2009-12-18, 00:25 | Link #6942 |
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And Code Geass sure as hell had it's share of them (probably one of the reasons people hate it so much) The Karma Houdinis of Code Geass, IMO, include, but are not limited to:
-Nina -Villetta -Ougi -Schneizel -Rolo (Yes, he died, but it was with respect and meaning. Much better than he deserved). -Cornelia |
2009-12-18, 00:35 | Link #6943 |
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Join Date: May 2009
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-and definitely Suzaku (having to be Zero until he dies does not excuse him murdering millions of people in Tokyo, he knew about his "you must live" Geass at that point and yet he still went ahead and piloted the FLEIJA armed Lancelot)
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2009-12-18, 00:41 | Link #6944 | |
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2009-12-18, 00:42 | Link #6945 | |
Spinning Lotus
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Which sort of brings me to a tangent: what's with Nunnally's attitude in Turn 6? I mean, I can understand being upset about Clovis' death, but Euphie's? Either Nunnally is terribly ignorant of her sister's activites, which she cannot possibly be, or completely callous about what happened. It doesn't make sense.
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2009-12-18, 00:48 | Link #6946 |
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Her just nuking at random is the only reason I would add her in. There is a difference in warfare between soldiers and firing weapons of mass destruction that just erase away everything. She'd be on the very bottom of the list though for blindly pushing a button when Schneizel said to fire away. It was also pretty bad that she agreed to having Pandragon blown away, even if she was convinced that it was 'forewarned...'
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2009-12-18, 01:27 | Link #6947 | ||
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As for Schneizel, he was consigned to a Fate Worse Than Death. Quote:
What was really odd was how she publicly lamented the death of Calares. |
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2009-12-18, 02:51 | Link #6948 | ||
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2009-12-18, 03:06 | Link #6949 | ||||
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Though much like Kallen, she will have to spend her life perpetuating the lie about Lelouch in order to honor his name. Realistically, the life she will lead (Empress of half the world) should erode her heart and crush her psyche regardless of how peaceful the era is, but it is evident that realism and consistency took a back seat to make the last arc work, and give everyone their happy endings. Quote:
Schneizel by definition had no desires for anything including his own life. His fate is to be magically given a single all consuming desire, which he will get to spend the rest of his life fulfilling. A lifetime of guaranteed Self Actualization is not what I call punishment. And. How. Has Noone. Mentioned. GINO?!?!?! *twitches violently* Last edited by Betteroffer; 2009-12-18 at 03:17. |
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2009-12-18, 03:20 | Link #6950 | |
Spinning Lotus
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Because he's too stupid and lacks any sort of responsibility to qualify. One time he suggests committing a massacre, which shows he's obviously ok with it, but he's the follow the leader type and doesn't make any of the decisions. He's basically your average grunt in a fancy uniform.
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2009-12-18, 03:24 | Link #6951 |
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Yeah, pretty much what morbos. I'm pretty "meh" about Gino. Yeah, he was a Brittanian (which automatically makes him evil incarnate blah blah blah) and he did some disagreeable stuff, but no worse than most of the Britannians we saw.
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2009-12-18, 03:25 | Link #6952 |
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Join Date: Feb 2008
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I think it was stated somewhere that Lelouch's Geassed slaves were poor pilots due to the Geass forcing them to die like lemmings for their master and otherwise causing problems with their thoughts. Which is why the only Britannian units actually doing well were the ones that weren't Geassed, which was basically Suzaku and Jeremiah.
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2009-12-18, 03:30 | Link #6953 |
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True, but it's just irritating to see people laud him as this "exception to the rule" of Britannia when he clearly isn't. I suppose it's the same way you and many other Shirley fans feel about Rolo getting praise and love despite what he did to her.
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2009-12-18, 03:52 | Link #6954 | |
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As for Rolo, yeah I guess it's more or less the same. Of course, I fail to see what Gino did that was worse than anything Rolo did (unless you want to make the argument that Rolo was a victim of brainwashing/unstable mental development, but I don't really buy that). |
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2009-12-18, 04:06 | Link #6955 |
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Actually there were one or two people awhile back on these forums, though there are a also a few other places where people have made comments to that effect.
Some of the things Gino did were attacking his own allies during a heightened terror alert, the massacre comment, his happily going along with letting the Eunuchs kill the Tianzi (I'm not saying I expected him to rebel there, just that he should have given a line or two saying he was aware of and at least slightly bothered by the fact that they were intentionally going to kill a 13 year old girl), implying he would get Kallen pardoned if she simply accepted her Stadtfeld identity, abadnoning Suzaku and the disaster stricken Tokyo settlement in favor of a rousing game of pool, turning on Suzaku rather than consider that he may have been traumatized from using the FLEIJA, and rebeling against Lelouch when he was still playing the Emperor of Justice. Not saying these things are better or worse than what Rolo has done, just that these actions don't strike me as making Gino anything other than a normal Britannian. |
2009-12-18, 04:12 | Link #6956 | |
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Gino was a little too happy-go-lucky to be all that despicable, though for one thing, he didn't seem too averse to behind the back tactics/assaults, like when he killed Senba in R2 6, or tried doing the same to Xing-ke when the latter was shielding Empress Tianzi. |
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2009-12-18, 04:23 | Link #6957 |
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To avoid being a Karma Houdini, one doesn't have to repent, so much as not get punished in some form, and Cornelia did infact lose almost all of her family, only to watch their killer become a hero (we aren't sure she knows Schneizel was Geassed). Euphemia's death alone should take Cornelia far away from the Karma Houdini category. Whether or not these punishments are sufficient depends on the viewer, as I think she got off lighter than she should have, but I don't think it's fair to put her in the Houdini category.
I agree with you on Gino being a back-attack guy, though I don't really hold that against him, as it's more in keeping with being an efficient soldier, though I wouldn't consider him anything close to 'honorable' (something else I've seen people call him). |
2009-12-18, 07:46 | Link #6959 |
Um-Shmum
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come on
you have a HUGE list of people here that you say are karma hudini not because they didnt pay at all (which is the TRUE definition of karma hudini) but because they didnt pay "enough" in the eyes of the one making the claim thats hardly fair, because in some cases, its litteraly impossible to pay enough nina can spend her life curing cancer and HIV and still never make up for everything she's guilty of suzaku's the same (he has a death toll in the tens of millions) and nunnaly is also beyond the point of equal trade and even lelouch, who actually DIED to make up for it, is hardly in the clear simply because the numbers CANT match up no matter what you do you cant just say "they suffered SOME, but not enough to avoid being karma hudini" the whole point of a karma hudini is that they do all the stuff they did, AND GOT AWAY WITH IT CLEAN by my book, all it takes is basiclly two factors to avoid being a karma hudini 1)honest repentence about your actions (key factor) 2)having suffered, as a result of them/having taken considerable actions to undo the harm, or otherwise improve the world as payment for ones actions in that regard, Schneizel is NOT a karma hudini, because he got whats coming to him he is a slave for all of his life (pretty much a fate worse then death) suzaku nunnaly and nina also are not karma hudini because nina and suzaku both did everything they could to prevent a greater catastrophy and make the world a better place and nunnaly ended up losing the one person in the world who matters the most to her, and is seemingly try to improve the world in the epilouge ougi is debetable, not simply because he didnt really "got away with it" (almost got killed, and thrown in jail for a few months) but because its debatable if his actions actually WARRENT a karmic retrebution beyond what he actually GOT (remember, ougi was stupid, not evil) the only ones who truely count are cornellia, villeta (although, being married to ougi might count ) and gino's just an idiot he didnt actually do anything to truely warrent a karmic retrebution beyond just generally being an idiot who's fighting on the wrong side of a war
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2009-12-18, 11:11 | Link #6960 |
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Oghi actually got rewarded in spite of his screwups. Some sort of averted karma trope applies, at the very least.
Even though he never was all that honorable for reasons just mentioned, I've also agreed that Gino was too simple-minded to qualify. |
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