Mahou Senki Lyrical Nanoha Force Manga Discussion

[Justin_Brett]

Saturating an area isn't really what the Eclipse Virus does, though.

[Keroko]

Not with anti magic, no. But teleporting into an area possibly saturated by various magical and non-magical bullets is not exactly healthier.

[Justin_Brett]

Seems like the Tome takes a little while to assess threats properly before figuring out what to do about them, so that at least wasn't a danger here.

[Keroko]

[detecting teleport, preparing countermeasures on targets zone of arival]

Would be a bitch if it turned out it had that kind of countermeasure, no? Know your enemy and all that. Besides, it doesn't even have to detect Fate to accidentally shoot her to pieces because it was fighting Nanoha and Fate teleported in the middle of the bullets. H4xx though it is, teleporting is not without risks

[Justin_Brett]

Well I don't mean teleport right in the middle where both it and Nanoha could potentially shoot her, of course, but closer at least.

Also, it failed to notice Subaru or Isis approaching until they were close enough to attack, so I guess it's not too good at multi-tasking, or just has bad range? Which Lily more-or-less confirmed at the end of the chapter.

[00-Raiser]

Nanoha did release chaff into the air, remember?

[Justin_Brett]

Yeah that's another thing I forgot about. Chaff is a thing in this universe now? Maybe I'm an idiot, but I don't remember anyone using it before. I can see how it would inhibit a device, but how exactly? They're sort of weird examples of technology.

[00-Raiser]

Same way it can confuse radar or any other kind of sensor, by filling it up with dummy blips.

Would have been awesome if they went the Gundam way and used dummy baloons

[Tiresias]

Originally Posted by Keroko

That's what we all keep saying. Really, the amount of times throughout the series teleporting would have been plenty convenient is ridiculous.

But then, that's the first mistake most authors make when they introduce teleporting. Suddenly they realize that they lost half of their tension factor. It's why Star Trek keeps thinking up technobable reasons for why the transporters don't work: Teleporting is overpowered.

At least ST bothered to find excuses. I never understand the reason why most, if not all, mobilizations conducted by Riot Force 6 uses METAL BOXES!!! helicopters. Even if AMF's somehow prevented teleportation directly into the enemy, doesn't mean they can just teleport say, five kilometers away?

And even if the reason for helicopters was because the StrikerS can't fly (which begs the question on why they were chosen for a mobile strike force), can't they just teleport the helicopter kilometers away from the target instead of having it transport troops all the way from your base, and vice versa?

Example: They could have just teleported Vivio instead of having Vice bring her without air escorts (until the very last, dramatic second).

Originally Posted by 00-Raiser

Nanoha did release chaff into the air, remember?

When did that happen again? And if the Book has a RADAR accurate enough to sense mages (which is most likely the standard feature of all devices), which are way smaller than aircrafts and thus have smaller Radar Cross-Sections, and capable of getting clear visuals on aforementioned mages from afar, I doubt a traditional "spread a cloud of small aluminium pieces" chaff would do much...

[Justin_Brett]

Well, teleporting everywhere would be a little silly if done for everything, so I don't really mind the idea of other vehicles for mage units. Better to have something and not strictly need it than be out of luck when you do. Weren't there some kind of fly laws in StrikerS too, for mages? Don't remember exactly what though.

[Tiresias]

Originally Posted by Justin_Brett

Well, teleporting everywhere would be a little silly if done for everything, so I don't really mind the idea of other vehicles for mage units. Better to have something and not strictly need it than be out of luck when you do.

Which would have been fine had they bothered to state the reason for it or, better yet, add a "because of X we can't teleport you guys, so you're gonna have to use da choppa'z" justification somewhere.

Weren't there some kind of fly laws in StrikerS too, for mages? Don't remember exactly what though.

IIRC that's in peace time (which is a good law IMO, because I can't imagine just how nasty the traffic control would be otherwise) but you'd think they would lift that restriction for their combat personnel in case of military emergency, especially for the big, final battle (and they most likely did, considering there were brief shots of redshirts hovering over the skies of Cranagan)

Besides, they have already abused teleportation in TOS and A's, so it's more jarring that they stopped using them. Don't tell me the Athra was the last ship with teleporters?

[00-Raiser]

Originally Posted by Tiresias

When did that happen again? And if the Book has a RADAR accurate enough to sense mages (which is most likely the standard feature of all devices), which are way smaller than aircrafts and thus have smaller Radar Cross-Sections, and capable of getting clear visuals on aforementioned mages from afar, I doubt a traditional "spread a cloud of small aluminium pieces" chaff would do much...

Page 6. We see from the Book's POV and it sees blots of white.

Originally Posted by Tiresias

IIRC that's in peace time (which is a good law IMO, because I can't imagine just how nasty the traffic control would be otherwise) but you'd think they would lift that restriction for their combat personnel in case of military emergency, especially for the big, final battle (and they most likely did, considering there were brief shots of redshirts hovering over the skies of Cranagan)

Fate needed permission to fly, so it needs to be authorized.

[Justin_Brett]

Well, there is a certain advantage to be had from actually seeing what's going on from a bird's eye perspective rather than radar or reports.

[Arcc]

Fate teleported a LOT during the first season- frequently with multiple jumps to avoid being traced. It's how she and Arf got to and from the Garden, and escaped from Nanoha and the TSAB numerous times. Arf also teleported in her desperate escape from Precia.

. . . On the other hand, it might not have been her own ability. It might have been something she could only do with Arf or Precia's assistance. But that seems like stretching the cover a bit thin. Especially given that she was without Arf for the latter part of the show and Arf is a manifestation of her own magic anyway.

Oh well. Authors forget. In-universe, skillsets defocus and respecialize. Tell me you've never dropped out in practicing a skill for the sake of honing something more immediately useful. For someone like Fate, teleportation stopped being a critical priority most of the time when she got a lot of skilled allies and ships at her disposal, allowing her to stop doing everything herself. Unlike Nanoha she's always been a master of one talent- it's why she can keep up with the Hucks in speed.

. . . So, any word on anybody else doing translations now? Reading Japanese is one of those skills I abandoned when I reworked my character build. I don't know what any of you are talking about anymore.

[dahak]

Originally Posted by Tiresias

Besides, they have already abused teleportation in TOS and A's, so it's more jarring that they stopped using them. Don't tell me the Athra was the last ship with teleporters?

There was a mention of Transfer points [and a fight that consisted of gadget drones attempting an intercept before our heroines could reach one] in the Manga and people teleporting from the Athra seemed to arrive in fights by flight except when near the coast. Which would explain why Fate and Nanoha say good bye there rather than somewhere more private.

I rather suspect long range teleportation is limited as to the locations it can be done to or from. That explains among other things why Tiana and Hayate go to the airport to teleport to Navy HQ and return there rather than directly to Long Arch.

[Justin_Brett]

. . . So, any word on anybody else doing translations now? Reading Japanese is one of those skills I abandoned when I reworked my character build. I don't know what any of you are talking about anymore.

ZSS Scans picked up the series.

[itanshi1]

yeah, found it easily, no reader available atm and they requested none be made available

[Arcc]

Oh, excellent. I would have checked there if I had remembered they existed.

[blitz1/2]

lol, I just went to nanoha wikia about the huckebein...is terrorist considered as an occupation? xD

[Koveras Alvane]

Originally Posted by blitz1/2

lol, I just went to nanoha wikia about the huckebein...is terrorist considered as an occupation? xD

Well, they do it for the living, apparently. :3 Both literally and in the "earning money" sense.