Claymore Chapter 118

[Claymore!]

Originally Posted by rafael1932

The real question is gala be able to sense as good Teresa does in close range( after the 7 years and because she lost her eyes) ?

As you stated, Galatea has a different ability. She is meant for long range yoki sensing. Teresa most likely can't "see" as far as Galatea can but Teresa is definately better in close range. She has acute yoki sensing, she can detect the small amounts of yoki that flow through claymores and yoma even before they can attack. With her increased skills in yoki sensing, Galatea can sense the flow of yoki through someones body, however i highly doubt it can be compared to Teresa's Yoki sensing. Galatea may be good enough to have gained acute yoki sensing but she doesn't have the speed to react to it. Teresa's sensing is much more refined and so she is a far better yoki senser at close range.

How did we get into this debate, because this discussion is a little off topic. And we don't need another Teresa debate

[irvinethearcher]

Originally Posted by Ryus

I'm sorry but this post is like reading from the gospel of Teresa... it just states how awesome she is and therefore you point was valid. Sorry but you didn't prove it... please see kinematics post about writing linearly. Here you pretty much just argued A repeatedly (she's really strong) then jumped straight to D (she could sense all masked yoki minus Priscllia), you failed to make all your points lead to a conclusion. Please see kinematics excellent post above think however you want but write linearly.

Sure all your points state she's awesome but once again you failed to even prove Teresa's comment about Raphaela's yoki not being quite masked yet wasn't true for x reason, let alone why Priscilla is any different than Raphaela in masking yoki or why Clare whom inherited Teresa's ability can't also detect masked yokis. I could list more reasons but fail to see a point since clearly you are on edge.

Once again I only got into this debate because you yelled at someone for posting a "speculative idea" (the side of the argument I find myself on now) as fact and then stated your point was the only logical conculsion, so I challenged you and now you're acting like we both have legit arguments... funny how you changed your tune.

What did you prove? You proved nothing at all too? I never wanted to prove something here because it is a futil effort from the start.

First i am not on edge and i didn't change my tune. I never said that i can prove my speculation. You brought one good argument with the death squad in the town and i admited it. What is wrong with this? I mean i don't want to win a race, i just want to discuss.
I always said that my point should be something to consider. I never said that it was the only logical conclusion i am at the moment with 50/50. After all the impossible things theresa did another impossibility doesn't seem impossible to me anymore. Aimless said that there are at most seven years between the incident and the meeting of rafaella and chibi theresa. Sounds logical except that the one who met her was theresa. I thought too that rafaella wasn't cloaked until i read the chapter in which galatea was able to sense some claymores on the meds. Now i am not sure about how cloaked rafaella was anymore.

You asked why clare could not sense as well as theresa did?
Because clare wasn't as strong, or as fast or had as much yoki as theresa so why should she be able to sense as well as her than?
If that were one of your best reasons than you can list all you want ...

Why priscilla could be different?
I wrote it the whole time. Hell she even has another kanji in the databook. And yes it is a difference if you suppress your yoki because of some kind of inner urge carved into your soul or of some training. I gave you the example of renee who could not sense her. If that is not enough to LEGITIMATE my speculation than i don't know what should be?

I don't need writing linearly. Everything is understandable for the one who WANTS to understand.
Only because something isn't written perfectely doesn't make it less true or wrong as long as the information it contains is clearly readable and understandable.

it's funny i am just reading gooral's post and he has written basically the same. But i am even to tired to read it to the end but soon the weekend comes along

[Elandyll]

Speaking in general.
The points taken as "facts" that have pretty much 0 facts (or sometimes made up facts) behind them, to argue and counter argue ad nauseam are just ... mind blowing.

Again, not talking about anyone in particular, but this is just so rampant here between chapters that it gives me a headache trying to find a constructive and factual thing to talk about.

Ah well.

[Nixl]

Originally Posted by Elandyll

Speaking in general.
The points taken as "facts" that have pretty much 0 facts (or sometimes made up facts) behind them, to argue and counter argue ad nauseam are just ... mind blowing.

Again, not talking about anyone in particular, but this is just so rampant here between chapters that it gives me a headache trying to find a constructive and factual thing to talk about.

Ah well.

FACT: Half the time it works all the time.

I see what you are saying, but I believe that is a result of people's expectations and or wanting different things out of the story. Some people are in it for the action,the tragedy or hairstyle/girl type fetishes. Take Gooral's expectation that Miria could have performed better against Rigardo, he, I and a lot of others could argue towards any direction until out fingers fall off. The debates may be a headache at times, but in many ways being able to have this discussion about just a manga is good and fun in itself. In a way it is rewarding.

Spoiler for speaking of Fetishmore:

Twin tails fetish fan got Dietrich
Drill hair fetish fans got Anastasia
Yandere fetish fans got Miata
So...where is my morbidly obese girl Yagi? WHERE. IS. SHE!?!

Spoiler for .:

Sorry for the poor taste joke, but both my play throughs of Fallout 1 and Morrowind glitched at very the end of the stories and so I am left with making crap posts on the forum.

[SagaraSouske]

Generally you should take people's posts as opinions or interpretations rather then facts. There are too many contradicting facts or facts that can be interpreted differently.

[Nixl]

Claymore does leave certain aspects vague and or up to interpretation. At least it is not like Blame!. Do not get me wrong, I love Blame! and it is an awesome manga in the later chapters, but it takes a read or two to fully understand everything that is being said.

Spoiler for Blame! spoiler:

Sanakan T__T

[Claymore!]

Originally Posted by SagaraSouske

Generally you should take people's posts as opinions or interpretations rather then facts. There are too many contradicting facts or facts that can be interpreted differently.

Yes most of what we say is just speculation. We go so in depth here that we expect to find answers somewhere, but most of the time we don't because the story doesn't have them. I have stated this before but Yagi most likely doesn't write the story that way. We tend to over-analyze things to the extreme . And then we make up our own conclusion and theories, and that leads to good debates and interesting topics.
I'm not complaining about it, i think it is a good think, it leaves more to the reader's imagination.

[In Flamez]

I read the chapter a few days ago, and haven't really thought about making a semi-proper response until now.

Overall, I really enjoyed the chapter and thought it was great. Cassandra is just tearing people apart!
I kind of rushed through it due to excitement, when I first read it. So I actually re-read the chapter the next day. I'm interested to see if Cassandra and Roxanna will end up having a conflict, and how they'll react to the current yoki manipulation from Rafutella. Miria's new technique has intrigued me as well. It seems as if she's partialy if not almost entirely awakening, or just of the limbs similar to Clare.

The only thing I didn't quite understand was how Rafutela (spelling?), is still alive. I definitely thought she was killed, but I guess not.

Not the most constructive post I've ever written, but I feel it sums up my thoughts nicely.

[Demon6666]

lol your post is pretty much a good summary of this entire thread.

But yeah, Raftella didn't die because Claymores can take a lot of damage. (think Jean in Riful's lair) As to how she escaped i have no idea.

[Gooral]

I have two new things to tell concerning this chapter.

1) Hysteria either doesn't consider Claymores as comrades or she just doesn't consider Claymores of this generation as comrades, hence her comment to Miria "your comrades". It's actually interesting that all three are so eager to harm other Claymores and do exactly what they were told (at least it looks that way).

2) Why are ninja's spears made of dried shit? They can be easily destroyed with claymore to smithereens and with human strength at that. The same thing happened in chapter 115... Why aren't they made from the same alloy as claymores? Especially since these ninja are to fight Claymores if necessary. So if Raki was able to destroy them Claymores would do it with their bare hands.

[rafael1932]

Originally Posted by Gooral

I have two new things to tell concerning this chapter.

1) Hysteria either doesn't consider Claymores as comrades or she just doesn't consider Claymores of this generation as comrades, hence her comment to Miria "your comrades". It's actually interesting that all three are so eager to harm other Claymores and do exactly what they were told (at least it looks that way).

2) Why are ninja's spears made of dried shit? They can be easily destroyed with claymore to smithereens and with human strength at that. The same thing happened in chapter 115... Why aren't they made from the same alloy as claymores? Especially since these ninja are to fight Claymores if necessary. So if Raki was able to destroy them Claymores would do it with their bare hands.

1- I dont get it right. She never had friends and now she wants because it feels good

2- There is nothing different from what people have said in that chapter where raki was fighting the twins, more of the same. Yes, we still don’t know if raki is human or not. And, yes, it is impossible to a normal human do what raki have done in that image.

[Korinov]

Originally Posted by Gooral

2) Why are ninja's spears made of dried shit? They can be easily destroyed with claymore to smithereens and with human strength at that. The same thing happened in chapter 115... Why aren't they made from the same alloy as claymores? Especially since these ninja are to fight Claymores if necessary. So if Raki was able to destroy them Claymores would do it with their bare hands.

There's a reason spears are made of wood instead of metal: they are not weapons meant to block attacks, just stab targets, hence the head being made of metal. Spearmen tipically used a shield to block enemy attacks. But I understand MiBjas not using shields, since they seem to be a mix of workers and guards to the MiBs. When you have to work and protect others in closed areas with corridors, the shield is more a nuisance than a tool (since you have to react and move quickly, and a shield is heavy). Steel spears would be also too heavy for normal humans to move around with ease.

And I don't think MiBjas' usual tasks includes fighting Claymores... they have a #10 permanently at headquarters for a reason. The thing is, when dealing when Raftela you have obviously no #10 to resort to, and any other claymore would be unreliable for the job since Raftela would be able to mess with her. Of course, all this also means the MiBjas are very unexperienced at dealing with hybrids (hitting young trainees with the wooden part of your spear is one thing, trying to kill a full grown claymore is different), and that could explain why they didn't manage to kill Raftela: instead going for the head they went for the easiest part to hit, the torso.

You could argue they're pretty useless at fighting, but it's pretty understandable: as Raki pointed out before, the Org relies only in hybrids to do all the dirty work. So when those hybrids are not available, they have to use their human servants who are clearly unprepared for anything more difficult than moving things around and bullying little girls.

Originally Posted by rafael1932

2-There is nothing different from what people have said in that chapter where raki was fighting the twins, more of the same. Yes, we still don’t know if raki is human or not. And, yes, it is impossible to a normal human do what raki have done in that image.

No, it's not.

[Gooral]

@Korinov
There are spears entirely made of metal (or metal rods), even in the past there were warriors that preferred very heavy rods (they even chose heavier - of higher density - metal to have even more destructive weapon). If ninja were trained in using them sooner or later they would build muscles to use them. Also, why don't they use claymores themselves when they know Claymores (or Raki with a claymore) will be their opponents and they know what will happen to their spears when confronted with them? It's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. And Rubel has shown that MiB can use a great sword using one hand so unless he's special they must be stronger than normal humans too.

As for ninja not being experienced with fighting Claymores, it doesn't explain why MiB did not point out Raftela might regenerate from such wounds. Still, they would be useless if they wouldn't even know that...

[Korinov]

Originally Posted by Gooral

There are spears entirely made of metal (or metal rods). If ninja were trained in using them sooner or later they would build muscles to use them.

If ninja were full-trained warriors meant to just do guard-like tasks, they would probably be equipped with better weapons. But they are not. They're just some servants who seem to do various tasks for the MiBs, nothing more.

Also, why don't they use claymores themselves when they know Claymores (or Raki with a claymore) will be their opponents and they know what will happen to their spears when confronted with them?

Because you need to be specifically trained in order to use a weapon like a claymore in combat. And as I've said before, these guys are not warriors.

It's like bringing a knife to a gun fight.

Exactly. The way they use their spears just shows they actually aren't used to fighting at all. They probably are barely trained at using spears as weapons and that's all. I mean, they don't even try to surround Raki and attack him from various fronts taking advantage of their weapons being lighter and so easier and faster to use. They just throw themselves at Raki and then try to block his claymore with their wooden spears (which just proves they've probably never fought anyone wielding a claymore).

I find it pretty logical, since they're not warriors.

And Rubel has shown that MiB can use a great sword using one hand so unless he's special they must be stronger than normal humans too.

I don't remember that part right now, but... did Rubel actually kill something with that greatsword? Wielding a weapon and even moving it around aren't the same as actually using it in combat.

As for ninja not being experienced with fighting Claymores, it doesn't explain why MiB did not point out Raftela might regenerate from such wounds. Still, they would be useless if they wouldn't even know that...

Well, that's another point (of a large list) that just makes Rimt a pathetic leader. But not really ninjas' fault, since they probably thought that Raftela would be dead meat after stabbing her like that.

[Nixl]

Originally Posted by Gooral

@Korinov
There are spears entirely made of metal (or metal rods), even in the past there were warriors that preferred very heavy rods (they even chose heavier - of higher density - metal to have even more destructive weapon). If ninja were trained in using them sooner or later they would build muscles to use them. Also, why don't they use claymores themselves when they know Claymores (or Raki with a claymore) will be their opponents and they know what will happen to their spears when confronted with them? It's like bringing a knife to a gun fight. And Rubel has shown that MiB can use a great sword using one hand so unless he's special they must be stronger than normal humans too.

As for ninja not being experienced with fighting Claymores, it doesn't explain why MiB did not point out Raftela might regenerate from such wounds. Still, they would be useless if they wouldn't even know that...

As far as I understood it the reason Claymores use claymore-swords is because anything else would not do enough damage against Yoma/ABs. Essentially, if Claymores used arrows/spears the Yoma would just regenerate since the wounds would not be severe enough. I do not think this mentality necessarily extends to fights between humans.

For humans or against Raki to be specific spears make a lot of sense. For one, it is much easier to work with a team in terms of space when the group is thrusting spears as opposed to swinging swords around. Swinging a claymore takes far more space than thrusting a spear. Consider that Raftela was impaled by 8 times from behind versus 4-5 claymores having to spread 360 degrees around Miria just to be able to perform a full arc of a sword swing. In addition, a spear wound is all that is needed to kill Raki unlike a claymore or AB that can regenerate such wounds. For instance, remember that Claire got impaled in the early chapters and still walked away. The Mib largely left all the fighting and resources in weapons to the claymores.

That is an interesting way to look at it Korinov, they are not warriors in a true sense. Just general laborers forced to fight.

[Claymore!]

Originally Posted by rafael1932

2- There is nothing different from what people have said in that chapter where raki was fighting the twins, more of the same. Yes, we still don’t know if raki is human or not. And, yes, it is impossible to a normal human do what raki have done in that image.

We are talking about Raki, he could be the most powerful and skilled human in the entire story (And yes I do believe that Raki is only human). But we don't know any other strong human warriors other than Galk and Cid. And Raki is way stronger than Galk or Cid.

[Korinov]

Any skilled and strong enough warrior from the middle ages wielding a two-handed sword was perfectly able to tear off limbs with a single swing, so I'd say Raki breaking some wooden spears with that sword is not exactly outwordly.

[Claymore!]

Originally Posted by Korinov

Any skilled and strong enough warrior from the middle ages wielding a two-handed sword was perfectly able to tear off limbs with a single swing, so I'd say Raki breaking some wooden spears with that sword is not exactly outwordly.

Yes Raki breaking those spears is not outwordly. And if the blade was actually sharp Raki would be just slicing through those spears instead of breaking them. He probably would be slicing through the Mibs too.

[FlavorOfLife]

Originally Posted by In Flamez

The only thing I didn't quite understand was how Rafutela (spelling?), is still alive. I definitely thought she was killed, but I guess not.

From the dialogue, she should already be dying but expending her time to manipulate youki. If the trainees don't help her, its probably likely she won't hang on for long and will die on her feet, literally. Given that most claymores shown die from being cut into 2 pieces or more or head shots, spearing her torso might not have been that great an idea but then again they might want her body intact for research (or something)

[rafael1932]

Originally Posted by Korinov

since they seem to be a mix of workers and guards to the MiBs.

Originally Posted by Korinov

You could argue they're pretty useless at fighting, but it's pretty understandable: as Raki pointed out before, the Org relies only in hybrids to do all the dirty work. So when those hybrids are not available, they have to use their human servants who are clearly unprepared for anything more difficult than moving things around and bullying little girls.

There are only 2 countries in the world and they are not going to send trained warriors in their unique reseach facility that may save their lifes ?

I wonder how many of soldiers the usa had when they were development their atomic bomb ? or they were human servants too ?

Originally Posted by Korinov

No, it's not.

Yes it is.

It is belong human something like that. unless raki is no longer human. humans are intelligent animals not brute creatures. If the wood is for military use ( of course there is wood more easy to break than this of course), but since they all are military guys, they must use some wood more hard to break. A human super strong could only break 1 and forces 2 wood sticks to fall from other ninjas guys. Unless raki is a claymore, then he can do anything he wants

Yagi made the ghosts having 99% of dying probability, now he is trying to make the scientists into dumb and military guys into civilians with weapons just to see if he can pull out the ghosts alive.

if you are ok with this is ok by me but i just want to see the next lame excuse that yagi is going to pull out just to make sure that the ghost come out alive from a scenario where they had no chance at all to survive

seriously. Do you really think that in that facility where their best scientists working in their last and only hope to survive they would not have expert military guys like those ninjas ? we are talking about 1 country that has half of the world into his hands.(According miria there is only 2 countries and rubel confirmed this to her)

Originally Posted by Claymore!

Yes Raki breaking those spears is not outwordly. And if the blade was actually sharp Raki would be just slicing through those spears instead of breaking them. He probably would be slicing through the Mibs too.

It is the same sword from before, a training sword made to not cut

Originally Posted by Korinov

Well, that's another point (of a large list) that just makes Rimt a pathetic leader. But not really ninjas' fault, since they probably thought that Raftela would be dead meat after stabbing her like that.

For those who are always calling the mibs stupid:

. this is a story where there are 2 countries
. 1 side puts their best scientists working in their latest technology in order to survive a war

See, they are the best of the best guys they have!!! Since when they are stupid ? where is the sense in that ? and if they are stupid shouldn’t they be already dead ? I mean they are stupid right ? And since when scientist are stupid ?

Like I was saying it is a lame excuse to bring up raftela back. The mib would be smart eneought to say to cut her head.