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Old 2014-04-09, 13:00   Link #10041
bludvein
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Learning different mythologies and histories isn't a bad plan, but its not something that would help in the short term. Even with sped-up learning it would take a couple years. However, it would give him a hobby and respectable work, while still being helpful when he inevitably has to fight. His grandfather was a folklore professor, so that might give him interest(even if it wasn't personally relevant).
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Old 2014-04-09, 13:51   Link #10042
Fwarlord
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Learning about deities? Just how many deities are there in this world, even with speedup learning, one will need many hundred years to finish that and it's still not enough. There can always be some gods who magnified since ancient time and their legend was lost a long time ago. That method is just too ineffective. If he doesn't want to kiss the girls every time using the [Sword], I think the proper way is to find an authority or power that allows him to access the memory of void directly and take out any information he wants, just like how Verethratna use it originally.
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Old 2014-04-09, 15:11   Link #10043
Ickarium
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Wouldn't say hundreds of years, but I will say Erica and Liliana, due to training on mythology and magic from a young age likely have the equivalent of a PhD in Anthropology, just with a 'mythic' focus.
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Old 2014-04-09, 18:19   Link #10044
GodSoul
He Who Would Swallow God
 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fwarlord View Post
Learning about deities? Just how many deities are there in this world, even with speedup learning, one will need many hundred years to finish that and it's still not enough. There can always be some gods who magnified since ancient time and their legend was lost a long time ago. That method is just too ineffective. If he doesn't want to kiss the girls every time using the [Sword], I think the proper way is to find an authority or power that allows him to access the memory of void directly and take out any information he wants, just like how Verethratna use it originally.
I agree with the declared

I believe that an authority would godou with power of spiritual vision if they had killed Athena

doni won two authorities increased their sword skill

Curse of Rampage:Curse of Rampage which raises magic power and outputs of effective control against mages,so the sword and physical skills are worth

Return to Medieval Style:that eliminates all modern technology, nuclear weapons, tanks, guns in general everything falls for nothing,so the sword and physical skills are worth

Voban authorities are directed to impose fear,Black Prince to strategy

anyway he won Sword of the Beginning and the End,then it was not a bad deal allow Athena to leave when he could kill her
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Old 2014-04-09, 19:44   Link #10045
Endscape
The Mage of Four Hearts
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Age: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fwarlord View Post
Learning about deities? Just how many deities are there in this world, even with speedup learning, one will need many hundred years to finish that and it's still not enough. There can always be some gods who magnified since ancient time and their legend was lost a long time ago. That method is just too ineffective. If he doesn't want to kiss the girls every time using the [Sword], I think the proper way is to find an authority or power that allows him to access the memory of void directly and take out any information he wants, just like how Verethratna use it originally.
He doesn't need to learn about all deities, just ones that are still out there gunning for him. If I were Godou, I would have at least started learning about Melqart and Athena after running into them.
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Old 2014-04-09, 20:03   Link #10046
bludvein
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Originally Posted by Endscape View Post
He doesn't need to learn about all deities, just ones that are still out there gunning for him. If I were Godou, I would have at least started learning about Melqart and Athena after running into them.
That's not such an easy task. For use of the golden sword he needs to know the myths themselves, their influence on other myths, the history of the countries involved, and the stories of other characters that appear in their myths. The amount of information needed is truly massive. You can't just focus on 1 or 2 characters. Skimming might give him an idea of what their powers are, but its unreliable.

Getting an authority that lets him read the memories of the void would solve his problems nicely, but thats pretty much Yuri's main value to the group. Getting something like that would limit her future contributions, so I doubt it will happen.

Last edited by bludvein; 2014-04-09 at 20:14.
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Old 2014-04-09, 20:05   Link #10047
Ravagerblade
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It's precisely his naivety that gets him into trouble all the time. He knows he needs to understand the deities he faces yet he slacks off on it all the time. As a campione he sucks so reliant on outside sources to do his job.

Even when the girls don't know anything after awhile they supposedly got the info from somebody that knows it *uldin and one of his wifes* then all of a sudden the girls can use Instruction magic on him? Godou couldn't have been told before hand? Face it the damn this is just a plot device so that Godou doesn't need to put effort into things.
Also as if by some great miracle the girls just happen to know every single detail about the deities that they're not told. It's complete utter bullshit (excludes Yuri).
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Last edited by Ravagerblade; 2014-04-09 at 21:10.
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Old 2014-04-09, 22:24   Link #10048
teejmo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bludvein View Post
Getting an authority that lets him read the memories of the void would solve his problems nicely, but thats pretty much Yuri's main value to the group. Getting something like that would limit her future contributions, so I doubt it will happen.
I think if he had killed Athena in the first novel, he probably would have taken her wisdom authority. She already showed she can use it to figure out various gods and their authorities. It was hypothesized within the story that authorities directly correspond to the Campione. Wisdom --> Golden sword --> Victory!
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Old 2014-04-09, 22:51   Link #10049
bakapervert
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ravagerblade View Post
It's precisely his naivety that gets him into trouble all the time. He knows he needs to understand the deities he faces yet he slacks off on it all the time. As a campione he sucks so reliant on outside sources to do his job.

Even when the girls don't know anything after awhile they supposedly got the info from somebody that knows it *uldin and one of his wifes* then all of a sudden the girls can use Instruction magic on him? Godou couldn't have been told before hand? Face it the damn this is just a plot device so that Godou doesn't need to put effort into things.
Also as if by some great miracle the girls just happen to know every single detail about the deities that they're not told. It's complete utter bullshit (excludes Yuri).
You forget that Godou is just an average high school boy in the term of booksmart. If you are in his place, can you memorize and understand the myth required to forge the sword in only a few month? Even if he manage to study and learn all that myth and history and all the trivia, I bet its all would be gone from his head in just a few weeks. I know I forget all the thing I study for my test immediately after the test is over. Not to mention with how complicated the gods and history is, its possible he can remember wrongly, cannot make connection, become confused, etc., etc. I think its the best decision to rely completely on the girls, after all they are an actual expert on the topic, and unlike Godou have been taught since they are young and not to mention smart as hell. With spirit vision, those knowledge will be more complete and detailed as well. Far better from just knowledge obtained from book.

As for learning magic or martial arts, in my opinion its better that he never learned at all. Using skill obtained from training will just making him less reliant on his instinct. The problem is Godou doesn't have talent like Doni or Luo Hao in martial arts or talent like Erica or Liliana in magic. And facing god with skill less than a grandmaster is just suicide. THose gods is just plain better in martial arts and magic, and facing those gods in area that they are strong at and Godou is just average of is really a bad tactic. Its better that he completely rely on his instinct and just do what is natural to him rather than using some half-assed skill from training in something he doesn't have talent of for just a few month. Like in some fight I have read in other series, sometimes its harder to fight a complete amateur swinging sword wildly compared to fighting a less skilled opponent with some training.
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Old 2014-04-09, 22:56   Link #10050
Ravagerblade
The Fearless
 
 
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Here's a small synopsis of Campione!:

Godou Kusanagi - A Godslayer! A Campione! He who usurps a Gods Authority to wield into battling Heretic Gods who roam the Earth.

Along with him he has four beautiful girls who he must rely upon for he lacks the knowledge and wisdom to battle the Heretic Gods who cause mayhem upon the earth.
For without these four competent girls he would be lost and unable to accomplish what his other kin can do for themselves, He's molded himself akin to a fish out of water!
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Old 2014-04-09, 23:01   Link #10051
Ravagerblade
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Not much of a Hero or MC then, it's just pathetic. If relying on instinct worked in the RL then this whole world would be doomed because there's no real logic in that. It doesn't work all the time, relying on one thing does not make the world go round.
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Old 2014-04-09, 23:07   Link #10052
bakapervert
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ravagerblade View Post
Here's a small synopsis of Campione!:

Godou Kusanagi - A Godslayer! A Campione! He who usurps a Gods Authority to wield into battling Heretic Gods who roam the Earth.

Along with him he has four beautiful girls who he must rely upon for he lacks the knowledge and wisdom to battle the Heretic Gods who cause mayhem upon the earth.
For without these four competent girls he would be lost and unable to accomplish what his other kin can do for themselves, He's molded himself akin to a fish out of water!
Doni has sword, Luo Hao has martial art and magic, Alec has his scheming, Voban, Aisha, and JPS has various awesome authority. And Godou has his lady-killer talent. Even if he doesn't has Erica, Liliana, Ena, and Yuri, he will just seduce some other girl to give him the knowledge he needed or to save him when he is in a pinch. Hell, he can even seduce other Campione, goddess, or divine ancestor. As proven in volume 10, he already planned to seduce Guinevere to got the info about Lancelot when his harem is not around. That's why the girls is always fret when Godou is out of their sight, he can easily add more girl in his harem and still win his fight even without them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ravagerblade View Post
Not much of a Hero or MC then, it's just pathetic. If relying on instinct worked in the RL then this whole world would be doomed because there's no real logic in that. It doesn't work all the time, relying on one thing does not make the world go round.
Not only instinct, but also the mastery of his authority. He doesn't learn any magic or martial art, but in return he is completely reliant on his authority and become more creative in how he is using it. If he has any other option other than his authority in a fight, it will just make it harder for him to master his authority. Other reason why I like Godou, there are already ton of MC out there that got stronger by training and preparing in their spare time. An MC that rely on his instinct, wits, and his lady-killer ways to win his fight is quite unique.

Last edited by bakapervert; 2014-04-09 at 23:21. Reason: some more addition
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Old 2014-04-09, 23:17   Link #10053
Ravagerblade
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How is that even comparable? (the first part) he is just relying on others to basically do the lion's share for him. Not very heroic or MC material.

Sure master his authority, then what? hinder his ability to protect his *normal highscool life* ?
He uses lame excuses so that he doesn't have to work.
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“No, I don’t get it at all. I may claim to ‘understand’ Othinus, but I only know her as a girl. I don’t understand anything when it comes to her being a Magic God.” - Touma NT13
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Old 2014-04-09, 23:35   Link #10054
bakapervert
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Originally Posted by Ravagerblade View Post
How is that even comparable? (the first part) he is just relying on others to basically do the lion's share for him. Not very heroic or MC material.

Sure master his authority, then what? hinder his ability to protect his *normal highscool life* ?
He uses lame excuses so that he doesn't have to work.
What lion share? The girls is only giving him the knowledge of the god and sometime healing him. He is the one facing the god, only sometimes the girls is helping him in defeating the minion divine beast or helping him escape. But the heavy lifting is still on Godou. He is the one in most danger.

And yeah he doesn't train, doesn't study more about the god, doesn't want to sacrifice his normal life. He is still risking his life facing dangerous enemy, keeping normal population safe from heretic god or other campione, saving the girl and all. Heroic or MC status doesn't come from training or their preparation, it come from their actual deed and the result they achieve. Yeah he is relying on the girls heavily on some thing, its not like he make them do all the work while he just lazing around in safe place and taking credit that not his.

Btw, I notice your avatar is Kamijou Touma and Othinus. Touma is almost the same like Godou, he never train in martial arts when he has spare time, never try to prepare for the enemy in the future, never search for more information about his IB, rely heavily on his comrade. Yet he is without a doubt an MC and goddamn heroic.

Last edited by bakapervert; 2014-04-09 at 23:40. Reason: Touma avatar
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Old 2014-04-09, 23:51   Link #10055
Ravagerblade
The Fearless
 
 
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No Touma is not almost the same, maybe some similarities but completely different in most aspects. Plus your comparing a fucking Godslayer to a guy who has a power in his hand that negates supernatural powers.
Sure both high school students, both get girls to like them.
One says he's a pacifist yet fights because it *thrills* (something of the sort) him, the other says he fights because he wants to he because he see's them needing help.

And back to the first point of yours; Knowing is half the battle.
Just realize that he isn't that great of a Campione or even deserving of the girls affections.

As a Campione he has much bigger responsibilities to deal with therefore he should be prepared to undertake the necessary measures/precautions. yet he treats it like it's fly on the wall.
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“No, I don’t get it at all. I may claim to ‘understand’ Othinus, but I only know her as a girl. I don’t understand anything when it comes to her being a Magic God.” - Touma NT13
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Old 2014-04-10, 00:19   Link #10056
bakapervert
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Yeah Godou got thrilled when he fight, but he doesn't fight solely for that. He also fight to protect the common people, to help someone he know (hikari). If he happen to enjoy the fight, is it really bad? And a Godslayer and a guy who has a power in his hand that negates supernatural powers, I think I can say that IB is the more unfair power, not to mention the dragon inside it.

And how can he doesn't deserve the girl affections? He save Liliana from Athena by giving her a favor that can be potentially fatal or worse in the future, he challenge Voban (one of the most experienced and strongest Campione) to save Yuri, saving Ena from Ame no Murakumo, and saving Erica from Verethragna, also saving Hikari from Sunwukong's stomach. Many other girl has fallen for an MC just because the MC is kind, saving a girl's live is good enough reason for affection no?

As for Godou getting the knowledge not by studying by himself but from the girl, what is so bad about that actually? Its not like to learn the knowledge the girls needed to risk their life or sacrifice anything other than time to learn it (well, except when Yuri try to get spirit vision by forcing herself, but in that case its not like Godou studying will be any use if they already need to use spirit vision to expose the god's identity or history). And yeah Godou is not that great as Campione, that's why he need the girls to help him and cover for him. Will the story or the fight become any better if he can rely to himself and solo the god that he fight? No, I like him as it is.
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Old 2014-04-10, 01:36   Link #10057
teejmo
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Godou, like bakapervert was saying, really isn't that bad of main character. I mean, unlike a lot of characters, his actions actually speak louder than his words. Whereas half of the harem leads out there simply say crap that causes the girl to fall for them, he simply goes out and risks his life for the girl, even before he really knows her. Of course a girl will fall for the prince who shields her from the evil villain. Following that first impression up with kind words is, in Pokemon terms, super effective.

As to his "fake pacifism" stuff, ever heard of being "caught up in the moment"? He's a competitor, who's one true joy is winning. Of course he'll get excited when he's fighting a god. It's a competition, to see who can get the better of the other. But Godou realizes that his actions, since they can be so explosive, affect others, so he really doesn't want to fight, so that other people will not be harmed. I'm sure if every god that came to him and said "hey, let's go to that open field where no one is and fight," Godou would jump at the chance.

Really, the only thing that's completely unlikable of Godou is his refusal to acknowledge himself. He simply can't admit to himself that he actually cares for these girls in a romantic way. Luckily, he finally seems to be turning the corner in the latest versions, even feeling ashamed for not following through on one romantic encounter (and more because he realized he could be hurting the girl's feelings, rather than simply failing as a man).
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Old 2014-04-10, 03:25   Link #10058
Fwarlord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ravagerblade View Post
No Touma is not almost the same, maybe some similarities but completely different in most aspects. Plus your comparing a fucking Godslayer to a guy who has a power in his hand that negates supernatural powers.
Sure both high school students, both get girls to like them.
One says he's a pacifist yet fights because it *thrills* (something of the sort) him, the other says he fights because he wants to he because he see's them needing help.

And back to the first point of yours; Knowing is half the battle.
Just realize that he isn't that great of a Campione or even deserving of the girls affections.

As a Campione he has much bigger responsibilities to deal with therefore he should be prepared to undertake the necessary measures/precautions. yet he treats it like it's fly on the wall.
Somehow I feel that you didn't realize the concept of being a campione. A campione is just a hateful devil king wielding absolute power, that's all. People fear them for their destructive power and insanity rather than respect them for their achievements or heroic deeds. Godou is no exception, other than the girls, gods and other campiones, everyone fear him, and unlike MC in many other series, they don't misunderstand him in this case.
Basically, campiones have no responsibility. This isn't a situation where "great power come great responsibility". They are no representatives of mankind who fight gods to protect the innocent. They fight mostly because they love to, there is a reason why every time a campione sense a god nearby, he is overcome by power and excitement.
In short, if you're looking for a story about heroes doing heroic stuff, this series isn't your thing. Unlike Touma, never once Godou wanted to be a hero, he just fights because he is a competitor and victor, protecting the innocent come second. Sure, he is not your usual heroic MC, but he indeed is an awesome MC.
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Old 2014-04-10, 03:51   Link #10059
lived_1714
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Originally Posted by Fwarlord View Post
Somehow I feel that you didn't realize the concept of being a campione. A campione is just a hateful devil king wielding absolute power, that's all. People fear them for their destructive power and insanity rather than respect them for their achievements or heroic deeds. Godou is no exception, other than the girls, gods and other campiones, everyone fear him, and unlike MC in many other series, they don't misunderstand him in this case.
Basically, campiones have no responsibility. This isn't a situation where "great power come great responsibility". They are no representatives of mankind who fight gods to protect the innocent. They fight mostly because they love to, there is a reason why every time a campione sense a god nearby, he is overcome by power and excitement.
In short, if you're looking for a story about heroes doing heroic stuff, this series isn't your thing. Unlike Touma, never once Godou wanted to be a hero, he just fights because he is a competitor and victor, protecting the innocent come second. Sure, he is not your usual heroic MC, but he indeed is an awesome MC.
Nope, that one, the one that said that campione has no responsibility is wrong, Erica already said that the people will give Godou money, food or whatever he wants and his job is to defeat the disaster known as heretic gods.

The second one is wrong, too. In Godou's head saving is the most important thing, not fighting.
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Old 2014-04-10, 04:06   Link #10060
Trung-t-rung
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Originally Posted by lived_1714 View Post
Nope, that one, the one that said that campione has no responsibility is wrong, Erica already said that the people will give Godou money, food or whatever he wants and his job is to defeat the disaster known as heretic gods.

The second one is wrong, too. In Godou's head saving is the most important thing, not fighting.
Well, Campiones truly consider themselves having no responsibilities. It's just that their interest in killing Gods is in common with magic organizations's goal. The second is true, however. Godou mostly doesn't consider fighting a God unless he is being attacked by them or innocent lives involved, still that doesn't mean he can't enjoy the fight
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