AnimeSuki Forums

srb · 2004-10-20, 04:56

Well put.

What everyone seems to forget when people use their own valuable time to bring you a free service is that everyone is human and as such makes mistakes. It is pointless to nag and flame at UF&YO since they're doing you a service by fansubbing Destiny, and if you don't want that service, don't use it (ie download). It's that simple.

I myself collect both UF&YO, AKingdom/AonE and SEED-Fansubs because I want to see how UF&YO improves and does compared to the much more experienced groups. Since they are much more experienced it is to be expected that their episodes are "better" per se but that does not mean that UF&YO are bad, they're just new and if you can't do a better job then just shut up.

For all intents and purposes they are doing this for themselves; Anyone who chooses to watch their version is just along for the ride and if you don't like the ride, get off because I'm sure they don't want people to, without any justification (no, being "worse" isn't a justification), flame and bash their release.

With all of that said... Why can't we all just get along?

JediNight · 2004-10-20, 04:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by hanjie

I was not directly involved in the process of translating or editing the episode. Therefore, I don't have sufficient grounds on which to base my claim. I accede to that. However, we had the first episode ready for release on Saturday, but we waited a day to release in order to make corrections and reencode. (We had originally planned 175mb files.) Relying on that transcript ultimately caused more trouble (eg. timing holes, translation errors, etc.) than good. A day's worth of editing can only do so much. As for the encoding, our raw was not of the highest quality. Both issues have been addressed in our second release.

From experience in encoding Season1: 175mb is just not adequate for Gundam Seed at all. The production values on the series are the highest of any series (especially at a length of 50 episodes) ... with exception of maybe Samurai7 (which also happened to be PPV). There is rarely, if ever, a static scene in the series ... either people or backgrounds are panning at all times. On top of that, the animation style doesn't have alot of defined lines between shading along with the CG sequences (never easy to compress) .... the end result being the series doesn't compress all that well and demands alot of bitrate.

I would say 200mb would be the low-end of adequate, and obviously just filling to 233mb for 3/CD is the best option. I don't know how Destiny is, but it might be variable framerate as well, which will mean you either settle for parts being jerky, use the 120FPS converter for AVI and leave it in 24/30fps with dropped frame padding, or go with something like Matroska that supports variable framerate(all arguments over MKV aside). Judging from the screencaps I've been seeing, I would recommend tweaking your compression curve a bit to eliminate some of that blocking you're getting ... its pretty evil atm

srb · 2004-10-20, 06:29

See fellows? That is constructive criticism.

JohnSilver · 2004-10-20, 07:12

I usually get a raw version, the first fansub to come out and then the Seed-Fansub version (since I like their dedication to the project). But I have to agree that 3/CD is the best compression rate for ANY anime, not just the high end ones. The closer it is to TV quality, the happier I get.

hanjie · 2004-10-20, 09:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnSilver

I usually get a raw version, the first fansub to come out and then the Seed-Fansub version (since I like their dedication to the project). But I have to agree that 3/CD is the best compression rate for ANY anime, not just the high end ones. The closer it is to TV quality, the happier I get.

if staying up till 9am to translate or sleeping in the school computer cluster overnight to distro isn't dedication, i don't know what is.

JohnSilver · 2004-10-20, 09:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by hanjie

if staying up till 9am to translate or sleeping in the school computer cluster overnight to distro isn't dedication, i don't know what is.

Hey, I'm not saying you're not dedicated... But you have to say groups that take the name of the series they translate SOUND more dedicated. And I'm glad for what you do, since I have both episodes from your organisation too on my computer.

Steffa · 2004-10-20, 09:59

shut up everyone

DarkPaladin56 · 2004-10-20, 10:00

Majority of people dont really care much about translation accuracy, as long as they understand the main plot and what the hell's going on...

and the Steffa needs a hug

Steffa · 2004-10-20, 10:07

this thread was to help people that were unsure of what to download

it's not a freaking competition between the fansubbers and most of all the fansubbers should not make any comments since they are not objective....i recommend you take these fights somewhere else or else take all the critism with fairness....if you don't like what ppl say about your size, image quality or translation then stop posting your torrents.....

so far i have downloaded everyone's first and second episode and to my opinion seed fansubs and aone are probably the best for image quality...the translation is good but it could improve....

[UKE]Auel · 2004-10-20, 11:11

That kind of constrictive criticism is always welcome, not the usual jackass elitist crap we usually get. I thank everyone who's shown their support for us, and I hope you keep coming back to us in the future. Just because our first episode was rough around the edges doesn't mean our entire subbing career is going to come out like that.

And if you still want to complain about us, then I've already expressed my opinions on that. :fingers:

Tsukiyomi · 2004-10-20, 11:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enragin_Angel

I handpicked a few lines from GSD ep 2 and compared Uke-Fansubs/YoumaOtakus, Seed-Fansubs and AnimeOne/Anime-Kingdom. Make what you will of it. FYI: I used the timecodes from Uke/YO's release. Seed-Fansubs and AnimeOne\Anime-Kingdom have different timecodes because they cut out the sponsor credits after the opening.

0:21
Uke/YO: "Eventually, under a mutual agreement between them, at the site of the tragedy at Junius Seven,"
S-F: "Under mutual agreement,"
AonE/A-K: "The treaty they eventually agreed upon,"
0:23
Uke/YO: "a treaty was made to exert great effort for mutual understanding,"
S-F: "A treaty was eventually signed at the site of the past tragedy, Junius 7,"
AonE/A-K: "based on the mutual agreement reached at Junius 7, the former place of tragedy,"
0:26
Uke/YO: "to achieve peace, equilibrium, and walk on..."
S-F: "Pledging increased efforts to accept each other and strive for peace."
AonE/A-K: "was to reach a common understanding and an oath of peace."
3:21
Uke/YO: "That's a new model too? They call it "Gundam," but what model is that? There's no information on it.
S-F: "Is that a new model too? [...] A Gundam? [...] What's going on? [...] We weren't informed about a unit like that..."
AonE\A-K: "Is that a new model, too?! [...] A Gundam? [...] What's the meaning of this? [...] There's no match in the library for this unit."
3:51
Uke/YO: "But I'm not sure if they're enemies or not."
S-F: "But I don't know if I'll be able to do that!"
AonE\A-K: "I understand, but I don't know if I'll be able to!"
3:54
Uke/YO: "And I don't know what this is going to involve!"
S-F: "And just how did something like this happen anyway?"
AonE\A-K: "Besides, how on earth did this happen?!"
4:05
Uke/YO: "If they really are enemies, then it's not going to be this simple!"
S-F: "How did the enemy steal them so easily!?"
AonE\A-K: "How could the enemy get them so easily?"
4:11
Uke/YO: "This isn't practice or the ceremony."
S-F: "This isn't a drill! [...] Concentrate on your task!"
AonE\A-K: "And this is no training exercise. [...] Brace yourself!"
4:26
Uke/YO: "Listen to what Captain Gladys said! Make sure you're all prepared!"
S-F: "I don't need Gladys to tell me that! Tell her to mind her own business!"
AonE\A-K: "I know that even without Gladys saying so! [...] Tell her not to interfere!"
4:47
Uke/YO: "Gottfried 1 and 2- activating. Load missiles 1-8."
S-F: "Gottfried Numbers One and Two activated. [...] Loading missile tubes Numbers One through Eight with Corinthos."
AonE\A-K: "Gottfriend 1 and 2 activated. [...] Load Corintoss into missile firing tubes 1 through 8."
4:48
Uke/YO: "Izawa and Harata suits on the catapult."
S-F: "Izawa unit and Harada unit, proceed to the catapult."
AonE\A-K: "Izawa unit and Harada unit, please proceed to the catapult."
4:52
Uke/YO: "Alignment, forward port, at the Nazca class."
S-F: "Aim the main cannon. [...] Target the portside fore Nazca Class Cruiser."
AonE\A-K: "Aim the main cannons at the forward portside of the Nazca-class."
4:55
Uke/YO: "Fire the engines and activate the Mirage Colliod simultaneously!"
S-F: "Deactivate the Mirage Colloid while firing the cannons."
AonE/A-K: "Disarm the Mirage Colloid concuurently with the firing." (Top note: The Mirage Colloid is a stealth system which uses microscopic prisms held in magnetic suspension.)
5:20
Uke/YO: "It's been shot down!"
S-F: "The Purcell has been hit!"
AonE/A-K: "The Herschel is hit!"
5:22
Uke/YO: "Missiles approaching, 18 in count."
S-F: "Missiles are approaching the Fourier. [...] Numbers: 18."
AonE/A-K: "Missiles approaching the Fourier... 18 of them."
5:35
Uke/YO: "It's not in the library. Its cloak has been deactivated."
S-F: "Analyzing its heat signature... [...] No matching data!"
AonE/A-K: "Searching library for thermal patterns. [...] No matching ship found!"

Wow props to Enragin_Angel for taking time to watch all those subs again and take down notes! I don't really understand why everyone is so harsh to one another. I came in here to read opinions on fansubs and all i see is flaming flaming and more flaming. I had to get thru like three pages of argument before i see Enragin_Angel's analysis on the translations! I believe this blunt comparison will allow all the fansub groups to improve on their translations. Translating to aim for 100% japanese match is one thing, but also fluid english flow is another. Sometimes group choose to over translate and deter from the original meaning and sometimes group are too literal and even sometimes they are a bit off on it as well. I agree the all groups are still not perfect, but to give my opinion after ep 2, i believe Seed Fansubs still has the best balance in translating atm.

The pen should be treated like a sword.. with the same respect and not to be thrown or thrust around without regard or care. Treat it as you would with the skill in using a sword.

-----
Balance: $0.02

[UKE]Auel · 2004-10-20, 12:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tsukiyomi

Wow props to Enragin_Angel for taking time to watch all those subs again and take down notes! I don't really understand why everyone is so harsh to one another. I came in here to read opinions on fansubs and all i see is flaming flaming and more flaming. I had to get thru like three pages of argument before i see Enragin_Angel's analysis on the translations! I believe this blunt comparison will allow all the fansub groups to improve on their translations. Translating to aim for 100% japanese match is one thing, but also fluid english flow is another. Sometimes group choose to over translate and deter from the original meaning and sometimes group are too literal and even sometimes they are a bit off on it as well. I agree the all groups are still not perfect, but to give my opinion after ep 2, i believe Seed Fansubs still has the best balance in translating atm.

The pen should be treated like a sword.. with the same respect and not to be thrown or thrust around without regard or care. Treat it as you would with the skill in using a sword.

-----
Balance: $0.02

I'm just defending our group. I'm not just going to sit here and watch some know-it-alls who are too lazy to make their own subs bad mouth our group. Constructive criticism is fine, but flaming is just asking for it. The person who replies to this is probably going to continue flaming and try to justify it. Watch.

Keith · 2004-10-20, 14:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by JediNight

Keith I would stop now, please. At risk of offending you, you obviously don't command a fluency of the English language, and have admitted you don't personally know any Japanese -- this leaves you in a really poor position to be criticizing translation differences. Leave translation comments to those that visit the boards with actual Japanese fluency. I have 4 years of Japanese classes + lots of additional vocab from anime, and I am still not qualified to comment on all the nuances in translations of course.

Wow, how do you know so much about me? U CAN'T SEE ME, just criticise me according what I wrote. Let me tell u something this is the world of internet. we don't need any formality. just feel free to do. why don't u criticise yourself first before somebody.

I am only one person, I can't "fight" with all of you. shut your fu?k. just remember. I won't do what UKE member Athrun suggested. u should do yourself. but I agree what u said in para 2 and 3. Therefore, I won't apologize (In fact i want) because of what you said in para 1. anyway, I don't want this kind of the fight.

you know. in the real world, life is not easy.

Steffa · 2004-10-20, 15:03

Uke accept the critics and shut up....don't take it personally...but if you want to fansub then do it just for yourself and don't post your torrents
i am quite sick of hearing the same comments from u subbers...u are all snobs thinking that you are better than all of us cos you can do these things....
go and choose another forum for your fights

Bestvgm · 2004-10-20, 16:11

Keith, there's no need to throw the f bombs around ^^. Each person has their own opinion and while I respect that, there is no need to trash others' work. I believe in the saying of, "If you want something done right, do it yourself" and this applies to fansubbing perfectly. While I do see that several of my co-subbers have gotten out of hand and I apologize for that, I do see where they're coming from. There's a huge difference between criticism and outright bashing. Please understand that Uke spends a lot of time during the weekend (Some of us sacrificing our weekends which is sad :/) to bring you Destiny and when we're met with bashing, it's just not right. Anyhow, now that i've given my two cents, can we please drop this and act like none of this ever occured? Thanks ^^;

P.S. If you find any large mistakes in our future releases, please stop by the #uke-fansubs channel, PM me and i'll see to it that it's immediately fixed. Thanks again

strike66 · 2004-10-20, 16:14

Uke, just ignore the criticism if u dont like it, the more u reply to it, the longer the flaming will last.

Who cares what others think about u, what u think about urself is what counts...

Lunamaria · 2004-10-20, 17:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steffa

Uke accept the critics and shut up....don't take it personally...but if you want to fansub then do it just for yourself and don't post your torrents
i am quite sick of hearing the same comments from u subbers...u are all snobs thinking that you are better than all of us cos you can do these things....
go and choose another forum for your fights

...Uh, we were only referring to the people who bitch and moan about our stuff, not everyone in general. We don't think we're better than you or anyone else just because we know how to fansub, it's just a tad hypocritical when people do things like say our translation sucks when they don't even know the language (which was some other guy, not you), and we're not "snobs".

But with that, do carry on. I believe our case has been made.

Oh and srb - thank you, I couldn't have said any of that better myself.

AnimeSannins · 2004-10-20, 17:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by vicious05d

For all you Gundam Seed Fans out there, what group does the best Gundam Seed Destiny Fan Sub?

A-Kingdom & AonE
ACH & A-H
Seed Fansubs
UF & YO
AnimeSannins

or

DeathSquad

I need your opinions. Thanks.

I believe the best is AnimeSannins. But I'm suspect :P

Enragin_Angel · 2004-10-20, 17:59

Lunamaria: at 3:51, Shinn says "dekiru ka dou ka wakarimasen." However, for this line, you put "I'm not sure if they're enemies or not." The correct translation is I don't know if I can or not. I suppose you heard "teki" or something, but this mistranslated line caused you to translate the next few lines incorrectly. I pointed the next few lines out in my earlier comparison post so that you would see the problem. When I saw version 2 released, I checked to see if this problem was fixed, but it was not. One thing I did notice was that you guys increased the encoding quality a bit, possibly per JediNight's advice...

Keith · 2004-10-20, 18:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bestvgm

Keith, there's no need to throw the f bombs around ^^. Each person has their own opinion and while I respect that, there is no need to trash others' work. I believe in the saying of, "If you want something done right, do it yourself" and this applies to fansubbing perfectly. While I do see that several of my co-subbers have gotten out of hand and I apologize for that, I do see where they're coming from. There's a huge difference between criticism and outright bashing. Please understand that Uke spends a lot of time during the weekend (Some of us sacrificing our weekends which is sad :/) to bring you Destiny and when we're met with bashing, it's just not right. Anyhow, now that i've given my two cents, can we please drop this and act like none of this ever occured? Thanks ^^;

P.S. If you find any large mistakes in our future releases, please stop by the #uke-fansubs channel, PM me and i'll see to it that it's immediately fixed. Thanks again

yes, I understand that. I know your work and I see the improvement. I hope you guys can do much better in future. Not like somebody (Uke-Fansubs Editor ?uel) just blindly defend "his" fansub without accepting any comment or opinion. He is mad. That's enough. I don't want to talk about that person any more.

If you compare your sub with other groups just like Enragin Angel did before, u can see the differences clearly, and will know what the differences are. Clearly, is not sentence structure, is the meaning. Other groups are slightly different in some areas or words. Did you guys think wihy u are different from others? Should think about that.

No comparison, no improvment. The life is this. That's why we have computer, wireless phone, spaceship and more. Why are the human beings keeping invent something or improve? Because they want BETTER.

2004-10-20, 04:56	Link #61
srb I can see time itself! Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Kingdom of Sweden Age: 37	Well put. What everyone seems to forget when people use their own valuable time to bring you a free service is that everyone is human and as such makes mistakes. It is pointless to nag and flame at UF&YO since they're doing you a service by fansubbing Destiny, and if you don't want that service, don't use it (ie download). It's that simple. I myself collect both UF&YO, AKingdom/AonE and SEED-Fansubs because I want to see how UF&YO improves and does compared to the much more experienced groups. Since they are much more experienced it is to be expected that their episodes are "better" per se but that does not mean that UF&YO are bad, they're just new and if you can't do a better job then just shut up. For all intents and purposes they are doing this for themselves; Anyone who chooses to watch their version is just along for the ride and if you don't like the ride, get off because I'm sure they don't want people to, without any justification (no, being "worse" isn't a justification), flame and bash their release. With all of that said... Why can't we all just get along?

2004-10-20, 06:29	Link #63
srb I can see time itself! Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Kingdom of Sweden Age: 37	See fellows? That is constructive criticism.

2004-10-20, 07:12	Link #64
JohnSilver MS Technician Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Near the gates of Valhalla Age: 40	I usually get a raw version, the first fansub to come out and then the Seed-Fansub version (since I like their dedication to the project). But I have to agree that 3/CD is the best compression rate for ANY anime, not just the high end ones. The closer it is to TV quality, the happier I get.

2004-10-20, 09:59	Link #67
Steffa Ninja Guru Join Date: Aug 2004	shut up everyone

2004-10-20, 10:00	Link #68
DarkPaladin56 Wandering Typesetter Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Canada Age: 35	Majority of people dont really care much about translation accuracy, as long as they understand the main plot and what the hell's going on... and the Steffa needs a hug

2004-10-20, 10:07	Link #69
Steffa Ninja Guru Join Date: Aug 2004	this thread was to help people that were unsure of what to download it's not a freaking competition between the fansubbers and most of all the fansubbers should not make any comments since they are not objective....i recommend you take these fights somewhere else or else take all the critism with fairness....if you don't like what ppl say about your size, image quality or translation then stop posting your torrents..... so far i have downloaded everyone's first and second episode and to my opinion seed fansubs and aone are probably the best for image quality...the translation is good but it could improve....

2004-10-20, 11:11	Link #70
[UKE]Auel The Oncoming Storm Join Date: Oct 2004 Age: 40	That kind of constrictive criticism is always welcome, not the usual jackass elitist crap we usually get. I thank everyone who's shown their support for us, and I hope you keep coming back to us in the future. Just because our first episode was rough around the edges doesn't mean our entire subbing career is going to come out like that. And if you still want to complain about us, then I've already expressed my opinions on that. :fingers:

2004-10-20, 15:03	Link #74
Steffa Ninja Guru Join Date: Aug 2004	Uke accept the critics and shut up....don't take it personally...but if you want to fansub then do it just for yourself and don't post your torrents i am quite sick of hearing the same comments from u subbers...u are all snobs thinking that you are better than all of us cos you can do these things.... go and choose another forum for your fights

2004-10-20, 16:11	Link #75
Bestvgm Uke-Fansubs Member Join Date: Aug 2004	Keith, there's no need to throw the f bombs around ^^. Each person has their own opinion and while I respect that, there is no need to trash others' work. I believe in the saying of, "If you want something done right, do it yourself" and this applies to fansubbing perfectly. While I do see that several of my co-subbers have gotten out of hand and I apologize for that, I do see where they're coming from. There's a huge difference between criticism and outright bashing. Please understand that Uke spends a lot of time during the weekend (Some of us sacrificing our weekends which is sad :/) to bring you Destiny and when we're met with bashing, it's just not right. Anyhow, now that i've given my two cents, can we please drop this and act like none of this ever occured? Thanks ^^; P.S. If you find any large mistakes in our future releases, please stop by the #uke-fansubs channel, PM me and i'll see to it that it's immediately fixed. Thanks again

2004-10-20, 16:14	Link #76
strike66 Newtype level 3 Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Canada owns u	Uke, just ignore the criticism if u dont like it, the more u reply to it, the longer the flaming will last. Who cares what others think about u, what u think about urself is what counts...

2004-10-20, 17:59	Link #79
Enragin_Angel ナマケモノ Join Date: Jul 2003	Lunamaria: at 3:51, Shinn says "dekiru ka dou ka wakarimasen." However, for this line, you put "I'm not sure if they're enemies or not." The correct translation is I don't know if I can or not. I suppose you heard "teki" or something, but this mistranslated line caused you to translate the next few lines incorrectly. I pointed the next few lines out in my earlier comparison post so that you would see the problem. When I saw version 2 released, I checked to see if this problem was fixed, but it was not. One thing I did notice was that you guys increased the encoding quality a bit, possibly per JediNight's advice...