[Game] Umineko no Naku Koro ni - Ep. 3 Banquet of the golden witch

[Matrim]

Spoiler for Ep.3 first 11 chapters:

Actually Battler says the culprit locked himself in and commited a suicide which he later changed to "had an accident". Beatrice is about to say something in red which looks like a statement that none of them has had an accident when Ronove. Also, a letter was found in the boiler room which is quite a weird occurence if Kinzo died due to an accidental fall in the fire or soemthing like that.

[Avisch]

The real interests of episode 3's first twilight compared to the others is

Spoiler for ch 0-11:

Is that the deaths are confirmable right? (I can't get to the game right now), no one's head has been made undiscernable (cept Kinzo's).

The first twilight of episode 1 is the most confusing because none of the deaths (cept Shannon's and Krauss's) are confirmable.

Episode 2 deaths have all of them confirmable.

Well actually Battler's explanation of everything for episode 3's 1st twilight, pretty much says all 6 servants are dead.

So basically the first twilights are going like this,.
Episode 1: 2 Confirmed Deaths, 4 Supposed (2 Servants, 4 Family)
Episode 2: 6 Confirmed Deaths (All Family)
Episode 3: 6 Confirmed Deaths (All Servants)

It's going to be fun to see the end of this all.

[Proto]

For Episode 5 there were 5 confirmed deaths though.

adendum:

says: episode 5
must say: episode 3

[Avisch]

......Does not compute.

[The Creator]

Originally Posted by Matrim

Spoiler for Ep.3 first 11 chapters:

Actually Battler says the culprit locked himself in and commited a suicide which he later changed to "had an accident". Beatrice is about to say something in red which looks like a statement that none of them has had an accident when Ronove. Also, a letter was found in the boiler room which is quite a weird occurence if Kinzo died due to an accidental fall in the fire or soemthing like that.

What if

Spoiler:

in one of the rooms, there was a secret room? I'm sure beatrice didn't cross out that option in this game, she did say that there were no hidden dorms in the jessica and kanon closed room, what if the culprit went to the secret room and escape after the siblings open the door? (it doens't matter in which room it was, or perhaps it does but not precisely to demostrate my point)

Again i'm strongly suspecting nanjo

[Proto]

......Does not compute.

Your erroneous data correction capabilities are not in par with my ability to make mistakes! (yup, now it's your fault)

Read adendum.

[Christen]

I'm just wondering if anyone has a copy-pasta of the witch epitaph in their original form (Japanese). I'm trying to find it and I have no luck.

[Orophin]

Originally Posted by christen

i'm just wondering if anyone has a copy-pasta of the witch epitaph in their original form (japanese). I'm trying to find it and i have no luck.

Spoiler for epitaph in japanese:

懐かしき、故郷を貫く鮎の川。
黄金郷を目指す者よ、これを下りて鍵を探せ。

川を下れば、やがて里あり。
その里にて二人が口にし岸を探れ。
そこに黄金郷への鍵が眠る。

鍵を手にせし者は、以下に従いて黄金郷へ旅立つべし。

第一の晩に、鍵の選びし六人を生贄に捧げよ。
第二の晩に、残されし者は寄り添う二人を引き裂け。
第三の晩に、残されし者は誉れ高き我が名を讃えよ。
第四の晩に、頭を抉りて殺せ。
第五の晩に、胸を抉りて殺せ。
第六の晩に、腹を抉りて殺せ。
第七の晩に、膝を抉りて殺せ。
第八の晩に、足を抉りて殺せ。
第九の晩に、魔女は蘇り、誰も生き残れはしない。
第十の晩に、旅は終わり、黄金の郷に至るだろう。

魔女は賢者を讃え、四つの宝を授けるだろう。
一つは、黄金郷の全ての黄金。
一つは、全ての死者の魂を蘇らせ。
一つは、失った愛すらも蘇らせる。
一つは、魔女を永遠に眠りにつかせよう。

安らかに眠れ、我が最愛の魔女ベアトリーチェ。

[Christen]

Thanks a lot Orophin

[Matrim]

Originally Posted by The Creator

What if

Spoiler:

in one of the rooms, there was a secret room? I'm sure beatrice didn't cross out that option in this game, she did say that there were no hidden dorms in the jessica and kanon closed room, what if the culprit went to the secret room and escape after the siblings open the door? (it doens't matter in which room it was, or perhaps it does but not precisely to demostrate my point)

Again i'm strongly suspecting nanjo

Spoiler for ep.3:

Beato did say in red that no one was hiding in the six rooms and that the fact that there are no hidden doors leading to other rooms was included in her locked room definition. Interestingly enough that definition is not in red.

[Avisch]

Originally Posted by Proto

Your erroneous data correction capabilities are not in par with my ability to make mistakes! (yup, now it's your fault)

Read adendum.

Umm. Ok I just figured it was possible to make two mistakes.
But i thought Beatrice had confirmed the deaths....of course thats probably what she wants us to think.

[Keriaku]

Originally Posted by Christen

I'm just wondering if anyone has a copy-pasta of the witch epitaph in their original form (Japanese). I'm trying to find it and I have no luck.

Why didn't you just open an unpatched copy of the game?

[Klashikari]

Originally Posted by Avisch

Umm. Ok I just figured it was possible to make two mistakes.
But i thought Beatrice had confirmed the deaths....of course thats probably what she wants us to think.

No, she DID confirm that:

Spoiler:

Kinzo, Genji, Shannon, Kanon, Gohda and Kumasawa are dead.

The only problem is to figure how Kinzo died and if his corpse being put in the incinerator wasn't done much later

[The Creator]

Originally Posted by Matrim

Spoiler for ep.3:

Beato did say in red that no one was hiding in the six rooms and that the fact that there are no hidden doors leading to other rooms was included in her locked room definition. Interestingly enough that definition is not in red.

Interesting. Can we be sure that beatrice saying it in white is in the game and isn't just a traslation mistake? Just to be sure, but i don't really think that she'll use a cheap trick like that....

Mmmm reading what you said again i have a question

Spoiler:

Beatrice says this "there are no hidden doors leading to other rooms", but what if there are doors leading to the same exit the normal door leads? The culprit could've escaped through after closing the room =x

[Klashikari]

None of Beato's definitions are in red in the original game, but considering the context and such, you can rely on her definitions without to worry about them, especially considering her repeating these conditions a lot in red, in Episode 2.

And wait... a door leading to the "same exit"? That doesn't make much sense, and it would be a weird hidden door.

[k//eternal]

I guess the idea of a "door with the same exit" is similar to the cat door some people have on their front doors. It goes to the same place, but it's meant for someone else to access.

It's not impossible, but it means the culprit would have to be pretty familiar with the mansion. Like, more so than most of the people living in it.

[chronotrig]

Spoiler for ep3 closed room definition:

Sorry, but her definition of a hidden door (from ep2) is 'an entrance or exit that cannot be recognized by those who do not know of it.' In ep3, it's even more strict, saying that 'a closed room refers to a room where the inside and the outside of the room are completely separated'. It doesn't matter where the doors go. As long as they lead outside of the room, they break the closed room definition.

Also, for every recognizable entrance, she states that it cannot be opened without a key to that room. And, as long as a door is locked, no one can enter through it. So while a door inside a door might be possible, it would also have to be locked with the same lock as the main door, or else it would fail Beatrice's closed room definition.

Interesting. Can we be sure that beatrice saying it in white is in the game and isn't just a traslation mistake? Just to be sure, but i don't really think that she'll use a cheap trick like that....

If you're referring to the ep3 closed room definition, believe me, I know how you feel. After translating that chapter, I looked all over it to see if she ever uses it in red, but it never happens.

To put it simply, not only does Beatrice never say the definition in red, she never even says any of the rooms in the first twilight are closed rooms in red.

That's a perfectly fair move for her to do (cheap tricks are her specialty) but it's up to Battler to call her on it. I think the reason Battler didn't is because Virgilia was the one who made those statements in white, and she's his ally.

[Christen]

Originally Posted by Keriaku

Why didn't you just open an unpatched copy of the game?

Haha, that's the first thought that comes to mind but:
1. I suck at Kanji and needs to use some websites to find the definition.
2. I'd like to read it outside the game.

[actawesome]

By the way, if the translators have need of an extra person to help them, I'll gladly do it. To be honest I don't know much Japanese, but I can help with the English translation and such.

[Goose Boy]

I think I know what is what lambdadelta said that beato did terribly wrong:

Spoiler for Beato´s great mistake:

In ep1 and 2.... the letter with the triangle thing... it is obvious maria placed it... also she was the first to see it in ep1

What does that mean? in ep2 rosa looked in maria´s pocket and the only envelope contained the key... im too lazy for reading again ep2 to figure it out but someone of the alive people gave the letter to maria... and she was always with someone and never alone by the wolf/sheep thing rosa had an obsession with

(09_suspicion from umineko soundtrack)

Now that we think about it, rosa was the only one to peek in maria´s pocket, what about if she placed the other letter inside and one said to deliver the triangle array or "beato" told her that? also she got out genji out of the room , what about if? she gave genji a key and he killed shanon george and gohda and made the locked room? he could have later gived the key to rosa meanwhile no one was watching.

Also, rosa died at the first twilight at ep1, so she could have given the letter to maria and no one would have saw her pocket, the point is that there:

There is rosa and an accomplice X, X was the one who commited the things in ep1 and for the kanon event: kumazawa´s expression was too convincing that she didnt, and the other alive people had alibis, eva and hideyoshi were in the room and were DEFINETELY dead beacause george touched them (he would have in his desesperation try to comprobate if they are dead), then we had the people of the first twilight. Shannon wasnt as she was recognizable, gohda feared the witch, krauss had all the situation controlated as he embezzled kinzo´s money, then comes rosa ( who could have faken her death but NEEDS an accomplice) and finally rudolf and kyrie, so probably kyrie would have done it, why? well, her breasts are so big that she could had the icepick launcher hided ( haha XD ) and if you see the drawing of the family, the line of people involved with black magic ( kinzo, eva for her witch self and maria) had kyrie in it. Get your own conclusion XD