(L) Bamboo Blade

[vorpal83]

Jodan's just a risky stance to take, you get more reach and speed, but you sacrifice your defence. I'd prefer to point my weapon at the threat.

[turbore]

Until this show introduced Tamaki's rival and got overloaded with braver philosophy, it was one of most pleasant animes to watch this season for its easygoing cheerful atmosphere.
Both Miyamiya's and Tamaki's rivals are nonsensical. One pair is feuding over boyfriend, that looks like to one like armadillo, to other - some ant eater, while other pair is busy fighting over some power ranger anime characters. There's nothing wrong with it, that is, until you actually start making serious drama out of it.
Oh well, cant be helped now. Hopefully mangaka will go the other way.

about Tamaki's mother,

Spoiler for bamboo blade:

She is introduced manga during flashback at the end of volume 7.

[ghazghkull]

Originally Posted by turbore

Until this show introduced Tamaki's rival and got overloaded with braver philosophy, it was one of most pleasant animes to watch this season for its easygoing cheerful atmosphere.
Both Miyamiya's and Tamaki's rivals are nonsensical. One pair is feuding over boyfriend, that looks like to one like armadillo, to other - some ant eater, while other pair is busy fighting over some power ranger anime characters. There's nothing wrong with it, that is, until you actually start making serious drama out of it.
Oh well, cant be helped now. Hopefully mangaka will go the other way.

about Tamaki's mother,

Spoiler for bamboo blade:

She is introduced manga during flashback at the end of volume 7.

Chances are that the anime is going on this weird tangent because they want to end it off somehow, since the manga is still on going and all.

[Peregrinus]

Originally Posted by Boohahaha

Agreed, in sport you are only as good as your opponent allows you to be. Tama's opponent was just better on the day. You are discrediting Rin when you say that Tama lost to circumstances rather than skill factor. After all Rin was not unsporting in anyway in terms of sledging her opponent or disrespecting them. It's like a post match interview like Tennis where the top player lost in a upset against another opponent, and then blame it on circumstances without giving credit to the opponent.

Allow me to draw a real sport parallel, I'm sorry to international folks, but I'm going to be using an American Football (henceforward, if I say Football this is what I'm referring to) example.

This last Football season the Washington Redskins played a game against the Buffalo Bills. They lost. Were they the worse team? Not according to the win-loss record of the season (Redskins were 9-7, Bills were 7-9), they were also playing at their home stadium (for those who don't know, the Redskins have some of the most devout and noisy fans, giving them a major home field advantage). They were, however, down one man: Sean Taylor, who had been murdered earlier in the week. It wasn't that he was not playing, he was out with an injury anyway; however, mentally, emotionally and spiritually, the Redskin players and coaching staff was completely drained. Had this extenuating circumstance not been present, they Redskins likely would have won the game (it was close anyway, 17-16). Strictly speaking, the Redskins were a better team, but due to circumstances that left them unable to play their best game.

This is what I'm talking about with Tama. Its not that Rin was more skilled, we have no way of knowing what her actual skill level is, she's not a slouch, by any means, but we can't say she's better than Tama because of this one match that has an exceptional number of extenuating circumstances, just as we can't say the Bills were better than the Redskins simply because they won one game when the 'Skins were completely off balance due to things that happened outside of the game.

Yes, this is a matter of "Any Given Sunday," the circumstances around the match led to Tama's defeat, and just as the loss to the Bills left a sour taste in my mouth because we really wanted to win that one, it was understandable. In this case, the loss is understandable, but unlike life, which is uncontrollable, this is a story, meaning that the writers decided to have Tama fall for the drama, that she, as a character, was set up to fail. A perfect storm was set against Tama, she has no way to win this fight. In other words, Rin did not win, Tama lost.

[Anh_Minh]

I think you guys are underestimating Rin's skill. Tama wasn't able to overwhelm her when they had their moment during the movie shoot, so they're roughly in the same league. And Rin has, since day one, been more sure of herself. She was able to shake Tama with the Braver talk, whereas she was left untroubled. Even without the jodan, it would not be really surprising if she's able to draw out more of her power in a high pressure situation than Tama. Just see how the karaoke went...

Now, you can argue that one match doesn't prove much one way or the other. But a win won't turn into a loss because the opponent has a shoddy excuse for not being at her best.

[Peregrinus]

See, I don't disagree that Rin is in Tama's league, but their match was pretty lop-sided... a blowout for Rin, Tama did not even score. Yes, Rin is more "mature," but in this case maturity = cynicism. The think I love about Tama is that she is an idealism and her naivety, which seems to be what Rin targeted in their conversations and set out to disprove in Tama's beliefs.

The difference is that both are convinced that they are "right." The difference is, Tama's beliefs are simply believed and simply held. She's never though about the "why" of her beliefs, they just are. Rin, on the other hand, is a bit of a philosopher, she's thought through her beliefs and analyzed them, she knows why she believes what she does. When she and Tama approached that she challenged Tama's beliefs, and Tama could not defend them, she did not have an answer for "why" and that unnerved her.

In the end, the battle was about belief, and Tama was not assured of her's the way Rin was of her's. This proves nothing about "skill," all it proves is that Tama is still growing and learning, whereas Rin likely thinks she knows all the answers... But know I'm off on wild speculation.

[Rembr]

So she's not able to beat Rin at her current level... skill or whatever else you want to call it.

It's fine, she's going to win later, so what's with all the paragraphs.

[grey_moon]

Originally Posted by Peregrinus

Yes, Rin is more "mature," but in this case maturity = cynicism. The think I love about Tama is that she is an idealism and her naivety, which seems to be what Rin targeted in their conversations and set out to disprove in Tama's beliefs.

Great post. I especially like the way you pointed out about them presenting their beliefs. In a way that is what I dislike about Rin. You see for me belief can't really be proved or disproved, its a personal thing, so when someone goes about trying to "convert" someone else I find it a little annoying.

[Peregrinus]

Originally Posted by Rembr

So she's not able to beat Rin at her current level... skill or whatever else you want to call it.

It's fine, she's going to win later, so what's with all the paragraphs.

No, it is my firm belief that Tama is capable of beating Rin at her present skill level, if there were none of these extenuating circumstances. To put it into roleplay terms, Tama was getting circumstance penalties to her attack rolls, while Rin was getting circumstance bonuses.

Why all the paragraphs? Because loosing due to circumstances (read: "outside forces") is not a fair test of skill, and because the net result is going to be a weepy recovery series of episodes when Tama shouldn't have lost in the first place.

[ThoHell]

My guess: Tama will return to the kendo club once she realized she loves doing kendo and being with friends, not just doing kendo because she has to. Not once in the series have we seen the expression/face of Tama's mother. Most of the time when she has flash backs about he mother it's related to kendo. I think that missing facial expression is some sort of a sign, Tama has yet to realize why she does kendo and what it means to her. I think when Tama finally is able to visualize her mothers face, she'll see that her mother did kendo with a happy expression (I mean she loved kendo). Then Tama will probably realize her own feelings after being able to visualize her moms facial expression along with realizing her mom's feelings about kendo.

Any takers?

[grey_moon]

Originally Posted by ThoHell

My guess: Tama will return to the kendo club once she realized she loves doing kendo and being with friends, not just doing kendo because she has to. Not once in the series have we seen the expression/face of Tama's mother. Most of the time when she has flash backs about he mother it's related to kendo. I think that missing facial expression is some sort of a sign, Tama has yet to realize why she does kendo and what it means to her. I think when Tama finally is able to visualize her mothers face, she'll see that her mother did kendo with a happy expression (I mean she loved kendo). Then Tama will probably realize her own feelings after being able to visualize her moms facial expression along with realizing her mom's feelings about kendo.

Any takers?

Sounds like a very likely scenario, and all you are missing is Blade doing the Obi Wan voice to spur Tama on and it will be perfect

I really hope that they will make something of Tama's mum, I hope it isn't going to be relegated into a plot device

[Boohahaha]

Originally Posted by Peregrinus

No, it is my firm belief that Tama is capable of beating Rin at her present skill level, if there were none of these extenuating circumstances. To put it into roleplay terms, Tama was getting circumstance penalties to her attack rolls, while Rin was getting circumstance bonuses.

Why all the paragraphs? Because loosing due to circumstances (read: "outside forces") is not a fair test of skill, and because the net result is going to be a weepy recovery series of episodes when Tama shouldn't have lost in the first place.

It doesn't matter WHAT circumstance she was in or what the writers decided to write. She lost and that's that, she lost to a better opponent on the day. Mental resolve and skill go hand in hand, if she was not mentally strong enough than too bad I am afraid. In fact sports people that come out giving all manner of excuses for their lost because of "outside circumstances" is seen as bad sportsmanship. But it happens all the time in the media, the difference is which side the media is on. When an opponent is given a handicap or cheats then yes it is not a fair test of skill, but otherwise it is all fair and square. Furthermore why even bring up the point that Tama lost was due to the writers direction? all stories are set up.

Cmon guys I know Tama is a very likable character, but let's give Rin some credit here for winning.

Yes, Rin is more "mature," but in this case maturity = cynicism. The think I love about Tama is that she is an idealism and her naivety, which seems to be what Rin targeted in their conversations and set out to disprove in Tama's beliefs.

As you grow older people become more skeptical and wiser, that's just life that most people finish University or studies and start workring in the real world will encounter. I was once very idealistic and naive myself, in fact I still am to a certain degree. But I am realist and reality can be very harsh at times unfortunately. So yes Tama being the way she is understandable for her age.

[grey_moon]

After watching epi 22 again I wonder if Rin was doing the same as Carrie.

There is no doubt about it that Carrie was trying to beat Miya with psych attacks, but how about Rin?

Could she have found out about Tama's weakness to the Jordan stance? As soon as Rin used the Jordan stance everyone expected her to freeze. So it is not like a hidden secret...

The build up to the fight, from their argument about their favourite characters to right before the fight when Rin basically accuses Tama of not representing Blade since she will lose.

Too many co-incidences there for my liking.

[yongshun]

Originally Posted by grey_moon

After watching epi 22 again I wonder if Rin was doing the same as Carrie.

There is no doubt about it that Carrie was trying to beat Miya with psych attacks, but how about Rin?

Could she have found out about Tama's weakness to the Jordan stance? As soon as Rin used the Jordan stance everyone expected her to freeze. So it is not like a hidden secret...

The build up to the fight, from their argument about their favourite characters to right before the fight when Rin basically accuses Tama of not representing Blade since she will lose.

Too many co-incidences there for my liking.

Rin never met Tama until she stayed over at her place for the Blade Braver shoot, and it couldnt have been taped as the only people who knows that she freezes like that when someone is in that stance is her teammates and her teacher's senpai from that other school and that wasnt an official match.

[Peregrinus]

I have to say, I don't think Rin was consciously trying to mentally debilitate Tama before the match. She just happened to hit Tama on her weakest points all at once. She had a stronger strength of conviction than Tama, she had been planting the idea that Tama couldn't win due to her lack of conviction, plus she used the Joden stance, which, when fighting Tama makes sense due to Tama's naturally shorter reach and height... it was a perfect storm against Tama. The only thing that could have made it worse is that she would have to fight either Braver or her mother...

But it wasn't orchestrated, and if it was, then I hope we see a repeat of "righteously indignant warrior maiden Tamaki."

[ThoHell]

Originally Posted by Boohahaha

It doesn't matter WHAT circumstance she was in or what the writers decided to write. She lost and that's that, she lost to a better opponent on the day. Mental resolve and skill go hand in hand, if she was not mentally strong enough than too bad I am afraid. In fact sports people that come out giving all manner of excuses for their lost because of "outside circumstances" is seen as bad sportsmanship. But it happens all the time in the media, the difference is which side the media is on. When an opponent is given a handicap or cheats then yes it is not a fair test of skill, but otherwise it is all fair and square. Furthermore why even bring up the point that Tama lost was due to the writers direction? all stories are set up.

Cmon guys I know Tama is a very likable character, but let's give Rin some credit here for winning.



As you grow older people become more skeptical and wiser, that's just life that most people finish University or studies and start workring in the real world will encounter. I was once very idealistic and naive myself, in fact I still am to a certain degree. But I am realist and reality can be very harsh at times unfortunately. So yes Tama being the way she is understandable for her age.

I didn't hear Tama making any excuses about loosing or showing poor sportsmanship. Right now she's completely lost and confused. Doesn't really know why she does kendo it seems like, Yeah shock from loosing and stuff, but she did not show poor sportsmanship walking off that mat nor did she make excuses. Anyways it was a destined lost that EVERYONE, us and for some reason Yuji and sensei 2, knew was going to happen. It was destined, so skill and all that doesn't matter and is thrown out the window. Not saying the lost was wrong, just saying the way it was laid out was wrong, to much predestined and the time of conflict was made too known (too known as in the characters in the series were so worried when they never worried before).

[Deathkillz]

Originally Posted by grey_moon

After watching epi 22 again I wonder if Rin was doing the same as Carrie.

There is no doubt about it that Carrie was trying to beat Miya with psych attacks, but how about Rin?

Could she have found out about Tama's weakness to the Jordan stance? As soon as Rin used the Jordan stance everyone expected her to freeze. So it is not like a hidden secret...

The build up to the fight, from their argument about their favourite characters to right before the fight when Rin basically accuses Tama of not representing Blade since she will lose.

Too many co-incidences there for my liking.

Well, Rin isn't the type to stoop so low as to use mind attacks like Carrie

I would say that even though her idol is a villain, to her, he is justice and so she will fight with honor as well. Underhanded tactics are for losers and I am sure she understands that ~ of course with the skill that she has, she would also think that there is no need to "cheat".

The question of her using the joudan stance is out for debating but I don't think she knows about that being tamaki's weakness. It could just be her fighting style or actually, a way for her to show respect towards tamaki as a worthy opponent to not hold back on any tricks. Everyone reacted that way because she used a unique stance (I assume that the joudan stance is not a common move to take in kendo practices?).

The argument was no more than a friendly debate to protect their own fangirl egos ^^

[Boohahaha]

Originally Posted by ThoHell

I didn't hear Tama making any excuses about loosing or showing poor sportsmanship. Right now she's completely lost and confused. Doesn't really know why she does kendo it seems like, Yeah shock from loosing and stuff, but she did not show poor sportsmanship walking off that mat nor did she make excuses. Anyways it was a destined lost that EVERYONE, us and for some reason Yuji and sensei 2, knew was going to happen. It was destined, so skill and all that doesn't matter and is thrown out the window. Not saying the lost was wrong, just saying the way it was laid out was wrong, to much predestined and the time of conflict was made too known (too known as in the characters in the series were so worried when they never worried before).

You are mis-interpreting my post. My post was in response to people that make excuses for their sporting heroes or teams for losing, in this case those posters in support of Tama that believe she did not have a fair match. I never said that Tama was being a poor sports.

[Peregrinus]

Originally Posted by ThoHell

It was destined, so skill and all that doesn't matter and is thrown out the window. Not saying the lost was wrong, just saying the way it was laid out was wrong, to much predestined and the time of conflict was made too known (too known as in the characters in the series were so worried when they never worried before).

Let me quote something that sums up my feelings about that and should tell folks why I simply don't like that idea in any story:

Originally Posted by Fred

"Can I say something about destiny? Screw destiny... ...Because destiny is just another word for inevitable. And nothing is inevitable as long as you stand up, look it in the eye and say, 'You're evitable.'"

[Vestus]

Originally Posted by Boohahaha

It doesn't matter WHAT circumstance she was in or what the writers decided to write. She lost and that's that, she lost to a better opponent on the day. Mental resolve and skill go hand in hand, if she was not mentally strong enough than too bad I am afraid. In fact sports people that come out giving all manner of excuses for their lost because of "outside circumstances" is seen as bad sportsmanship. But it happens all the time in the media, the difference is which side the media is on. When an opponent is given a handicap or cheats then yes it is not a fair test of skill, but otherwise it is all fair and square. Furthermore why even bring up the point that Tama lost was due to the writers direction? all stories are set up.

Cmon guys I know Tama is a very likable character, but let's give Rin some credit here for winning.

I don't know about you guys, but Miya-Miya is the best!!!!

Kidding aside, Rin is really good. However, I believe that the "ascension stance" that reminded Tama of her mother played a significant factor into disabling Tama's focus.

The one hand strike alone displays Rin's strength. However, she couldn't have won so easily against Tama if it weren't for the "ascension stance" (that isn't to say Rin used that on purpose to throw off Tama's focus). I mean we're talking about Tama. The little girl who smashes grown men without breaking a sweat.

EDIT: I think my parenthesis might be worded wrong. To clarify, Rin didn't use the "ascension stance" to throw off Tama. Well, judging on current facts. We might find out something later, but that's highly unlikely.

Originally Posted by Boohahaha

As you grow older people become more skeptical and wiser, that's just life that most people finish University or studies and start workring in the real world will encounter. I was once very idealistic and naive myself, in fact I still am to a certain degree. But I am realist and reality can be very harsh at times unfortunately. So yes Tama being the way she is understandable for her age.

However, it is the idealistic people whom shine and advance father.