Infinite Stratos - General Discussion

[asaqe]

And a bit of Asura Cryin on top of all that.

[Kunagisa]

One million and 200k sale~!

Season 2 please =D?

[Terminator98]

No season 2 would mean anti-climatic or loose end ending that would screw up everything and create angst, hate and infinite shipping wars between fans, because 12 episodes isn't enough. (see Fortune Arterial's good start, but failed ending)

Unless the crew here manages to create a really good story, but seeing that 8-bit is a first timer... hmmm...

*crosses fingers*

[Klashikari]

Except that there are possibilities for a series to end on a climatic note even with a single season.
Your example with fortune arterial doesn't hold the water: they had material to end with a proper ending, but they dragged things on and simply made an open ending.

12 episodes doesn't make an adaptation impossible, unless you are dealing with material of a gargantuan size.

[Terminator98]

Oh well, might be my impression after having watched so many fail ended 12 episodes stuff...
I don't see how they will end on a climatic note here, they'll have to introduce every girl, and as they still have two more girl to introduce, it might be problematic.

How long they take to introduce them all will dictate how long they will have to put up a good story so that the ending ends great with the necessary momentum.

As I said though, the thing that is bugging me is the fact that... there's a high possibility that the definite love interest for Ichika won't be chosen by the 12 episode's end. So unless they make a 2nd season, this will leave quite a lot to be desired on part of many of the viewers, as one of the main reason why we're watching this show, is to see how "x" ends up with Ichika (my choice for "x" being Houki). If we're just given "and they fought for him ever on with him choosing no one" type ending, this will be a downer, unless of course, they can give us a 2nd season that will close down everything and make us all happy.

Well, all that is just speculation.

[Westlo]

I really wouldn't worry about not getting a season 2, the LNs have nearly doubled their sales in the 5 weeks that IS has been airing and the IS Blurays are a clear #2 of the season based on preorders.

[Terminator98]

D-Gray Man and Pandora Hearts are a good counter example... they were very popular but ended up not having a second season (hope isn't dead for Pandora hearts, but yeah, it's been quite some time.)

[MeisterBabylon]

Now I've been hunting high and low for a link between the country reps with personal units who appear in canon thus far. At first I thot it was Hetalia, or some WW2 fetish that Japan had been into lately, but no real definition existed.

It was during a discussion about how many IS cores are there left for the ISA to use, when I brought up the idea that IS cores would probably been entrusted to only those countries stable enough to prevent their cores from being stolen. This led me to wiki the NNPT:

Originally Posted by Wikipedia

The Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons, also Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty (NPT or NNPT) is a treaty to limit the spread (proliferation) of nuclear weapons. The treaty came into force on 5 March 1970, and currently there are 189 states party to the treaty, five of which are recognized as nuclear weapon states: the United States, Russia, the United Kingdom, France, and China (also the five permanent members of the United Nations Security Council).

See something? I know I did. That would mean that we will very likely have a US rep and a Russian rep join Ichika's harem in future.

Which then takes us to...

Originally Posted by Wikipedia

Four non-parties to the treaty are known or believed to possess nuclear weapons: India, Pakistan and North Korea have openly tested and declared that they possess nuclear weapons, while Israel has had a policy of opacity regarding its own nuclear weapons program.

I seriously doubt the author, or Japan for that matter, is that progressive to consider featuring 2 dark-skinned nations, and hope to still sell. So that's Japan's ownership of IS, and their symbiotic (and often fetished about) cousin Germany covered. You could even argue flimsily I suppose that the troubled nature of Japan's and Germany's representatives history with IS was an allusion to turmultuous Indian and Pakistani experience with nuclear power. The German rep was even after Japan rep's life. Just like the two neighbours, don't you think?

So I won't be surprised if Israel's rep appears some time. Their personal IS program would be the worst kept secret in the world!

North Korea may or may not appear, but I reckon that the author has taken to use "rogue states" instead in this analogy. These states are represented by Phantom Task and/or the unmanned IS manufacturers who created the cores illegally, if they weren't the same party.



So there you go, if you wanted see if Infinite Stratos had something deep buried in cheap harem, here's a little something for you to think about.

[HashiriyaR32]

OKay, I've just gotta ask this.

What would happen if you were to pit a Variable Fighter against a mass-produced IS?

[felix]

Originally Posted by HashiriyaR32

What would happen if you were to pit a Variable Fighter against a mass-produced IS?

Valkyrie? They're technically (almost) the same, minus the transformation. My guess, best pilot wins.

[neowind]

Originally Posted by Terminator98

No season 2 would mean anti-climatic or loose end ending that would screw up everything and create angst, hate and infinite shipping wars between fans, because 12 episodes isn't enough. (see Fortune Arterial's good start, but failed ending)

Unless the crew here manages to create a really good story, but seeing that 8-bit is a first timer... hmmm...

*crosses fingers*

true//its not always about if it does well..most of the time these 12eps are a test, or to help make money for the novel and the manga that is coming out. we would have to see how it plays out.

Originally Posted by Klashikari

Except that there are possibilities for a series to end on a climatic note even with a single season.
Your example with fortune arterial doesn't hold the water: they had material to end with a proper ending, but they dragged things on and simply made an open ending.

12 episodes doesn't make an adaptation impossible, unless you are dealing with material of a gargantuan size.

yeah they can just end open ending. since the novel is still going and there still other characters to introduce.and the author for the novel is having mental problems. there so many variables.. i think sadly no 2nd season just end it with that fight they show in the first eps thats it. its all about making sales for the novel.. it would be nice^_^ but sadly there not doing these kind of things.. japan anime is doing all this 12 eps. only the big market main stream animes get 24 or more. like last exile and so on.

Originally Posted by Terminator98

D-Gray Man and Pandora Hearts are a good counter example... they were very popular but ended up not having a second season (hope isn't dead for Pandora hearts, but yeah, it's been quite some time.)

true. but sale of the manga went up. like crazy. so yeah and anime stuidos tend to do there own route then the mangaka or authors of the novel

Originally Posted by felix

Valkyrie? They're technically (almost) the same, minus the transformation. My guess, best pilot wins.

will never know XD

Originally Posted by stuopidget

One million and 200k sale~!

Season 2 please =D?

whos the blue hair girl?

[Master_Yoma]

Ichika is getting a really nice harem

[Hiro Hayase]

Originally Posted by neowind

true//its not always about if it does well..most of the time these 12eps are a test, or to help make money for the novel and the manga that is coming out. we would have to see how it plays out.




yeah they can just end open ending. since the novel is still going and there still other characters to introduce.and the author for the novel is having mental problems. there so many variables.. i think sadly no 2nd season just end it with that fight they show in the first eps thats it. its all about making sales for the novel.. it would be nice^_^ but sadly there not doing these kind of things.. japan anime is doing all this 12 eps. only the big market main stream animes get 24 or more. like last exile and so on.




true. but sale of the manga went up. like crazy. so yeah and anime stuidos tend to do there own route then the mangaka or authors of the novel




will never know XD








whos the blue hair girl?

Spoiler for Blue Haired Girl:

The blue haired girl is actually student council president and the Russian representative candidate. She later becomes Ichika's bodyguard and forces him to become student council vice-president. I forgot her name though.....

[Javiersansano]

Spoiler for Blue Haired Girl:

Her name is Tatenashi

[asaqe]

Well Masatox decided to review the series and frankly I wasn't surprised. Even as a fanservice loving fan I can understand his POV. Too bad he doesn't know this is SOP for Mediafactory stuff.

http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/vid...finite-stratos

[KLGChaos]

Originally Posted by asaqe

Well Masatox decided to review the series and frankly I wasn't surprised. Even as a fanservice loving fan I can understand his POV. Too bad he doesn't know this is SOP for Mediafactory stuff.

http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/vid...finite-stratos

I'll watch the series until the end, but I can see some points as being valid. The fan service doesn't bother me because it isn't excessive, but Ichika is fairly useless and there's pretty much no plot to be found. Not to mention that it's one massive cliche after another... the girls are all cardboard cutouts of various harem tropes (tsundere, TWO childhood friends, snotty english girl, gender-bender girl, angry german girl, etc). The story (or what little there is of it) basically goes -> girl comes in -> girl battles Ichika -> girl falls for Ichika -> repeat while each previous girl just becomes of the pack getting angry about the new girl coming in. It also doesn't make me laugh out loud like a few other series do. More like it's just going through the motions.

Still, it's got some nice artwork and I've already invested in watching 6 episodes, so I'll see it through until the end.

Still really like Gosick and Kore wa Zombie much better, though.

[pauldy]

Originally Posted by asaqe

http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/vid...finite-stratos

Didn't really watched the whole of the video review but looking at some parts, he seems to base everything on episode one.. Pretty much like those reviews in other places...

but in fairness to them, the anime series does feel a kind of bland after 6 episodes of watching.. the characters, very typical.. the story.. not really there yet perhaps.. though only thing that's going for this imo is the animation..

I haven't watched 7 yet.. been busy lately.

but anyway, IS still has 5 episodes to go to prove it's worth.. ^

[Wild Goose]

Originally Posted by HashiriyaR32

OKay, I've just gotta ask this.

What would happen if you were to pit a Variable Fighter against a mass-produced IS?

Depends on the VF and the MP IS and what era we're using.

Variable Fighters fall into several categories and generations - very much in parallel to modern fighters.

The first Variable Fighters are the VF-0 and SV-51 of Macross Zero. Basic performance is about roughly equal to jet fighters, though the SV-51 has some stealth properties: the Tomcats weren't able to get a lock on it for Sparrows, though Shin was able to track it and get a firing solution for the gun.

Then there's the VF-1, which had a top speed of about mach 2, could operate in space, and carry multiple weapon loads. THat's 2009.

Then we get to the time of Macross Plus and Project Super Nova, the Advanced Variable Fighter competition. The stats for the prototype YF-19 and YF-21 are insane: +20/-10 G manuvers, top speed in excess of Mach 5 at 10,000 meters, top speed of Mach 22 at 30,000 meters... while the IS is a small target and can turn on a dime, the AVF units aren't slouches, and have the pinpoint barrier as a defence against the IS; also, the VF's have an advantage in that they've got longer operational time compared to the IS. As long as they catch the enemy fire on the PPB they're good, vs the IS that relies on the shield defense. And if things are looking bad the VF pilot can hit afterburner and go hypersonic, opening the range, gaining time to think and react, and come back for round two.

Macross Frontier era (2059) is even worse - at this stage, in comparison to the IS, which is still relatively new, not even hitting 20 years yet, Variable fighters have been in deployment for 50 years. They are a mature technology that is proven, with more advances to build on - the Armored VF-25, for instance, has performance equal to a clean YF-19, while loaded with 52 tons of equipment.

In terms of manuver, the later model VFs have the advantage due to the inertia dampening available to the UN Spacy - humans WILL lose consciousness at 9Gs; as a result unless the IS is able to negate the effects of Gs, the VFs will be able to outmanuver the IS.

Basically, given everything that I've seen, in a manuver battle the VFs win; in an armament battle... more date required. VF weapons are on orders of magnitude more powerful than current conventional weapons - note also that Frontier's mecha are using MDE shells which cause mini black holes or something like that.

I'd point out, however, that the chances of surviving a VF-25 Armored flushing its pods, sending 242 micromissiles and 30x 200mm rockets towards a single target, are not very good.

tl;dr : Zero and Macross-eras, goes down to the pilot. Plus and beyond, VF has the advantage.

Unless the VF pilots are Max and Millia. Then obviously Max and Millia win.

[felix]

The technology is too different to compare Wild Goose. For all we know VF might not even be able to scratch a top of the line IS.

[Wild Goose]

Perhaps, but given that we've so far see no objective level of destruction to quantify, at the end of the day this boils down to guesstimation.

Unless both Infinite Stratos and Macross Frontier appear in the next installment of Another Century's Episode.

My points still remain though: The early generation VFs, with performance similar to conventional fighters, will face a tough time against IS, given that White Knight apparently soloed 207 next generation fighters (which I'm going to assume are F-22s, given that that's the only 5th Gen fighter in active service - PAK-FA, J-20, KF-X and ATD-X are still prototypes) and 7 carrier groups. The later generations, Project Super Nova and descendants, would have less of a performance gap.

The G-limit is a crucial part of that: outmanuvering the enemy is one thing, but if you can simply disengage at will and return to the fight on your own terms, you can dictate the course of battle. So far I've not seen the IS able to accelerate in excess of 20G, which Project Super Nova & descendants can. There's also the fact that at 10,000 meters they can hit mach 5, which we haven't seen yet from IS...

Also, speed is only one part of the combat equation - energy is crucial; energy being defined by pilots as how rapidly they can change position and increase speed.

Also, while they tend to get chewed up pretty bad, in Battroid form the VF-1's energy conversion armor is capable of tanking an armor piercing shell from a 120mm tank gun with no damage, which forms a certain benchmark for how powerful beam weapons are.

Hmmm, that reminds me: weaponry wise VFs tend to stick to gatling guns and shitloads of missiles for their attack options - few VFs use beam weapons in a primary role (interestingly, the VF-17 and YF-21/VF-22 have forward firing beam guns, and the VF-27 uses a beam gunpod); contrast with current 3rd Gen IS, where the various nations are experimenting with beam weaponry. And energy converting armor has tended to not work so well against beam weapons.

...what would be really useful is if someone could post stats for various IS up; we could then compare those to available stats for VFs and work from there.

At the end of the day though, I'd also like to remind that as of Frontier VFs are a maturing tech - 50 years old. It's now 67 years since jet aircraft were first deployed as fighters and compare the advances between the F-22 and the Me 262.