Macross Delta - Character Discussion - Hayate Immelmann

[Kairin]

The purpose of this thread is to provide a place to discuss all things Hayate Immelmann related.
To keep the discussion enjoyable for all Macross fans, please follow the guidelines below and stay on-topic!

Note: Please don't use this for the specifics (i.e. episode, chapter, game, etc. discussion) there are other threads for that stuff.

Thread Guidelines

• No campaigning!
  No "hate" or "xyz must die" posts. Discuss why you do or don't like characters without whinging and whining or blatantly campaigning for your favourite.
  
  
• Be polite to your fellow forum members.
  Do not insult or harass other members for their likes and dislikes. Do not take it so seriously that you end up in an argument with another forum member because they express a fondness for a character you loathe. Discussion and good spirited banter are always welcome, but harassing people will not be tolerated.
  
  
• Discuss, don't chat.
  Please remember that AnimeSuki is a discussion forum, not a chat room, there is a difference. If you wish to chat, then please make use of our IRC channel.
  
  
• Have fun, but post intelligently.
  It's great to have fun, but please try your best to add substance to what you post and make your thoughts interesting for the generation of fans that will follow after you’re long gone and on to watching some other series.
  
  
• Use Spoiler tags!
  Spoilers are allowed, but they must be enclosed in spoiler tags clearly marked with a proper title. Failure to do this can result in a BAN.
  
  
  • Adding a Spoiler tag:
    

    Just highlight your spoiler and click the button found on the "Quick Reply" and "Reply to Thread" forms. Make sure that you include a title for the spoiler!

    
    
  • Please use the Report button if you see any spoilers:
    

    Click the button found to the left of the post, just under the poster's avatar. Using the Report button is anonymous and helps the Moderators to locate and deal with problems quickly.

    
    
  • Posting prohibited spoilers may result in a ban.
    Note: Reporting a post does not mean the poster will be banned instantly. The Moderators will use bans if warnings are repeatedly ignored.

[charles883]

Is it just me or Hayate is younger version of Isamu

[magnuskn]

Hrm, maybe. I don't think he'll keep the "I'm irresponsible" attitude for all that long.

[Tenzen12]

If nothing else he take his job protecting Walkure (Freya) pretty seriously...

[Shinji103]

Hayate is nothing like Isamu. Hayate's irresponsible behavior comes from his former lack of passion. As he told Freya, he went all around looking for something he enjoyed but couldn't find it. That's why he was always half-baked about his jobs, because he wasn't motivated by anything and he had given up on finding something he could feel passionate about. He may have found that now, but a person can't just change how they act on a whim.
Isamu had found his passion long ago; he was just wild, overconfident, and disrespectful.

Incidentally, the aforementioned passion is why I think Freya is going to win the triangle. (Besides all the focus in the OP, ED, and episodes that Freya gets and the huge lead she has on Mirage) She gave him the passion that he'd been looking for for so long. Mirage is going to have to do something pretty drastic to top that. At this point, Mirage's best chance is if Freya is temporarily removed from the picture (captured by the Aerial Knights or something) so Mirage can gain some ground. But I hope Freya isn't captured; I hate the abuse of the Damsel in Distress shtick. -_-

[Tenzen12]

Well it's possible that Freya will be winner this time around, but not because she has better starting position. That's something that was never relevant, be it Minmay or Ranka.

Also OP is more of Mirage centered. Just saying.

[Shinji103]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Well it's possible that Freya will be winner this time around, but not because she has better starting position.

That's pretty much what I just said with the whole Freya giving Hayate his passion thing.

Also OP is more of Mirage centered. Just saying.

Not really. One of the first scenes in the OP is Hayate and Freya together. Then Mirage gets her own scene by herself after that before the flight scene with her and Hayate.

[Tenzen12]

It's still not enough to be determining factor, it's just starting bonus.

As for opening, there is as you yourself noted flight scene (which has same or greater weight than Freya x Hayato scene), than we got another Hayato x Mirage scene with Freya background to conclude whole thing with putting Mirage first in whole triangle shot.

[Shinji103]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

It's still not enough to be determining factor, it's just starting bonus.

Seriously? Wow.
She practically changed his life and gave him exactly what he'd wanted and been looking for, and had given up on finding. If you can't see how significant that is to a person, there isn't much point in continuing this.

As for opening, there is as you yourself noted flight scene (which has same or greater weight than Freya x Hayato scene), than we got another Hayato x Mirage scene with Freya background to conclude whole thing with putting Mirage first in whole triangle shot.

I knew you were going to bring that up. -_- That other scene was really about the Walkure and their singing, and I honestly don't know why Hayate and Mirage were there in that scene of the OP at all. You didn't see Freya or any of the other Walkure in the background of Hayate and Mirage's flight scene. Same principle.

[Lhklan]

I'm ... Not so sure that Freyja is the one that gave him the thing he's looking for. Tone precise, right now I think it's like this: Freyja gave him the clue - flying, Arad open the door - invite him to Walkure while Mirage gave him the means - teaching him how to pilot the VF in all mode and not just Battroid mode

[lars18th]

I Find Hayate one of the most poorly developed characters in the show up until now.
I honestly feel that his plot would be more bearable if Arado would just step up and say "I had to hire him and give him a plane because he is the main character of the show and that is what we do to main characters"

Here, I will lay it out:

- Hayate is personally invited for job interview at Macross Elysion.

- Side character points out Hayate's work record is a failure.

- Hayate points out "Hey YOU called me here so you are clearly more interested in hiring me than I care because I am that kind of guy who just dgaf"(even though clearly I have no job, no family and should be pretty concerned about being able to... ya know, survive)

- Some silly semi-suicidal tendency is displayed and becomes highly over-rated (omg! you have the ability to predict wind! this will come in super handy in space. All hands! Bend over to this teenager now!).

- Hayate spits at everyone's face by pointing out he hates the military (inside a military base)

- Instead of getting offended, Arado agrees with him... (yeah rebels are so cool, I want to be a rebel too)

- Then Hayate points out, just to be completely honest: HE WILL NOT FOLLOW ANYONE'S ORDERS

- Arado finds that a reasonable statement as well and looks quite happy.

- GRATS! Hayate now gets to be a real main character and fly a Valkyrie!

Did anyone actually like that scene? Seriously?
I find it lame to compare him to Isamu.
Surely Isamu was a very carefree individual who enjoy life to the fullest at the expense of being quite irresponsible sometimes but that is what made him get pushed into his gig as a test pilot.
The chain of events that led Isamu to be where he was actually made sense.
Up until now we have to swallow the "Arado saw something in him" line which is beyond cliche and simply not enough to put Hayate where he is.

[Tenzen12]

But he doesn't transform into magical girl!

[lars18th]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

But he doesn't transform into magical girl!

His saving grace! Hired!

[Tak]

You guys are giving me 'is this a zombie' vibes...

- Tak

[Tenzen12]

Well, I did consider write it as "Masou Shoujo"

[azarhal]

These forums need a likes buttons.

I don't think Arad hired Hayate because he though he found a great pilot. He didn't even saw him fly, just dance...and in episode 4 we learn he haven't explained the ins and outs of Delta yet to him either.

I'm starting to think that he hired him just to piss off Mirage at this point.

[Tenzen12]

He saw potential, which is pretty big thing. As for explaining, he delegated it to excellent and reliable instructor Mirage so there is absolutely no problem.

Well, if Hayate were unusable, he would be kicked out and he barely avoided that, mind you.

[Darthtabby]

Originally Posted by lars18th

I Find Hayate one of the most poorly developed characters in the show up until now.
I honestly feel that his plot would be more bearable if Arado would just step up and say "I had to hire him and give him a plane because he is the main character of the show and that is what we do to main characters"

Here, I will lay it out:

- Hayate is personally invited for job interview at Macross Elysion.

- Side character points out Hayate's work record is a failure.

- Hayate points out "Hey YOU called me here so you are clearly more interested in hiring me than I care because I am that kind of guy who just dgaf"(even though clearly I have no job, no family and should be pretty concerned about being able to... ya know, survive)

- Some silly semi-suicidal tendency is displayed and becomes highly over-rated (omg! you have the ability to predict wind! this will come in super handy in space. All hands! Bend over to this teenager now!).

- Hayate spits at everyone's face by pointing out he hates the military (inside a military base)

- Instead of getting offended, Arado agrees with him... (yeah rebels are so cool, I want to be a rebel too)

- Then Hayate points out, just to be completely honest: HE WILL NOT FOLLOW ANYONE'S ORDERS

- Arado finds that a reasonable statement as well and looks quite happy.

- GRATS! Hayate now gets to be a real main character and fly a Valkyrie!

Did anyone actually like that scene? Seriously?
I find it lame to compare him to Isamu.
Surely Isamu was a very carefree individual who enjoy life to the fullest at the expense of being quite irresponsible sometimes but that is what made him get pushed into his gig as a test pilot.
The chain of events that led Isamu to be where he was actually made sense.
Up until now we have to swallow the "Arado saw something in him" line which is beyond cliche and simply not enough to put Hayate where he is.

I really like Delta, but I do have to agree that bit was rather whaaaat? It bugged me way more than the magical girl inspired transformation sequences, which I consider merely a minor stylistic touch.

[magnuskn]

Yeah, let's say that the hiring process was way more out there than what happened to Alto, who showed some pretty damn impressive skill and a willingness to follow orders for the good of Frontier (subliminated into an overwhelming urge to protect Ranka, because of his issues with feeling trapped on Frontier).

Damn, I miss Alto.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Well it's possible that Freya will be winner this time around, but not because she has better starting position. That's something that was never relevant, be it Minmay or Ranka.

Minmay-Hikaru-Misa triangle is a little controversial to bring here, because it wasn't a traditional triangle (Minmay's feelings weren't real love, iirc). So was Hikaru choosing Misa over Minmay because he loved her more or because she was her only real option? That has always been the question.

However, Ranka never had a lead on Sheryl in the beginning. Sheryl was even the one who gives Ranka and Alto the push for both of them to start living their dreams and

Spoiler for movie spoilers:

she's the one who gives Alto the dream of sky in the movie which conclusively ends with her victory.

Ranka only gained a 'lead' in the triangle after episode 11, before that she was overshadowed by Sheryl at every turn. Sara Nome also always had the lead, no contest.

Of course, this time could be different from the obvious winners with a massive lead. I'm not ruling out anything because the romantic development hasn't even begun yet.

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Also OP is more of Mirage centered. Just saying.

Huh? Freyja appears the most in the OP and Freyja occupies Sheryl's place in the shot out to frontier first OP trio standing (it's the same protagonist's Valkyrie + trio + Macross still). Not to mention the song seems to be more about Freyja's feelings because of the urgency in the lyrics, like she was running out time while the Frontier opening was about a love triangle.