Sword Art Online - Episode 22 Discussion / Poll

[ellessarr]

ok in the end was none of then fault and was just a misunderstanding

[NoemiChan]

Originally Posted by ellessarr

ok in the end was none of then fault and was just a misunderstanding

Ok, this is ok too.

[Oroboro]

Dramabomb explodes for massive damage! It was obvious from the start where it was headed.

Also holy hell that fight was glorious.

[Solafighter]

I have waited for this so long. And damn, well done adapted.

I must say, that the scene with Kazuto and Suguha at the door, was the most emotional anime scene, i have ever seen. The way, they talk to eachother, how Suguha feels, the voice acting. Just greatly done from the staff.

It felt really real.

[Clarste]

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

Ok, she just doesn't knew anything nor ask anything.... and fate ( or rather the author) made them look like idiots to not ask anything ever since they both entered the game.

That's not the part that makes her look like an idiot.

[NoemiChan]

Originally Posted by Oroboro

Also holy hell that fight was glorious.

I nearly stood up my chair when I thought Kirito was near the opening of the top door.. damn.. the flying swords was one hell of a weapon.... Being stabbed by those huge things.. damn!!! Just the weight of those will pull you down....

[erneiz_hyde]

bawwww onii-chan.

OK, with that silly plot point out of the way, we can get to the real plot. I watch this for the plot. And by plot of course I mean dem sugus. Damn, with her love in ruins is there anything left for Suguha now other than be dem sugus (and perhaps dat ass).

And fuyukomi is just around the corner, the hunting season is upon us! I'm expecting good things.

[Klashikari]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

I'm quite sure this same conversation was had last week. The key point of Suguha's role is as a love interest, not as a family member. You could eliminate her being a family member completely, but the essential point is that she's someone close to him in real life and falls in love with him in the game (thinking she's running away from her doomed real-life crush). This is the message that Suguha's character development is trying to convey. The "sister" aspect is rather inconsequential, and only explains their real-life connection to each other. She could easily be a next-door neighbour/childhood friend whose chance at having her feelings returned were "stolen" by SAO. The only benefit of being Kazuto's "sister" is that it helps explain why Kazuto feels nothing towards her and can't return her feelings (and also the way her feelings developed, as explained in this episode). It also, of course, increases the irony of the situation.

I'm quite sure that neither "familial affection" nor "reconciliation with an estranged family member" have any relation whatsoever to Suguha's role in this story. Perhaps it's an alternate plot that you would have preferred... but I can't see how it's at all connected to the point here.

The problem is exactly as you describe though: Suguha is set as a plot device and not a character on her own: she could be any possible cliché such like the girl nextdoor and her relevancy would be close to null. Instead of being a "complete" character, with her own actions to take regardless of "ALO Kirito existence", she is there just so Kazuto goes through ALO with a "little twist". In fact, her role is slightly better than the likes of Liz...

Here, she is simply a romantic foil for Kazuto who basically has his eyes dead set on Asuna, to which arguably doesn't have any other possible thought, save games. At this point in the narrative, you would wonder why Suguha was even put in an equation as strong as a blunt 1+1=2. Really, Suguha had obviously no chance at all, and having a wrecked romance there doesn't bring anything, save a drama forced there for the hell of it.
If you were to remove the romance aspect, the ALO arc wouldn't be hurt by the slighest: it would actually be possible to have more IRL/in game exposition, than really a focused duo, whereas one is basically going for a dead end.

If the point was to only bring a focus on Kazuto dead set in rescuing Asuna, they could definitely work with Suguha as a true sibling like I mentioned before. Heck, I think Suguha being in love with Kazuto is even less relevant than her being his sister.

By the way, I think if Suguha was just another girl Kazuto knew IRL, it would have been actually a better romance foil, as there wouldn't be really any social reason not to hook with her, save stronger feelings for a given person, which is Asuna.
Having Suguha as his sibling, regardless if she is blood related or not basically give a bigger failure flag than any non relative ones.

[Polarpew]

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. OMG I WAS CRACKING UP AND TEARING UP AT THE SAME TIME. SO FUNNY AND SO SAD!!!!! GOD THIS IS WHY I LOVE DRAMA.

On a side note this is first anime that made be both cry and laugh at the same time. Was wondering how this was going to be adapted and they did it MAGNIFICENTLY. Gosh the way they ended the episode was awesome totally depressing cliffhanger, how they continue it, I look forward to greatly. BEST EPISODE of the season

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

Another heart melting and heart breaking episode... We got two in one...

The Heart Melting Part

Yui crying out to Asuna... Kirito defying the difficulties of the Guardians just to save Asuna.. and Asuna crying for the knowledge that Yui and Kirito were just below is very touching... I got tears in my eyes.

The Heart Breaking Part

We all expected it... like I said... just..one word for Kirito to say.... "Asuna" will break Suguha... I wished Kazuto hugged Sugu to calm her down and told her that he will always loved her as his sister... his most beloved imouto..

unfortunately their relationship isnt so good for him to do that. Plus he's not very good at social interactions with people that wasn't from his game

[Green²]

...I wonder if Suguha has the will to be able to return to the game now. Kirito's has a lot of explaining to do as he absolutely owes her at least that much now. And for even if after then, will he allow Suguha to return to the death game?


Suguha:
The escape from despair to a dream of beauty & wonder, crushed by now a painful reminder of the broken heart of two worlds.

[GundamZZ]

So, Kirito avoids Sugu just because they are not sibling. It makes me wonder if he had the mutual feeling with Sugu. They just didn't know it was SUKI, but they found it embarrassing?

By the way, the revival count down has same mechanism is like a certain underground online game(of other anime).

[NoemiChan]

Originally Posted by Green²

...I wonder if Suguha has the will to be able to return to the game now. Kirito's has a lot of explaining to do as he absolutely owes her at least that much now.

No explanation needed. They didn't bother to ask in the first place...

Originally Posted by Green²

And for even if after then, will he allow Suguha to return to the death game?

Eh? Huh? This is ALO and not SAO right?

[Seihai]

I'm a bit pissed off at how far Kirito actually got in the tower base. My pride as a gamer was 'hurt'. I mean come on, even Lloyd Irving is at least willing to accept that he isn't able to do anything on his own! And here we have Kirito with his 'skilled' character who probably made the huge raid party that Leafa was talking about look like a group of idiots. It doesn't help that the way he brushed through the mobs felt like a button-mash to me. The fight was impressive nonetheless but the one-sidedness took off some of my tension due to just how long that scene was.

And so in the second half we have Kazuto reveal and confirm Suguha's true amount of misfortune that we all knew about since long ago. Although nothing new, they handled this part rather nicely as you could really feel their emotions with the way Suguha finally confronted her feelings at him directly, the way he reacted and looked away, and finally the way she huddled herself on the bed while crying. Thank goodness that this whole situation is plain enough to be solved within another episode? In the end neither of them did something wrong, but now that the truth's out at least they can start doing things right. Next episode's title pretty much screams "we're gonna make up and then kick some Sugou's butt together with an army that I funded with my h4x gold".

[NoemiChan]

Kirito is probably checking how difficult the guardians are.

[Tsukou]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

I wouldn't say that this "diversion" is any more "pointless" than the arc itself, to be honest. This "romance" was doomed to fail just as much as our arc villain is doomed to be brought down. If you eliminate the one "pointless diversion" you're just left with the other, and it's not as if Kirito chasing after Asuna is all that compelling on its own (I mean, not the relationship, but the overall circumstance they find themselves in).

That may seem like a knock on the show, but if your engagement is limited by whether or not the destination is foreseen, I'm not sure there's much to this whole story arc. I think you have to enjoy the journey. I thought the journey of Suguha's feelings and how it wove through the story was fairly-well realized for what it is, even if a bit more of it came together at the end of this episode than might have otherwise. I also don't think this is the end of her journey either -- now that her feelings are out, she has to decide what to do next. This too isn't so unpredictable, but we'll still see how she is able to stand herself back up again. That's really the emotional core of this arc: Suguha learns to accept her doomed feelings for Kazuto and move forward, as he remains fixated on his one true love. I'd say she's really more the focal point than he is, to be honest.

I find myself agreeing with your point of view quite a bit in previous episode discussions, and would like to add that I don't understand people's dislike of harems where you know what the author is intending. Heartbreak isn't the end of the world, and in most cases I see it as a way for characters to grow in the future. Reading the first page of comments makes me feel like when a girl gets her heartbroken, she becomes useless, which is ridiculous. You can't measure a character's worth based on failures and successes.

And like you said, it's about the journey. Obviously everyone here knows in the end Kirito will defeat everyone who gets in his way, and eventually meet up with Asuna and she'll probably wake up, and it'll be happily ever after. We've probably known that ever since we saw Kirito walk out of the hospital. That doesn't make the series any more or less enjoyable. People need to just sit back and enjoy the ride, and even tho we know Suguha gets dumped, doesn't stop her from being a good character. I actually really enjoyed the end of this episode where she's pouring out her feelings, and thought it was well scripted. Despite myself being sad for her position, I still enjoyed watching it. I feel like anyone who didn't like Suguha, didn't like her because they knew she wouldn't succeed, and I feel like that's such a poor criteria, because I felt like she's a good character. Sure the romance is cliched, but honestly can you not say the Asuna romance wasn't cliched either? Doesn't stop it from being good. And when she talks about how she was glad when Kirito woke up from SAO and how he began to treat her nicely again, it puts pieces as to why she likes him.

Well that's enough from me, just think people should enjoy the show for what it presents, and not try to force it into a little box of preconceived notions.

[ellessarr]

Originally Posted by Tsukou

I find myself agreeing with your point of view quite a bit in previous episode discussions, and would like to add that I don't understand people's dislike of harems where you know what the author is intending. Heartbreak isn't the end of the world, and in most cases I see it as a way for characters to grow in the future. Reading the first page of comments makes me feel like when a girl gets her heartbroken, she becomes useless, which is ridiculous. You can't measure a character's worth based on failures and successes.

And like you said, it's about the journey. Obviously everyone here knows in the end Kirito will defeat everyone who gets in his way, and eventually meet up with Asuna and she'll probably wake up, and it'll be happily ever after. We've probably known that ever since we saw Kirito walk out of the hospital. That doesn't make the series any more or less enjoyable. People need to just sit back and enjoy the ride, and even tho we know Suguha gets dumped, doesn't stop her from being a good character. I actually really enjoyed the end of this episode where she's pouring out her feelings, and thought it was well scripted. Despite myself being sad for her position, I still enjoyed watching it. I feel like anyone who didn't like Suguha, didn't like her because they knew she wouldn't succeed, and I feel like that's such a poor criteria, because I felt like she's a good character. Sure the romance is cliched, but honestly can you not say the Asuna romance wasn't cliched either? Doesn't stop it from being good. And when she talks about how she was glad when Kirito woke up from SAO and how he began to treat her nicely again, it puts pieces as to why she likes him.

Well that's enough from me, just think people should enjoy the show for what it presents, and not try to force it into a little box of preconceived notions.

you get a "good point", "grow" this is the problem on most of the harems this "dont happen" aways the girls gona stay in love with him(one saide) the MC awas gona be the same and on SAO is not different, and i can't say much more... about this because can be spoiler...(fear of warns ^^)

edit: in fact the only "grow" us have in a harem is the number of girls falling for MC

[HandofFate]

Sugu exploding and accusing Kirito of quitting kendo and avoiding her because he knew they weren't blood-related seemed harsh imo.

Not sure if Kirito had that intention, maybe he did. But wow. Shots fired by Sugu there.

Kind of thought that maybe Kirito not being related was a birth secret for him and that they got Kirito when he was a baby, and even he didn't know.

Imagine him finding that out right there on top of having to save asuna.

After sugu shuts the door and Kirito leans against the door and drops to the floor.

"...I'm adopted?"

[Seihai]

Originally Posted by GenjiChan

Kirito is probably checking how difficult the guardians are.

Yeah, confirming the enemy's strength is a crucial thing to do in games anyway. I don't doubt the logic behind Kirito's actions at all. It's just that I'm not really satisfied with how the whole scene plays out. The battle conveyed what it wanted to convey, and that's good. But in my opinion, especially because it is that long, they could have packed so much more stuff in it to 'spice up' things.

[Oroboro]

Kirito has always been a loner... and though he learned to work together with Asuna, it seems he's never really taken the lesson to heart.

[Dr. Casey]

Just read the first page so far, but wow that's a whole lot of griping

I don't think I'll ever understand why people get so butthurt over the things that they do. I'm not sure why the occasional tragic love story is such an awful thing.