The ever so growing Crunchyroll and Video Streaming in general (+ Netflix & Amazon)

[TJR]

Anime production companies are not directly part of the equation. They're just contracted to create the content, and the role often ends once they've submitted a master. They don't create/sell DVDs or any of the associated merchandise - those are the domain of other companies.

OTOH, an anime studio may or may not be part of the production committee (which consists of the companies that finance the anime project) that manages the copyrights; it depends on the terms of the original contract. If they're a member, they invest some money into the project and are thus entitled to a percentage of the profits.

As for distribution, I have no idea how it works. If other businesses are any indication, there're a small handful of large distributors that control the channels, and the product ends up changing hands several times (these large wholesalers have contracts with various sub-distributors that do nothing but acquire product from one wholesaler and sell to the next) before it reaches the retailer. All costs are passed onto the consumer, hence high prices.

[Alex Keller]

Crunchyroll is dope.
Has one of the most active forums I know of, it does.

[karice67]

@TJR
Hm...true on the anime production company part. I was assuming that most animation production companies are amongst the sponsors, but I can't be certain about that.

Originally Posted by TJR

As for distribution, I have no idea how it works. If other businesses are any indication, there're a small handful of large distributors that control the channels, and the product ends up changing hands several times (these large wholesalers have contracts with various sub-distributors that do nothing but acquire product from one wholesaler and sell to the next) before it reaches the retailer. All costs are passed onto the consumer, hence high prices.

But in Japan, retailers who stock anime DVDs are usually chain stores (animate, Tsutaya, Tower Records etc). I've never EVER seen a small, family-run store in this business, so I'd wager that DVDs don't change hands all that much, but instead rely on the networks of the retailers themselves. The cost is still transferred to the consumer, but if anything, the sub-distributors are the retail stores themselves.

[bayoab]

Originally Posted by karice67

Any links or examples?

See this post and the related posts. I can't find the exact one but those are for normal games.

[Nightbat®]

Originally Posted by karice67

Personally, I'm fine with the DVD prices on Amazon Japan. It hurts my pocket a fair bit, but to me, it's fair given how much it actually costs to produce an anime (around 15 million yen an episode in 2008 (source) - that's about USD140,000, before counting the cost of the TV spot or other advertising).

$140,000 Yet the animators get diddley**** a month

makes you wonder where that money goes

[0utf0xZer0]

Originally Posted by Nightbat®

$140,000 Yet the animators get diddley**** a month

makes you wonder where that money goes

It sounds like an impressive amount of money until you consider the per frame cost.

I remember the director of Angel Beats saying that the show's 10000 frames per episode was about 2.5 times the norm. So 140000/4000 frames = $35 per frame, without factoring in voice acting, sound work, etc. Now admittedly I don't know how how long it takes to produce a frame, but it's not actually sounding like a heck of a lot of money to go around to me.

[bayoab]

Originally Posted by Nightbat®

$140,000 Yet the animators get diddley**** a month

makes you wonder where that money goes

One of the JETRO (or METI?) pdfs has the full breakdown. There is also a few blogs and I have a rough outline from someone who presented said thing here. Basically, it's because they are paid by how much they produce and what they produce and you get 50 people working on an episode. Thus, the average take of each person an episode is like 1k.

[karice67]

Originally Posted by bayoab

See this post and the related posts. I can't find the exact one but those are for normal games.

I think that's Amazon doing what Amazon likes to do - killing the competition.

Originally Posted by bayoab

One of the JETRO (or METI?) pdfs has the full breakdown. There is also a few blogs and I have a rough outline from someone who presented said thing here. Basically, it's because they are paid by how much they produce and what they produce and you get 50 people working on an episode. Thus, the average take of each person an episode is like 1k.

I found and read a 2005 report from JETRO. Hm...it was incredibly positive about the great response of Western markets to anime...something that I think we're going to look back on soon as the "anime bubble"...

I've also seen other reports/articles focusing on what specific people get paid. E.g. An in-between animator (starting out) gets something like 200yen per frame, and they might be able to do something like 500 frames a month, if they work 14 hours days...etc.

Even just thinking about it - comparing what's involved in producing an anime to what's involved in making a TV show. For the latter, you just turn on the camera and shoot, then edit, add sound effects, special effects, ADR etc. But with animation, they animators have to produce EVERY single frame. (Which is one of the reasons we see so much recycled footage on anime on TV - it really isn't that cheap or quick!)

p.s. Going back to whether a production company will get money from DVD sales etc: This article, on the anime industry in Japan (which I linked above), also from JETRO (although I can only find it through google, not through the site itself), notes that whilst the production company would only receive the production fee in the past, "in recent years, often a production committee is formed by the TV station, the video software maker, the character merchandising company and the anime production company." It also has some quite comprehensive charts on the different segments of the industry that are involved in producing a series.

[Vexx]

There's so much "incest"/partnerships/gladhanding/fuzzyaccounting in this arm of japanese industry that I'd hate to even start trying to do an audit on where the money goes between companies ... the animation team and the voice actors definitely don't see much of it (though the more popular directors and VAs get a share of non-salary perks).

[TJR]

Originally Posted by karice67

p.s. Going back to whether a production company will get money from DVD sales etc: This article, on the anime industry in Japan (which I linked above), also from JETRO (although I can only find it through google, not through the site itself), notes that whilst the production company would only receive the production fee in the past, "in recent years, often a production company is formed by the TV station, the video software maker, the character merchandising company and the anime production company." It also has some quite comprehensive charts on the different segments of the industry that are involved in producing a series.

Yeah, that's the production committee. If an animation studio is a member, it gets a cut of the profits. Or to be specific, the money technically flows to the production committee, which divies it up amongst members (those who invest more get a bigger cut, etc.).

However, the exact arrangement varies. In most cases, the studio is either not part of the committee (you need cash reserves to invest in a production. Aside from a few exceptions, most studios either have little money on hand or are unwilling to risk what they have) or it has a small stake.

Take Durarara! and Toradora! for instance. Both have been big hits, but the studios involved see no money at all, which is a bit discouraging.

[karice67]

Originally Posted by TJR

Yeah, that's the production committee. If an animation studio is a member, it gets a cut of the profits. Or to be specific, the money technically flows to the production committee, which divies it up amongst members (those who invest more get a bigger cut, etc.).

However, the exact arrangement varies. In most cases, the studio is either not part of the committee (you need cash reserves to invest in a production. Aside from a few exceptions, most studios either have little money on hand or are unwilling to risk what they have) or it has a small stake.

Take Durarara! and Toradora! for instance. Both have been big hits, but the studios involved see no money at all, which is a bit discouraging.

Oops...I did mean "committee", so thanks!

I've been wondering about how the money is divvied up, especially for the three series I'm buying now. I suppose the good thing about not investing is that it's "safe", especially if the show doesn't do well...but it also means they don't get to profit from any hits they make.

In any case, if the money I'm spending makes it back to the people who fund these shows, I'm happy. I'd even be happy to pay more if it means that the in-between animators get a pay-rise that will actually enable them to make a living!

[Crisis]

Youtube thanks to Funimation now legally show anime as well.

Saw these

OURAN HIGH SCHOOL HOST CLUB
GUNDAM WING
GUNDMA SEED DESTINY
SCHOOL RUMBLE
FMA BROTHERHOOD
GIRLS HIGH=
RAMEN FIGHTER MIKI=
GHOST HUNT
MIRAGE OF BLAZE=
RUMBLING HEARTS=
D.GRAY MAN
KOI KOI SEVEN=
DANCE IN THE VAMPIRE BUND=
DARKER THAN BLACK
AMG
HEROIC AGE=
NABARI NO OU=
DEVIL MAY CRY
SAMURAI X
SEKIREI=
BIRDY
SHUFFLE
SHIKABANE HIME
PAHNTOM REQUIEM
BALDR FORCE EXE
EL CAZADOR=

But they are dubbed.

[bigsocce]

On a sidenote, hulu has been profitable for the last 2 quarters and it is expected to generate $200 million in ad revenue for 2010. Of that, about 60-70% will be paid back to the content providers. Hulu keeps about 30-40% of the ad revenue for upkeep of the site.

Hulu has over 1 billion video views each month
CR has 21.8 million video views each month (world wide)

[bigsocce]

Total Internet : Total Audience 31,241,101 100.0
Google Sites 13,056,042 41.8
Hulu 1,070,460 3.4
Microsoft Sites 655,068 2.1
Yahoo! Sites 477,887 1.5
CBS Interactive 457,261 1.5
Viacom Digital 370,179 1.2
Vevo 331,144 1.1
Turner Network 302,626 1.0
Fox Interactive Media 300,392 1.0
AOL LLC 280,328 0.9


FYI: Hulu has been profitable for over the last 2 quarters. They are expected to generate about $200 million in ad revenue this year. Of that, the content providers will get about 60-70%. Some venture capital firm bought 10% share of hulu for $100 million way back when it first started (2007?- or 2008?), valuing the website at $1 billion.

[AbZeroNow]

Was debating starting a new "General Crunchyroll News Thread" so when news about Crunchyroll gets posted, it could be talked about in an objective way.

Anyway, this was posted on ANN about a week ago, and I don't think it's been talked about here, and I figured this is was the best existing thread to talk about it.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news...ows-mobile-app

Crunchyroll already quietly added Spanish subtitles for Area no Kishi(Knight in the Area) but this is potentially great news to their subscribers in Latin America as it could also mean an increase in available series to Spanish-speaking countries(and one significant Portuguese speaking one)

[Urzu 7]

What is the purpose of having the queue feature at Crunchyroll? Can't you just pick an episode and watch it whenever you feel like?

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by Urzu 7

What is the purpose of having the queue feature at Crunchyroll? Can't you just pick an episode and watch it whenever you feel like?

I am assuming that this is so that you can use the computer to setup the queue you way you like it, and then go to your device (like PS3, etc.) and just hit play and have it play through the whole list. Triaging through menus to find episodes on the PS3 or other devices like phones is more time-consuming.

[Utsuro no Hako]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

I am assuming that this is so that you can use the computer to setup the queue you way you like it, and then go to your device (like PS3, etc.) and just hit play and have it play through the whole list. Triaging through menus to find episodes on the PS3 or other devices like phones is more time-consuming.

Pretty much, except you have to manually advance to the next episode in the queue (at least on Roku). The queue also keeps track of where you are in a series, so if you fall behind you don't have to remember which episode you watched last.

On a side note, I believe that with Koi to Senkyo to Chocolate streaming on the Anime Network, every summer series except Ebiten and Joshiraku is legally available in the US.

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by Utsuro no Hako

On a side note, I believe that with Koi to Senkyo to Chocolate streaming on the Anime Network, every summer series except Ebiten and Joshiraku is legally available in the US.

With Ebiten, there's a semi-decent chance it may be "simulcast" when it airs on Japanese TV this fall, which would cross it off the list as well.

[Urzu 7]

Will Koichoco go on CR? I just subscribed to CR and I like it. The HD streams are good quality.

Should I go with 720p streams or 1080p streams? I hear the 1080p streams aren't true 1080p. Are the 720p streams not truly 720p? Would it still be worth going with 720p streams? I'd like to know due to monthly bandwidth caps.