[Manga] Chapter 439 Discussion

[Viron]

I don't care about Hinatas or Sakuras love very much, but I think Hinatas injury triggering 6-tails (and following events) is important to the plot...

[KingOfWorlds]

WOW...
We were just talking about Naruto not knowing his parents...
and the village not knowing and all that other stuff like a chapter or 2 ago...
And now BAM!...
I think Kishi b havin spies on these forms

[lotus_lee]

But but, what about the other half of the Nine Tails power that's locked away? Who's gonna save Naruto then if this is the last we see of Yondiame?

Maybe Itachi's power (ie. Sharingan) will be his saviour then.

Although Naruto has to one day surpass his father and defeat the Nine Tails all by himself right?

So many possibilities...

[Mr. Johnny 5]

Anyway it's certain that Yondaime who we've seen is dead because... he didnt age at all and not only that...he still has the exact same clothes as when he died. Don't worry he won't return to save Naruto from Pain. He is probably an advanced memory of himself.
Probably similair to the father of Kal-El aka Superman. Who was dead but could answer Supermans questions.

[ragnos007]

Originally Posted by james0246

Naruto willingly went to the Seal chamber and sought the Kyuubi. It would have been just as easy to have Naruto start to remove the seal, only to be forced to stop by another seal activating, And instead of a Minato clone popping up, the Kyuubi could simply shout in rage, and briefly explain that its chakra had been split (why wouldn't the Kyuubi know that its chakra was split?). Et cetera, et cetera. Minato need not appear as the fail safe at all, there are perfectly valid other means of providing simple information (ala Naruto's heritage, the Kyuubi's chakra, Madara, etc).

That is why, I have specifically said (many times) that I hope Minato provides some key information that the other known characters could not have provided. Otherwise...Minato's appearance seems fairly pointless (outside of dramatic effect).



I'm sorry; I have no idea what you are talking about. Yes paper seals exist...so what does that have to do with the conversation at hand? Are you disproving my point? Proving it?

to date all of the paper seals have been removed by hand to break the seal. having one that wont is too stupid. Plus Naruto is the most gutsy ninja around say he got electrocuted while trying to remove the seal he'd be like wtf and keep charging it until he finally decides to throw a rasengshuriken at it to get the job done. Having minato come to stop him both surprises Naruto and makes him just about shit his pants.

Plus when you think about it if it is possilbe to create a failsafe where you appear to stop him wouldnt you trust that one more considering you know you'd be able to stop him if you were there. Hell you'd just have to say Naruto i'm your daddy and naruto would stop.

But yes i do agree with you that it would be better that Minato did bring a belated house warming present to kyuubi... well naruto (but saying kyuubi is funnier because his new house is a cage in naruto :P) in the form of something important to say

[ragnos007]

Originally Posted by bozan

Haha ok, well change it from Sasuke to Choji then . Or anyone where it wasn't immediately obvious what role they would have until later.

The alternatives you mentioned are plausible, but so is Minato existing in spirit form for several minutes inside Naruto. I don't really see those alternatives as being any better than the current one.

But enough of this. Personally, I think the more interesting question is whether Minato knew about Madara, why he would decide to put the fox inside Naruto if he did, and what he was hoping would eventually happen. I'm still completely confused about this, even after reading chapter 370 4-5 times.

Lol what is chojis purpose:P he's a side character :P

[DeDe]

Originally Posted by Fran~

Why?.
I mean to the plot...

I meant more to fandom who care about things like shipping. But as James said, unless Minato actually says something of importance then his role was basically to state info that could have been handled by another means.

I am really curious as to how Kishi will explain Minato's appearence.

[Master Mold]

Originally Posted by DeDe

I meant more to fandom who care about things like shipping. But as James said, unless Minato actually says something of importance then his role was basically to state info that could have been handled by another means.

So the 4th stopping Naruto from releasing the Kyuubi was not important?

[pedrobaka]

Originally Posted by DeDe

Yondaime: Though I don't want this to happen, because I don't want to see you again...Kyuubi. But I'm glad to see my grown up son...so things even out.

So this basically means, yondaime is sealed away inside naruto aswell as the kyuubi.
Kinda makes sense, 9 jinchurikis, all sealed away in people, and the so called best shinobi would kill himself to seal just one? Right, the kyuubi is nothing compared to the others but even so.. come on.. he's gotta be alive somewhere.

[Cub-Sama]

Originally Posted by Kafriel

If one wishes strongly, they can achieve many things...but there is one taboo that nobody must break-and that is, reviving the dead:O

Tsubasa Reservoir Chronicles right?

Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5

Anyway it's certain that Yondaime who we've seen is dead because... he didnt age at all and not only that...he still has the exact same clothes as when he died. Don't worry he won't return to save Naruto from Pain. He is probably an advanced memory of himself.
Probably similair to the father of Kal-El aka Superman. Who was dead but could answer Supermans questions.

He's simply an apparation that appears to guide a common thing that happens to some people who have lost a loved one, they see them as guides telling them what to do I think not sure though. It's like in Tenjou Tenge when a dead Shin appeared and told Aya not to use the sword and tried to take it away.

[Fran~]

@Cub: LOL... Cub did you read the last TJTG chapter and who is back??...
Oh Great had throwed all cliches by the window, one word can describe last chapters of TJTG: Madness!

Originally Posted by DeDe

I meant more to fandom who care about things like shipping. But as James said, unless Minato actually says something of importance then his role was basically to state info that could have been handled by another means.

I am really curious as to how Kishi will explain Minato's appearence.

DeDe... Minato is the one and only who knows the most info about Kyuubi. Who is gonna tell Naruto that info?, Jiraiya is dead, Kakashi and Tsunade doesn't know it.

When we are talking about the Kyuubi, Minato is the only who has the last word. He is the man who not only sealed it but splitted its chakra for some unknown purpose.

[james0246]

Originally Posted by JINBEI

So the 4th stopping Naruto from releasing the Kyuubi was not important?

It depends on how you look at it. If Minato's sole purpose is to appear, stop the 9th Tail from forming, and then promptly disappear, then yes, Minato's appearance would matter vey little (considering that there are other probable means of stopping the 9th Tail). It is only if Minato can do something that no other character can do, or reveal information that no other character can reveal, that we can then say the Mianto's appearance is important and beneficial.

Originally Posted by Fran~

DeDe... Minato is the one and only who knows the most info about Kyuubi. Who is gonna tell Naruto that info?, Jiraiya is dead, Kakashi and Tsunade doesn't know it.

When we are talking about the Kyuubi, Minato is the only who has the last word. He is the man who not only sealed it but splitted its chakra for some unknown purpose.

See, this line of thought just doesn't make sense to me. If I break my leg, I sure as hell know that my leg is broken, probably how it broke, when it broke, why it broke, and potentially which parts (bones, etc) of the leg are broken. So, why wouldn't the Kyuubi know that its chakra is fucked up (split), and potentially why it was split? It is not like the Kyuubi is an unintelligent monster, on the contrary, it is a very intelligent creature. So, why is it outside of the realm of probablity that the Kyuubi could know what is going on with...the Kyuubi?

To put it another way, the Kyuubi is there and it potentially knows quite a bit. Minato is dead. So, which would have been easier for the story to have answer the question? The currently 'living' Kyuubi, or the guy that has to be brought back to life just to answer the question?

This is why I have said many times, that Mianto simply coming back to discuss the Kyuubi isa bit silly. He has to come back with more information than just that, or else his coming back seems very superficial.

[El_Negro]

Originally Posted by Mr. Johnny 5

Anyway it's certain that Yondaime who we've seen is dead because... he didnt age at all and not only that...he still has the exact same clothes as when he died. Don't worry he won't return to save Naruto from Pain. He is probably an advanced memory of himself.
Probably similair to the father of Kal-El aka Superman. Who was dead but could answer Supermans questions.

Thinking exactly the same thing

[Master Mold]

Originally Posted by james0246

It depends on how you look at it. If Minato's sole purpose is to appear, stop the 9th Tail from forming, and then promptly disappear, then yes, Minato's appearance would matter very little (considering that there are other probable means of stopping the 9th Tail). It is only if Minato can do something that no other character can do, or reveal information that no other character can reveal, that we can then say the Mianto's appearance is important and beneficial.

The 4th just did something no other character can do, or has done, his appearance from what we can gather from the spoiler, is important and beneficial. As for information we will have to wait till next chapter.

[Krono]

Originally Posted by james0246

To put it another way, the Kyuubi is there and it potentially knows quite a bit. Minato is dead. So, which would have been easier for the story to have answer the question? The currently 'living' Kyuubi, or the guy that has to be brought back to life just to answer the question?

Ok, so explain to me why you think that the Kyuubi would try and talk Naruto out of breaking the seal.

[bozan]

Originally Posted by james0246

See, this line of thought just doesn't make sense to me. If I break my leg, I sure as hell know that my leg is broken, probably how it broke, when it broke, why it broke, and potentially which parts (bones, etc) of the leg are broken. So, why wouldn't the Kyuubi know that its chakra is fucked up (split), and potentially why it was split? It is not like the Kyuubi is an unintelligent monster, on the contrary, it is a very intelligent creature. So, why is it outside of the realm of probablity that the Kyuubi could know what is going on with...the Kyuubi?

I don't think the analogy fits quite exactly. The sealing of the Kyuubi involves two people - Minato and the Kyuubi. Breaking your bone involves one person and one thing - the person breaking his bone and the bone. I think saying that the kyuubi should know about Minato's intentions is like saying that the bone should know why the owner broke it and how it was broken. I can see where you're coming from though, because the Kyuubi is probably more intelligent than people are making him out to be.

[Cub-Sama]

Originally Posted by james0246

See, this line of thought just doesn't make sense to me. If I break my leg, I sure as hell know that my leg is broken, probably how it broke, when it broke, why it broke, and potentially which parts (bones, etc) of the leg are broken. So, why wouldn't the Kyuubi know that its chakra is fucked up (split), and potentially why it was split? It is not like the Kyuubi is an unintelligent monster, on the contrary, it is a very intelligent creature. So, why is it outside of the realm of probablity that the Kyuubi could know what is going on with...the Kyuubi?

To put it another way, the Kyuubi is there and it potentially knows quite a bit. Minato is dead. So, which would have been easier for the story to have answer the question? The currently 'living' Kyuubi, or the guy that has to be brought back to life just to answer the question?

This is why I have said many times, that Mianto simply coming back to discuss the Kyuubi isa bit silly. He has to come back with more information than just that, or else his coming back seems very superficial.

Actually the Kyuubi may just think he feels weaker or different as a result of being sealed into a human who is inferior to him, he may not know he has been split in half, say if you feel sick all of a sudden you might think you ate something bad you don't know if someone drugged you or not only that person knows. Also why would the Kyuubi want to reveal anything to Naruto, he just feeds him vague facts to try and persuade him.

@Fran I forgot to check if it is updated so I need to read it

[james0246]

Originally Posted by Krono

Ok, so explain to me why you think that the Kyuubi would try and talk Naruto out of breaking the seal.

I am not talking about specific instances, rather I am making a general comment on the characters in the story. But, if you want a possible series of events then: As the Kyuubi attempts to have Naruto release the final seal (which would unleash the full might of all 9 tails), a secondary seal comes into play which prevents Naruto (or anyone else) from ever fully releasing the Kyuubi. No Minato apparition need appear, the seal need only act as it has always acted. Consequently, after it is thwarted, the Kyuubi could, as it has done in the past after being suppressed, reveal important clues that will become paramount to the story later on (Madara, anyone?).

Again, I am not saying that Minato appearing is bad. Rather, I am not sure why everyone is so willing to just accept Minato appearing without first questioning why he appeared and what he personally can do that the seal or other characters couldn't do as well. Right now, Minato's appearance is purely for Dramatic Effect (much the same as Kakashi's father appearing), but in future chapters he could be extraordinarily important. I am simply exploring the possibilities of what Minato could say, and the impact on the story that Minato's words will undoubtedly bring.

[HayashiTakara]

so just as many suspects... Sakura is still pining over Sasuke.

[kakakka]

As the Kyuubi attempts to have Naruto release the final seal (which would unleash the full might of all 9 tails), a secondary seal comes into play which prevents Naruto (or anyone else) from ever fully releasing the Kyuubi.

TBH, I would feel it's as out of the blue as Minato appearing. That seal was always been emphasized as a very important factor in sealing and releasing the Kyuubi. I don't know, my only reaction when there is going to be a second seal is that "it's like all those suspense hidden on that stupid first seal, from the beginning, is all for crap.."

My thoughts on Minato appearing is that its supposed to contrast Kyuubi in this chapter. The 4th and Kyuubi has been like dark and light / balance since the beginning for Naruto. Minato is his role model, Kyuubi is his curse. Minato gave him a curse, Kyuubi provided him with powerful chakra. This chapter, Kyuubi is almost succedding in making Naruto release the seal, possibly sacrificing his life to gain power, but then Minato appears to save him from path of total destruction. Minato appeared to balance out the lure of the Kyuubi, which is possibly strong this chapter.

The seal can be a symbol of Naruto's balance/mind.