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View Poll Results: Gurren-Lagann - Episode 27 (END) Rating
Perfect 10 340 65.01%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 97 18.55%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 35 6.69%
7 out of 10 : Good 18 3.44%
6 out of 10 : Average 8 1.53%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 0.38%
4 out of 10 : Poor 3 0.57%
3 out of 10 : Bad 2 0.38%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 1 0.19%
1 out of 10 : Painful 17 3.25%
Voters: 523. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2007-10-26, 08:36   Link #621
s[H]sIkuA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaziek View Post
Completely agree with that list. Gurren Lagann does epic speeches, sacrifices and coming back from the brink of destruction PERFECTLY. The first time simon does his speech and then the giga drill breaker on his own, against guame. That was EPIC. I dont think anyone can say they werent screaming YEAAAAAAAAAHH!!! At their screen when they watched that for the first time.. Hell i've watched it 4 times and I still do.
Thats what great about GL, everytime they are in situation where its "LOOK" like almost impossible to handle/ escape from , they did it. And the spirit that each of the character shown (I can't even remember how many times I saw that in GL anymore) its simply epic.

Like the ocean in universe part, I still cry even its the second time I watch it. Libera Me from Hell + King Kittan And when they comes out of it with the "TENGEN TOPPA GURREN LAGANN!" phrase, I was like OMGWTFBBQ this is simply AMAZING
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Old 2007-10-27, 14:29   Link #622
shaolinx
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totally great... Gainax ruined a perfectly good / rewatchble series for me. sad endings make rewatching a series very painful. woulda been happier killing off simon and nia at the same time...

NOOOOOOOO NIAA!!!!!!!!!
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Old 2007-10-30, 19:56   Link #623
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dudeeeeeeeeeee

any one saw the intro for gurren lagann ds there 2 new charater a cat girl and some other guy and the gurren lagann combines with another meck need more info here the lint to the video






http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKlRiz5SV88
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Old 2007-10-30, 20:43   Link #624
shaolinx
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Originally Posted by chechiarts View Post
any one saw the intro for gurren lagann ds there 2 new charater a cat girl and some other guy and the gurren lagann combines with another meck need more info here the lint to the video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKlRiz5SV88
whose that >.>!
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Old 2007-10-31, 18:32   Link #625
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yeaaaaa

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Originally Posted by shaolinx View Post
whose that >.>!



have no fucking idea but here the ling for other people to see tell me ho are this two new people

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKlRiz5SV88
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Old 2007-11-01, 15:23   Link #626
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questions and thoughts

Though the Simon at the end does look a lot like Kamina's dad, that seems a little unrealistic, not that this show is realistic. I just don't think there is the evidence to prove it, besides..they don't even look the same, simon has no jewelry or tatoos. So are people saying that his dying wish was to go back in time and save earth again? its not like he saved his son. If he really did go back, how did he die in the future, maybe i just dont understand how fantasy time travel works...

I have yet to see the claim that nakim is kamina and yoko's son? there is evidence to back that up. It also seems likely that it is Nakim at the beginning of ep. 1. Boota is older, and it never shows the man holding the drill's face. Can't be Simon, thats for sure.

Last edited by Rease; 2007-11-01 at 15:27. Reason: fix
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Old 2007-11-01, 19:06   Link #627
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Originally Posted by shaolinx View Post
totally great... Gainax ruined a perfectly good / rewatchble series for me. sad endings make rewatching a series very painful. woulda been happier killing off simon and nia at the same time...

NOOOOOOOO NIAA!!!!!!!!!
Gotta agree with that. Now he lives the rest of his life lonely.


Gotta say though the saddest thing is it is over. Was definantly a diamond in a coal pit, this show.
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Last edited by Messerschmitt_Bf-109; 2007-11-01 at 20:31.
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Old 2007-11-02, 15:56   Link #628
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welll

looks like the ds game will bring a especial episde og gurren lagan a never before seen episode i can wait
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Old 2007-11-03, 22:28   Link #629
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I loved how every moment of GL just made you want more, and made your adrenaline pump. I have to admit that I was skeptical about seeing it at first because mecha anime's have never been my thing, but I am glad that I did. Gurren Lagann is one of the best series I have ever seen.

I've seen many complain about the ending, but I don't hate it at all. I liked the ending and felt that there was enough closure there to make it happy as well as bitter sweet. Gainax really impressed me.
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Old 2007-11-09, 18:12   Link #630
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omg

i never saw this in the anime omg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phoazKc2v4c
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Old 2007-11-11, 04:32   Link #631
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This anime didn't make much logical sense... But I try not to think about it. It's still soooooooooo awesome. I don't know... It makes you feel good.
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Old 2007-11-12, 17:23   Link #632
s[H]sIkuA
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Originally Posted by kimchipride View Post
This anime didn't make much logical sense... But I try not to think about it. It's still soooooooooo awesome. I don't know... It makes you feel good.
Heh logical? Anything made in movie no matter is anime or real person acted movie doesn't have logic at all. If we have, there wouldnt be Matrix or LOTR

My advice is just forget about everything and enjoy the show as much as possible. It feels so great after finishing GL seriously. The impact it made to me is even greater than Eva.
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Old 2007-11-13, 23:10   Link #633
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First, I found something interesting while browsing the web that I'd like to share with everyone. The post itself expresses some skepticism regarding the original source of this info, so take this with a grain of salt or read the whole original post (in Japanese, linked from the page I'm linking) on your own. Link: http://giapet.net/?m=20071005

Quote:
There was a recent interview with Hiroyuki Yamaga and Yukari Fukui* about GL’s finale and the future of the show in a weekly manga-zine released yesterday. They mostly said not so important stuff about what they believed but there were a few fragments of interesting information revealed here and there.

* Nakajima wrote a major number of side-stories about the characters and gave them to the production staff and the VAs, this would help for a better background of the GL world.
* Yamaga doesn’t really wants to make a sequel to GL… he would prefer to expand into animation the character side stories wrote by Nakajima.
* Simon isn’t virgin… however they had a different idea of how would he lose his virginity during concept stages. He was supposed to lose his virginity to a beastwoman in episode 6, he would get traumatized after discovering she wasn’t a human. In the final canon version he just had a somewhat cute but akward first time with Nia.
* The spin-offs they want to do the most would be either about Nia, as Fukui really loved the character and would like to act in a number of her side stories, or about Viral being a guerrilla freedom warrior during the 7 year timeskip.

(*Note: Yukari Fukui, Nia’s seiyuu, WAS interviewed in the magazine. However, Yamaga’s name isn’t listed in Otona Anime’s lengthy content post.)
One interesting thing is that if this source is to be believed, what you hint at "is to come" in this post...

Quote:
Originally Posted by musashiken View Post
Well, it's hard to imagine what happened during those 7 seven years. People from different backgrounds have different perceptions on how they view relationships. I mean I can say that they kept a very pure relationship throughout those 7 years. At least a wedding signifies and confirms of what is to come.
...should be "what has already come".

Anyways, I must say that there have been very few animes that I've enjoyed as much as this one. While nothing can be perfect, this one approached that level in my mind, which is why I'll rate the series as 10/10.

As for my opinion regarding the ending, I could go on for ages but I'm sure I'd just bore everyone so I'll keep it as brief as I can and focus on what seems to be points of controversy and disagreement. I apologize if this ends up being a bit disorganized, as I only finished the series yesterday evening and I'm still sorting out my thoughts in my head.

As for the Boota/humanoid reversion: Honestly, I think it would have been hilarious for Boota to remain humanoid and, once everyone reassembled, to suddenly appear sitting on a very shocked Viral's lap.

There's obviously no definitive reason for Boota not remaining humanoid as we can draw from the series, though one can form many hypothesis. The hypotheses involving Super Spiral Space returning "true forms" and his spiral energy returning to Lord Genome have already been mentioned, but here's another to ponder: Boota, even in non-humanoid form, displayed traits of intelligent behavior (tearing off part of himself to feed Simon & Kamina, using spiral energy to power GL, etc). What if the act of him evolving was already in an alternate reality? Then, when it appeared that he became trapped in an alternate reality after evolving, that was simply an alternate reality within an alternate reality? There's nothing to prove this, but it is certainly a possibility for those of us that like to completely over-analyze everything.

Most likely, the reason he reverted is because the final image of Simon plus his furry companion wouldn't really work if Boota remained humanoid.

As for Nia dying/fading: I really enjoyed this character, and was very sad to see her go. Would I have liked to see her and Simon live happily, have some kids, and grow old together? Hell yes! However, I accept that Gainax decided for her to die, even though I admit there was manly tear welling during the conclusion of this episode. Personally, I think that I came to like Nia more due to the way she is portrayed in Ep 27; her actions and mindset just seemed perfect for her character. (I'd actually be willing to bet that her popularity increased after her death in the final episode.)

People are asking for a definitive reason for why she had to die. I don't think there can be a definitive reason for why anyone must die other than the fact that they are mortal. I don't mean for this to justify her death at this particular time point, as there are many, many ways Gainax could have created a plot where she lived longer, just as they could have created many ways where she died earlier. My point is in works of fiction such as this, you aren't ever going to find a definitive reason for why someone does or doesn't die at a given time and that looking for one is futile. Because of this, I'm not going to argue why she did or didn't have to die. Gainax provided an explanation in the context of the show, which is most likely the best "justification" you're going to get.

Honestly though, there are definitely "happy" traits to her end. Consider this: even fictional couples that "live happily ever after" eventually die; their happiness is not eternal, as it is limited by the inevitability of death. What is more important, than, is what you do in the time you have and how you make the most out of it.

Simon and Nia had 7 years together, which is more than many couples get. Nia had the love of a man who crossed "impossible" odds and broke space-time to save her and return her to her normal self (in the sense of her personality, not the sense of her physical body necessarily, as it was clearly of AS substance at the end). Just like Lord Genome, Nia was able "to create a tomorrow for the Spirals," so I'm sure she was satisfied in the sense of completing her "quest," per say. The AS universe disappeared immediately following the AS's demise, yet Nia managed to sustain herself through pure force of will until her wedding day, a day you often hear described by others as "the happiest day of my life". Personally, I think the point is that Nia "broke the impossible and kicked reason to the curb" in managing to sustain herself that long and to marry Simon. There is no way to know what Simon did or didn't try to do to save her after the battle since it is not shown, but what is apparent is that he made the most of the time he had left with Nia in order to assure her happiness, which really is more important than assuring she somehow live longer. Although both Simon and Nia knew that her time was short, neither of them had any tears in their eyes and both had smiles as they were married, and even as she faded to nothing; clearly they had no regrets. She is surrounded by all of her best friends and the last words she hears are, "I love you." I can think of many, many worse ways to die.

Of course it's sad that Nia didn't live longer, but the deaths of loved ones will always have elements of sadness whether they occur tomorrow or 50 years from now. It's the life up until that death that matters. As a fan, you can choose to either be happy for what Simon and Nia had, be sad at what they didn't, or accept both: a bittersweet emotion indeed.

I think my biggest disappointment is not that Nia died, but that they never had the chance to raise children. Still, one could say that all the children of the universe are "their" children, since they helped create a future for them. Ah well.

Regarding epilogue stuffs: I thought this was rather well done and helped create even more closure.

A lot of people say that Leeron hasn't aged, but at least to me it looked like he had, though it wasn't as apparent as with other people. The fact Yoko didn't get to have a sustained love relationship is sad, but she obviously loves the children she teaches and is enjoying helping to raise the next generation. I was happy with Gimmy and Darry being together and the new pilots of GL. The scene with the graves/memorials for Kamina, Nia, and the others was very moving too.

As for Simon being a "sad, lonely hobo"... are you sure you guys watched the same show as I did? Yes, as a wanderer his clothes are tattered and aren't flashy, but if you judge your heroes at just clothing-depth...

Not once is he shown with a frown on his face following the defeat of AS. Of course he's probably saddened by Nia's death, but he even has a smile on his face as he explains that "if we revive them [dead people] unwillingly, they'll just get in the way of our followers." It seems to me that since Nia had accepted her fate, if Simon had not honored that wish and instead spent the last of her moments trying to "fix" her, he would have been effectively trying to unwillingly revive the dead. Instead, he is content with what he and Nia had and is happy that they dug a path for future generations to follow.

With this mindset, the "benevolent wanderer" fits perfectly. Simon never desired the spotlight or a grand leader role, but he accepted it in order to create a new future. With that objective complete, he passes this role to the future generation and returns to his "normal" self, a person that helps create new paths for people without huge flair and recognition. Though his only consistent companion is Boota, each individual he helps is another person whose company and thanks I'm sure he enjoys. He knows that all his friends of the Gurren Brigade love him and would accept him back at a moments notice, and he carries the memories of his dead companions in his heart. I'd hardly define this as "lonely".

As for the "no, I guess I'm nobody" comment, I doubt Simon actually feels that he is a nobody and that his actions carry no weight, especially since he is smiling and chuckling a bit as he says it. Rather, I think it's a statement that his name and notoriety are inconsequential when compared to the actual product of his labors, which is readily apparent all around him in the universe he helped create for everyone. Also, the kid he's talking to wasn't even alive during Simon's struggle, so that past is meaningless to the kid compared to the future that Simon is encouraging him toward. Additionally, his comment regarding "all the lights in the sky being stars where our spiral friends await" has definite optimism to it.

Simon does not seem like a broken man to me, but a man content with what he has done and the work he continues to do, while watching over his friends in case they should need him again.

------

Wow, that ended up being a lot longer than I intended, so I apologize for the novel I just wrote. Suffice to say I greatly enjoyed this show, plan on buying the DVDs, and look forward to any potential future installments of this series (as long as they don't screw it up )
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Old 2007-11-13, 23:52   Link #634
s[H]sIkuA
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Wow good job explaining , very interesting indeed.

And the way you describe it sounds like you are in the team that make TTGL j/k

I expect GAINAX to come out with some side story / OVA though. Its hard to make a sequel at this point as the story really summed itself perfectly.

I am actually quite glad they are "planning" to do some Nia side stories but I would've happier if they elaborate on Lord Genome past though, together with the previous Spiral Battle. Helix King rocks
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Old 2007-11-14, 00:30   Link #635
Rehwyn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chechiarts View Post
have no fucking idea but here the ling for other people to see tell me ho are this two new people

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKlRiz5SV88
Quote:
Originally Posted by chechiarts View Post
i never saw this in the anime omg http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phoazKc2v4c
Both of these are from the Gurren Lagann OVA that came with the DS game, situated between episodes 5 and 6. It's been fansubbed already, so I'm sure if you poke around on the internet (such as doing a search on www.btjunkie.com) you'll be able to find it. Sadly, it's only 12 minutes long. ><;;

Quote:
Originally Posted by s[H]sIkuA View Post
Wow good job explaining , very interesting indeed.

And the way you describe it sounds like you are in the team that make TTGL j/k
Haha, thanks! I try to be thorough when I explain my opinions. XD

Quote:
I expect GAINAX to come out with some side story / OVA though. Its hard to make a sequel at this point as the story really summed itself perfectly.

I am actually quite glad they are "planning" to do some Nia side stories but I would've happier if they elaborate on Lord Genome past though, together with the previous Spiral Battle. Helix King rocks
Like I said, the blog I got that from was a bit skeptical on how much of that info can be trusted. Still, I'd be surprised if Gainax doesn't do something with GL after its rousing success.

As much as I like Nia, I too think it'd be hard to do a side-story entirely devoted to her. Maybe an OVA or two, kinda like the OVA devoted to Tessa from Full Metal Panic. Anything longer than that would need a driving force, such as Viral's guerrilla fighting, or the Helix King backstory, both of which I think they could do and would work if done properly. She could definitely play roles in side stories not entirely devoted to her as well.

I guess we'll just have to wait.

Last edited by Rehwyn; 2007-11-14 at 00:40. Reason: Added content
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Old 2007-11-23, 16:36   Link #636
Ermes Marana
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TTGL is a fantastic series, but the ending is weak.


Nia disappearing just because the AS was defeated?

This contradicts several things.

First, we were told earlier that Nia was the messenger by random chance, and even the AS said it was ironic that the daughter of a Spiral Knight would turn out to be a messenger. Nia was created by the Helix King, not the AS. Having her suddenly, in the LAST EPISODE, get rewritten to be an illusion created by the AS makes no sense, and goes against everything up to that point. Besides, even if by chance she got a certain combination of genes that made her a messenger, how does that imply she would disappear?

There was absolutely no weight or reality to Nia having to disappear, which made it feel like it was randomly tacked on to make the ending tragic.

Also, they totally ignored the fact that Simon had guaranteed not only Nia would live, but would in fact get her original body back. And that she said it was possible. Going by the last episode, it was never possible and looking back that earlier scene doesn't make sense.


That isn't the only thing that feels off about the finale though.

Also wrong is how Simon responds to the suggestion of bringing Nia back. Given that Nia didn't "die", but rather disappeared, he could easily justify bringing her back. Sure, bringing back all the dead would be troublesome, but bringing back a single girl who disappeared would have no ill effects. His argument is unconvincing and out of character, especially given that he already made the promise (conveniently ignored in the last episode).

For that matter, he could have given her a new body BEFORE she disappeared. Helix King gave Viral a new body.

Here is a guy who just promised the girl he loved she would live, and just shouted that he would reach for the tomorrow of his choosing, and all of a sudden he breaks his promise and gives up on his tomorrow because he thinks Nia would "get in the way" of the younger generation? One of the worst out of character moments I have seen.


Also, having Simon say "even if the universe gets destroyed" felt really off. Just moments before he was shouting how he wouldn't let that happen, but at the end apparently he has lost all his confidence and fighting spirit. How does that go along with the theme of the show?


Giving the drill to Gimmy in front of everyone at the wedding was off, they had not built up a relationship important enough for him to do that. Little thing, but it bugs me.


And then the epilogue was horrible. Just in case anyone tried to imagine a happier ending, they have to crush all possibility and make Simon a solitary hobo who never sees his friends again.

A quiet, lonely hobo wandering around saying he is "nobody" is not going to inspire people. That isn't the way Simon himself was inspired and changed. Quite the opposite. It completely goes against the whole show to have Simon apparently trying to "help" people that way, when such an approach was the wrong approach throughout the entire show. But I guess there is nothing else in the universe Simon wants, so he had nothing to reach for anymore. What an unnecessarily sad ending.


Like I said though, fantastic show. Just, like many animes, has a horrible ending that kinds of spoils it some, especially for rewatching.
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Old 2007-11-23, 18:06   Link #637
tabun
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As for rewatching Gurren-Lagann, I strongly recommend only watching episodes 1-15. Episode 15 was a better ending to the show than any later episode could ever have been. It emanates hope and a sense of completion. Only one "heroic death" down the line (although it is Kamina-sama none the less!), but so much left for imagining!

I just did exactly that. After pondering to view episode 16 after that, I decided not to. Listen to the soundtrack instead! It is quite good!
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Old 2007-11-23, 20:19   Link #638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ermes Marana View Post
TTGL is a fantastic series, but the ending is weak.


Nia disappearing just because the AS was defeated?

This contradicts several things.

First, we were told earlier that Nia was the messenger by random chance, and even the AS said it was ironic that the daughter of a Spiral Knight would turn out to be a messenger. Nia was created by the Helix King, not the AS. Having her suddenly, in the LAST EPISODE, get rewritten to be an illusion created by the AS makes no sense, and goes against everything up to that point. Besides, even if by chance she got a certain combination of genes that made her a messenger, how does that imply she would disappear?

There was absolutely no weight or reality to Nia having to disappear, which made it feel like it was randomly tacked on to make the ending tragic.

Also, they totally ignored the fact that Simon had guaranteed not only Nia would live, but would in fact get her original body back. And that she said it was possible. Going by the last episode, it was never possible and looking back that earlier scene doesn't make sense.


That isn't the only thing that feels off about the finale though.

Also wrong is how Simon responds to the suggestion of bringing Nia back. Given that Nia didn't "die", but rather disappeared, he could easily justify bringing her back. Sure, bringing back all the dead would be troublesome, but bringing back a single girl who disappeared would have no ill effects. His argument is unconvincing and out of character, especially given that he already made the promise (conveniently ignored in the last episode).

For that matter, he could have given her a new body BEFORE she disappeared. Helix King gave Viral a new body.

Here is a guy who just promised the girl he loved she would live, and just shouted that he would reach for the tomorrow of his choosing, and all of a sudden he breaks his promise and gives up on his tomorrow because he thinks Nia would "get in the way" of the younger generation? One of the worst out of character moments I have seen.


Also, having Simon say "even if the universe gets destroyed" felt really off. Just moments before he was shouting how he wouldn't let that happen, but at the end apparently he has lost all his confidence and fighting spirit. How does that go along with the theme of the show?


Giving the drill to Gimmy in front of everyone at the wedding was off, they had not built up a relationship important enough for him to do that. Little thing, but it bugs me.


And then the epilogue was horrible. Just in case anyone tried to imagine a happier ending, they have to crush all possibility and make Simon a solitary hobo who never sees his friends again.

A quiet, lonely hobo wandering around saying he is "nobody" is not going to inspire people. That isn't the way Simon himself was inspired and changed. Quite the opposite. It completely goes against the whole show to have Simon apparently trying to "help" people that way, when such an approach was the wrong approach throughout the entire show. But I guess there is nothing else in the universe Simon wants, so he had nothing to reach for anymore. What an unnecessarily sad ending.


Like I said though, fantastic show. Just, like many animes, has a horrible ending that kinds of spoils it some, especially for rewatching.

HOLY S***! There's so much wrong in you post that it isn't even funny.

Yes,Nia was Lordgenome's daughter and untill her Ant-Spiral programming kicked in her body was still human but after that point (ep 18) her body was transformed into that resembling a Mugan (that's why she could warp and her body basically became a bomb [Lordgenome mentions that in ep 22 inside the moon]). And lookie here...Why created the Mugans? That's right! The Anti-Spiral! And what happened to everything they have created after their defeat? That's right. It dissolved along with them.


So your argument about Nia's death being tacked on flies straight through the window. Thank you, don't come back.


Also she never said it was possible to regain her human body. She said that the chance of it happening was close to 0%. It was Simon who said it was just as good as 100% for him. He was wrong. In the end he's no God.

Ok, next point:
She DIED. The one sustaining her body was no more. It was truly a miracle she was able to hold it together to her wedding day. Also, as stated earlier, Simon's no God. He has no right to decides who dies and who is worthy of ressurection. Also it hold true to the promise he gave the Anti-Spiral. "Then... Make sure... To protect the Universe..." "Of course. Human's aren't that foolish". Using spiral power to revive the dead is missuning that power. Of course he could've used his power to revive but they both agreed not to do so. Why? Using the spiral power in such a way would inevitably lead to the Spiral Nemesis. And what were the Anti-Spirals fearing the most? What made them kill and seal off their own bretheren at the far edges of the galaxy? That's right - Spiral Nemesis.


I'd be pretty dishartened too if I knew my wife would dissapear forever in a matter of seconds. Besides it was his own way of saying "I'll remember you for all eternity".


How was giving Gimmy the Core Drill off? Simon had fullfilled his mission, he had no more need of the Core Drill so he passed it on. Gimmy in many ways was simmilar to Simon. Gimmy had spirit, was ready to fight for his comrades and undoubtebly he will make a fine pilot. That is why Simon entrusted the Core Drill to him. Besides who would you have given the Core Drill? Rossiu? He's the politic; his mission is to ensure the well being of ALL the Spirals. Viral? He's a bestmen, he cannot utilise it. Yoko? She chose the path of the teacher; passing down the story of the Dai-Gurren Dan to the young generation. Reite? Leeron? Tetsukan? Gabal? Attenborough? Don't meke me laugh. Gimmy was the best and wisest choice.


The Epilouge IS happy and full of hope. Everyone's walking the paths they themselves chose. Rossiu tries to bring all these scattered Spiral races together and lead them into a bright future; He's a leader like he always wanted to be. Yoko's is still teaching the young one's and that is her pride and joy. Viral, Gimmy & Darry still protect the Earth and humanity and Simon - I cannot stress this enough - is following the path he himself chose. Oh and he does inspire people. Didn't you notice that he was the narrator the whole time? He keeps the the tale of the Great Gurren Brigade alive and passes it on to future genertions. If that tale isn't inspiring than I don't know what the hell is. He does it from the shadows. So what? Simon has always been humble. He himself often stated throughout the series "I am Simon the Digger". He returned to his roots. He never needed the fame of being in the limelight. Anti-climatic? Hell no! True to his character? Yes.

This lead me to the conclusion that you either:
a) are really bad at connectiong the dots
b) was expecting a Hollywood type ending. The bad guy dies, the hero gets the girl, everything is roses and sunshine HURR-HURR.

In the latter case you've just been GAINAX'd.
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Old 2007-11-24, 04:05   Link #639
CSakuraS
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ermes Marana View Post
Giving the drill to Gimmy in front of everyone at the wedding was off, they had not built up a relationship important enough for him to do that. Little thing, but it bugs me.
One of the main themes of this show is the the alternation of generations. Kamina was inspired by his father, Simon was inspired by Kamina, and Simon goes on to inspire Rossiu, Gimmy, and Darry. Yoko dedicates her life to watching over the next generation. All the heroic sacrifices were made so that the people after them could move forward.

Simon even explains it in the last episode: "Remember. This hole rips holes through the universe. That hole will become a path for those who follow us. The wishes of the defeated and the hopes of everyone who follows- with those two thoughts, we'll carve the path to tomorrow!"

Even if Simon wasn't as close to Gimmy as he was with Kamina, it's pretty clear to see how Gimmy and Darry have grown to admire/respect Simon after the 3rd arc, and it sticks with the theme.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave1988 View Post
Also she never said it was possible to regain her human body. She said that the chance of it happening was close to 0%. It was Simon who said it was just as good as 100% for him. He was wrong. In the end he's no God.
Personally I think it would have been possible for Simon to return her body to the way it was if they had time to actually do anything about it. But obviously they didn't have time, because as soon as Nia was rescued, the Anti-Spiral was trying to wipe them into oblivion, and saving Earth became a priority. To protect the future of mankind, the Anti-Spiral had to be defeated right then and there, and ultimately that's what Nia sacrificed herself for.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tabun View Post
As for rewatching Gurren-Lagann, I strongly recommend only watching episodes 1-15. Episode 15 was a better ending to the show than any later episode could ever have been. It emanates hope and a sense of completion. Only one "heroic death" down the line (although it is Kamina-sama none the less!), but so much left for imagining!
I disagree with that. Though I love all of the 2nd arc, it was only starting with the 3rd arc that this show really caught my interest. Things got darker, complicated, and had an even more epic scope. Characters continued to grow, change, and develop. New relationships formed, while old ones crumbled, only to grow stronger. Compared to the 1st arc, which had a couple episodes bordering on filler, the 3rd and 4th arcs waste no time in advancing the story.
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Old 2007-11-24, 04:09   Link #640
Ermes Marana
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave1988 View Post
HOLY S***! There's so much wrong in you post that it isn't even funny.

Yes,Nia was Lordgenome's daughter and untill her Ant-Spiral programming kicked in her body was still human but after that point (ep 18) her body was transformed into that resembling a Mugan (that's why she could warp and her body basically became a bomb [Lordgenome mentions that in ep 22 inside the moon]). And lookie here...Why created the Mugans? That's right! The Anti-Spiral! And what happened to everything they have created after their defeat? That's right. It dissolved along with them.

You are just repeating what happened. I already know what happened, I'm saying it was weak.

Yes, everything created by the AS disappeared, but there was no explanation of why it all had to disappear. Kamina dying, while sad, felt real. Nia's death felt tacked on, because it never felt like everything created by the AS had to disappear. The only reason everything the AS created had to disappear was to give an excuse to make Nia disappear.

And the fact is Nia did not disappear right away. Simon could have given her a new body BEFORE she disappeared, thus avoiding the problem of resurrecting someone. LordGenome gave Viral a new immortal body, Simon couldn't have given Nia a regular one? Again, no explanation for why he didn't. It feels tacked on just to make the ending tragic.

If LordGenome, who was willing to oppress the entire human race to prevent Spiral Nemesis, didn't think twice about giving Viral an immortal body, then Simon can't give Nia a mortal body before she disappeared? Sorry, but it doesn't add up.


When I say the ending was weak, I don't mean it was sad. Kamina's death was sad, but FAR from weak. It was very powerful. Nia's disappearance was weak because it was handled very poorly and didn't make sense.


As for the epilogue, I think the reason it was bad was that Simon wasn't old at the end of the main storyline.

I'm OK with old guys becoming wandering hobos who say they are "nobody". But Simon was too young for that. The epilogue gives the impression that he spent his entire life alone as a wandering hobo. If that isn't true, they should say so.
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