AnimeSuki Forums

willyvereb · 2009-08-05, 01:00

There's only to. The "Will of Steel" is a bad end and only has a very brief conclusion part(Kotomine explains to Shirou what he must do).
HF has probably the most sad ending(Normal End) and one of the happiest endings(True End)

DeotoxSlayer · 2009-08-05, 01:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by willyvereb

There's only to. The "Will of Steel" is a bad end and only has a very brief conclusion part(Kotomine explains to Shirou what he must do).
HF has probably the most sad ending(Normal End) and one of the happiest endings(True End)

I can agree to it having the happiest ending as for the sadest one IMO Fate ending beats it by a little.

willyvereb · 2009-08-05, 01:37

Saber parting? Seriously thats not that sad...

Spoiler for HF:

Question? Do you think Shirou can have children even after HF's True ending?
His body's situation somewhat doubts it...

Tyabann · 2009-08-05, 04:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by willyvereb

Question? Do you think Shirou can have chioldren even after HF's True ending?
His body's situation somewhat doubts it...

Well, the doll's shape depends on the soul, right?

I suspect that also includes internal organs and sperm production.

DeusX · 2009-08-05, 05:48

hm my fav ending is the "Sunny Day".
in the tiger dojo you hear that in the HF should also be a "ridicolous ending" (thats not the actuall name just how they call it there) where even saber stayed alive but they removed it.

OH! ttly forgot: has Fate/hollow ataraxia also been published for the PC?

willyvereb · 2009-08-05, 06:25

My Favourite end is HF's normal end:"Cherry Blossoms' Dream"
Just because Shirou's epic sacrafice scene. In many sense he suprpassed even Archer's GARness that time.

DeusX · 2009-08-05, 07:11

i don t know which end is more saddening: cherry b or cont of the dream =/
the fat ending was just fucking dumb: when they told each other about their feelings she just disappeared and in the UBW where he kinda focusses on tohsaka she stays!

willyvereb · 2009-08-05, 08:11

Simple...we need a bit of sadness to make a good ending. Or so the jJapanese writers thinks(especially Nasu...almost every one of his characters have tragic or traumatising past, fighting insanity or having other saddening thing.)
If you keep saber you've got an all-happy ending. It coul've been somewhat lame to be honest. Even in HF True end there's a bunch of sacrafices and still it considered the happiest one. Why? Because of the sacrafices themselves and perhaps probably Shirou and Sakura's happy "wife-husband" life.
Not to mention if you keep King Arthur then a time paradox forms with it(she's dying after the battle at Camlann and actually diued while she lives in the modern world.). Maybe that's why Shirou must "mana-recharge" Rin so much after the ending. The world tries to fix that contradiction and as the time goes with greater and greater effort So even in UBW she stays until she won't have the answer from Shirou to the question Archer asked.
Saber has no intention staying at that world. She's king first then a woman. She's already married to her country.

kakakka · 2009-08-05, 08:23

Quote:

There's only to. The "Will of Steel" is a bad end and only has a very brief conclusion part(Kotomine explains to Shirou what he must do).
HF has probably the most sad ending(Normal End) and one of the happiest endings(True End)

Only two? I saw two Sakura Normal, one when you have performed the Limit Burst and one you got from finishing the True Ending. So they're the same right? Thanks.

For me the saddest ending is Fate Route Ending. Sorry, Heaven's Feel is sad throughout, the impact of the last ending* is just....that. In Fate, you keep believing, like the optimistic Shirou, that everything is going to be alright in the end, but you got shattered by the reality and have to accept it. And/Or maybe because I watched the anime first, and playing the game made me more engaged in Fate.

*I got the Cherry Blossom's dream ending first.

willyvereb · 2009-08-05, 09:03

Everyone does that ending first (after the many bad ends:P) in HF. Completing the normal ending the requisition of the true end(Return to the Spring).
And I don't know. For me sad ending is when the very end is sad too. Fate's ending only bittersweet. But every ending is bittersweet. Maybe Fate'ssudden, but that's all. Maybe because of the anime I wasn't shocked by it. I tend to analyse things throughly even if I just simply watch something and don't reallyconcentrate on it. Maybe that's why I thought it must end that way in Fate. I hoped for something different, but Nasu's works really don't force the happy ends.
But HF normal ending was different. I knew he's going to die if he overuses his abilities, I knew why he's doing it, but the simple amount of description got me. I could imagine the feeling as he looses everything. Then after that dramatic end I hoped at least sakura's going to be happy, but the thing she got was emptiness and guilt. She lived her remaining life in a false hope, closing her heart.

Q: Has anyone a suggestion who's the father of Rin's daughter?
I guess not, because we have no clues mentioned to find it out.

kakakka · 2009-08-05, 09:32

Quote:

Everyone does that ending first (after the many bad ends:P) in HF. Completing the normal ending the requisition of the true end(Return to the Spring).

Yeah. A friend of mine said to make Sakura (first) and Ilya (second) happy to avoid most of the bad ends.

Quote:

But HF normal ending was different. I knew he's going to die if he overuses his abilities, I knew why he's doing it, but the simple amount of description got me. I could imagine the feeling as he looses everything. Then after that dramatic end I hoped at least sakura's going to be happy, but the thing she got was emptiness and guilt. She lived her remaining life in a false hope, closing her heart.

As you said, we know it's going to happen, there is no false hope to cling to since its more realistic than the other routes. There is no impact. I mean, really its sad, but not the a very memorable/saddest one.

I don't think Sakura closed her heart. Well, maybe for a possible lover, but she didn't totally closed her heart to everyone. I remember reading she got new friends (in contrast before when only Shirou was her true friend) and when she got old, she got students to teach.

willyvereb · 2009-08-05, 09:49

You're right I said it somewhat wrong. She closed her heart partially. But I think she even secluded herself from the word. She returned to the girl she was at the beginning somehow. Maybe she expresses herself more and more active, but she remains at Fuyuki and plants cherry trees for Shirou. She lives a good life, but she has a big hole inside her heart. She dies lonely.
I think our opinions about what's sad differs. Foor me when there's less hope. In Fate Shirou had plenty of hope and he really managed to keep himself together. HF's normal ending is a different case. sakura's gripping into an impossible hope(and to be honest I hoped she may the very least hallucinates about it's completition in the end).

Slash_Emperor · 2009-08-06, 15:37

I think HF Normal is pretty much the saddest ending in the game =S. Then comes UBW True, Fate, UBW Normal and HF Normal. But HF has the best bad endings overall - the Heart of Steel and the one where Shirou fights Saber.

HF True was lame to me, as it didn't fit with the whole tragic feel of the entire route.

Tyabann · 2009-08-06, 16:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slash_Emperor

HF True was lame to me, as it didn't fit with the whole tragic feel of the entire route.

That's the point. You get your happy ending only after suffering for a long time.

Flinch · 2009-08-06, 16:45

After enduring long amounts of suffering, you don't get happy endings. What you get is less suffering, but you will ALWAYS suffer from your past; that's basic psychology.

Tyabann · 2009-08-06, 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flinch

After enduring long amounts of suffering, you don't get happy endings. What you get is less suffering, but you will ALWAYS suffer from your past; that's basic psychology.

Basic psychology =/= the way fiction works.

The characters DESERVE that happy ending.

mAc Chaos · 2009-08-06, 18:35

What was Shirou's justification for passing on Kotomine's offer to use the Grail to revive everyone who died from the big fire, and undo the past, again? I remember he wanted to move forward like he thought Saber should, but I don't remember the specific details right now. Did you guys think his choice made sense or should he have tried to bring them back?

Tyabann · 2009-08-06, 18:51

Bringing people back who died is a disservice to their memory.

Also the Grail would have corrupted his wish anyway.

kakakka · 2009-08-06, 18:55

Quote:

What was Shirou's justification for passing on Kotomine's offer to use the Grail to revive everyone who died from the big fire, and undo the past, again?

I thought he decided to fight so that the war will end shortly, not to get the Holy Grail? His answer to those who died in the fire is to live his life whatever he think is fit (like being a superhero...)

I thought it was Saber who wants to redo (undo?) her past, somewhere along the lines of her being not the ruler of her country?

mAc Chaos · 2009-08-06, 18:57

Well, it also would've kind of went against the whole direction the story had been going, with Saber having to learn to accept the past and move on. If Shirou listened to Kotomine he would've just done the opposite of what he had been telling Saber to do all along.

Wouldn't most people decide to just go with it and use the Grail though (assuming it worked)? I mean, he could undo it all with a snap of his fingers.

I also thought that it was also because of those things that he became the person he was, so they are, in a way, living on through him.

2009-08-05, 01:37	Link #1403
willyvereb Mad Scientist #0000 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Hungry Age: 35	Saber parting? Seriously thats not that sad... Spoiler for HF: HF normal was a real tearjerker. Shirou memories and sense of time gradually dissapearing. His last remaining memories being only about Sakura, then his sacrafice. Not to mention it wasn't happy and hopefull like the Fate's in the end. sakura calmly waiting for Shirou while it's sure he never comes back.In Fate Shirou has hopes and friends, but in HF normal Shirou died, and sakura while lives her life locked herself in again. Question? Do you think Shirou can have children even after HF's True ending? His body's situation somewhat doubts it... Last edited by willyvereb; 2009-08-05 at 04:17.

2009-08-05, 05:48	Link #1405
DeusX ttly nO.ob but anime addi Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Germany	hm my fav ending is the "Sunny Day". in the tiger dojo you hear that in the HF should also be a "ridicolous ending" (thats not the actuall name just how they call it there) where even saber stayed alive but they removed it. OH! ttly forgot: has Fate/hollow ataraxia also been published for the PC? __________________ <3 Anime

2009-08-05, 07:11	Link #1407
DeusX ttly nO.ob but anime addi Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Germany	i don t know which end is more saddening: cherry b or cont of the dream =/ the fat ending was just fucking dumb: when they told each other about their feelings she just disappeared and in the UBW where he kinda focusses on tohsaka she stays! __________________ <3 Anime

2009-08-06, 16:45	Link #1415
Flinch Onii-chan~ Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Einzbern Castle Age: 32	After enduring long amounts of suffering, you don't get happy endings. What you get is less suffering, but you will ALWAYS suffer from your past; that's basic psychology. __________________

2009-08-05, 01:00	Link #1401
willyvereb Mad Scientist #0000 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Hungry Age: 35	There's only to. The "Will of Steel" is a bad end and only has a very brief conclusion part(Kotomine explains to Shirou what he must do). HF has probably the most sad ending(Normal End) and one of the happiest endings(True End)

2009-08-05, 06:25	Link #1406
willyvereb Mad Scientist #0000 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Hungry Age: 35	My Favourite end is HF's normal end:"Cherry Blossoms' Dream" Just because Shirou's epic sacrafice scene. In many sense he suprpassed even Archer's GARness that time.

2009-08-05, 08:11	Link #1408
willyvereb Mad Scientist #0000 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Hungry Age: 35	Simple...we need a bit of sadness to make a good ending. Or so the jJapanese writers thinks(especially Nasu...almost every one of his characters have tragic or traumatising past, fighting insanity or having other saddening thing.) If you keep saber you've got an all-happy ending. It coul've been somewhat lame to be honest. Even in HF True end there's a bunch of sacrafices and still it considered the happiest one. Why? Because of the sacrafices themselves and perhaps probably Shirou and Sakura's happy "wife-husband" life. Not to mention if you keep King Arthur then a time paradox forms with it(she's dying after the battle at Camlann and actually diued while she lives in the modern world.). Maybe that's why Shirou must "mana-recharge" Rin so much after the ending. The world tries to fix that contradiction and as the time goes with greater and greater effort So even in UBW she stays until she won't have the answer from Shirou to the question Archer asked. Saber has no intention staying at that world. She's king first then a woman. She's already married to her country.

2009-08-05, 09:03	Link #1410
willyvereb Mad Scientist #0000 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Hungry Age: 35	Everyone does that ending first (after the many bad ends:P) in HF. Completing the normal ending the requisition of the true end(Return to the Spring). And I don't know. For me sad ending is when the very end is sad too. Fate's ending only bittersweet. But every ending is bittersweet. Maybe Fate'ssudden, but that's all. Maybe because of the anime I wasn't shocked by it. I tend to analyse things throughly even if I just simply watch something and don't reallyconcentrate on it. Maybe that's why I thought it must end that way in Fate. I hoped for something different, but Nasu's works really don't force the happy ends. But HF normal ending was different. I knew he's going to die if he overuses his abilities, I knew why he's doing it, but the simple amount of description got me. I could imagine the feeling as he looses everything. Then after that dramatic end I hoped at least sakura's going to be happy, but the thing she got was emptiness and guilt. She lived her remaining life in a false hope, closing her heart. Q: Has anyone a suggestion who's the father of Rin's daughter? I guess not, because we have no clues mentioned to find it out.

2009-08-05, 09:49	Link #1412
willyvereb Mad Scientist #0000 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Hungry Age: 35	You're right I said it somewhat wrong. She closed her heart partially. But I think she even secluded herself from the word. She returned to the girl she was at the beginning somehow. Maybe she expresses herself more and more active, but she remains at Fuyuki and plants cherry trees for Shirou. She lives a good life, but she has a big hole inside her heart. She dies lonely. I think our opinions about what's sad differs. Foor me when there's less hope. In Fate Shirou had plenty of hope and he really managed to keep himself together. HF's normal ending is a different case. sakura's gripping into an impossible hope(and to be honest I hoped she may the very least hallucinates about it's completition in the end).

2009-08-06, 15:37	Link #1413
Slash_Emperor Heroic Spirit Join Date: Aug 2009	I think HF Normal is pretty much the saddest ending in the game =S. Then comes UBW True, Fate, UBW Normal and HF Normal. But HF has the best bad endings overall - the Heart of Steel and the one where Shirou fights Saber. HF True was lame to me, as it didn't fit with the whole tragic feel of the entire route.

2009-08-06, 18:35	Link #1417
mAc Chaos King of Heroes Join Date: Feb 2009 Age: 38	What was Shirou's justification for passing on Kotomine's offer to use the Grail to revive everyone who died from the big fire, and undo the past, again? I remember he wanted to move forward like he thought Saber should, but I don't remember the specific details right now. Did you guys think his choice made sense or should he have tried to bring them back?

2009-08-06, 18:51	Link #1418
Tyabann Homo Ludens Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Canada Age: 34	Bringing people back who died is a disservice to their memory. Also the Grail would have corrupted his wish anyway.

2009-08-06, 18:57	Link #1420
mAc Chaos King of Heroes Join Date: Feb 2009 Age: 38	Well, it also would've kind of went against the whole direction the story had been going, with Saber having to learn to accept the past and move on. If Shirou listened to Kotomine he would've just done the opposite of what he had been telling Saber to do all along. Wouldn't most people decide to just go with it and use the Grail though (assuming it worked)? I mean, he could undo it all with a snap of his fingers. I also thought that it was also because of those things that he became the person he was, so they are, in a way, living on through him.