Tokyo's Youth Ordinance Bill

[Decagon]

Originally Posted by aeriolewinters

Not only that, protests... If planned by the right people and people who wield political power, can topple whole regimes, just ask president (Cory) aquino for instance. Sometimes the smallest of things can cause the biggest damages. I believe that staging a protest would set it on a national stage, and not only this. The implications of this bill don't actually only limit itself to anime per se. It actually suggests a future of denying people the freedom of expression.

Well, going by these numbers from earlier in the thread and considering this is something Tokyo is trying to pass for their area (wider scope of their actions notwithstanding), replacing these Tokyo politicians seems much more a targeted response. See, if you make it a national issue you not only get people who do care, but you get people who really don't give a damn about anime and manga. From what I recall, Japan's rural areas votes get more weight per person than urban voters and rural areas tend to be more conservative in any country.

[aeriolewinters]

From what I recall, Japan's rural areas votes get more weight per person than urban voters and rural areas tend to be more conservative in any country.

Not if you play their game and word it like as a first step to controlling media. People power, in our country was never about toppling a regime, it was popularly about toppling dictatorship with the power of the people, "a true democratic act." in which the people personally made the regime flee.

If you play their game and word the bill as something of a prelude to another thing that'll happen, then it would weaken the foundations of certain things.

For example, a man may not care if anime will be affected, but as soon as you tell them that this is just a first step in a gloomier scenario, in which all forms of media are content-controlled by the government, it would rub them in a way that they have to do things for the sake of freedom of speech. If someone has the mind to oversee this, and be charismatic enough to rally people, it'd be a perfect form of protest.

[Vexx]

Ya'll seem to be confusing Japan for some other country with all this talk. They're really not the confrontational types within the society. Most of any mitigation/derailing will occur "with harmony and behind closed doors".

[Decagon]

Originally Posted by aeriolewinters

/snip

The point is that this is about Tokyo. While it is the political and economic center of Japan, this is effectively a law enacted by its local government by people who probably think their dicks and clout are as big as their egos. They are not the governing body of Japan!

[flying ^]

man can we just arrange to send Justice Scalia over there?

he silenced the state of California for their bs.

he can do the same to Japan.

[octoberasian]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wang

Well yeah, doesn't it violate their Article 21?

"Freedom of assembly and association as well as speech, press and all other forms of expression are guaranteed. 2) No censorship shall be maintained, nor shall the secrecy of any means of communication be violated."

A shame that some people might only be realizing this now, or at least their voices aren't being heard towards the deaf ears of certain politicians...

Just reading that and I'm getting eerie parallels to what's happening in the US with Arizona now checking who is an illegal immigrant or not.

And, last time I recall from my two years of political science and government classes in college, federal law supercedes state and local law. If the same applies in Japan, then Article 21 supercedes anything that dumbass governor of Tokyo has signed into law.

If this law has a detrimental effect on anime and manga industry as a whole, then one thing to say-- "Goodbye anime and manga."

I'm hoping this doesn't have any adverse affects after April 2011 and after July 2011.

It's starting to go back to: "If we do not learn from history, we are doomed to repeat it."

Hasn't similar censorship and strict enforcement of various forms of media been done throughout history like in China, Soviet Russia and even Nazi Germany?

[Vexx]

Throughout time and space, there have been and always will be annoying busybodies that want to "protect you" by dictating what you have access to. Sometimes to the extent of burning you at the stake to "save you".

Its just part of an eternal battle....

[Yui Is My Wife]

Well, the motherfucking bill has just been SIGNED INTO LAW.

http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2010/1...gned-into-law/

Billy Joel was right about "Only The Good Die Young."

Only the rotten and evil seem to get to live as long as Ishihara does.

[asaqe]

Can we please avoid Sankaku for once? The site's a tabloid and it will cause more panic then usual.

[Vexx]

Originally Posted by Yui Is My Wife

Well, the motherfucking bill has just been SIGNED INTO LAW.

http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2010/1...gned-into-law/

Billy Joel was right about "Only The Good Die Young."

Only the rotten and evil seem to get to live as long as Ishihara does.

Can we *all* drop using Sankaku as a "news source"? Its a piece of tabloid hyperbolic garbage for that purpose - everything is written to maximize eyeballs (page hits).

That said, the bill was passed by the assembly though what final version I've not snared a copy of yet. Its already gathering negative attention from the federal level, the news media, and the publishing industry (not just anime/manga). There is a lot of reason to suspect the law will just lay there and rot like many other "think of the children" laws in Japan (and elsewhere) - the industry will lay low for a bit and then proceed with business as usual just more quietly. Apparently this is Ishihara's last term in office (3 term limit?) and he's 78. You will *outlive* him

Look, I'm 53 ... I've watched a lot of witchburners over the decades (and fought a few). Its a neverending battle but in the long run - they lose. They lose because the facts aren't with them. They lose because they don't think rationally. Note how attitudes towards homosexuals have changed in the US/Canada/Europe -- most of that shift was a combination of facts, rationality, and the reactionaries simply being outlived by the younger people.

OTOH, it is also true that morals tend to be cyclic ... some days I talk to younger people and think they're more prehistoric than my parents were.

[gecd]

ishihara..
he is not considering the future of japan

[Vexx]

Originally Posted by gecd

ishihara..
he is not considering the future of japan

He is cynically protecting *his* style of authorship (novels) against the transfer of general interest to anime/manga by demonizing the latter. It makes good press with his "why can't it be like the Old Days" Imperial buddies. PM Kan hates him but you gotta play the game in local politics.

The really insidious thing here is the classic japanese societal problem of that instead of confronting the law head on, at least some publishers will just prefer to roll over and self-censor. Is anyone noting the current Amazon.com scandal of self-censoring print-on-demand titles off of their shelves? There isn't even a specific law driving that behavior. They're just being irrationally risk-averse (or moralist twits, it isn't clear yet)

However, anyone who studies that sort of thing knows that authors tend to become more creative at slipping things under the radar. Watch and see if in the latter part of 2011 the body count of "look!!! teen boobz!!!!" series drops in lieu of more complex story content.

[Edgewalker]

Originally Posted by Vexx

The really insidious thing here is the classic japanese societal problem of that instead of confronting the law head on, at least some publishers will just prefer to roll over and self-censor. Is anyone noting the current Amazon.com scandal of self-censoring print-on-demand titles off of their shelves? There isn't even a specific law driving that behavior. They're just being irrationally risk-averse (or moralist twits, it isn't clear yet)

This is what I am worried about, that the general "don't rock the boat" Japanese mentality will kick in and publishers will just belly up and off themselves for a bill that may end up being unenforceable anyways.

It also seems that the Prime Minister is against the bill from what I have read on 2chan. But My Kanji is terrible so don't take my word for it.

[zaeraal]

The problem with this bill is that Ishihara does not realize, that every coin has two sides and edge.

One side says that by showing this "improper images" to children, they will be negatively afected and start doing bad stuff

Other side says that by fullfilling their "desires" on TV, or showing them how the character suffer, when they are under brute violence, they will have no will to commit those "crimes" in real life. Its the same princeple as with playing PC games, when you are stressed, you play them and the stress is relieved. And the next day when you meet with your noisy boss, anoying teacher or whoever else, you will have no intention to stab him with your knife, because you realize he just isnt worth it.

And on the edge of the coin is written, that if a person has the tendency to become violent, HE WILL BECOME VIOLENT, and it dosn't matter how many anime he watches. And who does not have the tendency, he will not become violent, and will either not watch those "violent" animes, or will watch them with understanding, that its just a show, nothing less and nothing more.


Another flaw of this bill is : if there is up there is down, if there is left, there is right. If bad anime converts good people into bad people, then "good" anime converts bad people into good people. Well lets think about it for a while, if a person commit crimes, he goes to prison and there they should show him uh, miki maus, pokemons, duck tales, gummi bears, donald duck, tom & jery and similar shows all day long, in order to convert him into good person after he leaves the jail. The same should aplly to schools - for every bad grade a episode of tom & jery, for every missing homework 2 episodes of pokemons. And like this the bad students will convert to good diligent students. But wait..

*a light bulb turns on above my head*

How comes i never saw a system like this, how comes there isn't a country, a city, or even a single school where this is applied.. Maybe people realized, this stuff just does not work! If you can't convert bad people to good with anime, ON WHAT BASIS Ishihara claims that bad anime converts good people into bad ones.

[christinemarie]

Recent trend of crimes for the past several years in Japan, where the suspect/offender blames manga or anime for their crime.

A fact that the crime rate in Japan is lowest among other countries out there.

If the crime rate in Japan rises up next year, blame Ishihara or he would start make excuses, that would led on prohibition of animes and manga with violence.

[~Yami~]

as long as they still produced the anime/manga and I can still watch/read it... I don't mind
I don't care about rating (since I think Anime/manga is for 18+ from the beginning)
But still, this bill shows a "war declaration" to otaku in all over the world

[jpwong]

Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon

We're having a referendum next fall to get it repealed, which it probably will be. Democracy might actually win for once.

I'm... surprised they're waiting that long considering there'd already been a report a mere month after it went into effect that basically said it was going to cost several hundred million dollars to turn the train around at that point. I can only think it's going to cost into the billions to turn the party around if they wait a year, unless one of the restrictions is they won't be refunding anyone's HST purchases (not from BC, so not current on that debate).

Anyway, to the topic on hand, I wonder if they've considered any potential economic impact by passing this. From what I've read in this thread, Tokyo does have quite the market share going for itself, but I can't imagine it's the be all end all for publishing companies. Assuming this bill isn't thrown out for being unconstitutional or something, if they come down too hard on a company to "make an example" as it were, I see this going two ways. Either people will fall in line, or else these companies will take themselves outside of the law's effective zone. If they do decide to pack up and move, I wonder if the government has considered what sort of job vacuum that would create if enough companies take off all at once.

In regards to the trend of people blaming anime and manga for their violent tenancies, I see it the same way as the trend of people blaming video games over here. The main difference seems to be that no one here is succeeding in pushing out some sort of broad blanket law that would restrict the sale and production of video games.

[Revenger1589]

Doraemon is also boycotting TAF apparently, now this is a real blow.

[Roloko vi Britannia]

Originally Posted by ANN

The Yomiuri Shimbun paper reports that the Tokyo Metropolitan Government plans to make a handbook to specifically describe what content would be restricted, as well as a pamphlet for the general public.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/cms/...rsion?n=168284

I wonder when they will release this handbook and maybe it will make things clearer on what exactly they will restrict.

[darry]

Anyone here that thinks this Law will last not long ? (havent read anything besides this text)