(CR) Sousou no Frieren (Frieren: Beyond Journey's End)

[mangamuscle]

Originally Posted by GDB

That can be how one describes sociopaths too, but no one would hesitate to call them evil if they did the same things.

By definition I would say this demons are psycopaths:

psychopathy is characterised by an extreme lack of empathy. Psychopaths may also be manipulative, charming and exploitative, and behave in an impulsive and risky manner. They may lack conscience or guilt, and refuse to accept responsibility for their actions.

That plus their instinctive feeding habits makes them hardwired to be humanities natural foes imo.They might not seem evil because they do not rejoice in their actions (like your average demon or 2D villian), to them humans are simply talking livestock.

[Dark Wing]

Originally Posted by grecefar

this should be a good experience for stark and fern, and the people of the town. They are lucky that one demon messed up and frieren will act.

Yea and it's been nearly a hundred since the humans here had to deal with demons. So it's naturally that many have forgotten about their tricks. Frieren an elf who is by her nature is cold and emotionally distant can't fall for these trick because of her own lack of empathy.

All she had to do was wait for them to blow their cover to make it easier to avoid the unnecessary problems it will cause with the city officials.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Shadow5YA

Her moniker is something lost in translation, as it's supposed to be the title drop and have multiple meanings.

The original title and her moniker is Sousou no Frieren 葬送のフリーレン, with sousou meaning "attending a funeral".
The word leaves room for the interpretation that she's someone who outlives others because of her natural lifespan while also leaving the possibility that she is the gravedigger.

There's just no way to translate it in English without losing the nuance of one or the other.
Case in point: "Beyond Journey's End" captures her story after Himmel's death well, but now the nuance of her being a killer is lost. Conversely, "Slayer" would only describe her as a cold-blooded killer but it doesn't describe the story of how Frieren has to outlive everyone she will ever know.

I didn't know about that. Really interesting.

I'm thinking this story will most likely end with Fern dying of old age, and Frieren not having regrets this time because she always stayed by her side and went out of her way to get to know her.

On a different note, I'd say Himmel is partly to blame for Elves going extinct. He could have had tons of babies with Frieren if he had just confessed. Of course, there's no way to know how Frieren would have reacted, but in retrospect it's clear she did like him. We'll never know what could have been.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Kanon

I didn't know about that. Really interesting.

I'm thinking this story will most likely end with Fern dying of old age, and Frieren not having regrets this time because she always stayed by her side and went out of her way to get to know her.

On a different note, I'd say Himmel is partly to blame for Elves going extinct. He could have had tons of babies with Frieren if he had just confessed. Of course, there's no way to know how Frieren would have reacted, but in retrospect it's clear she did like him. We'll never know what could have been.

We don't know if elves can have babies with humans. Or if Frieren is even old enough...

Originally Posted by Dark Wing

This is has to be the most fascinating representation of demons in fiction I've seen in awhile. That they were monsters who've evolved over time to look and behave like humans but never able to pull it off so they come off as cold and emotionless or outright gleefully sadistic.

Some are better at it than others. The young girl who deceived Himmel was, well, young. The peace envoy was much better.

[TheForsaken]

Originally Posted by Kanon

He could have had tons of babies with Frieren if he had just confessed. Of course, there's no way to know how Frieren would have reacted, but in retrospect it's clear she did like him.

"Let me think about it for a couple of decades then I'll give you my answer."

[Frontier]

I mean, the way she describes Elves they sound practically asexual and aromantic. Even if he'd confessed it might not have done any good at the time .

Does make you wonder what makes them settle down and have kids though...

[Dark Wing]

Originally Posted by Frontier

I mean, the way she describes Elves they sound practically asexual and aromantic. Even if he'd confessed it might not have done any good at the time .

Does make you wonder what makes them settle down and have kids though...

They seem to be the pandas of the fantasy world...

Seriously though it could also be that Elves here don't have the desire to reproduce until they reach certain stage in life. For all we know Freiren could just be elf version of a young adult and isn't ready to start a family. That would require her to settle down in one place what maybe a few centuries or however long it takes for Elves to reach the point of independence.

[Guardian Enzo]

There must be some of them with some interest in it or they'd already be extinct.

[Frontier]

Originally Posted by Dark Wing

They seem to be the pandas of the fantasy world...

Seriously though it could also be that Elves here don't have the desire to reproduce until they reach certain stage in life. For all we know Freiren could just be elf version of a young adult and isn't ready to start a family. That would require her to settle down in one place what maybe a few centuries or however long it takes for Elves to reach the point of independence.

Originally Posted by Guardian Enzo

There must be some of them with some interest in it or they'd already be extinct.

The way Frieren flashed to a home with a swing set on fire when she was talking about it makes me think she did at least have a family she grew up with before something happened and she ended up with Flamme.

[Nachtwandler]

Originally Posted by Frontier

I mean, the way she describes Elves they sound practically asexual and aromantic. Even if he'd confessed it might not have done any good at the time .

Does make you wonder what makes them settle down and have kids though...

I liked how Tolkien resolved it: Tolkien elves were actually very sexually active, but were losing their sex drive after having kids (the actual number varied from one elf to another).

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Frontier

I mean, the way she describes Elves they sound practically asexual and aromantic. Even if he'd confessed it might not have done any good at the time .

Does make you wonder what makes them settle down and have kids though...

She might have accepted to spend the rest of his life with him. It's just a few decades, and he's not boring.

[ramlaen]

I think the best word to describe the demons is "predatory". Their completely foreign culture and morals (lack of) aren't what prevents them from having a peaceful relationship but rather it is their overt desire to prey on humans that does it.

[Decel]

That last sentence of the episode! It was a great buildup! Can't wait for the next episode.

I guess this episode was supposed to convey something like "those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it?"

The setting seems a bit awkward though: Aura was reawakened for over 20 years and they have been fighting no? During all this time the demons haven't tried this tactic? My only reasoning is that Aura is the play-maker.

Kinda weird that humans learned and reversed-engineered magic so adeptly but seemingly didn't do so about demon psychology/behaviour.

Also my take from the early discussion is that Flamme is the one who taught humans magic? No wonder everyone is hustling fake grimoires of her...

[magnuskn]

I mean, what exactly are humans to do about demon behaviour? Put them into concentration camps and re-educate them?

The show makes a point about how people in that medieval-like world forget things after a generation has passed and while magic seemingly has progressed a lot in 80 years (by explicit effort from Frieren), demons seemingly don't attack frequently enough that "don't talk with demons, they lie about everything to get to eat you" has manifested enough in humanities conciousness to stick against the emotional manipulation tactics.

[Ragashingo]

I wonder if there's something to Aura regaining her power 28 years ago... and it being 28 years since the death of Himmel the Hero? Did this Aura go into hiding and wait out Himmel's death?

[TURI123456]

Originally Posted by TheForsaken

"Let me think about it for a couple of decades then I'll give you my answer."

Originally Posted by Kanon

I didn't know about that. Really interesting.

I'm thinking this story will most likely end with Fern dying of old age, and Frieren not having regrets this time because she always stayed by her side and went out of her way to get to know her.

On a different note, I'd say Himmel is partly to blame for Elves going extinct. He could have had tons of babies with Frieren if he had just confessed. Of course, there's no way to know how Frieren would have reacted, but in retrospect it's clear she did like him. We'll never know what could have been.

My interpretation of things may be wrong but hasn't he given Frieren a ring?

[Alchemist007]

Frieren chose to let Himmel learn through example, and later stated the fact that demons are known to use "mother" and "help" calls to trick humans, unfortunately this example cost a girl her father.

The demons seem like a virus with intelligence and patience. They want their victims but are willing to wait for at least some period of time.

[Decel]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

I mean, what exactly are humans to do about demon behaviour? Put them into concentration camps and re-educate them?

The show makes a point about how people in that medieval-like world forget things after a generation has passed and while magic seemingly has progressed a lot in 80 years (by explicit effort from Frieren), demons seemingly don't attack frequently enough that "don't talk with demons, they lie about everything to get to eat you" has manifested enough in humanities conciousness to stick against the emotional manipulation tactics.

Learn from it. The same way we learn about animal behaviour. I don't see how that relates to re-educating them, as the episode clearly showed.

Also, we must have gotten different impression from ep3, since from my point of view it was humans that made 80 years of effort learn killing magic and evolve magic.

Also, I'm not sure about demons not attacking frequently, since the show mentioned since the march up north that the region is in conflict with the remainder of the Demon Lord.

I wonder if Aura is the lone survivor, though I assume not. How many of the Lords' generals did they kill in the first walkthrough?

[Guido]

So, I got my hunch right that both the master and the student shared similar traits.

Eisen and Stark just needed a little push to snap out of fear in order to accomplish what was needed to be done.

But, even Eisen could tell his student had achieved such monstrous potential that the former did not want to continue to train Stark so that explains why he unconsciously hit the lad.

I guess Stark lacking resolve for the time being prevented him from getting a grasp of the strength he obtained, until Frieren told him that it was all over with the dragon getting killed by his own doing without needing for her to deal the finishing blow.

Originally Posted by FlareKnight

That was great .

Love Frieren's hopes of sitting down and doing some research were instantly dashed. And dashed due to the level of her fame . Perfection! Too bad for her, but good for everyone else. She has almost eternity, but everyone else has a slightly more limited lifespan here. I do think she's slipped a bit in terms of remembering how precious time is for everyone. And apparently she's forgotten how scary Fern can be when she's annoyed.

For a minute I half expected Stark to say he was dying or sick. But I guess it would be about his mentor. The guy may be a dwarf, but he's not going to live forever. And if he's already too old to travel then he may not have forever.

Good job by Stark overall in this episode. He handled that dragon with class and I love how he didn't even need support. He's absolutely powerful, but just needed to stand up and face his opponent. In the end the people were right. The dragon did avoid the village because he was there. Just because he was afraid doesn't mean the dragon could ignore how strong Stark is.

Also...ouch. Not only was he on the other side of the x-ray vision spell, but Fern wasn't impressed...

I think Frieren expected to make the most out of the time she was to wait for the following couple of years to invest in her magic research but getting her hopes dashed once her identity became public delivered to the audience one amongst many of her best expressions. I guess you could say she reacting for a second time to the fanfare parting with the most sour expression played for an unintended but serious joke.

[magnuskn]

Originally Posted by Decel

Learn from it. The same way we learn about animal behaviour. I don't see how that relates to re-educating them, as the episode clearly showed.

Also, we must have gotten different impression from ep3, since from my point of view it was humans that made 80 years of effort learn killing magic and evolve magic.

Also, I'm not sure about demons not attacking frequently, since the show mentioned since the march up north that the region is in conflict with the remainder of the Demon Lord.

I wonder if Aura is the lone survivor, though I assume not. How many of the Lords' generals did they kill in the first walkthrough?

I'm pretty sure that Frieren had a lot to do with the magical upgrades general magic users got, simply from the fact that, at large, the show has made several points about how knowledge gets lost very easily if nobody keeps it alive with an effort.

And if demons were attacking so frequently, it would make little sense that people would still get taken in by their deceitful attitudes, given how inevitably tragedy follows treating with demons.