(L) Mushoku Tensei: Isekai Ittara Honki Dasu (Jobless Reincarnation)

[Tenzen12]

Seen speculation, that she's one of two students that disappeared in 1st episode.

[stray]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Well there is plenty artiless that mention this and it takes like half minute find them. That said finding articless is much simplier then finding studies they are potentialy based on. It's obviously possible it's just very common myth, but if it is it still very believable one that wasn't debunked yet.

Have you never heard of Dunning-Kruger?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunnin...3Kruger_effect

Generally people who are the most talented underestimate their own abilities and struggle with things like imposter syndrome. Its the mediocre ones who overestimate and get themselves in trouble.

[VDZ]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Well there is plenty artiless that mention this and it takes like half minute find them. That said finding articless is much simplier then finding studies they are potentialy based on. It's obviously possible it's just very common myth, but if it is it still very believable one that wasn't debunked yet.

"It's actualy proven that smart people are more prone to make terrible mistakes, then average (and it's mostly due overconfidence)" 'hasn't been debunked yet' because it's not falsifiable. You would need to define what constitutes a "smart person" and define what counts as "a terrible mistake", then somehow track all occurrences of "terrible mistakes" for a group of "smart people" and a control group, then in addition to all that would need to prove a casual relation between the statistically significant increase in "terrible mistakes" and overconfidence. More likely, it's just 'common knowledge', in much the same way it's common knowledge that both 'birds of a feather flock together' and 'opposites attract', even though they contradict each other. In other words, bullshit people only think is true because people keep repeating it.

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Nonetheles you don't have to read anything to figure that when there is god-like figure that people (or it itself) call god it's save assume "god" not name their mother gave them.

People can adopt (or be given) names during their lives, not everyone sticks with the name they were born with. Emperor Augustus was originally just named 'Gaius Octavius' but changed his name to 'Augustus' (meaning 'great') later in life, related to his position of ruler of the mightiest empire on earth. 'Nanahoshi' (seven stars?) likewise sounds like it could be an adopted/given descriptive name, just like people may have started calling Man-god 'Man-god' because of his godly status. (AFAIK not much about Mushoku Tensei's cosmology has been revealed yet, but if Orsted is the Dragon-god while seeming like a mostly normal being it's probable that Man-god was also once less abstract than he is now.)

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

They'd also need to assume that it's possible to travel between the two worlds with your physical body, because otherwise that logic doesn't make any sense. Rudy has blond hair in spite of being originally from Japan. Generally isekai either have the reincarnation method or the physical travel method, having both in the same story is decidedly odd.

There are settings in which both are canon (e.g. Death March to the Parallel World Rhapsody), but if it's a thing in Mushoku Tensei then it has yet to be introduced. (But Mushoku Tensei hasn't shown any isekai'd people other than Rudeus in general.)

[BWTraveller]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

They'd also need to assume that it's possible to travel between the two worlds with your physical body, because otherwise that logic doesn't make any sense. Rudy has blond hair in spite of being originally from Japan. Generally isekai either have the reincarnation method or the physical travel method, having both in the same story is decidedly odd.

Doesn't really change my point. Unless Man-God is lying about all living beings of this world just naturally feeling a sense of pure dread when he's around, Nanahoshi is clearly not of this world. Which would mean either she's a deity or another outsider. Doesn't really matter whether she came here via summons or other methods.

Also, one thing they cut that was in the LN:

Spoiler:

Along the journey, Rudy comes across a dish titled "Nanahoshi-style" that very strongly resembles Japanese karaage. He was overjoyed as he's always delighted to find something that resembles Japanese food, though this one wasn't exactly to his liking. Thanks to this, the name feels familiar to him when he hears it.

[Tenzen12]

Originally Posted by VDZ

"It's actualy proven that smart people are more prone to make terrible mistakes, then average (and it's mostly due overconfidence)" 'hasn't been debunked yet' because it's not falsifiable. You would need to define what constitutes a "smart person" and define what counts as "a terrible mistake", then somehow track all occurrences of "terrible mistakes" for a group of "smart people" and a control group, then in addition to all that would need to prove a casual relation between the statistically significant increase in "terrible mistakes" and overconfidence. More likely, it's just 'common knowledge', in much the same way it's common knowledge that both 'birds of a feather flock together' and 'opposites attract', even though they contradict each other. In other words, bullshit people only think is true because people keep repeating it.

Ok, I apologise I made off-the-cuff remark about this topic. I should have said it in a way it sound like have research paper on hand. Given I am not really trying contend this point in first place, I will not regardless of it's validity or lacks or thereof

People can adopt (or be given) names during their lives, not everyone sticks with the name they were born with. Emperor Augustus was originally just named 'Gaius Octavius' but changed his name to 'Augustus' (meaning 'great') later in life, related to his position of ruler of the mightiest empire on earth. 'Nanahoshi' (seven stars?) likewise sounds like it could be an adopted/given descriptive name, just like people may have started calling Man-god 'Man-god' because of his godly status. (AFAIK not much about Mushoku Tensei's cosmology has been revealed yet, but if Orsted is the Dragon-god while seeming like a mostly normal being it's probable that Man-god was also once less abstract than he is now.)


There are settings in which both are canon (e.g. Death March to the Parallel World Rhapsody), but if it's a thing in Mushoku Tensei then it has yet to be introduced. (But Mushoku Tensei hasn't shown any isekai'd people other than Rudeus in general.)

Fair point, but Augustus is still follow naming convention. He didn't put "Emperor" as his name. And we already seen that tittles don't replace names in MT. We got Sword King Ghislain (Aka Ghislain), Dragon God Orsted (aka Orsted), but Nanahoshi is apparently just Nanahoshi. It's not like it's impossible that it's some kind of tittle, but it's also not impossible that Rudeus is third reincarnation of Jesus. But there is no reason think that's the case and there is no reason (for now) to think Nanahoshi is anything else then Japanese name. If it looks like duck and sound duck, its almost certainly duck.

I actually don't know if Hitogami was ever just some dude, but if nothing else Orsted is part of spieces that is obviously closely related to dragons. Just looks on scales on his face and reptilian eyes...

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Jan-Poo

I would have expected Rudy to be more surprised by that though.

For what it's worth, the manga version did have him specifically take note of it.

[Metaneo]

Originally Posted by GDB

For what it's worth, the manga version did have him specifically take note of it.

The Manga version had Orsted be much more approachable and less intimidating, meaning Rudeus' conversation came across as much more casual.

[Huh...?]

Next Episode Preview
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNfPdVW4wjU

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by BWTraveller

Doesn't really change my point. Unless Man-God is lying about all living beings of this world just naturally feeling a sense of pure dread when he's around, Nanahoshi is clearly not of this world. Which would mean either she's a deity or another outsider. Doesn't really matter whether she came here via summons or other methods.

I don't have any problem with that reasoning. It's only the part where people think that black hair specifically makes it likely that she's Japanese that doesn't sound valid to me, at least with the knowledge we have right now. Because even if she was just like Rudy, then as Rudy demonstrates, she would have inherited the genetic traits of whoever are her parents in the new world and her ethnicity in the previous world wouldn't have affected in any way her hair color.

So unless it's possible for earthlings to travel to this fantasy world with their physical body, then the only conclusion is that black hair is a trait that can be found in this fantasy world.

Of course there are also all kind of possible speculations one could make about that. Maybe Nanahoshi really hated her new identity and she dyed her hair or used magic to become as much as possible as she was before.

Originally Posted by GDB

For what it's worth, the manga version did have him specifically take note of it.

Well that would have certainly made things more clear to me. Maybe they'll make Rudeus point that out on the next episode. That sounds like a very important information to me and something that would be very odd for Rudy to not consider.

[magnuskn]

Well, if the speculation that Nanahoshi is the girl Rudeus pushed out of the way of Truck-kun in his former life is true, then it figures that she didn't die the same way Rudeus former self did. If for some reason she was transported to this fantasy world, maybe it is her directly? Although in that case she probably should be way older? Eh, questions, questions. Let's see what answers will be provided.

[Frontier]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

Well, if the speculation that Nanahoshi is the girl Rudeus pushed out of the way of Truck-kun in his former life is true, then it figures that she didn't die the same way Rudeus former self did. If for some reason she was transported to this fantasy world, maybe it is her directly? Although in that case she probably should be way older? Eh, questions, questions. Let's see what answers will be provided.

I think unlike Rudeus, who died, the other kids just "vanished" after he saved them from the truck, so it might have been entirely different circumstances which might have effected how they ended up in the world differently.

[BWTraveller]

Well yeah, I do recall while they were trying to resuscitate him they'd mentioned that the kids were nowhere to be found. Since his body just died but their bodies vanished, it does stand to reason that whatever happened to them involved their physical bodies.

[Tenzen12]

Anyway found this coverage of novel content

YouTube

https://youtu.be/KWzCqDtQW_k

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

Long story short Rudeus was willing to talk Orsted because later seemed not just non-hostile, but genuinely freindly and happy to see them (Ruijerd and Eris to be exact) and despite other party memebers still being wary of him he was about to leave without doing anything wrong anyway.

[Decel]

I just realized: the Man God knew that Orsted would revive Rudy, no?

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Decel

I just realized: the Man God knew that Orsted would revive Rudy, no?

No, Rudy was already healed by the time they started talking. If I recall, Orsted didn't revive him, just healed the wounds he gave him. Which means he had to have done it within a few dozen seconds, considering the last wound was a piercing of the heart.

[Decel]

Originally Posted by GDB

No, Rudy was already healed by the time they started talking. If I recall, Orsted didn't revive him, just healed the wounds he gave him. Which means he had to have done it within a few dozen seconds, considering the last wound was a piercing of the heart.

Ah the show didn't give that impression, since Rudy had the hole in his body for a while when he was speaking with the Man God.

[Jan-Poo]

Originally Posted by Decel

Ah the show didn't give that impression, since Rudy had the hole in his body for a while when he was speaking with the Man God.

But that's a completely different "body". In the end the appearance he assumes in that "space" it's just how Rudeus perceives himself. He has a hole because he thought he was dead, the moment the Man God told him he wasn't dead, the hole disappeared.

[Frontier]

Rudeus dreams of everyone he knows and loves together and enjoying each others' company, Eris' family, his family, and even Roxy, Sylphie, and Eris together (and man, Eris is tall, although he only remembers Sylphie from when he last saw her). Of course it all spirals out of control as a dragon passes by and he gets reminded of his own mortality and the possibility of losing his second chance after Orsted nearly killed him .

It was nice to see Ruijerd find out that the curse is ending and, if he works hard enough, he'll be able to properly redeem himself and the Superd's reputation. Seeing Ruijerd cry was pretty emotional .

Seeing your hometown where you grew up and all the hallmarks of your childhood so ravaged and forlorn is pretty upsetting, with the only thing you have left are the happy memories you can recall. It really feels like Rudy's childhood has ended, in more ways than one .

It's tough to see Ruijerd go, but he went off by showing how much he appreciated everything Rudy did for him and by acknowledging how far Eris has come as a warrior and how far he'll know she will go moving forward. After all this time together, they have really become a family, and he pats their head like they were his own kids. Poor Eris crying and trying to grab him in vain...hopefully one day Dead End can be reunited .

Man, it was nice to see Ghislaine make it out okay, and to see her and Eris get reunited. I wonder if Rudy told her about her brother and niece off-screen ?

Although the emotional reunion takes a turn for the worst with the revelation that, not only was Eris' grandfather executed, but her parents are both dead because they landed in disputed territory and were likely killed. Eris lost her family. And on top of that another lord Greyrat is thinking of taking her on as a concubine and she's stuck in a political rut. Hearing Eris cry after sending everyone away, even Rudy, was tough. She put on a composed front but she really did just lose her whole family .

Well, Zenith still hasn't been found but it seems like Sylphie is okay at least, so that's something .

Woah. Eris in that nightdress was too effective .

Eris has lost everything, but she still has Rudy, and she wants to make a family with him because he's the only thing she left...and ultimately not a family of a "brother and sister," but a family of man and wife, as she wants to be with him and bear his "kittens" (did Eris' mom use that on her dad? It would make a lot of sense for this family). Rudy isn't sure how comfortable he is with it knowing the emotional state Eris is in, but she still wants him and she knows he wants her, and amidst flashbacks of their history together, going from punching, to learning, to bonding, to becoming companions, adventurers, and a real family...the two become one as lovers .

Rudy is on cloud 9 having finally punched his v-card in and nothing can ruin his day...until he goes back into the tent and finds nothing left of Eris but her hair and what Rudy perceives as a "Dear John" letter, as she leaves off with Ghislaine and Rudy without any idea where she's going. Rudy thought he had finally found love and someone who loved and cared for him as a man, for the first time in his entire life, and she left him. What did Eris mean by "not compatible" ?

[Tenzen12]

Just to make something clear. Eris leaving is direct consequence of their encounter with Orsted. If that didn't happen, she wouldn't feel inadequate and wouldn't ever even consider leaving to seek strenght protect Rudeus. Eris and Rudeus separating and impact it left on him is what made "Turning point 2" a turning point.

Anime didn't really made it clear and there were lot people who called that previous episode inconsequential, which to be fair there indeed wasn't any obvious consequences until this one.

[GDB]

Originally Posted by Frontier

What did Eris mean by "not compatible" ?

If the next episode does what the manga did, it'll likely give us Eris's viewpoint of this and explain it.