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Originally Posted by magnuskn
Yeah, the whole thing kinda went nowhere in the series.
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That was one thing I hated most about Frontier: a lot was brushed off to the side and forgotten or just avoided completely. There was no actual confrontation of a lot of things, including questions, between characters. Sure, the audience knew what was happening but not the characters.
If Kawamori could actually do like SDF, which showed quite a few characters dwelling and confronting, like Max to Milia as an example, then Frontier would've been better. There were many characters whom must looked lost and didn't know who to trust anymore because they weren't communicating information, and it's not just Ranka or Sheryl either, which makes me sad.
That's why I pinpoint on that specific thing as saying it's out of character for him. Up until that point, when someone said a friend of his was in trouble, sick, or upset; he'd rush to his or her side or at least confront them, like he did with Michael. But after Michael's death, Alto did no confrontation of Ranka nor visited Nanase in the hospital, didn't even visit Sheryl to make sure she was fine, since she was next to Nanase during the time and might've sustained injuries. He pushed all his friends aside.
My vision of Alto is that he thought of Michael as his surrogate brother (or just a brother in particular) since they were so close that they understood each other. When they had problems, they each confronted the other. They had a very close relationship like brothers. So his death left a huge hole in Alto's life because he had no one to fall back on as support. Sad.
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It is not unprobable that they were in Battle Galaxy.
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But they still spoke out through Grace after Battle Galaxy was destroyed by Quarter. Which rose my probability that in the series, the war hadn't ended, that there's another ship of Galaxy somewhere out there. And that's not unprobable considering that fleets can usually split up. Kawamori has shown us that with Macross 7 (although that was against its wishes) and still fend for themselves.
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I really preferred her as a villain. She was great at being one.
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Notice I say that I like both. I'm not disagree nor agreeing with you here.
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Some of that is surely due to the movies having much more limited time to tell their stories.
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I know. I never disregarded that. But it reminds me of the interview with Kawamori before the movie was released: he said Brera would get a significant role.
However, I never saw it. He plays a villain in the movie, albeit a higher one who does the final blow to Mishima (who had it coming for more than one reason,
one of them being that he's so bad at his job as being a villain), but besides nuking the bad guys along with himself in the end, he had no significant role. He is also partly to blame for Sheryl's fake death at the halfway point, for if he'd allowed Alto, Sheryl, and Ranka to escape that area, that scene wouldn't have played out. But besides pulling out of Galaxy's control thanks to both Alto and Ranka (which I add Alto because of his words), he had no significant role in the movie besides that stated above; and that made me sad.
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Hm, wait. How did we get from discussing about a possible information leak in Leons conspiracy in the series to something about the movie? ^^
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I'm sorry, I was talking about the movie I had watched (the one about the gas). But when we return to the series, the same words apply about them not addressing it but giving hints. And they gave quite a few subtle hints at Mishima being unaware of those around him till it was too late. Look at his reactions to figuring out Grace's real plans for Frontier...
And the name of the movie I watched was
Speed. (And for a little laugh, when I was looking at it, there was no summary nor did I look on Wikipedia for it, so I said "either this is about racing or it is about the drug." Turns out, it was about bombs.
)
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We will have to agree to disagree here.
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I guess so.
But we can agree that we both like characteristics of Sheryl from both universes in some way.
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That's quite different a reading of the situation that what I got. What I saw was her caving in immediately to every demand made of her.
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Here's my response to this here: if she's taking everything at face value, then we must as well.
She doesn't say out loud that she's suspicious of Grace nor talk to anyone else about it nor does she state out loud that she's insecure about her own powers/abilities. So we have to take the scenes at face value here that either is probable. If she's taking things at face value and finding them suspicious but not catering to that suspicion, then she's waiting to find a clue to the matter. She most likely doubts Grace's loyalty considering that Grace has left Sheryl without a moment's notice. And therefore, it's not unprobable that we could say she's suspicious of Grace's sudden change in management.
However, I must say that I thought it was weird that when Grace talked about changing
Aimo, Ranka looked up like "why change my song?" It was almost like a double-standard question of "why not just write a new one?" And later, when Grace talks about the changes made to her schedule, Ranka looks down and shows suspicion. Remember that faces can show more than one type of emotion for an expression. In this case, since there was so much happening in the episode, we have to assume both emotions are in that expression. But until she starts to sing the new version of
Aimo, Ranka shows nor speaks of doubt until later when she talks to Brera about it, having failed the emotion chart.
So self-doubt kinda flies out the window as an excuse.
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Eh, I really don't buy the two versions of the universe being the same. The differences in characters and setting are very significant. I maintain that "execution without trial" wouldn't have been as easily possible in the series, especially since we saw there that the president does not have all the political power, but that there are senators with political pull in the background.
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Except, once again, we have to return to Frontier's condition. By the time 15 rolls around even to 17, Frontier was a critical point, though it wasn't address publicly until 18 and finally took drastic measures in 21. So, given the condition of Frontier, it is likely that the senate would vote towards execution without trial to save oxygen. At the point of 21, I was actually asking myself what was happening to the prisoners in the cells, as if asking if they were executed to save oxygen for civilians.
We have to think of all of that before saying it's unlikely, especially if we consider the timeframe I was mentioning.
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Not a big problem for me, I like series Alto way more. I guess that stems from me not really seeing how he made terrible decisions in the war. ^^
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I'll agree on the "not seeing the terrible decisions in the war" bit.
Don't get mad when I say this, but I have a feeling that's due to Sheryl remaining on Frontier with Alto. Had the latter applied to Ranka, I'm sure I'd be in the same boat. But once Ranka was gone, I saw Alto's decisions at face value. It wasn't due to either girls' fault. It was his own.
However, I'm not saying that some AS fans haven't noticed it either, but they have a difficult time accepting it, even some AR fans have difficulty accepting Alto's decisions in the 2nd movie because Ranka was still there at the time and the triangle was the big focus to them.
However, when you take out the romantic interest, the person fueling Alto forward was himself. And believing what others told him without thinking over his own options himself (or rather if he wanted to die for that information that might be proven to be false later) wasn't a good decision. In the 2nd movie, Ozma justifies this by asking Alto to decide what he's gonna fight for, even gives him a nice big punch to snap him into present.
(And take into account that most AR fans take this as another romantic moment in which Alto is given the choice of Ranka, however, taken at face value, this is an inspirational speech.) In the series, Alto had no one to tell him to decide for himself. Yasaburou didn't exactly come off as an inspirational person who could make Alto think for himself, however, Ozma was always able to do so.
This is why I believe Alto sees Ozma as a surrogate father or father figure; because Ozma always tries to help Alto along and gives him advice like a real father. It's quite different from Alto's relationship with his biological father.
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