Tower of God

[Anh_Minh]

There are so many reasons why "Best Seed in the Floor of Test" isn't that relevant...

[BigNobody]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

There are so many reasons why "Best Seed in the Floor of Test" isn't that relevant...

what reasons?

[dazo]

any person from outside the tower is a irregular inside the tower, that meant that Rachel have the same potential than the other irregulars *in any case, she would be comparable with the zahard warriors/families heads*


and a irregular existence is planed for the tower..but, that this irregular also bring other with him , make the companions, more irregulars that the irregular that opened the door

We haven't seen anything that'd make her stand out, power-wise.

sui is waiting for the right moment...even hwa mention that she is a damn problem

light bearer also mean lucifer so, the firework are going to be great

And Light Bearer is just a position. Everyone above the second Floor has at least one.

the position that you receive at the start , is the position with most affinity with your capacities/style

- like , baam being a wave controller

the light bearer position is for exploration and planning (like koon), but a light bearer can also stop attack, create trap and make shield...

the light bearer position is very important and, the usually require a hight level of shinso control to move the lighthouses, making the light bearers an elite inside the tower (its probable that a light bearer have more affinity/talent with shinso than the wave controller)

-mazino can be stopped with an opera----and a irregular is much more powerful than a opera

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by dazo

any person from outside the tower is a irregular inside the tower, that meant that Rachel have the same potential than the other irregulars *in any case, she would be comparable with the zahard warriors/families heads*

Irregulars are people chosen by the Tower rather than by Haedon. As far as we know, Rachel wasn't chosen by either, she just happened get dragged along with Baam (who was chosen). All she really has is her status as Irregular, she hasn't shown any evidence of being strong.

and a irregular existence is planed for the tower..but, that this irregular also bring other with him , make the companions, more irregulars that the irregular that opened the door

sui is waiting for the right moment...even hwa mention that she is a damn problem

light bearer also mean lucifer so, the firework are going to be great

the position that you receive at the start , is the position with most affinity with your capacities/style

- like , baam being a wave controller

the light bearer position is for exploration and planning (like koon), but a light bearer can also stop attack, create trap and make shield...

Yes, I know what a Light Bearer is, I just don't see how it's important that she's one.

the light bearer position is very important and, the usually require a hight level of shinso control to move the lighthouses, making the light bearers an elite inside the tower (its probable that a light bearer have more affinity/talent with shinso than the wave controller)

Except Wave Controllers are the ones who were noted to be rare.

-mazino can be stopped with an opera----and a irregular is much more powerful than a opera

Mazino's an Irregular.

And it just goes to show that an Opera's powerful item. So what?

Originally Posted by BigNobody

what reasons?

It just means she was one of the best in the crop of Regulars who had the test at the same time and place as her. Who cares now? Being the best student in your first grade class becomes progressively more irrelevant with each passing year. It certainly doesn't, by itself, mean you'll do well in college. It's the same principle.

Besides, she was already part of the FUG conspiracy. I wouldn't put it past them to manipulate the results to get her where they wanted.

[dazo]

Irregulars are people chosen by the Tower rather than by Haedon. As far as we know, Rachel wasn't chosen by either, she just happened get dragged along with Baam (who was chosen). All she really has is her status as Irregular, she hasn't shown any evidence of being strong.

yeah well..that is enough to be called a "non chosen" a.ka. irregular

she like the 10 warrior,a person that entered the tower following the "tower irregular " and like any person from outside the tower she can manipulate shinso as "an irregular" /"just like the heads"

there is some issues, but:

and debates over just what it means to "open the door" led many to believe that either Rachel or Baam was not an Irregular. SIU finally confirmed that both were Irregulars in a live chat with fans

check the wiki

the fact the she is able to fulfill her mission without depending on her power make her a huge monster *and , yes ..she is strong but when she is going to user her power depend on siu *

Yes, I know what a Light Bearer is, I just don't see how it's important that she's one.

its important because that make rachel a master mind, capable to stop any type of attack/person *she can also use "stop"*

Except Wave Controllers are the ones who were noted to be rare.

yeah, but you can climb the tower without a wave controller, but no without a light bearer

Mazino's an Irregular.

And it just goes to show that an Opera's powerful item. So what?

so, rachel can stop mazino, that is the level of what you can expect of rachel

Who cares now? B-eing the best student in your first grade class becomes progressively more irrelevant with each passing year. It certainly doesn't, by itself, mean you'll do well in college. It's the same principle.

not applicable to the tower and irregulars

if that was the case, baam as a genius in the 2 floor should be a lame wave controller in the actual time-line

. I wouldn't put it past them to manipulate the results to get her where they wanted.

Yu Han Sung quote about lies

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by dazo

yeah well..that is enough to be called a "non chosen" a.ka. irregular

she like the 10 warrior,a person that entered the tower following the "tower irregular " and like any person from outside the tower she can manipulate shinso as "an irregular" /"just like the heads"

there is some issues, but:

and debates over just what it means to "open the door" led many to believe that either Rachel or Baam was not an Irregular. SIU finally confirmed that both were Irregulars in a live chat with fans

check the wiki

the fact the she is able to fulfill her mission without depending on her power make her a huge monster *and , yes ..she is strong but when she is going to user her power depend on siu *

That's why I said she's technically an Irregular. We don't know for sure if "Monstrous strength or potential" is a requirement for the Tower to choose you, but even if it was, she bypassed that. So we can't conclude she's super strong.

its important because that make rachel a master mind, capable to stop any type of attack/person *she can also use "stop"*

No, it makes her a Light Bearer. We've seen plenty of them who weren't that impressive.

yeah, but you can climb the tower without a wave controller, but no without a light bearer

Who are a dime a dozen.

so, rachel can stop mazino, that is the level of what you can expect of rachel

Yeah, I'm gonna call bullshit on that. Unless you believe she has an Opera? And if she does... There's a difference between the strength of the items and the strength of the wielder.

not applicable to the tower and irregulars

if that was the case, baam as a genius in the 2 floor should be a lame wave controller in the actual time-line

Except that Baam, for the whole of his career in the Tower, has been shown to be a bit of a monster. So, no, we don't really have to care that much about his being seeded on the Floor of Test. We have all the other things he's done since to say "he's strong".

Yu Han Sung quote about lies

What about it?

[dazo]

That's why I said she's technically an Irregular. We don't know for sure if "Monstrous strength or potential" is a requirement for the Tower to choose you, but even if it was, she bypassed that. So we can't conclude she's super strong.

the monstrous strength come from the fact that you are from outside the tower *along with the god-like shinso control.* , so any person from outside the tower is a damn monster inside the tower *who open the door is secondary *

and, rachel has showed her irregular aura to androssi
* androssi felt that a fight against rachel was futile ,and that rachel come from a different place *

No, it makes her a Light Bearer. We've seen plenty of them who weren't that impressive.

but she is a irregular light bearer, that mean that she is best of the best *being a irregular mean being able to use the almost god cheat code *

just like how baam is not a just a wave control, rachel is not mere light bearer, and the same concept apply to all irregular/people that come from outside the tower
* irregular break the restriction made by the guardians *


about the impressive..yes..well you see how bunny girl/baam stopped ran attack (maschenny lance)in the"hand of arlen" arc .. that is what a light bearer can do ...under the guardian control, also a light bearer can freeze(baam signature) and, can work as countermeasure to the the "freeze technique" (this is what we are going to see in the fight against aka)

Yeah, I'm gonna call bullshit on that. Unless you believe she has an Opera? And if she does... There's a difference between the strength of the items and the strength of the wielder.

the guardian rules or almost all tower weapon( Gong Bang exist outside the tower too ) cant compete with an irregular , so, she is much more stronger than a opera
*i wouldn't surprise if she obtain the opera at certain point...*

Except that Baam, for the whole of his career in the Tower, has been shown to be a bit of a monster. So, no, we don't really have to care that much about his being seeded on the Floor of Test. We have all the other things he's done since to say "he's strong".

Rachel has been shown as a monster too ...we have androssi words about rachel, traveler feelings, rachel cutting dan, and the whole speech of Hwa Ryun about rachel "possibilities" (chapter 190)

"she is a being that no even the guide can foresee. like you, a being that is most foreign to the tower. a being that can change the tower"

edit; the best seed was done with lero-ro supervision, so its legal

about Yu Han Sung quote:
"because sometimes(rumor) conceal themselves, they appear smaller than they are"
not because Rachel look weak , mean that she is weak .

ps: happy almost Christmas

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by dazo

the monstrous strength come from the fact that you are from outside the tower *along with the god-like shinso control.* , so any person from outside the tower is a damn monster inside the tower *who open the door is secondary *

We don't actually know that.

You said to check the wiki:

Most Irregulars have shown exceptional power from the moment they entered the Tower, but it is unknown whether this is a universal property of Irregulars, whether it's something they naturally have as a result of their origin or whether such power is usually just a prerequisite to forcing your way into the Tower in the first place.

Heck, we've seen Baam, and all he really has for now is potential. On an absolute scale, he's not that strong.

and, rachel has showed her irregular aura to androssi
* androssi felt that a fight against rachel was futile ,and that rachel come from a different place *

So she has an aura. That's not the same as being strong.

but she is a irregular light bearer, that mean that she is best of the best *being a irregular mean being able to use the almost god cheat code *

We don't know that. Again. And we know it's not the case for Baam.

just like how baam is not a just a wave control, rachel is not mere light bearer, and the same concept apply to all irregular/people that come from outside the tower
* irregular break the restriction made by the guardians *

As far as we know, Guardians don't restrict how strong people are.

about the impressive..yes..well you see how bunny girl/baam stopped ran attack (maschenny lance)in the"hand of arlen" arc .. that is what a light bearer can do ...under the guardian control, also a light bearer can freeze(baam signature) and, can work as countermeasure to the the "freeze technique" (this is what we are going to see in the fight against aka)

Yeah, those are common guardian techniques. So what? Remember the Light Bearers from Team Tangsooyook? Or how easily Ron Mei got owned? They look that scary to you?

Or heck, take Koon. I'm sure he's pretty good for a Light Bearer of his Floor, but remember the problems he had against Reflejo?

the guardian rules or almost all tower weapon( Gong Bang exist outside the tower too ) cant compete with an irregular , so, she is much more stronger than a opera

That's ridiculous. If an Opera can stop Mazino, and Mazino is an Irregular, then an Opera can stop an Irregular. Simple syllogism.

*i wouldn't surprise if she obtain the opera at certain point...*




Rachel has been shown as a monster too ...we have androssi words about rachel, traveler feelings,

That's just impressions. She hasn't done anything.

rachel cutting dan,

She cut someone made helpless by her team mates. That's not exactly something to be proud about.

and the whole speech of Hwa Ryun about rachel "possibilities" (chapter 190)

"she is a being that no even the guide can foresee. like you, a being that is most foreign to the tower. a being that can change the tower"

That's just her being an Irregular. Which, again, we don't know if it's synonymous with super strong.

According the wiki, there were "less famous Irregulars"... That at least means their ranks were low enough to go below some Regulars.

about Yu Han Sung quote:
"because sometimes(rumor) conceal themselves, they appear smaller than they are"
not because Rachel look weak , mean that she is weak .

Yeah, she's neither as weak nor harmless as she appeared. There's a large gap between that and "actually strong".

ps: happy almost Christmas

Merry Christmas.

[Valky]

Strong or not, she can be used to kill Zahard. Pretty sure that's what matter the most for F.U.G.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Valky

Strong or not, she can be used to kill Zahard. Pretty sure that's what matter the most for F.U.G.

You'd need to be strong to even get close. Though I suppose they could try melting her down and turning her into a weapon, like they did with Baam. (Really, if it was that easy, they wouldn't need to bother with Baam. She's cooperative, and he isn't.)

[Valky]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

You'd need to be strong to even get close. Though I suppose they could try melting her down and turning her into a weapon, like they did with Baam. (Really, if it was that easy, they wouldn't need to bother with Baam. She's cooperative, and he isn't.)

Well, the whole point is she can be used for that, either it means making her stronger or using her as weapon. F.U.G has a lot of human experiments, surely there is one way or another to make use of her.

Btw, why can't they bother with Baam too? Isn't having more weapon better?

Kinda wish she'll die in the middle of story though, she's not really 'cool' final boss material.

[itisjustme]

Using the thorn against the first stage miniboss, Baam you need to grow back your hair quick.

[Hollownerox]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Rachel's only technically an Irregular. She didn't push the Tower's doors open, Baam did. And even so, they seem to take pretty good care of her for some reason.


Are you sure about that? Regulars have problems with Shinsoo, because they're regular people. (Unless they're from noble families or something.) Irregulars are, for the most part, monsters. I assume high shinsoo resistance goes with the territory.

It's been stated that Shinsoo is the Tower's version of air, Regulars are people who have always lived inside the Tower; while Irregulars are used to air as we know it. It was said that every Irregular finds Shinsoo to be uncomfortable when they first arrived (Zahard himself claimed it felt "boggy"), with the exception being Baam who is almost completely unaffected by Shinsoo. While the other Irregulars are not negatively affected by Shinsoo, I still find it extremely odd how Baam, a person completely alien to the tower, has such a high affinity with what is the most essential component of it.

And about Rachel, that is another thing I consider strange, she doesn't appear to have any outstanding qualities, and yet FUG seems to use her as a valuable asset. This could be simply because they are using her to keep Baam under their thumb. However I remembered a segment back in the first arc, where the director was talking about how the Floor of Test was meant to weed out those who would bring harm to the tower. The exact quote was, "If someone had a problem with the Tower itself" = Anak, "Or someone with an unknown strength" = Baam, "Or someone with powers that kept growing to a size greater than their own" = The chapter depicts Arkyung, but since we now know he wasn't the real irregular, it most likely refers to Rachel. I'm not sure exactly what the line is supposed to mean, but I'm sure it was an intentional piece of foreshadowing on SIU's part.

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

You'd need to be strong to even get close. Though I suppose they could try melting her down and turning her into a weapon, like they did with Baam. (Really, if it was that easy, they wouldn't need to bother with Baam. She's cooperative, and he isn't.)

This is the thing I also found to be really weird, there seems to be a lot of infighting within FUG regarding Baam. On one hand, a bunch of Elders and the other Slayers think he's useless and would rather melt him down into a weapon for the other Slayers to use. However on the other hand the leader of FUG, Grace Mirchea Luslec, seems really intent on making Baam the Slayer to achieve their ideal. This seems to go beyond the fact that Baam is an irregular, since the guy even went so far as to give Baam his own family name (For those who don't know, Grace Mirchea Luslec was one of the people who helped Zahard climb the tower, and is the leader and #1 Slayer of FUG). And while this might be irrelevant, it seems like it can't be mere coincidence that Grace Mirchea Luslec is called the "Absolute Darkness" of the Tower, and Baam's name happens to also mean Night.

[Iron Maw]

Originally Posted by Valky

Kinda wish she'll die in the middle of story though, she's not really 'cool' final boss material.

I rather doubt she is going the final boss. Having Rachel die now doesn't really make much sense and just means the plot ends now. Remember Baam has no interest in the Tower's affairs or it's organizations. Nor is there a reason for him to care especially when they'all just using him.

[dazo]

a remote?!
hahaha siu at his best!


it has been a long road since the last time that siu pulled something like this, but his touch is still intact

although, its sad that siu don't use his troll moves with baam team

- we got a angel! *her reaction and screen-time in this chapter is gold - she look like the princess from "a fairy tale of the demon lord"*

-daniel personality and "lies" policy sound interesting

....the lack of rachel is disturbing, siu is hiding something.....

mirotic guardian is still looking to the wrong side , and cassano can kill illusion ..

---------------------
for the irregular deal:
"Characteristics of Irregulars:
Irregulars possess enormous strengths which eventually become a symbol of fear."

While the other Irregulars are not negatively affected by Shinsoo, I still find it extremely odd how Baam, a person completely alien to the tower, has such a high affinity with what is the most essential component of it.

yep, there is a chance be that baam is not a fully irregular like we think, his childhood in that cave with the "Crest of The Crimson Three Eyes"(zahard symbol) in the wall can change everything

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Hollownerox

It's been stated that Shinsoo is the Tower's version of air, Regulars are people who have always lived inside the Tower; while Irregulars are used to air as we know it. It was said that every Irregular finds Shinsoo to be uncomfortable when they first arrived (Zahard himself claimed it felt "boggy"), with the exception being Baam who is almost completely unaffected by Shinsoo. While the other Irregulars are not negatively affected by Shinsoo, I still find it extremely odd how Baam, a person completely alien to the tower, has such a high affinity with what is the most essential component of it.

So what? Enryu was also a master at using Shinsoo.

[Hollownerox]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

So what? Enryu was also a master at using Shinsoo.

Yeah, but we don't have as much info about Enryu as we do about Baam, so we don't understand his circumstances. What I'm trying to say is that from what we know about the other irregulars, Zahard and his group as well as Urek, that Shinsoo is uncomfortable since they are used to air from the outside. They can have mastery over it, but it is something they learned over time, not an inherent value.

The only irregular we know that was immediately used to Shinsoo and could control it naturally is Baam. Combined with the fact that he is virtually immune to it, has learned techniques based around it with a single glance, Headon was clearly expecting his arrival, and he was stuck in a cave with the freakin eye of Zahard plastered on the wall; it is clear that he had some relationship with the Tower even before entering it.

With that said I'm a bit curious as to how SIU is looking to develop Baam, since the new chapter came out I went to take a look at the blog posts and this one in particular caught my eye.

Spoiler for SIU blog:

"About Baam’s change… I absolutely can not draw a main character who is completely nice/strong/moral. I think such characters kill the story. In a good story, a helper will show correct path when someone goes astray and temptations will try to stop that person from going the right way. Since this particular main character was about innocence, there is a chance of going corrupt."

SIU has always stated that the story was not about Baam, always saying that the story was about a variety of characters and that Baam was "the eye of the storm". And with this comment it makes me wonder whether or SIU is actually going to make this a protagonist's journey to villain or something. The FUG arc definitely had some foreshadowing in that regard, and numerous characters have talked about how Baam isn't completely right in the head. While I'm not really sure if that's a good direction to take the story, it would certainly be an interesting one.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Hollownerox

Yeah, but we don't have as much info about Enryu as we do about Baam, so we don't understand his circumstances. What I'm trying to say is that from what we know about the other irregulars, Zahard and his group as well as Urek, that Shinsoo is uncomfortable since they are used to air from the outside. They can have mastery over it, but it is something they learned over time, not an inherent value.

The only irregular we know that was immediately used to Shinsoo and could control it naturally is Baam. Combined with the fact that he is virtually immune to it, has learned techniques based around it with a single glance, Headon was clearly expecting his arrival, and he was stuck in a cave with the freakin eye of Zahard plastered on the wall; it is clear that he had some relationship with the Tower even before entering it.

As far as we know, everyone finds high concentrations of Shinsoo unpleasant to some degree. And that concentrations at the top are nothing like what you get at the bottom.

Are Irregulars more bothered than Regulars? It's unknown, but consider this: it's impossible to be "strong" without high Shinsoo resistance. Because at the higher levels of the Tower, you can't even move without that. That trick Lero Ro used to repel lots of Regulars? It wouldn't have phased a High Ranker... which describes every named Irregular except Baam and Rachel.

[Valky]

That was a bit lame.

[tsunade666]

Miss Hwa Ryun! She called Rachel a B*tch which is true! No one messes with her god.

Rachel also shows up -_-

Ran really needs to cool down.