Character Discussion - Rolo

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by Orga777

You know... Vakir has a point....
Most of you guys are ban-wagon jumpers.....<.<'

Is there enough to feel sorry for Rolo? Yeah. Is there enough to outright forgive him for all that he has done? Ha... no. I pretty much agree with everything Vak is saying. Especially when he said people are basing forgiving Rolo because Lelouch sorta did. That pretty much shows that nobody is really that subjective while watching and only sees things by one POV (Lelouch's.)

I do agree with Vakir's points. I only told him off on the one thing because acting like a jerk wasn't gonna get him the debate he wanted.

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

I do agree with Vakir's points. I only told him off on the one thing because acting like a jerk wasn't gonna get him the debate he wanted.

Well, I will agree to that.

[Vakir]

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

I do agree with Vakir's points. I only told him off on the one thing because acting like a jerk wasn't gonna get him the debate he wanted.

Heck, I'll agree on that. I just also feel that people will not debate typically anyway because they aren't hearing what they want to hear, and it has proven itself.

Even if I presented my points differently...I feel I'd be hard pressed to find anyone who would listen that doesn't agree. No one wants to have a character discussion that isn't wholly one sided.

[Orga777]

Originally Posted by Vakir

Heck, I'll agree on that. I just also feel that people will not debate typically anyway because they aren't hearing what they want to hear, and it has proven itself.

Even if I presented my points differently...I feel I'd be hard pressed to find anyone who would listen that doesn't agree. No one wants to have a character discussion that isn't wholly one sided.

I feel your frustration... Since I deal with that plenty at times.

[Lyllrik]

While I did know he'd die at some point in the show, he did much better than I expected.

Hmm I dont know whether to be happy or sad. I guess, I'm glad he decided walk his own way and follow his heart. It's a sad he'd have to die for it, even if it was the only fitting way for him to end. Still, I'm rather amazed Rolo managed to move Lelouch to acknowledge him as a little brother, and even pry Lelouch out of the path of madness. (LOL seems like Suzaku just went in there instead >_>)

Quite grateful that Lelouch told Rolo that lie so he could die with least with a little bit happiness. At least he cared enough to let Rolo "leave with a smile".

*clap clap*

Oh well, rest in peace Rolo. Your last performance exceeded my expectations.

You deliberately choose to ignore that he had intentions of murdering someone he was intended to safely recover, proving he gave more of a damn about himself than his dear brother up until he offed himself.

It's statements like this that makes me wonder what kind of perfect world some people live in.

ROLO IS'NT A SAINT. Why is he not allowed to be selfish?

I've always compared his reactions to Nunally was much different from that of a little kid's raction to a newborn sister/brother.

He's like the firstborn kid in a family who reccently got a little sister/brother, who's getting all the attention. He's insecure about his own position, and reacted to defend it. Rolo just didn't happen to be an average five years old. He was raised differently and was stripped off human emotions. He doesn't have a proper moral compass. You know how he solves problems already. *shrug*

As for Shirly, well she didn't just happened to mention the wrong name. In that scene she practially sided with Nunally, intenting to bring her back to Lelouch. In one way or another, she became an enemy or a "bad guy" in Rolo's eyes.

Was he selfish? Well, yes. But considering his given the choices: a) give up the only happiness he's know to let stranger by happy with his beloved brother or b) "brush his teeth" and keep his own happiness, I can understand his choice of sticking with himself. He'd be a freaking saint if he did choose otherwise.

Hell, I doubt he'd mind to have Nunally around if Lelouch only had said he'd want both Rolo and Nunally. The sad thing is Lelouch intents to kick Rolo out after he gets Nunally back - he doesn't plan to include Rolo at all. Rolo's is the little kid who's afraid for being left behind and no longer loved because a new sister gets all attention from family.

I don't believe Rolo is unwilling to share - he didn't react negatively in that one scene Milly said Shirly might one day be his family. He's just unwilling to give it at all up, as it is in the case of Nunally.

Down to the ground, he's just that worried and insecure kid. I repeat, he's afraid he'd lose practially everything to Nunally if she was returned to Lelouch. He just a human with simple very desires. He's not a saint. He's got all right in the world to be jealous and selfish.

(Also, I find it funny that Lelouch was oblivious of Rolo's jealousy, to the point he'd send Rolo to rescue Nunally having high expectations for his performance. While that guy's a good/decent warlord, he's not good at reading people.)

In the end, Rolo got the truth smacked right into his face - his brother never loved him, it was all an act. But his love for his brother was real, which led him to do the only selfless thing he'd ever done in his pitiful life. In the end, he wasn't a saint or a hero but just a human with very simple wishes. Even in at death, he carries that wish for a family with him - he knows the truth, but in even in death, he's trying fool himself. And I'm glad Lelouch had mercy on his tormented soul and put him to rest with that white lie.

[LAngelo]

u gotta remember that Lelouch would rarely mention Nunnally's name infront of Rolo after getting his memories back...meaning that he didnt know he truly cared about her...he just saw Nunnally as being governor and since lelouch has killed his past siblings, he probably thought he was doing a favor for Lelouch and he would kill her later anyway. as for shirley...she had a gun and was talking like an insecure person and Nunnally seemed like the enemy at the time..in his mind....,,as for killing people, rolo was bred to kill people and thats it..,,,,,,..finding out what love and caring for someone was, came to a shock for him and he didnt want to let that go...he wanted to protect Lelouch from everyone. its a misfortune inderecly caused from the geass cult

[Franckisted]

Originally Posted by LAngelo

u gotta remember that Lelouch would rarely mention Nunnally's name infront of Rolo after getting his memories back...meaning that he didnt know he truly cared about her...he just saw Nunnally as being governor and since lelouch has killed his past siblings, he probably thought he was doing a favor for Lelouch and he would kill her later anyway. as for shirley...she had a gun and was talking like an insecure person and Nunnally seemed like the enemy at the time..in his mind....,,as for killing people, rolo was bred to kill people and thats it..,,,,,,..finding out what love and caring for someone was, came to a shock for him and he didnt want to let that go...he wanted to protect Lelouch from everyone. its a misfortune inderecly caused from the geass cult

That's purly nonsense.

For Shirley, she clearly explain to Rollo her reasons. He just snap out of it when she pronounced Nunnaly name.
For nunnaly, Rollo "and I kill her, nii-san doesn't need 2 sibling, I'm more than enough". Just re-watch.

[LAngelo]

its like a person who misuses a gun to kill innocent people....and then you blame the gun

the gun can be rolo in this situation and the person is the geass cult


the blame goes to the gun user, not the gun
the blame goes for the geass cult in my mind since rolo stopped being the tool at the last moment of his life in order to save the only person that ever cared about him....atleast the Lelouch under the geass

[Lyllrik]

Originally Posted by LAngelo

u gotta remember that Lelouch would rarely mention Nunnally's name infront of Rolo after getting his memories back...meaning that he didnt know he truly cared about her...he just saw Nunnally as being governor and since lelouch has killed his past siblings, he probably thought he was doing a favor for Lelouch and he would kill her later anyway.

BS. There's no way Rolo doesn't know Nunally's importance for Lelouch. Rolo was shown staring at his locket that while Lelouch was confronting Nunally about her beig a governor. He did some pranks on Lelouch in the metro, showing him pictures of Nunally (that episode Lelouch went emo with Refrain). He also knows Lelouch says her name in his sleep etc.

For that reason and that Lelouch never mentions her name in Rolo's presence, I belive that is how Rolo gets the ideas of that Lelouch is lying to him, which is why Rolo would resort to killing off both Shirly to make sure Nunally is away and stays away.

[LAngelo]

is that safe to say????
Lelouch didnt speak of his love of Nunnaly infront of Lelouch so he saw her as just another sibling like the others he killed in the past....and the only thing to solve a problem that he was taught, was to kill.....you cant directly put the blame on rolo

[morbosfist]

Originally Posted by LAngelo

is that safe to say????
Lelouch didnt speak of his love of Nunnaly infront of Lelouch so he saw her as just another sibling like the others he killed in the past....and the only thing to solve a problem that he was taught, was to kill.....you cant directly put the blame on rolo

Rolo's not an idiot. He knows what Nunnally meant to Lelouch. That's why he was trying to drive a wedge between them in episode 7. It was his only method of trying to discourage Lelouch from pursuing her. Same with killing Shirley and finally heading for the source. He didn't want to lose the first real brother he had.

[LAngelo]

i dont know what eps. rolo shows the nunnally pictures to Lelouch nor saying Nunnally's name in his sleep.....even then, since he was taught to kill to solve problems....even then, the blame cant solely be directed to him because a normal person would not solve every problem by killing...its not a personal ambition, its monster that was fed to his brain from birth...not 100% his fault

[LAngelo]

imagine if rolo was never born into the geass cult....do you actually believe that as a normal

kid, he would resolve every problem by killing innocent people????? how many 16 year old

kids do you see going around killing people everyday when they have problems??,,,,get real,

he seems like the kind of kid who would be a real pussy if he wasnt bred into the cult

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by LAngelo

i dont know what eps. rolo shows the nunnally pictures to Lelouch nor saying Nunnally's name in his sleep.....even then, since he was taught to kill to solve problems....even then, the blame cant solely be directed to him because a normal person would not solve every problem by killing...its not a personal ambition, its monster that was fed to his brain from birth...not 100% his fault

Originally Posted by LAngelo

imagine if rolo was never born into the geass cult....do you actually believe that as a normal

kid, he would resolve every problem by killing innocent people????? how many 16 year old

kids do you see going around killing people everyday when they have problems??,,,,get real,

he seems like the kind of kid who would be a real pussy if he wasnt bred into the cult

What-If scenarios are entirely pointless, as they haven't happened. And actually, plenty of 16-year-olds kill people all the time, especially when they have problems.

Rolo's attempts at messing with Lelouch's mind happened in episode 7. We also do not know if he was actually "taught" to kill others as a way of solving problems; killing came from his training as an assassin. While it was the Cult who ingrained that training on him, they did not once order Rolo to kill Shirley, and the Cult was destroyed in its entirety during Rolo's mission to secure Nunnally.

Killing Shirley was his choice and his choice alone; there was no one there to egg him into killing her. Nunnally is a very viable threat to Rolo's existence, and Shirley wanted to bring Nunnally back into Lelouch's life, meaning he'd have no place in it anymore. Thus, he killed her. So yes, the blame can be solely placed on his shoulders.

[LAngelo]

killing people isnt his moral ambition, but you know how rolo was taught since a little kid and its the quickest way to get rid of a problem,,,kill the other person....you HAVE to take into account a what-if scenerio about being bred as a killer,,,,courts always look at the history of person and how they grew up in thier childhood before making a verdict...common sense

[LAngelo]

courts would be presented with this...."well lets c, he was taught to kill since childhood to solve problems the quickest way, was trained into being an assasin which is altogether illegal".,,,they would obviously have to charge the geass cult and the secret intelligence service also....they all take the blame

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by LAngelo

killing people isnt his moral ambition, but you know how rolo was taught since a little kid and its the quickest way to get rid of a problem,,,kill the other person....you HAVE to take into account a what-if scenerio about being bred as a killer,,,,courts always look at the history of person and how they grew up in thier childhood before making a verdict...common sense

You're applying real-world things into an alternate reality where equality DOES NOT EXIST. Therefore the entire argument is flawed. And as I already said once before, we do not know how Rolo was taught in his childhood, beyond receiving training as an assassin.

EDIT: Stop double-posting, dammit. Put your entire argument inside of one post.

In the end it's all moot, because the very Cult that raised him was also destroyed for his act of killing Shirley.

[LordJedi]

Seriously, everyone should be entitled to feel what they want about Rolo's character. I just find it kind of pathetic how people get all worked up when there's a different opinion, in this case having some sympathy for the character being discussed.

Makes me wonder, is it because they are still pissed that their fictional girlfriend (shirley) got killed by another fictional character or some lame shit like that.

If you ask me, the writers have done a great job keeping the show entertaining.
Lot of things are left to one's interpretation yet there is always guys who think they have Mao's geass and know every CG character better than anyone lol.

[LAngelo]

think about it......he was trained to kill since the beginning and when the geass cult was being attacked by Lulu,,,one of the little kids ordered some BK guy to kill another guy...a little kid doesnt even know what death is unless he is taught, obviously from the geass cult......it might not be a law in the geass world, but how can you put the blame on a kid who was taught to kill to solve problems, his entire life....

[Rising Dragon]

Originally Posted by LAngelo

think about it......he was trained to kill since the beginning and when the geass cult was being attacked by Lulu,,,one of the little kids ordered some BK guy to kill another guy...a little kid doesnt even know what death is unless he is taught, obviously from the geass cult......it might not be a law in the geass world, but how can you put the blame on a kid who was taught to kill to solve problems, his entire life....

WE DO NOT KNOW HOW THEY WERE TAUGHT WHEN IT COMES TO MORALS.

How many times do I have to say that?

We don't know if he was taught to kill to solve problems. He was obviously taught to kill, we know that much. All we know is that he's a failed experiment trained as an assassin, who developed a severe and dangerous brother complex, who was able to take control of his life during its last legs.

And finally, as I said, if you want vindication for what the Geass Cult taught them, you've already been vindicated, because Lelouch WIPED THEM OUT. However, do not blame them for actions that they did not do: Rolo, and only Rolo, killed Shirley. Rolo, and only Rolo, made the decision to kill Nunnally when given the chance.

And with that, I take my leave for the night.