Accel World - Episode 20 Discussion / Poll

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Ami-chan

Had she done absolutely nothing, the problems would have already solved themselves.

Oh, so beating Noumi once would've uninstalled Brain Burst, erased all the incriminating data that he had on Haru, made Noumi forget about the incident entirely so he couldn't spread the rumors that he's started doing, and returned Haru's wings? Yeah... I somehow completely doubt that. And considering he had to accept a Battle Royale, it's not like they'd get to 2v1 him any further.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by GDB

Oh, so beating Noumi once would've uninstalled Brain Burst, erased all the incriminating data that he had on Haru, made Noumi forget about the incident entirely so he couldn't spread the rumors that he's started doing, and returned Haru's wings? Yeah... I somehow completely doubt that. And considering he had to accept a Battle Royale, it's not like they'd get to 2v1 him any further.

To be fair, Chiyu's actions clearly didn't help with those matters either. In fact, Noumi's willingness to use this incriminating data against Haru may have been brought on by him feeling like Haru is useless to him now since Chiyu is with him.

If Haru and Taku had taken down Noumi together, without Chiyu getting involved, it's quite conceivable that Noumi might have been less eager to slander Haru's name like this. This is because if Noumi had been defeated by Haru and Taku, he might feel a bit more "cornered", and he may have wanted to save up every card he could in dealing with Haru and Taku. It's still far from clear to me if Chiyu's approach was even a smart move, even putting aside moral considerations with it.


You know, it really shouldn't surprise anybody that Chiyu is getting some criticism here. She did help Noumi defeat Haru and Taku. If you were in Haru or Taku's shoes, how would you feel about Chiyu's actions?

I know that if I was in Haru or Taku's shoes, I'd have a real hard time ever trusting Chiyu again. Even if she does have hidden motives here, and one of her goals is to somehow help Haru and Taku in the long-run, the fact of the matter is that Chiyu isn't trusting them with that information (and she had an opportunity in this episode to let them in on her plans). Yes, she may be fearful that even the most discreet of conversations between the three of them could be overheard by Noumi somehow, but at the same time her leaving Haru or Taku completely in the dark about any positive motives she may have concerning them carries its own risks too.


Honestly, if I was Haru, I wouldn't put much trust in Chiyu or Taku (with Taku, it's because of what he did before). If I was Haru, the only person I'd totally trust is KYH.

[Lycodrake]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Honestly, if I was Haru, I wouldn't put much trust in Chiyu or Taku (with Taku, it's because of what he did before). If I was Haru, the only person I'd totally trust is KYH.

And Sky Raker...maybe.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

To be fair, Chiyu's actions clearly didn't help with those matters either. In fact, Noumi's willingness to use this incriminating data against Haru may have been brought on by him feeling like Haru is useless to him now since Chiyu is with him.

Or he did it because the dog tried to bite its owner, regardless of what Chiyu would have done.

If Haru and Taku had taken down Noumi together, without Chiyu getting involved, it's quite conceivable that Noumi might have been less eager to slander Haru's name like this. This is because if Noumi had been defeated by Haru and Taku, he might feel a bit more "cornered", and needed to save up every card he could in dealing with Haru and Taku.

How would he be cornered? It took both of them with trump cards to beat him. He obviously wouldn't accept a 2v1 match again, and he'd be expecting both Haru's jetpack and the IS, so they wouldn't catch him off guard.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by GDB

Or he did it because the dog tried to bite its owner, regardless of what Chiyu would have done.

If that was the case, Noumi would have released the incriminating evidence before this episode. This isn't the first time Haru fought Noumi after all.

How would he be cornered?

He'd know that he could be beat. Right now, he probably feels entirely unbeatable, and that's largely due to how he thinks that Chiyu is on his side. It's also due to how he never lost even once to Haru... which wouldn't be the case if Chiyu hadn't interfered like she did.

When a villain knows that he can be beat, he saves up his best cards for emergency situations (the good villains do this, anyway).

It took both of them with trump cards to beat him.

It's not like those trump cards are going away.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

If that was the case, Noumi would have released the incriminating evidence before this episode. This isn't the first time Haru fought Noumi after all.

You don't punish the dog before it's your dog. It wasn't until after that battle where he took Haru's wings and declared him his dog. This is only their second battle overall.

It's also due to how he never lost even once to Haru...

Again, this was only their second fight.

which wouldn't be the case if Chiyu hadn't interfered like she did.

He'd just shrug it off as it having been 2v1, which was entirely the reason he lost.

When a villain knows that he can be beat, he saves up his best cards for emergency situations (the good villains do this, anyway).

Or he just doesn't let the opponent tag team him again.

It's not like those trump cards are going away.

But they only worked as effectively as they did because they were unknowns. Now they're known.


I'd like to point out I'm not necessarily defending Chiyu or her actions, though she obviously has her reasons. It's just ludicrous to say things would've worked out peachy clean, fine and dandy if she hadn't stepped in.

[Dr. Casey]

Good debate, been fun to read.

And lol, I just realized that since this story arc takes place during April, Haru's and Taku's 14th birthdays are around this period. What awesome birthdays, huh.

[Bahamut]

...so i take it that Chiyu is planning to go the undercover route but only to fail in the end....

...just want to see Noumi defeated asap...by a burst link match or by Haru getting expelled from school because he went berserk and broke the little f***er's arm...

...besides that...during the scene with Haru getting punched by the boyfriend...not sure if i got that right but did that guy say...

"...if you're innocent...you can beat me as much as you want...but if you are proven guilty...i will beat the **** out of you blah blah blah..."

...to me that doesnt really justify being able to punch someone before they are even confirmed as guilty...but either way i really do hope they follow up on that scene...because if i were given that kind of golden offer...i would stop at maybe broken bones...im not sure...

[orpheus2]

Originally Posted by GDB

You don't punish the dog before it's your dog. It wasn't until after that battle where he took Haru's wings and declared him his dog. This is only their second battle overall.



Again, this was only their second fight.



He'd just shrug it off as it having been 2v1, which was entirely the reason he lost.



Or he just doesn't let the opponent tag team him again.



But they only worked as effectively as they did because they were unknowns. Now they're known.


I'd like to point out I'm not necessarily defending Chiyu or her actions, though she obviously has her reasons. It's just ludicrous to say things would've worked out peachy clean, fine and dandy if she hadn't stepped in.

But because of the fact he never lost even before, he feels pretty much invincible and thus making him even more smug. However, it cause him to make more mistakes.

True. There should have been a cleaner way. If Chiyu has a plan, could she not just encrypt some form clue at least.

Originally Posted by Dr. Casey

Good debate, been fun to read.

And lol, I just realized that since this story arc takes place during April, Haru's and Taku's 14th birthdays are around this period. What awesome birthdays, huh.

I am sure they will look back and say it was an awesome birthday./sarcasm/

[orion]

Originally Posted by orpheus2

But because of the fact he never lost even before, he feels pretty much invincible and thus making him even more smug. However, it cause him to make more mistakes.

True. There should have been a cleaner way. If Chiyu has a plan, could she not just encrypt some form clue at least.

Chiyu's just using lessons out of Chinese history (how to fool enemies).

http://history.cultural-china.com/en...story5360.html
http://history.cultural-china.com/en...360H11438.html
http://history.cultural-china.com/en...360H11447.html

[orpheus2]

Originally Posted by orion

Chiyu's just using lessons out of Chinese history (how to fool enemies).

http://history.cultural-china.com/en...story5360.html
http://history.cultural-china.com/en...360H11438.html
http://history.cultural-china.com/en...360H11447.html

Ah, the "to fool thy enemies, fool thy allies first" stratagem. That's explains it. But still, would Noumi buy Chiyu's explanation for siding with him. *looks how smug Noumi is* Oh wait, he would.

[Gohan78]

Even if Chiyu has a plan of her own, she should have shared this plan with her best friends. Isn't she aware that they are suffering with the doubt that she actually betrayed them?

Well, I never liked Chiyu to begin with. In my eyes she's cheating on Taku, with her thoughts if not with her actions (but one could argue that direct linking with Haru on her bed already constitutes cheating).

[Endless Soul]

Be careful Chiyu, you reap what you sow.

However, Haru, to his credit, seems to understand why Chiyu is acting the way she is. That is some pretty impressive loyalty.

Not to worry Noumi haters,he will get his come-uppance. I don't know when, I don't know how, but it will happen.

Endless "Giga lucky" Soul

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Endless Soul

Not to worry Noumi haters,he will get his come-uppance. I don't know when, I don't know how, but it will happen.

I'd assume within the next 4 episodes or so.

[Awrya]

At the very least, before the season is over

[HandofFate]

wow, Chiyu, way to be a total *****

They need to be more brutal h-doujins featuring her.

Regardless, I think I have an idea why she's betraying her teams right now. She said Soumi is paying her pts to be his personal healer. And Taku admitted it be more efficent for her to pair with him rather than them. Which I think is total bs, even underhanded ways, Noumi doesn't seem to accumulate that much more BurstPoints, especially with how much he spams it. And its only been 2 freaking days.

Its definitely tied tot Chiyu's role as a healer. She's probably trying to level up as fast and quick as possible to upgrade her skill. She probably saw she has a special move she can learn that can reverse Noumi's Steal Ability and Restore it to its Original Owner.

Even then, the way she's acting about it is annoying as hell. I still be pissed off at her about it.

[hero147]

Originally Posted by Awrya

At the very least, before the season is over

I hate Noumi but I would laugh hard if they end this season on a cliff-hanger.

As much as I detest Chiyu's actions, I don't hate her because I do believe in her good intentions. Though I do wonder how intricate/well-thought her plan must be since she doesn't seem to be the scheming type.

[Triple_R]

@GDB - All of the points you made to me are highly debatable. You don't truly know if Noumi would have shrugged off a loss to Haru and Taku. It might have had a considerable impact on him, especially given his obvious ego. In real life, many bullies only need to be knocked down once in order to stop their bullying.

And Noumi can't completely control whether or not he'd ever get double-teamed again. And Noumi had the benefit of surprise himself - Haru wasn't expecting Noumi to be able to use the Incarnate System anymore than Noumi was expecting Haru to know about it.

A rematch pitting Haru and Taku against Noumi may very well have played out more or less the same way their most recent fight did, before Chiyu got involved.


Honestly, I think it's quite conceivable that things might have worked out decently well if Chiyu had not gotten involved. Clearly that's what Haru and Taku were thinking, or they wouldn't have taken the actions that they did.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

@GDB - All of the points you made to me are highly debatable. You don't truly know if Noumi would have shrugged off a loss to Haru and Taku. It might have had a considerable impact on him, especially given his obvious ego. In real life, many bullies only need to be knocked down once in order to stop their bullying.

And you don't know he wouldn't lash out even worse. In real life, a good number of bullies will also become more violent if you knock them down once. They don't like their authority being questioned, especially not by one they consider lesser than them.

And Noumi can't completely control whether or not he'd ever get double-teamed again.

Yes he can. You have to accept a Battle Royale or team duel. You can only be forced into a 1v1 duel. It's why he had to click the "accept" button before it turned into a Battle Royale. The only other way to 2v1 him would be to find him in the Unlimited Boundary.

And Noumi had the benefit of surprise himself - Haru wasn't expecting Noumi to be able to use the Incarnate System anymore than Noumi was expecting Haru to know about it.

Difference is he used it against Taku. Haru used it against him. Haru's surprise meant nothing in that instance. Sure, it sucked for Taku, but it was mostly used to get outside of the building, since his wings were negated inside.

A rematch pitting Haru and Taku against Noumi may very well have played out more or less the same way their most recent fight did, before Chiyu got involved.

Again, it wouldn't be Haru and Taku against Noumi. It'd be Haru or Taku against Noumi.

Honestly, I think it's quite conceivable that things might have worked out decently well if Chiyu had not gotten involved. Clearly that's what Haru and Taku were thinking, or they wouldn't have taken the actions that they did.

Again, how would it work? How would that have given Haru his wings back? Haru and Taku clearly aren't thinking straight, otherwise they'd have asked Kuroyukihime for help. Instead, they're keeping her in the dark just so she can enjoy her vacation. Just because they're main characters doesn't make them infallible.

Furthermore, what's to keep Noumi from retaliating and constantly beating them over and over until their Brain Bursts are uninstalled?

[Dark Wing]

Also let's not forget that Noumi is working alone as shown by sulfur pot. So whats stopping him from calling in back up if things got worse for him.