Dating

[Gamer_2k4]

Originally Posted by Ledgem

This is good advice, but it deserves mention that you might never feel "ready." I remember having pangs of anxiety when I asked my wife to marry me (I was 22), and again when we actually got married (I was 24). It was something that I had given great thought to, wanted to do and felt strongly about, but the thought that this was it - a commitment for life and eternity - was still frightening (I know some people have lax attitudes toward marriage and divorce, but it's something I take very seriously). It's only natural to wonder if you're making a mistake, if you wouldn't be better off with someone else, if the timing is right, and so on.

While your perspective is certainly valid, the opposite is also very possible. I've been with my girlfriend for a year and a half now, and we've known for most of that time that we wanted to marry each other. The thought of waking up next to her every morning and sharing life with her every day is nothing short of amazing, and I can't imagine where anxiety would ever come in. If money wasn't an issue, we'd be married now, and I've never wondered if there's someone better. I have her, and we're perfect for each other. What more could I want? What's there to be worried about?

And yes, I take marriage very seriously too. I intend for this to be for the rest of our lives, and I'll do my hardest during that entire time to make it the best relationship possible. That doesn't mean I need to worry about it, though.

[synaesthetic]

Marriage is an overrated heteronormative paradigm. I don't like it. I don't like the trappings that go with it. My partner recently started referring to me as her "wife" to other people and I made her stop because it doesn't sit well with me--I'd prefer not to bend and bow to society's heteronormative bullshit, and I asked her to simply use my name.

That said, I would like to go through the legal process of marriage with my partner because it confers useful legal benefits that we would otherwise not receive. Unfortunately, this is currently not possible in California thanks to Proposition 8 and its current status in legal limbo.

Weddings are totally fun, though--I mean, what girl could resist a rockin' party where you wear a pretty dress, eat lots of great food and drink yourself silly? And then get laid at the end of it? I mean come on, that's just awesome.

[jvcscasio]

I don't think marriage is simply an heteronormative paradigm.

I see marriage as a symbol, just like a birthday party. It only has meaning because we put a meaning there. Marriage is basicaly this: A way for humans to feel that they are together.

Most of us NEED a symbol, we feel confortable with them around. People have religious figures, make birthdays parties, make funerals, create fanclubs, go to forums because we are like that. People need symbols, something like an false idol, to look for.

You may not like the symbol they created of marriage, but think of your partner, for her, marriage may still be an idol of love, a something that make her feel together with you even if it's false, even if it's just an idea created by her own mind through culture.

Unless you feel REALLY bad with it, I don't think you should deprive the person you love from her beliefs and idols.

And if you want freedom, get out of united states... You won't get anything there.

[synaesthetic]

Oh, I don't, and she's got a lot of really good logical reasons to want it--same as me. I would just prefer to be called by my name and not the "wife" moniker.

I mean, it's annoying. It requires explanation. If I talk about her as my "wife" then people assume I'm a guy. I don't like that; I'm not a guy. If she tells people the same thing, they give her blank stares and it's just weird.

[jvcscasio]

Do as me, stop caring about what other people think XP

But well, if she agrees with you, I see no problem... I thought she wanted to marry and you didn't because you saw that as something despicable from a controlled society, sorry~


My girlfriend don't like the idea of marriage too, but since I'm not religious nor anything, I don't really mind if we never marry...

[germanturkey]

today, i realized that years of failed relationships have turned me into an eccedentesiast. its never a fun feeling.

[jvcscasio]

What is a eccedentesiast?

[wanderer86]

wondering if any Otaku here live in Western sydney. I have Zero friends, so its impossible to meet anyone let alone some with similar interests.

[Crashmaking Zoomatic]

So, howdy, everyone!

I posted in this thread a couple of years ago, and I think I need some help again. Not really -help-, persay, but just some opinions/someone to listen. It's going to be very long, though, so you've been warned!

Spoiler for Length:

So. I've been with my boyfriend almost four years now. We met online, grew really close, and things ended up happening as they did; we've made a habit of meeting each other at least once a year, and have wracked up four visits so far. It would be more, but he lives across the pond, so you know...

Now, as far as relationships go, this is still my first. I've never actually had too much interest in them beforehand (a lot of that probably has to do to how my parents made it sound like I would be a huge disgrace if I got in a relationship before I was thirty...), but this was the first time I -clicked- with a person. I'm decently sociable, but fairly awkward around people I don't know, girls especially, and I have -never- in my entire life opened up to anyone, or been on a close and personal level with another person except for my boyfriend. And to get to that level, he really had to dig, and this was before he even had an interest in me as a girlfriend, so I appreciate it beyond belief, in hindsight.

So needless to say, I tell him everything, and he is my support in every way possible. I've learned a lot more about myself over this process, and because of how honest he is, I've been able to work towards bettering myself as a person over these years. It may sound like I'm giving him a lot of credit, but it's all well deserved! That's a little background, so let me get to my worries here. About half-way into our relationship, he had some fairly prominent health problems that might have been cancer, but eventually, he was found to be in the clear. This situation went on for a year, though, and really messed with his mood (understandably). It was also during that time that we found out that he's suffered from depression for quite a while. He didn't even know it himself, and it was almost impossible to tell, but the more he understood how different his thoughts were at times, the more he sunk into it, I guess? Or at least, he -shows- the fact that he's unhappy around me much more, something I appreciate because I want to help, but at the end of the day, there's very little I can do. He's made it very clear that just my presence brightens up his day even if it isn't obvious, and I completely believe him, but it almost feels like a role-reversal now. At one point, I clung onto him because I had no one else like him who would put up with my moods (normal people never even know there were moods in the first place!), my insecurities, and whatever else, and now it feels like he clings onto me, and if for some reason, I left the relationship, he would fall apart, and that's terrifying. I want to help him and support him, but it's far easier to cheer me up than vice-versa. I feel like I'm fighting a losing battle, sometimes, no matter how hard I try.

As much as I love him, it's been very difficult on me. There was a period where I used to snap at him for little things because I got so -frustrated- with his short responses and general lethargy. We communicate mostly through text unless he's feeling talkative (rare now-days), and for someone like me who's not as good at driving conversation (my boyfriend is really good at it when he tries), having all my efforts effectively slam into a brick wall was tough. I felt horrible because I knew he couldn't exactly help it, but I still found my patience waning quickly. His remedy for the situation was always to 'pretend that he was feeling alright and force himself to talk more', but I was never happy with that because I -do- want to help him. He'd still do it on and off even if I told him not to, in any case, but if he hit a particular low, it'd usually drop. The worst part is that I generally felt happier when he -did- put up the act because I was actually able to relax, even if I knew he was still the same. In any case, he hasn't actually done this for a while.

I've managed for a long time. We spend a lot of our time roleplaying and things like that (we met on a roleplaying game), which is a lot of fun, but, well. I don't know. This summer has been especially taxing because I've been very stressed studying for the MCAT (medical college admission test) while trying to get my materials ready to apply at various schools, and if anyone knows, it's a long, incredibly stressful process, and when I'm spending half of my day working on this, spending the other half tending to my boyfriend has become increasingly difficult all of a sudden. I've recently realized that I often feel very detached, and I've been questioning our relationship a lot. Apparently it's something he's picked up on too, which just makes him feel more down. I feel like my patience is thin again, and though I haven't snapped at him or anything like that, my ambivalence has kind of leaked out enough to make him feel like our relationship isn't actually going to last (he used to be very confident about it, at one point). He tells me he wouldn't blame me too much if I left him, but says that although he isn't trying to trap me, he really would be a mess if I left, and I know that's just him being honest, a quality of his I've always admired.

Now, I don't -want- to feel this way, nor do I want to break-up with him or anything. I do still love him. I've just had very little patience lately with everything else going on, and it's -worrying-. I feel like the villain here too, but as understanding as I try to be, very little actually changes (which is in no way his fault), and it's harder for me to depend on him in return. It's probably not healthy that we spend the majority of our free time with each other, but as someone who has a strong, intrinsic dislike of spending time with other people except for him, it's never been a particularly huge problem. He's kind of similar too. But even with his mood, I know that I am still what brightens up his day considerably, and to find his well-being so stuck to me is very worrying. I'm expecting a lot of people to tell me to break up with him, but I don't want to do that because I do love him, and he is one of a kind to me, even if I'm not really -feeling- that love at the moment like I used to. I don't want to make any serious decisions during a period that has been incredibly stressful, either, but, if anyone has managed to read this far, some general opinions would be wonderful. I think I just needed to get that out. Of course, I've spoken to him about my problems, and the solution still is 'I'll force myself to type more sound more enthusiastic!!' but I don't think that's the solution here at all.

So. That's all. If you actually got this far, thank you very much!

[DemonOfWrath]

Ok, has he gone and sought any professional help about his depression? If not then I'd try and suggest to him that he does, as seriously that's one of the best things he can do to help himself. Having been through something rather similar to him myself I can tell you that it really will help him in pulling out of it at least a bit, as while he may think it'd be pointless, or that it'd reflect on him negatively (the "oh geez I'm seeking therapy for this" response) it'll help give him a new, and unbiased, perspective on what's going on with himself that you won't be able to provide by yourself.

Also, and I'll be a bit harsher here, the fact that he's relying so much on you for his mental well-being in not a good thing at all. Of course, having someone who knows what's going on and who you can talk to when you really need a slight push away from being depressed about something is good (as stewing on it by yourself is THE worst thing you can do basically), and he does have that in you, but fundamentally he has to be able to be happy without relying on someone else, otherwise he can't truly improve on his current situation.

So yeah, my advice would be to try and steer him towards seeking some professional help about his depression and such. Make sure to let him know that there's nothing wrong with that, and that you want him to because you love him and want to help him as much as possible (I am assuming of course that will be the case, but it sounds like it is). Explaining to him that you're worried and you're having trouble handling it yourself is absolutely fine as well. It certainly doesn't mean you're abandoning him or giving up on him or anything, and if anything it may help him get some motivation for it (getting told that by my best friend is what pushed me to actually go do it myself btw).

Note: Don't take this as me saying that seeing a therapist is definitely going to help him 100%. It obviously depends on what exactly is going on with him, but with some things it might help a lot more than you or he would think. I'm certainly NOT an expert on this stuff, I just have some first-hand experience I can base stuff off of.

[Crashmaking Zoomatic]

Thank you for your response! He--thankfully--did seek medical help, but he hasn't actually had -therapy-. He's on medication for it right now, and while he thinks it helps somewhat, it's not like it's turning things around. I do wish there was something he could do outside of relying just on me that would make him happy, but at the moment, nothing seems to seem like a viable option. He works quite often, and after work, his way of kicking back is hanging out with me. I feel the same way, but it just hasn't been quite as relaxing for me as it is the other way around, unfortunately. There was a small blip of happiness once he had undergone this pending surgery for his thyroid, and even though the aftermath was initially rough, he was just incredibly happy after. It almost felt like how he used to be when we first met, as cliche as it sounds, and that was the loveliest of feelings, but unfortunately it didn't last.

I'm so glad that your own situation ended up improving, though!

[NorthernFallout]

In addition to what DemonOfWrath said, it feels like you two haven't talked about this particular topic in any depth (correct me if I'm wrong.) In other words, a collapse in communication, which I feel is pretty normal in situation like these. If you haven't, telling him what you told us might help him understand a bit more and might help smooth over it before it goes somewhere you don't want to.

If you already have, I wish you luck.

[HasuMasu]

I think friends would help with depression, that's generally how I got out of mine.

Just spent time with friends and got really into some hobbies eventually helped me up.

[Crashmaking Zoomatic]

I've spoken to him about how frustrating it's been, but his way of trying to fix it is to always pretend that he's in a decent mood, and I don't really want him to pretend. But thank you for the well wishes!

But maybe that would help. It's not something he's really worked towards, though. Occasionally he goes out with some friends, but he never really enjoys them enough to make it a regular occurrence, I feel. He's usually working late on weekdays, too, and sometimes even on weekends, so there isn't quite a lot of time for much.

[SummeryDreams]

Here's my point.. Love has a reason which reason itself you can never understand.. Something you can never explain by words but you will surely know it's true love..

[Ascaloth]

You need to wake him up and make him face the fact that he needs help. Forcefully, if that be necessary.

Smack him.

[SummeryDreams]

Originally Posted by Ascaloth

You need to wake him up and make him face the fact that he needs help. Forcefully, if that be necessary.

Smack him.

I guess he doesn't need help, nobody teaches me as well... Let his experience be his teacher anyways.. Good luck to him..

[Ledgem]

Originally Posted by Crashmaking Zoomatic

So, howdy, everyone!

I posted in this thread a couple of years ago, and I think I need some help again. Not really -help-, persay, but just some opinions/someone to listen. It's going to be very long, though, so you've been warned!

I'd imagine that many of us on AnimeSuki can relate to you in some form, and advice will be given based on personal experiences and thoughts on how others are dealing with the situation.

Hello, Crashmaking Zoomatic. I used to be you, except that I'm male and didn't date online. I am now less awkward and more socially confident than I used to be. I am halfway through medical school and my wife is halfway done with residency; we met in undergrad and survived two rounds of medical school ("the great relationship ender") with very little strife. I'll give you my thoughts, my experiences, and tell you a bit of what you can expect.

You're probably aware of this bit, but I'm going to say it anyway: long-distance relationships are incredibly difficult. Communicating through text and voice creates many risky openings for misunderstanding. A distance relationship is also very different from having someone near you, and going a step farther, living together. A person's time and activity demands "in real life" differ from what comes across online. Their lifestyle and habits can be endearing or grating.

Knowing that, where do you see this relationship going? Where do you want it to go, where do you think it will realistically go, and what does your boyfriend think? When you envision your ideal relationship, what does it look like? These aren't questions that you need to give me the answers to. If you haven't thought about it before, it's worth thinking about now. This relationship has been a major source of support for you, but if it has no chance of meeting your desires then it is holding you back. You could be seeing other people, but as long as you're in this relationship then those options are essentially off-limits to you.

A relationship has a strong foundation when both members in the relationship are strong enough to stand on their own. This doesn't mean that you can't rely on your relationship for support, or that it shouldn't factor into your feelings of identity and self-worth. However, the relationship should not be a patch for deficiencies that you have as an individual. Based on what you've written, I worry a little bit that this is what happened for you. An unhealthy dynamic has developed: you relied on your boyfriend for a lot of personal stability, but now that he needs you for support you're having trouble. You're feeling guilty about it, which is understandable. But what can you expect? The bandage that helped to cover your individual deficiencies is faltering. You're now forced to stand on your own in addition to supporting someone else's deficiencies, whether temporary or not. Depression is a difficult issue to deal with, whether as the one suffering from it or as a close pole of support. If you haven't addressed your individual setbacks and either improved or made peace with them then you're really a source of support for two people: yourself (the individual) and your boyfriend. That's difficult.

Medical school crushes many relationships because of the time commitment. While there are some exceptions, I can tell you that this is how I felt, how my wife felt, and how many of our peers felt: you will not have any time for yourself. More often than not you will feel anxious, depressed, stressed, or any combination of the three. According to statistics (and my own experience) the depression and feelings of "burnout" tend to diminish once you're finished with the first two years, but that isn't a short amount of time. Once medical school is over, the stress levels tend to rise again in residency.

There are two major factors to consider regarding relationships and medical school: first, how stable you are as an individual (the more stable you are, the better you'll be able to weather these challenges, and the less instability your significant other will experience); and second, how much your significant other understands and supports what you'll be doing. Many people who are not in medical training in some form really don't understand or appreciate just how terrible it feels and how much work is involved. This leads to conflicts where they don't understand why you're unable to spend much time with them (leading to feelings of neglect), or why you tend to be gloomier than usual.

So, what should you do? The advice is simple, and this applies to all relationships: talk to him. He's going through a tough time in his life, and unless you turn out to be one of the exceptions (and I sincerely hope you will be), you're on the brink of taking at least a two-year walk through hell's outer rings. This is about being fair to yourself, and fair to him. If the relationship is becoming a drag on you, how badly will it impact on your performance? If you become distant and emotionally unpleasant, how badly will it impact on your boyfriend?

To summarize, you have a few questions to go through. Don't answer me or try to justify yourself to me; ask yourself. Where do you see the relationship going, is it matching your expectations, and will it match your expectations going forward? Is this relationship founded on something genuine and stable? Is this truly love, or is it just a source of comfort? Are your and your boyfriend's futures on a path toward intersection with each other, or divergence? What does he want and expect, and how does it compare to your own wants, expectations, and reality?

If the answers seem to indicate that the relationship holds a lot of promise, then you've made your choice and the only thing left to do is move forward with it. Others here may be able to give advice on long-distance relationships, and I can give some advice on what to expect with what's ahead and how to counter it as far as the relationship goes. If it doesn't seem promising, then there's no shame in breaking things off (whether temporarily or for good). It doesn't represent a failure, it just means that the conditions that you both experienced were too tough for the bond and chemistry that you have at this particular point in time.

Best of luck to you in your application and in your relationship. Remember, the first two years tend to be the worst for most people. If my and my wife's experiences are anything to go by, it greatly improves as you move forward after that.

[DonQuigleone]

Ledgem is on the money.

I'm just going to add that therapy can help a lot, and he should seek it out. As you've said, he shouldn't be giving across "false" enthusiasm. Try to find out what things he feels particularly depressed about. (Also, how about sex? I think insufficient sex and intimacy and physical intimacy can often contribute to depression, and that's a problem in long distance relationships)

Also, if I were you, I'd certainly try to broaden your own social horizons. Not necessarily to date other people, but you should try to maneuver yourself into a position where you are choosing to spend time with him, but that you aren't dependent upon him for socialising.

Likewise, he should be your boyfriend because you choose for him to be your boyfriend, not because he's the only possibility.

[Crashmaking Zoomatic]

Originally Posted by Ascaloth

You need to wake him up and make him face the fact that he needs help. Forcefully, if that be necessary.

Smack him.

At the very least, he understands that he -does- need help. It's just about finding time to get it, but at the moment, at least I know he hasn't ruled out therapy! He's just waiting for me to see whether I can visit or not this winter before figuring out a time.

And Ledgem, thanks for the really detailed response! As you said, I won't go through and answer all those questions, but I will say that I have somewhat mixed feelings on the future. On the one hand, I've never enjoyed spending time with any person as much as I have with him, and considering how averse I am to spending long amounts of time with -anyone-, I don't really want to lose this bond with him. There aren't many people who have similar interests to me, either. And I -do- love him. He's also a very large source of comfort, yes, I definitely can't deny that.

Also, the future is something I find scary, for lack of a better word, and the thought of deciding anything at this point isn't pleasant at all. Neither of us want to move to our significant other's respective countries, but because I plan on going to medical school, and he can work overseas as well, he finally decided that he would come and stay with me during med-school, and most likely live with me here. Whether that's a good idea while in medschool or not, I don't know at the moment, but it -is- worrying just because I have no idea what to expect.

We've never spent more than a couple of weeks together, and I've always had a lot of fun each time, but I also know there's a difference between spending time together watching movies and playing games, and spending time with each other supporting ourselves and working. As an undergraduate, whenever tests come up, I know that I would end up getting very stressed, pressured, and panicked fairly easily, so I can't even imagine how it would be in medical school. Asides from that, though, I'm relatively stable, or at least I'd like to think. I'm just not a fan of social situations, and considering I've never had a friend quite like my boyfriend, I'm a little unsure of what to expect without him. I feel it can go both ways: on the one hand, I'd stick to myself the same amount, and on the other hand, maybe I'd go out more. I don't know. If I do bring up the time commitment of medical school, my boyfriend simply says that he's researched it himself, and that he knows what to expect, and that he can handle it, which I really do hope.

If there's one thing we've always done, it's talk to each other openly, and as a whole, we communicate a lot, hence why we've lasted so long. I think we have a very good dynamic in that sense, it's just been difficult to support myself and him as you put it so well. I can't necessarily rely on him to make me feel better like I used to, and in some ways, that's probably made me even stronger. At this point, I'm probably just rambling on. It's normal to feel worried about how the relationship will hold up in the future, right?

I've never been a person who's been too interested in relationships, and while I'm really good at interacting with guys, anything even remotely romantic with anyone else never fancies my interest, so I doubt I'd even look for a partner if we broke up.
Thank you too DonQuigleone! You bring up a good point when mentioning intimacy. I didn't bring it up because I didn't know how appropriate it was here, but without going into any detail, he's never really been satisfied with the intimate side of our relationship. That's mostly my fault simply because I've never been interested in anything intimate in the first place, and I guess I just don't have much of a drive. It's the opposite of how he is, and while I do try, it's obvious that I'm not into it anywhere near as much as he is...The intimacy in each visit could definitely have been better, and that does get him down a lot. He doesn't tell me specifics of what else he's depresesed about either: all I know is that it's a mish-mash of things that just race through his head at lightning fast speed. I also know I need to get out more, but it's difficult when I just don't enjoy spending time with other people! Group outings are alright, and can even be fun, but if I have to spend time one-on-one with another person for an extended period of time, I feel like I'm going insane. But I definitey don't think I'd have a problem getting into another relationship, or being with anyone else. Nothing about it sounds appealing to me, and I honestly do want to be with my boyfriend because he's great fun! He has all the qualities I'd even want, and he's a genuinely good person. There're just some problems here and there...

But thank you guys for the responses again!