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View Poll Results: Tate no Yuusha/Shield Hero - Episode 14 Rating
Perfect 10 1 7.69%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 2 15.38%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 8 61.54%
7 out of 10 : Good 1 7.69%
6 out of 10 : Average 1 7.69%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 13. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2019-04-11, 10:37   Link #21
Kanon
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Join Date: Jun 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dharma View Post
Yep. But note how his behavior echoes Myne's. I am getting the same vibe here as with Naofumi framing: things does not making sense to me. Which imply that I don't know something important about situation. Or just bad plot. Not really sure about this case yet - there is some promise but also some disappointments.

Spoiler for Speculations for explanation, somewhat high probability to be spoilers:
At this point the best way for this to make sense is what you said. I'd the church is the most likely culprit, what with Idol making a point to show his cross. They're also the only one with enough influence over the masses, including the nobles and the soldiers, to carry that out. The true mastermind is probably Myne though, she's just using them to get what she wants. And they in turn probably think they're using her.
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Old 2019-04-11, 11:03   Link #22
The Green One
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The question is who is the Church supporting? Is it Myne? The King? Both? Or is it a full on rebellion and coup and they want power for themselves? There's got to be some sort of end game here.
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Old 2019-04-11, 11:27   Link #23
Dengar
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If you have problems understanding why a noble could just waltz into another noble's territory and take him captive, then uhh, how do I put this... Not all nobles are equal.
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Old 2019-04-11, 15:29   Link #24
Dharma
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
At this point the best way for this to make sense is what you said. I'd the church is the most likely culprit, what with Idol making a point to show his cross. They're also the only one with enough influence over the masses, including the nobles and the soldiers, to carry that out. The true mastermind is probably Myne though, she's just using them to get what she wants. And they in turn probably think they're using her.
Hmm, my take is a bit different. Myne does not seem to be clever enough to be the mastermind but yes, she may be the driving force behind the events. Catalyst of sort. But to catalyze you need reagents, what are they?
Spoiler for Probably overthinking the plot, maybe spoiler:

So the question for me does Myne just got lucky with the situation or is there someone else pulling the strings behind the scene? Realistically I'd say first but there is matter of waves. Strange factor that makes no sense for me. May be there is still more than meets the eye.
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Old 2019-04-11, 16:02   Link #25
Kinematics
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frodonk
If the skinny guy's arrest was too easy because he only had 3 maids with him, it was also too easy for all those demi-humans from his territory to storm the fat guy's castle, right up to his front gate!
BWTraveller and Dengar covered most of the problem points, but I want to note that the demi-humans did not get to Idol's front gate. They only got to the gate that protects the bridge over the chasm that surrounds the keep, which is itself surrounded by a major wall. They were about three levels removed from being anything resembling an actual threat. There was nothing preventing them from getting to that point, so of course it's "easy". It's like saying it's too easy to walk up to the front door of the grocery store (whether the store is opened or closed). It's a meaningless objection.
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Old 2019-04-12, 00:05   Link #26
cyberdemon
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my god he procreated

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Old 2019-04-12, 03:47   Link #27
The Green One
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With what? A Female Elmer Fudd considering the way Charmless talks?

Well anyway, back on topic.

Melty herself revealed her motivation to Naofumi. She's feeling guilty she hasn't been able to do more to stop what's going on as she feels responsible as the heir to the throne that she should be able to make this stop and is frustrated that she can't figure out how. She thinks her mother is counting on her to resolve the situation and wants to live up to her mother's faith in her. She's ashamed to hear about what a group of Melomarc soliders did to Raphatalia's destroyed village. She meant well but as a child she was naive enough not to realize that instead of taking her back to the Capital to confront her father and put and end to this that the tub of lard might have other plans for her instead and didn't realize the position she put herself into until it was too late. It's not that Melty's an idiot, she just isn't experienced enough yet. I mean she's a child. I can't think she's more than 12 at best. These last two episodes have tried to highlight that Melty is a little girl in WAY over her head.
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Old 2019-04-12, 11:03   Link #28
frodonk
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Originally Posted by BWTraveller View Post
Depends on his power and influence. Considering the current political environment he's probably got a fair degree of influence, and if he'd gotten some inkling that Melty might be there, he'd have prerogative. The guy appears to run a fairly small, largely rural territory, and with his unpopular position he probably couldn't just stand against him and refuse entry or anything. It'd just give him more fuel to claim some sort of collusion. It's all a matter of how much political power and prestige he has. There certainly are some who can throw their weight around like that. Especially if they have some sort of background of achievements to further bolster their position.
This might be the case here, but I don't know and haven't seen enough to say for sure that this is the correct explanation. We'll see in the next episode since that might also focus on how Idol got to where he is now.

Quote:
To protect Naofumi and Melty. If he saves his own backside, he leaves Naofumi and Melty defenseless in a position where even if they escape they'll still pinpoint their location and thus their route. No matter how things work out they'd be in even more danger. Not to mention that Melty is in the hands of a man who at the very least BELIEVES he has enough power to get away with anything up to and including killing a princess whose political position is inconvenient to him and framing a guy who he can't confirm was present (though the top-ranking nobles will automatically believe and insist must have been). Escaping would be worse for her yet again.

Not to mention his people. If he fled, this could be used against him to push him out much faster than if he stood up for himself and claimed no knowledge of the Shield's presence. Flight would be taken as confirmation of guilt and leave his people in a very vulnerable state, while enduring this torment and insisting no involvement gives him a better chance at maintaining his position and thus protecting everyone.
It's possible that this skill of his was mentioned now and will be useful later on. Yeah I might've been too hasty since this arc isn't over yet.

Quote:
There's a huge difference between believing in one bad apple who deceives others, tricks them into colluding with her and does what she wants and recognizing that the nobility is filled with people who are just as bad. And it takes even more to believe that a noble would be so very arrogant, sure of his security and determined to get what he wants that he'd risk raising a hand against her. She recognizes that there's a bad apple in the government and some negative prejudices, she doesn't recognize that there are people like this.
I was basing how I expected Melty to react on what Nao did when he learned about what Myne's accusation. I guess Nao really is the only emo kid in all this and Melty handled her sister's betrayal better than Nao did.

Quote:
That was Naofumi's goal. Melty wanted to protect him and secure the party's safety more. She wanted them to just pack up and run while she took a shot that Idol would take her to the king (again she knows her sister's a bad person, but not that there's tons of others just as bad), not for them to just hide long enough to regroup and come to her rescue.
Melty had a deathwish and wanted Nao/raccoon/turkey to live, got it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Green One View Post
Melty herself revealed her motivation to Naofumi. She's feeling guilty she hasn't been able to do more to stop what's going on as she feels responsible as the heir to the throne that she should be able to make this stop and is frustrated that she can't figure out how. She thinks her mother is counting on her to resolve the situation and wants to live up to her mother's faith in her. She's ashamed to hear about what a group of Melomarc soliders did to Raphatalia's destroyed village. She meant well but as a child she was naive enough not to realize that instead of taking her back to the Capital to confront her father and put and end to this that the tub of lard might have other plans for her instead and didn't realize the position she put herself into until it was too late. It's not that Melty's an idiot, she just isn't experienced enough yet. I mean she's a child. I can't think she's more than 12 at best. These last two episodes have tried to highlight that Melty is a little girl in WAY over her head.
Yeah I agree. I hope that Melty stops doing these things though, they create more problems for everyone lol.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dengar View Post
If you have problems understanding why a noble could just waltz into another noble's territory and take him captive, then uhh, how do I put this... Not all nobles are equal.
We haven't even seen actual nobles outside of the royal family and the capital before this episode, let alone know how they're organized into their territories or whatever. I apologize for not being savvy enough to instantly understand why a noble didn't even have a single soldier/bodyguard with him and all he had were 3 maids.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kinematics View Post
BWTraveller and Dengar covered most of the problem points, but I want to note that the demi-humans did not get to Idol's front gate. They only got to the gate that protects the bridge over the chasm that surrounds the keep, which is itself surrounded by a major wall. They were about three levels removed from being anything resembling an actual threat. There was nothing preventing them from getting to that point, so of course it's "easy". It's like saying it's too easy to walk up to the front door of the grocery store (whether the store is opened or closed). It's a meaningless objection.
Point is it was still awfully close to the castle deep inside Idol's territory. If you arrested a neighboring territory's lord and expected the peasants to march towards your keep to demand their lord back then you would've at least put up checkpoints or patrols or something before a large mob arrived awfully close to your castle/mansion/keep.
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Old 2019-04-12, 12:53   Link #29
maximilianjenus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frodonk View Post
Point is it was still awfully close to the castle deep inside Idol's territory. If you arrested a neighboring territory's lord and expected the peasants to march towards your keep to demand their lord back then you would've at least put up checkpoints or patrols or something before a large mob arrived awfully close to your castle/mansion/keep.
That's not how castles work; you can to use the castle superiority; not make our soldiers unprotected in a checkpoint; this is not a gun zone .
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Old 2019-04-12, 16:59   Link #30
Dengar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frodonk View Post
We haven't even seen actual nobles outside of the royal family and the capital before this episode, let alone know how they're organized into their territories or whatever. I apologize for not being savvy enough to instantly understand why a noble didn't even have a single soldier/bodyguard with him and all he had were 3 maids.
It's nothing worth apologizing for. It's just that not every noble actually can afford an army of soldiers.
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Old 2019-04-12, 21:25   Link #31
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Originally Posted by frodonk View Post
I was basing how I expected Melty to react on what Nao did when he learned about what Myne's accusation. I guess Nao really is the only emo kid in all this and Melty handled her sister's betrayal better than Nao did.
Gotta bear in mind that she's had a decade to get used to her sister's nature. To Naofumi she was a complete stranger and the first and only person to treat him warmly, and then suddenly turned into a monster who'd throw the most heinous accusations at him just to get a little extra money and a little more favor with the popular Spear, so this was a huge shock. To Melty she was a selfish, shortsighted sociopath who resents being replaced as heir to the throne who finally decided to go ahead and get rid of her. It goes down a whole lot easier when you already know the person you're dealing with eats live puppy hearts for dessert.

And as far as the peasants' ability to come straight up to his castle, as Maximilian mentioned, it's a matter of how castles work. Generally speaking in feudal societies nobles don't have huge armies watching the entirety of their territory at all times. The vast majority of his military would likely either be in the castle itself or abroad serving the king or overlord. A sizable and well-organized army would be reported fairly quickly but not a moderate-sized band of commoners with pitchforks, and either way they'd most likely defend themselves from the well-fortified castle rather than risk men's lives in open battle.
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Old 2019-04-13, 02:27   Link #32
frodonk
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Gotta bear in mind that she's had a decade to get used to her sister's nature. To Naofumi she was a complete stranger and the first and only person to treat him warmly, and then suddenly turned into a monster who'd throw the most heinous accusations at him just to get a little extra money and a little more favor with the popular Spear, so this was a huge shock. To Melty she was a selfish, shortsighted sociopath who resents being replaced as heir to the throne who finally decided to go ahead and get rid of her. It goes down a whole lot easier when you already know the person you're dealing with eats live puppy hearts for dessert.
This is assuming that Melty already has knowledge of how awful her sister is before all this. Other than Malty being a "problem child" since she was little, I didn't get the impression anybody knew how evil Malty/Myne is since she only acts like a cartoon villain when the Shield is involved.

Quote:
And as far as the peasants' ability to come straight up to his castle, as Maximilian mentioned, it's a matter of how castles work. Generally speaking in feudal societies nobles don't have huge armies watching the entirety of their territory at all times. The vast majority of his military would likely either be in the castle itself or abroad serving the king or overlord. A sizable and well-organized army would be reported fairly quickly but not a moderate-sized band of commoners with pitchforks, and either way they'd most likely defend themselves from the well-fortified castle rather than risk men's lives in open battle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maximilianjenus View Post
That's not how castles work; you can to use the castle superiority; not make our soldiers unprotected in a checkpoint; this is not a gun zone .
Yeah, my knowledge of medieval fortifications is not that good, sorry!
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Old 2019-04-13, 10:53   Link #33
maximilianjenus
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Originally Posted by frodonk View Post
This is assuming that Melty already has knowledge of how awful her sister is before all this. Other than Malty being a "problem child" since she was little, I didn't get the impression anybody knew how evil Malty/Myne is since she only acts like a cartoon villain when the Shield is involved.
That's a decent assumption, but it could be wrong, we mostly see Melty when the shield hero is there, but she could perfectly act like a cartoon villain with other people, it might not be too far fetched to assume she does, since she lost her rights to sucession before the shield hero even existed in her world.
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Old 2019-04-13, 11:06   Link #34
The Green One
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Most of the people who Myne interacts with on any regular basis are her inferior in social status. So when she tells someone to do something they're going to hop to it because legally they have to do what she says. So most people aren't going to dare defy her. It's when she encounters the few people who have enough power to not have to hop when she says jump or just have nothing left to lose and doesn't give a frick anymore does her real personality come out.
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Old 2019-04-13, 19:11   Link #35
frodonk
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Originally Posted by maximilianjenus View Post
That's a decent assumption, but it could be wrong, we mostly see Melty when the shield hero is there, but she could perfectly act like a cartoon villain with other people, it might not be too far fetched to assume she does, since she lost her rights to sucession before the shield hero even existed in her world.
Given that we know almost nothing about the queen at this point, I just hope we get a rational explanation as to why Malty is this evil and why she isn't the crown princess.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Green One View Post
Most of the people who Myne interacts with on any regular basis are her inferior in social status. So when she tells someone to do something they're going to hop to it because legally they have to do what she says. So most people aren't going to dare defy her. It's when she encounters the few people who have enough power to not have to hop when she says jump or just have nothing left to lose and doesn't give a frick anymore does her real personality come out.
I wonder what the interaction between Myne and the Queen is like, she's one of the few people she can't boss around
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Old 2019-04-15, 07:38   Link #36
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catch up with this series, and letting aside the plot is a bit conveniently over the place, and there's too much stupidity going around, it's generally so far so good.

Anyways, speaking of Myne I think that before the waves she was mean but not a villain as she is now, the levels she reached are over the top. There was not the reason nor the chance to do so. That, aside for the reason she got ousted on which I'll refrain making speculations because we have still too little knowledge about the reign. I mean, this fact alone, Myne removal from the line of succession, is quite anomalous. As much as the Queen being exiled given the context they are in, a matriarchal society. I'm expecting the two events to be strictly related. Last, the king who was once not royalty, and likely not even nobility. Speaking of which, did I get it wrong or he said something about a previous shield hero? So that's not the first time the waves came?
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Old 2019-04-16, 05:03   Link #37
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The waves had to have happened before in order for their to be a previous Shield Hero and Summoning ritual, right?
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Old 2019-04-16, 19:33   Link #38
Kinematics
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The waves had to have happened before in order for their to be a previous Shield Hero and Summoning ritual, right?
That's correct.
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Old 2019-04-16, 20:32   Link #39
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Originally Posted by Arya View Post
catch up with this series, and letting aside the plot is a bit conveniently over the place, and there's too much stupidity going around, it's generally so far so good.

Anyways, speaking of Myne I think that before the waves she was mean but not a villain as she is now, the levels she reached are over the top. There was not the reason nor the chance to do so. That, aside for the reason she got ousted on which I'll refrain making speculations because we have still too little knowledge about the reign. I mean, this fact alone, Myne removal from the line of succession, is quite anomalous. As much as the Queen being exiled given the context they are in, a matriarchal society. I'm expecting the two events to be strictly related. Last, the king who was once not royalty, and likely not even nobility. Speaking of which, did I get it wrong or he said something about a previous shield hero? So that's not the first time the waves came?
I don't think the Queen was "exiled". She's just travelling through other countries for diplomatic negotiations of some sort. If she was exiled the Shadows wouldn't answer to her, her word would not have such instant authority as seen in the show, her designation of heir would have no weight and even if it did Melty wouldn't have a responsibility to follow her orders. It's made pretty clear throughout that the queen is still in power, she just happened to be visiting other countries for various reasons.

And yes there was at least one previous Shield mentioned, but again how long ago this was has not been stated. The fact that the Church has managed to develop an entire religious belief centered around three and demonizing the fourth suggests to me that it'd been at least a few generations. Dogma doesn't change that quickly, so it'd take a bit for them to erase the historic knowledge of the predecessor's achievements and replace them with whatever "demonic" acts they came up with.
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Old 2019-04-17, 03:19   Link #40
Arya
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Originally Posted by BWTraveller View Post
I don't think the Queen was "exiled". She's just travelling through other countries for diplomatic negotiations of some sort. If she was exiled the Shadows wouldn't answer to her, her word would not have such instant authority as seen in the show, her designation of heir would have no weight and even if it did Melty wouldn't have a responsibility to follow her orders. It's made pretty clear throughout that the queen is still in power, she just happened to be visiting other countries for various reasons.

And yes there was at least one previous Shield mentioned, but again how long ago this was has not been stated. The fact that the Church has managed to develop an entire religious belief centered around three and demonizing the fourth suggests to me that it'd been at least a few generations. Dogma doesn't change that quickly, so it'd take a bit for them to erase the historic knowledge of the predecessor's achievements and replace them with whatever "demonic" acts they came up with.
Well, not formally exiled, but practically. She is not reigning anything, not even when she tries to stop her husband and first daughter villain actions. She has to do it through the Shadows. Why? She is not exercising the power she is supposed to have. She doesn't even act directly or in first person toward the king, her husband, but she uses her daughter.
In regard of being traveling, the castle I remember she was pictured in was a rotten one, for any reason she was there, an odd location to put a Queen in. And the location was always the same iirc.

About the previous Shield I meant that I was under the impression the King met this previous Shield, or in any case he caused the lost of someone he loved, maybe when he was young, so not yet Royalty. The king said something of the likes, moreover linking it with to demi-humans.
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