never got much positve response to that idea, still it is a possibility



Leftover suspects:
Remote trigger: George, Jessica
Non-Remote trigger: Shannon, (Kanon)

Accomplice: Maria

[Tyabann]

Originally Posted by Escargotage

*snip*

Pretty sure that's just their assessment of the characters and not in the actual game.

[Escargotage]

Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon

Pretty sure that's just their assessment of the characters and not in the actual game.

Ah, thank you for the info.

[TsundereCake]

I still have no idea what's real or what's fake with Episode 7

"Anon 1: SHKANONTRICE CONFIRMED!
Anon 2: SHKANONTRICE DENIED!"

Usually by this time I have at least an inkling of what's going on in the Ep.... I'm not even sure what the plot is with this one

;_;

[Renall]

It's different, and it's not focusing on the things pretty much anybody expected it to focus on, and people are reading a lot of things into it that probably aren't there. But some could be. But even if they are, this is Bern's game. So... well.

[Kitsu]

I still have no idea what's real or what's fake with Episode 7

"Anon 1: SHKANONTRICE CONFIRMED!
Anon 2: SHKANONTRICE DENIED!"

Usually by this time I have at least an inkling of what's going on in the Ep.... I'm not even sure what the plot is with this one

;_;

I think the problem is that there is no clean line between spoiler and speculation from 2ch. People seem to take that everything that is written down on 2ch directly as spoiler while it only might be speculation or interpretation from that poster.
I guess we will only know when we get our hands on the episode.

[Volcanic]

Excellent explanation of this alternate universe we seem to be in, for those curious.

Personally I'm wondering where everyone else is- we've seen Kyrie, MARIA, Bern, Shannon, Krauss and Eva but no other old characters that I can think of.