2010-05-14, 16:59 | Link #421 | |||
Secondman
Join Date: Jun 2009
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Next thing you know, you'll be stating that Aizen had a hard time/that he had to break a sweat taking care of 4 captains. They didn't, it's as simple as that, there is no battle credit that can be taken from that. And i am not saying Stark should've won i am saying there was nothing to it, the shikai took 1 manga chapter 3 attacks, what a rip-off. Before Shinsui went Shikai, Stark dogdged a hell of an amount of attacks and now playing a game he is wide open like that? to be killed, what battle skills? they were flushed down the toilet at the end of the kids game. Why not use one of his cero attacks from his gun when shouting saying the color but noo.. he doesn't even get the chance because he's done in two attacks. Quote:
You didn't state that but you were kinda implying it by stating that Ulquirroa didn't have any battle skills but to just use projecttiles etc.. Therefore u suggested he would just be doing that over and over. And you agreed to it aswell. (when i posted about a stupid person attacking comment) |
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2010-05-14, 23:00 | Link #422 |
Pedites Extraordinarii
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Maryland
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Stark > Ulquirroa
This is a fact. Stark is #1 and Ulq is #4 for a reason. In terms of analytical skills, Ulq was fighting idichigo...who has the IQ of a rock. Ulq also played around for half his fight and allowed Ichigo to get powerups. If it was stark vs ichigo, the fight would've been finished in half a second with a million ceros that no way in hell ichigo could block. Stark wouldn't be dumb enough to toy around, letting his opponent get stronger and stronger. And Shunshui vs Ulq, Shunshui would've butchered Ulq. Stark was fast and agile enough to last against Shunshui's deadliest shikai, but I doubt Ulq has the power or ability to even half as long as Stark did. |
2010-05-15, 07:22 | Link #424 | ||
Secondman
Join Date: Jun 2009
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And like i said before, it ísn't about who is stronger Quote:
Thats a big speculative argument you are taking right here saying Stark wouldn't have let Ichigo do what he did when Ulq try to overkill Ichigo.. and Stark didn't even want to kill any of his opponents so where is this idea coming from? Stark isn't relentless. I seriously don't know what manga chapter you people have been reading Starkk was fast and agile enough? if he was that why did he get butcherd in 2/3 attacks? He was fast and agile in the beginning when they were tasting eachother out but not when Shunshui used his Shikai, it ended in a matter of seconds. I am not going to continue on this speculative path as to what Ulq would've done because thats just pointless. |
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2010-05-15, 14:10 | Link #425 | |
The Ironman
Join Date: Sep 2006
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As for winning in 2 blows after that, that's precisely Katen Kyoutsou's power--to end the fight in only a few attacks because the strength of your blow determined by how well you understand the game, not by your physical power. If winning Katen's games meant Shunsui had to be physically superior to the opponent, it would be mostly pointless to use it because he could simply outfight his enemy without putting himself at risk of the rules of the game which are also dangerous to himself.
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2010-05-15, 16:07 | Link #426 | |
Secondman
Join Date: Jun 2009
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Stark was unable to counter or dodge a killing attack, thats my point, it got wrapped up just like that, nothing to it. If Stark got cut from the back he wouldn't have died, he got cut from the front wide open cutting his critical organs etc. Like you stated before the game doesn't improve power or abilities, it mearly gives out rules that players need to follow. Stark wasn't 'seriously' wounded, he was just wounded, like how Shunsui was wounded else he couldn't have suprised attacked Shunsui with such speed. Thats the point. |
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2010-05-15, 16:22 | Link #427 | |
Schwing!
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Central Texas
Age: 39
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I think the only indication of Stark's speed was when Aizen had him get Orihime after the Kenpachi vs. Nnoitora fight. |
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2010-05-15, 21:03 | Link #430 | ||
The Ironman
Join Date: Sep 2006
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That's not the case, the damage of Shunsui's attacks magnified several times (at risk to himself), while his opponent's attack power essentially neutralized unless they figure out the rules. It takes the factor of strength out of the equation during the fight because damage inflicted based entirely on rules of the game. In other words, no matter how strong/resistant the opponent normally is, they'll be heavily damaged if they take a single blow while Shunsui uses Iro Oni. That's incredibly broken ability Quote:
Shunsui proved why he's a brilliant fighter by defeating a Stark, but this hardly a case of him dominating his enemy in straight-up contest of strength and speed, he won because: 1) he waited until Stark lost the use of his guns ( his strongest and fastest weapon) by unleashing his wolves on Rose and Love 2) launched a sneak attack with kage oni to weaken him. Then, to be sporting, he explained Katen's powers and give Stark a "hint"by attacking him with a color he knew wouldn't cause much damage. (I'll give you this, Shunsui probably would've won even faster if he hadn't done that, though he didn't expect Stark to figure out so quickly). Finally, he ended it by calling out the color which would give him the strongest attack. And of course, yes, Stark's fight far less impressive than Ulquiorra's. But Ulq matched against the main character, he's going to receive star treatment. Stark matched up against secondary characters and his fight (like Halibel and Barragan) was quickly wrapped up so that Aizen could make his debut into the fight.
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Last edited by Sabaku Kyu; 2010-05-15 at 21:27. |
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2010-05-16, 06:30 | Link #432 | |||
Secondman
Join Date: Jun 2009
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The first time Starkk attacked he had the highest risk if he had created just an opening like Shunsui did attacking him from the front Shunsui would be dead, wouldn't he? Those are the rules, his attack was Max(imized) Quote:
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2010-05-17, 02:36 | Link #435 | |
Secondman
Join Date: Jun 2009
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Could be, Ulquiorra did state that Aizen never saw him in that form, not that he didn't know of it. |
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2010-05-17, 11:03 | Link #436 | ||
The Ironman
Join Date: Sep 2006
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When Shunsui called out black he targeted Starks hollow hole in his chest, and so he created a wound that cut through Starks vital areas. Quote:
And yes, I'm going to say Stark's wounds were pretty serious compared to Shunsui's. Getting blasted with cero not the same thing as being run through the torso. For some example, when Utitake run through with WW's fist or Ichigo run through with Ulq's hand their wounds were critical and they were both knocked unconscious. While on the other hand characters have taken ceros several times at near point plank range and been relatively ok. In Bleach, attacks that penetrate usually do the most serious damage and Ulq mentioned that most espada lack the power of instant regeneration But anyways. Stark's fight was rushed and his powers looked nerfed at the end because Kubo didn't do a particularly good job at conveying why Stark lost. But if you look at the fight closely, it's not a case of Stark suddenly becoming an idiot and forgeting he can dodge swords and shoot guns. Shunsui planned this victory brilliantly, but he took advantage of some key opportunities. I'm not sure about Stark's power compared to Ulquiorra's in his 2nd form, it's possible Ulq was more powerful but you can't really judge by the fights. Ulq's fights were Ichigo's typical my-reiatsu-bigger-than-yours-tug o' war. Stark's fight was about Shusui setting up a trap that stacked the odds in his favor.
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Last edited by Sabaku Kyu; 2010-05-17 at 11:15. |
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2010-05-17, 11:19 | Link #437 | |
Senior Guest
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Athens (GMT+2)
Age: 35
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2010-05-17, 13:57 | Link #439 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
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though lookign back at that chapter... Shunsui cut start across his chest, but based on the rules of the game, shouldn't his attack have been stopped and been ineffective when the sword made contact with Stark's non-black body... Shunsui had to cut through the white to get to the black afterall |
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2010-05-17, 15:41 | Link #440 | ||
Secondman
Join Date: Jun 2009
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For example stark conistst only of red.. and Shunsui has nothing red not even a drop. He could still attack the red but it would be minimal right? And Stark wouldn;t be able to attack maximized with red right. he wouldn't be able to attack with red at all? Rofl that kinda sucks because both of them would only be able to land minimal attacks? Quote:
He is a fairly calm fighter and most people never expected anything else but superiority/talent/uniqueness and intelligence as a fighter as he dealt with a lot of fighting sitaution failry easy and calm always knowing what approach to take, you can just tell with some fighters and he is most certainly one of them. |
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