One Piece - Chapter 628 [manga]

[Battler-kun]

Finally!

Back to the present and just about the right time the real action is kicking in.

Just can't wait

Well, i think Luffy should be strong enough now to overcome Jimbei.

[paradox13]

the kind of people that are ALREADY filled with human hate and would refuse to see otherwise

Which is in fact most of the population.

[Slayerx]

Originally Posted by paradox13

Which is in fact most of the population.

No its not... by the end of the flashback, the merpeople seemed willing to move on as they seemed to be embrace the Prince's words at otihime's funeral... also there is the petition which is proof of the support to move on. Futhermore, the mermaids were more than happy to entertain the strawhats and even hide them from the princes. The only time the strawhats received any hate was from those of the fishman pirates or from the citizens after the strawhats were suspected of crimes; y'know legit reasons for hate... thus far, no one on fishman island outside of the pirates have treated the strawhats negatively just because they were human

most do not seem to hate humans to such an extent and seem open minded, and it takes an A LOT of hate like what we see from Hodi to believe a conspiracy theory like "they only saved us in our most desperate hour so they can betray us later"... i mean this isn't just being friendly, this is risking your life saving an entire kingdom and thousands of lives from a feared enemy... espetially when you consider that instead of waiting till later to betray they could just step up and act out their evil right now

[risingstar3110]

They should get Zoro a bubble, and this act would then have ended more quickly...

[ZGoten]

I don't think Luffy and Jimbei will actually fight, at least not for long. There's a good chance, that Luffy will eventually entrust everything in Jimbei's hands. If Zorro can 1-hit Hodi, so can Jimbei, probably. And if he can 1-hit Hodi, he can probably 1-hit everyone who's with him, too. Of course Luffy doesn't know that, but that doesn't matter, since Oda does. Jimbei will probably convince Nami and the others that his plan of actions is the correct one, which will in turn convince Luffy.

However, even though Jimbei would probably own Hodi's entire gang single-handedly and blindfolded, I can't imagine him being the final saviour of this arc, so to say. Somewhere along the line, there will have to come a moment, when there's no choice but to let Luffy step in, I suppose, or at least some of the other straw heads (if Oda should decide to save displaying Luffy's new awesomeness for later). As for what the situation will be, when that moment arrives, I don't know. Maybe Jimbei will have a change of heart and join Hodi, but that's unlikely. Or he's been secretely with him all the time, which I don't believe either. Maybe he'll just get caught or beaten in a moment of unawareness. But the most likely thing to happen is probably Hodi playing dirty, by threatening to kill somebody unless a certain demand is met. But still, this all begs one question: what will be the final "epic" battle?

[ronin myael]

luffy immature? nah, he acted like a real captain would. his crew needed him, it's only natural that he comes to their rescue. you would do the same for your friends if they needed your help.

i don't think the jinbei and luffy fight would actually happen. the fight doesn't make sense. neptune is going to die, zoro and the others are under threat, it just seems stupid at this point.

that color spread also made me pant in excitement. it would be interesting to see what power-ups they acquired over the past two years.

loved that cage conversation between zoro, usopp and brooke as well. i laughed when zoro asked usopp to free him of his cuffs and usopp pretended to open it magically but apologized for not being able to call on his psychic powers. lol

[cloak_and_dagger]

I'm most curious about Chopper's powers. I love that new look in the colour spread.

[marvelB]

Originally Posted by Slayerx

No, still doesn't make a whole lot of sense even in that perspective. The idea that the strawhats are just rescuing the kingdom from an imminent threat is just a ruse so they can betray us later is like conspiracy theory that ONLY the fringe group of people would believe; the kind of people that are ALREADY filled with human hate and would refuse to see otherwise. Besides which is worse "a bunch of humans attacked the palace" (as the merpeople currently believe), or the theory that "the humans that saved the kingdom only did it to get on our good side so they can betray us later"... which is gonna make humans look WORSE in the eyes of the people. One is a widely believed understanding of what has already happened and the other sounds like a conspiracy theory only the hatemongers would believe

Really, the conspiracy theory mindset isn't as far-fetched as you think. I think you're underestimating the terrifyingly complex effects that racial bigotry can have on people. I mean, goddamn, neither Arlong nor Hody actually experienced the horrors of slavery for themselves, yet their deeply rooted hatred for humanity has caused them to commit acts that are just as, if not more heinous than their supposedly "inferior" oppressors. And sure, while it may be true that they represent the minority, one must remember that minorities tend to have the loudest-heard voices over the majority (this holds quite true in real life, with the results being good or bad depending on the minorities in question)......

Originally Posted by Slayerx

Really, i think this storyline would work better if Hodi was a more charismatic and good character; a hero of the people not unlike Fisher Tiger. Like he admired Tiger in his youth and believed in the value of otihime's ideals but after her death realized they were nothing more than ideals and thus began thinking more like Arlong. It would help make him much more distinct from arlong and probably make this whole conflict more gray. I mean, imagine if this was Tiger trying to take over the kingdom and reform it. His words that Otihime's dream were wrong would have more weight to it; the merpeople would honestly be divided on what to do. King neptune is a good king who has never done them wrong, but Tiger is a hero of the people whose words have a ring of truth to it. All in all the last person to sort out this situation is a human... not only would the merpeople HATE to see their hero get beaten by a human, but given the divided nature of the issue this is something that the merpeople have to sort out themselves and not an outsider who may or may not have their own personal interests. As such the ONLY people qualified to sort out the situation would be the Princes, or another merpeople hero like Jinbei.

While it's true that Hody holds nowhere near as much influence as Tiger or Jinbei over the island's inhabitants, he at least has some recognition for being the one to capture Otohime's "killer" (notice that some townsfolk even recognized him right away during his speech). And again, going back to what I said in the above paragraph, Hody at least DOES have influence over the minority he's representing..... even if that minority happens to be a group of radicals. To them, he IS a hero, and for him to be toppled by yet another homo sapien would just cause the cycle of hate to repeat itself again and again (or at least, that's how I imagine Jinbei perceives the situation as a whole.....).



Now, you're probably gonna say something like "But One Piece is a shounen manga! That kind of idea is too complex for kids!", and while it's true that OP is a kid's fantasy comic, I think Oda also respects his audience enough to not whitewash a subject as serious as racism.

[Amirali]

Originally Posted by marvelB

While it's true that Jinbei seems to be a little too selfish in this situation, I can at least kinda see things in his perspective: He's probably adamant in stopping humans from rescuing the kingdom because he's really paranoid that the anti-human hatemongers will suspect that they're just trying to get on their good side so they can betray them somewhere down the line. Eventually that suspicion and paranoia would mix with their deeply-ingrained disdain for humans and give birth to MORE generations of monsters like Arlong and Hody. So again, while I may not fully agree with his judgement in such a troubling situation, I can at least see the picture from his shoes......

Agreed. Part of it may also be the shounen trope, "this is my fight". Jinbei may feel responsible for having let things come to this by being indecisive, and now he wants to atone without anyone else risking their life. Also, given that him and Hodi were comrades at one point, he may feel he owes it to Hodi, in a strange way, to take him down himself if he has to.

Originally Posted by marvelB

Really, the conspiracy theory mindset isn't as far-fetched as you think. I think you're underestimating the terrifyingly complex effects that racial bigotry can have on people. I mean, goddamn, neither Arlong nor Hody actually experienced the horrors of slavery for themselves, yet their deeply rooted hatred for humanity has caused them to commit acts that are just as, if not more heinous than their supposedly "inferior" oppressors. And sure, while it may be true that they represent the minority, one must remember that minorities tend to have the loudest-heard voices over the majority (this holds quite true in real life, with the results being good or bad depending on the minorities in question)......

I second this too. Continuing the theme of racism and complexity, there is an inspirational statement if Jinbei were to take hodi down. One fishman taking down another, solely because he stands against his racist beliefs. A statement that , no, this is not what all fishmen are about. To use a bad analogy, rather like Martin Luther King speaking out against Malcolm X's radicalism would be far more effective than a white leader criticizing it.
I don't think Luffy defeating Hodi would cause too much backlash, to be honest, other than in the vocal minorty. But Jinbei taking Luffys side, for the sake of fishmen everywhere would be a powerful image. Perhaps they'll decide to teamup, and take hodi down together ultimately?

Originally Posted by Slayerx

Really, i think this storyline would work better if Hodi was a more charismatic and good character; a hero of the people not unlike Fisher Tiger. I mean, imagine if this was Tiger trying to take over the kingdom and reform it. His words that Otihime's dream were wrong would have more weight to it; the merpeople would honestly be divided on what to do.

I totally agree. Oda's done a good job painting the issue in shades of gray; especially with Otihime's death. So it would have been nice to have at least one fishman villain who was somewhat sympathetic; more so than Hodi and Arlong. Simply deposing King Neptune, and executing all invading human pirates, for example, would actually be a fairly defensible step from a fishman perspective, and still have set up the conflict nicely.

[grey_1960]

Chapter 628
That was a good chapter. I am surprised Zoro, Brooks, and Usopp don't escape. The Poneglyphs scene was weird.

Luffy Vs. Jimbi
I am looking forward to Luffy vs. Jimbi, if it happens we will get to see more powerful moves with luffy. So far we have seen him use all three haki and combine is Devil Fruit. This should be a pretty good measure to see how strong he is. He was not able to defeat Jimbi at all two years ago. Even in Jimbi wounded state.

[Undertaker]

Quick thought on the chapter.


As I expected, the signatures became the to-kill-off list for Hody. But what I still don't quite get was how Hody turned into what he is now. I mean, he didn't seem like he was effected by Otohime's death in the flashback that much. Though with Oda specifically pointed out that Hody was the one that execute Otohime's sniper along with the hints that made me believe WG is behind this. Maybe Hody knew something that others didn't know and that knowledge drove him over the edge.....




At this point, I think Jinbe has become a bit too indecisive. (which is kind of hinted in the flashbacks compare to his pre-Sun Pirate self) On one hand, he wanted to co-exist with human, on the other hand, he is tring to prevent human (the good ones at that) from interfering with this.

While I can kind of see where he is coming from. But in this situation and at this point of time, it is not a good decision by Jinbe. The only reason he could have make that choice was as some already pointed out that on one hand Jinbe thinks that this is his fight and on the other hand, he is afraid that if Luffy get involved, it'll only resulting another rises up to become the next Hody and be even more extreme. (Tiger Fisher=>Arlong=>Hody)

The problem is that this is already beyond what Jinbe can handle by himself. Unless he is calling his former crewmates as backups, (Aladdin?) this situation seems to be over his head. I mean, Hody had to have already taking into count on any potential interferences by Jinbe. And the simple fact that Jinbe is unable to prevent this whole thing from happening in the first place shows that he has already lost control of the Fisherman in the lower district.


As for Jinbe vs. Luffy. There is two way this can end. First is obviously someone will talk some sense into them and stop the fight (Nami). the other would be Oda teasing us by have them having a quick skirmish with Jinbe realizes that, Luffy has improved to a point that he would be unable to stop Luffy from interfering which allows him to back down.


Personally, I'm more interested in the apology letter by Joy Boy. Robin mentioned that it is different from other Ponyglyphs. Maybe it's because that piece is related to the Fishermen/Mermaid during the Void Century instead of human.

I wild guess of the week is that it might hold the key as to what leads to fishmen/mermaid to live underwater at this place....

[Blackbeard D. Kuma]

Originally Posted by Undertaker

As for Jinbe vs. Luffy. There is two way this can end. First is obviously someone will talk some sense into them and stop the fight (Nami). the other would be Oda teasing us by have them having a quick skirmish with Jinbe realizes that, Luffy has improved to a point that he would be unable to stop Luffy from interfering which allows him to back down.

A 3rd possibility is that the fight will be interrupted by Decken or someone else (perhaps Caribou). Either way, the fight won't reach a conclusion. Although, as I've already stated before, I fully expect that Luffy has surpassed Ace by this point, and by extension, Land Jimbei as well.

[grey_1960]

Possible Ending
With all this battle over hating humans or liking them, and the race issue, debating with Hodi is impossible. Argument like these in fiction or real life never really die or go away as easily. The only way for Luffy to end the Race debate or their fears with humans that has affected the Fisherman people for decades it to force them up to the surface regardless if they want it or not. This way they will have to mingle with the humans. They were planning to migrate anyways so this is the best option. I can see Hodi making his argument when Luffy comes. But it will fall on deaf ears.

Hodi no longer relavent
Hodi's role in this arch is almost coming to an end. If you look at the situation now he really does not have much options or power on his side. It seems Majority of the fisherman Island have respect for the royal family. Second Shirahoshi is more powerful then Hodi or Decken. Third all luffy has to do is talk to the Royal family and convince Shirahoshi that the time has come to make changes for the good of the people. For Hodi, he has corned himself and forced a confrontation with Luffy which I don't think he can do with out interference from a powerful player. Second the presence of the Strawhats changed the battlefield big time. If the Straw Hats where not here, I believe Hodi could pull it off . Hodi does not have anymore bargaining power left. If he kills the King, Shirahoshi most likely will summon the Sea Kings in a fit of rage. He certainly is not powerful enough to face off with the Straw Hats. Zoro, Ussop, and Brooks are part of the main characters crew so I don't see them dying anytime soon. I can see in the future one of the Strawhats dying in the story by not in this arch. Looking at his options I can't really think of much he can do.

[AnbuItachi]

Looks like Zoro is still way below Mihawk's level. I believe it was stated that Mihawk can cut the elements. So if it was him, he could probably split the H2Os and make some O2! Then he wont run out of air.

[PixelCreek]

^ That'd be epic. He cuts the water and it turns to air.. hah. A bit rediculous at the same time xD

[marvelB]

Originally Posted by grey_1960

Second Shirahoshi is more powerful then Hodi or Decken.

.....Wait, what? Now, granted Shira can be considered a bigger threat than both enemy captains due to her bloodline limit unique ability, but in terms of physical power I'm more than certain that those two have her beat by a landslide. I mean honestly, which would you consider stronger: A princess who spent over half of her life imprisoned in a room, or two pirate captains who been very much active during the ten years since Otohime's death (one of them even having received military training, at that)? I think the answer should be more than clear.....


...Unless you're suggesting that Shira was secretly receiving kung fu lessons during those lonely nights in her room or something? Because there's been absolutely nothing that indicates as such (and quite frankly, such a silly idea would be teetering dangerously close towards fanfic territory....).

[grey_1960]

^
I am talking in the sense of power to communicate with Sea King that she is more powerful. Strength wise I know she could not defeat them but power wise she is strong. Under water Shirahoshi's power make her a more formidable opponent then Hodi or Decken. If she had more confidence and knowledge of her power she could have easily swept aside Hodi and Decken with out any problem. That is the main reason Hodi took the King has a hostage was to protect her from the ability. Second Hodi never took the princess Hostage because he feared the power she had. Strength wise she can't match Hodi or decken but when it comes to drugs, devil fruit , and the ability to communicate your commands to a Sea King who would think is more powerful of the three? Even now if you pitted her against Decken and Hodi she could probably win. Her power alone wether she realizes it or not would activate and they would come and protect her.

[paradox13]

[quote]but in terms of physical power I'm more than certain that those two have her beat by a landslide[/quoe]

Don't forget that Merpeople are the fastest swimmers in the sea..even catching Shirahoshi would not be an easy task.

[ellifeedn]

Remember back when it was foretold that Luffy would destroy Fishman Island? What if it was that Luffy would destroy Hody's Fishman Island?

[marvelB]

^Hmm, that's actually an interesting way to look at it. And yes, destroying Hody's ideal vision of the island would count as saving it as well, so.....

Originally Posted by paradox13

Don't forget that Merpeople are the fastest swimmers in the sea..even catching Shirahoshi would not be an easy task.

Yes, but that's where Decken's DF power comes in, naturally.



And again, I still wouldn't consider Shira to be "stronger" than Hody or Decken, just more "threatening" due to her sea king summoning power. Kinda like how the WG considers Robin to be one of the biggest threats amongst the Straw-Hats due to her ability to read poneglyphs (and potentially unearthing those ancient weapons).....