One Piece - Chapter 655 [manga]

[RRW]

Originally Posted by Talendra

Just to throw a small question into the zoro/new crew member from wana discussion: why is it, anyone seems to expect a potential crew member from wano has to be some kind of samurai and therefore collide with zoros niche in the crew?

Someone from Wano could easily be more.. special in his role and still fit well into the wano-theme.

you mean ninja? that might be awesome

but i doubt we gonna have another sword user. maybe she (i am really hope next will be female. so we have some gender balance) can use trap and explosive. but it might be overlap with ussop or franky.

puppet user perhaps?

[yakumo-chan]

I just saw One Piece Volume 65's cover,,

Luffy using Red Hawk was awesome!
so luffy's hand was really on fire there, I wonder if there really is a technique that you can create fire since Sanji can create fire too

[karumofin]

All this talk about Katanas makes me realize that this will possibly a great arc for Tashigi to participate in...

[Undertaker]

Originally Posted by Talendra

Just to throw a small question into the zoro/new crew member from wana discussion: why is it, anyone seems to expect a potential crew member from wano has to be some kind of samurai and therefore collide with zoros niche in the crew?

Someone from Wano could easily be more.. special in his role and still fit well into the wano-theme.

Because the only information we have right now is that Wano is full of Samurai.

I agree, it doesn't have to be a Samurai, but in that case, there is obviously no character conflation then.

[noktown]

Originally Posted by yakumo-chan

I just saw One Piece Volume 65's cover,,

Luffy using Red Hawk was awesome!
so luffy's hand was really on fire there, I wonder if there really is a technique that you can create fire since Sanji can create fire too

Both Luffy and Sanji used very fast spinning to create fire(Luffy was spinning his hand),at least Sanji used to do it.

[Undertaker]

Originally Posted by ronin myael

i'm probably speaking with biases here since i loved the 黃金傳說 stories. muramasa's blades were graded low as well, none of them were considered meito (as far as i know of) and yet muramasa was a very skilled swordsmith and his swords were of high quality as well. the reason for this is he lost favor with the shogun, tokugawa ieyasu, because the latter deemed his swords too dangerous to use and considered them cursed. he forbade his samurai from using them and those who did were executed. and so the muramasa blades were either destroyed, discarded, hidden away or had their signatures erased or replaced. so who knows? perhaps some of the meito in japan now were muramasa blades once, they only had their signatures altered so muramasa never took the credit for their deeds and fame. this story sounds too much like kitetsu and his cursed blades. sandai kitetsu is not considered a meito either. and the reason for that is probably similar to that of muramasa's swords.

I love Muramasa as well, but there are so many Muramasa made by that clan to really say anything. They and Muramasa black smith isn't rated in Wazamono system though. Just like other famous blacksmith during Sengoku times and Koto periods, their sword were deemed too valuable to be tested, but generally speaking they are widely considered as some of the best swords. I mean this is evident that both Masamune and Sadamune are not ranked as well and both are contemporaries to Muramasa. As well as the none of the makers of the Katana that are currently regard as five best blades were rated as well. (Tenka Go ken: Dojigiri, Onimaru, Mikazuki Munechika, Otenta, and Juzumaru)

But most of its curses were really spread from Tokugawa clan as you said, and it mainly due to that clan's ill encounters with those swords. The only thing I would say is that Tokugawa incidents all seem to be done by different swords, it just got complicated when Muramasa isn't a name to just one sword but a name for all sword done by Muramasa clan of blacksmith.

[Shiroth]

Originally Posted by karumofin

All this talk about Katanas makes me realize that this will possibly a great arc for Tashigi to participate in...

I second that. We really haven't seen much of her in battle at all, so now would be a good chance to see if she's improved at all.

[randomlex]

A random idea - I'd like to see a sword made by Vegapunk using a super alloy (like the one from which the Pacifistas are made). It would contradict everything that the samurai stand for, and it would be stronger than any Meito, as well .

[RRW]

Originally Posted by randomlex

A random idea - I'd like to see a sword made by Vegapunk using a super alloy (like the one from which the Pacifistas are made). It would contradict everything that the samurai stand for, and it would be stronger than any Meito, as well .

maybe yubashiri been remade using that

[Hisoka??]

Originally Posted by ronin myael

i'm probably speaking with biases here since i loved the muramasa stories. muramasa's blades were graded low as well, none of them were considered meito (as far as i know of) and yet muramasa was a very skilled swordsmith and his swords were of high quality as well. the reason for this is he lost favor with the shogun, tokugawa ieyasu, because the latter deemed his swords too dangerous to use and considered them cursed. he forbade his samurai from using them and those who did were executed. and so the muramasa blades were either destroyed, discarded, hidden away or had their signatures erased or replaced. so who knows? perhaps some of the meito in japan now were muramasa blades once, they only had their signatures altered so muramasa never took the credit for their deeds and fame. this story sounds too much like kitetsu and his cursed blades. sandai kitetsu is not considered a meito either. and the reason for that is probably similar to that of muramasa's swords.

the way the muramasa blades resurfaced years later and how those who rebelled against the tokugawa regime took on these swords and even carried them openly, reminds me of how zoro disregarded the so-called curse and went ahead and used sandai kitetsu anyway.

it just seems incredibly unfair to me that just because of reputation swords would be deemed weak or unusable. so rankings don't really mean much to me. but then, in one piece this does not exactly apply. as for wado ichimonji, i guess it's because oda didn't give us (yet) a background about its history. i don't like the look of it too. sure, it's strong and quite possibly the most powerful sword zoro has ever owned, save for shuusui. but it looks like something a woman should wield, which is probably why i think the rightful owner should have been kuina. i don't think it really suits zoro's masculine and rough nature. this might change if we get to find out more about it though and when that happens i will stand corrected. perhaps it originally belonged to a famous onna bugeisha or woman samurai, who knows? it's just my opinion of course, don't worry about it.

Well, I like the cursed sword idea, but if you consider the fact that there are 2 (essentially) stronger versions of the same sword around, it just lends itself to being replaced. That, or zoro reaches a level where what weapon he uses doesn't matter.

As for Wado ichimonji, I foresee him giving it to Tagishi (spelling) as either a way of entrusting his faith in her way of justice or as an expression of his feeling (shipping =p). And then he gets one of the top tier of swords.

[Ami-chan]

Originally Posted by Undertaker

Because the only information we have right now is that Wano is full of Samurai.

I agree, it doesn't have to be a Samurai, but in that case, there is obviously no character conflation then.

But to be fair, weren't ninjas ronin that were hired to do the dirty work? I forget where I heard/read that, but that's the impression I've been under for a while now. I think it'd be hilarious/awesome if Luffy's crew picked up a ninja.


Or a dragon.

[marvelB]

Hey guys, the next chapter's spoilers came out early this week! I already made the thread for it here.

[Undertaker]

Originally Posted by Ami-chan

But to be fair, weren't ninjas ronin that were hired to do the dirty work? I forget where I heard/read that, but that's the impression I've been under for a while now. I think it'd be hilarious/awesome if Luffy's crew picked up a ninja.


Or a dragon.

Ninjas are basically mercenary spies so most of them don't have strict affiliations. Though the famous ninja clans tends to link themselves with a daimiyo.

Ronin are samurai who has lost their clans/masters and in search of a new lord so they are still technically viewed as samurais unless they clears up the issue.

[ronin myael]

Originally Posted by Hisoka??

Well, I like the cursed sword idea, but if you consider the fact that there are 2 (essentially) stronger versions of the same sword around, it just lends itself to being replaced. That, or zoro reaches a level where what weapon he uses doesn't matter.

As for Wado ichimonji, I foresee him giving it to Tagishi (spelling) as either a way of entrusting his faith in her way of justice or as an expression of his feeling (shipping =p). And then he gets one of the top tier of swords.

we don't know where those two other swords are. if kitetsu is indeed based on muramasa, the others might have been destroyed. sandai kitetsu might be the only kitetsu in existence. besides, i doubt zoro would replace that sword unless it breaks. it may be a "problem child" but he likes it. it suits him too i think.

as for wado ichimonji, well that could be a possibility. or maybe he would end up returning it to his master the moment he fulfills his ambition.

But to be fair, weren't ninjas ronin that were hired to do the dirty work? I forget where I heard/read that, but that's the impression I've been under for a while now. I think it'd be hilarious/awesome if Luffy's crew picked up a ninja.

the name ronin were given to masterless samurai. ninja were mercenaries for hire just like undertaker said. they had no real ties or loyalties except maybe for their clan or village. but there were some rogue ninja who only worked for themselves. they were the ones that daimyo would hire for recon or assassination missions that the samurai deemed beneath them or too dishonorable for them. that's why the samurai hated the ninja. the ninja were willing to do just about anything just to accomplish a mission. they specialized in stealth, deception and manipulation. while the samurai held themselves as honorable warriors who followed a code.