2015-05-08, 03:43
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I disagree with you all.
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Adamantium is also a vibranium alloy, but different. |
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2015-05-08, 04:22
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Link #343 |
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Juanita/Kiteless
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: New England
Age: 40
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So that extra scene at the credits..."Guess I'll do it myself" *grabs infinity gauntlet*...what is Thanos up to? Did he orchestrate the events of Avengers 2? If so, why? Does he just want to wipe out earth and humanity? If so...lol why? For what reason? Or does he just want to kill all the avengers because he sees them as the only real threat to him dominating the universe?
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2015-05-08, 04:59
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Link #344 |
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Did someone call a doctor
Join Date: Apr 2007
Age: 40
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Thanos is a fan of nihilism, he is (attempting) to court Death (an actual entity in Marvel, one of a few that represent different facets of reality - kinda like Gods, but not really). He believe he can get her love by wiping out all life in the universe. As for 'why earth', his race (Titan) is an offshoot of the original earth 'human' species called the Eternals that fled during a civil war almost 1 million years ago and started a colony on Titan (Saturn's moon). How much of that will be changed in the movie will just have to been seen, because already events and backstories do not match what is in the comics (i.e. Drax the Destroyer). So I guess you could say it is justice from his point of view, also it sends a pretty big message by wiping out what is essentially the cradle of life in the universe.
It's hinted and theorised that he was mind controlling Loki directly through the Mind Gem, and it might be possible to make the same case (indirectly) for Ultron, since mind control is one of his abilities (via telepathy) and his technological knowledge exceeds pretty much anyone. It seems that he is directing other players to move the gems into roughly the one place and is going to 'make an entrance' when he collects them (which seems like a weird thing, but eh, comic strategy). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thanos
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2015-05-08, 16:37
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Link #347 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
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Not many people here are are going to read this, but I might as well write this up anyway for future discussions, so that I have something to refer to the next time I get into a bull-fight about Age of Ultron.
So I came across a rather peculiar video a few minutes ago. At the beginning, I thought it would just be another raging ten year old ranting about how much he hate the movie instead of giving valid reasons, but boy, was I surprised. Though I have to admit, there are a few points the reviewer got slightly wrong, such as Tony's negligence towards the safety of the residence in the tower he destroyed (Tony clarified with Jarvis whether if he could buy out the tower rather than ask about the presence of any civilians, but I feel the reviewer should had at least mentioned that). Let's just do a rundown of the reviewer's criticisms: New Characters Don't Matter in the Grand Scheme of Things - Both true and false While I could see how Patrick Ward (the reviewer) arrived at this conclusion, he's unfortunately uninformed and not really accurate to say the least. Scarlet Witch herself would definitely play a more significant role in future Marvel movies, so the 'grand scheme of things' part wasn't that accurate. That said... In the movie itself, if we don't count the future movies Age of Ultron is shamelessly setting up for, yes, the new characters can be removed and it wouldn't make much of a difference. This isn't really attributed to the twins being boring and generic as the video has suggested, but rather, it's attributed to not enough screentime dedicated to their character development, in my personal opinion. The movie, like the reviewer said, is very congested. Joss tried to cram so many things into one movie that none of the elements were shown long enough for me to care about them, particularly the reason why the twins are so pissed off about Tony Stark. There's a very, very short exposition scene where Quicksilver explains their backstory, but that's it. The only sole interaction between Tony and the twins only involve the one fist-fight in Klaw's factory, and you'll never see any closure or development of this conflict for the rest of the movie. While it's true that Hawkeye tried to convince the twins that Tony isn't the kind of person that they think he is (a scene thinned out to barely one minute), I personally felt they could have done a lot more to flesh out the twins' character development. But this is a minor complaint, to be honest, compared to the far more terrible flaws that plague the movie, as Patrick further explained... The Movie Rushes From One Action Scene to Another - False Compared to the first Avengers, this is actually a pretty tame movie when it comes to action scenes. I was pretty glad that things slowed down just enough for exposition to happen as they reflect on the haunting visions the Scarlet Witch showed them. And of course, there's the pretty awesome foreshadowing into Civil War, where Cap lectures Tony about the consequences of trying to win a war before it begins. However, that kind of 'setting up' leads to the following problem, which is probably the biggest fundamental problem in the MCU yet, one that Patrick accurately pointed out in the video. The Movie Sets Up For Other Movies - True There was a time when Joss Whedon received backlash from Star Wars fans for criticizing "Empire Strikes Back". He said, and I quote, Quote:
"Why was SHIELD taken down?" "Oh yeah, you have to watch both Winter Soldier and Agents of SHIELD to understand what happened in between Avengers 1 and 2." "What's the point of Thor's vision again?" "Oh yeah, it's to set up the final Infinity Gem. You know, the one on Vision's forehead." "What's the point of Andrew Serkis' character?" "Watch Ant-Man to find out." The one tie-in to the rest of the cinematic universe that works was the Civil War foreshadowing, but only because it's related to the theme presented in the movie script. This isn't Guardians of the Galaxy or Infinity War. Don't bring in references to other movies like this is a comic book. This is not a comic book. While the 'setting up' and 'references' might work better behind the pages of a comic book, one usually goes into a movie to enjoy the movie he's watching, not sit through advertisements for the AoS TV show (which is not even that good compared to Daredevil) or future movies. Ironic to what Joss criticized, the entire MCU is one long movie that doesn't end. If you missed Winter Soldier or Guardians of the Galaxy, you would have no idea why SHIELD was taken down, or what the hell an Infinity Gem is in the first place. I thought it was called a Tesseract in the first Avengers? And Andrew Serkis being shoe-horned in was incredibly unbelievable. He appears for a total of five minutes altogether (if you accumulate the total amount of time he appears on screen, it's about four minutes or less), and then he disappears, never to be spoken of again. This is just as bad as those one-off thug bodyguards that appear in Fast and Furious movies. A rule of thumb when it comes to storytelling: Anything that doesn't add to the story shouldn't be in the story. The way these cameos appear as 'set ups' for future movies serve no other purpose than to be Chekhov's gun in the Age of Ultron itself. That's bad writing. Or just shameless advertising. Take your pick. The absolutely worst part of the movie is probably the bar scene where several cameos appear all at the same time to pander to those comic book nerds out there who have the slightest idea who Rhode and Sam Wilson are. Those who merely watched the first Avengers and proceed to watch the sequel will be bored by these random characters who came out of nowhere and interact with each other in some rather boring conversations. Hawkeye's Character Doesn't Really Develop - Slightly True But Largely False While it's true that Hawkeye didn't receive a very satisfying development, that's pretty much a matter of "IMO" perspective. The introduction of a family for Hawkeye was pretty good, I must say, as it made him the more human member of the Avengers. Before this, he was just about as lame as the Black Widow is in both Avengers movies (yes, both, but more on that later). He fades into the background with no interesting personality other than being a forgettable archer bodyguard, and we were supposed to somehow care for him when he got mind-controlled by Loki's magic stick of destiny (without knowledge of his comic book background). Age of Ultron corrects this problem by giving him a more relatable aspect in a world of gods and monsters. If anything, any scene with Hawkeye is easily much better than the rest of the movie altogether... though that's not saying much. Tony's Collateral Damage Unanswered For - True Superheroes might as well be mob bosses or rich celebrities, not just in the MCU, but also in the DCU. They can destroy buildings and kill people in the process, but to answer for any damage done? Per-lease! That's WAY too realistic! This is more of a nitpick than anything else though - it's a nitpick when compared to other movies anyway. Pretty much any generic action movie will have these John Waynes that walk off to the sunset with the girl without any consequence: Transformers, Fast and Furious, The Transporter, Rush Hour, etc. Except Mad Max, of course, but let's not compare these travesties to the Road Warrior. When characters get to do things without consequence or conflict, it becomes a pretty boring piece of fantasy of which its only sake is to pass the two hour while you chew on popcorn. And by 'consequence', of course, I don't mean things that happen to progress the plot (namely "plot-device"). I'm talking about things that make sense in accordance to anyone's sense of logic. When buildings get destroyed, people usually die or get injured, and someone usually has to answer for it. Not the superheroes though, because these glorified celebrities are just way too high and mighty ("For I am mighty") to answer for them. The thing I don't get is why these scenes don't happen, because when you say that "It gets in the way of the plot," how can two lines of dialogue berating Superman or Iron Man for their reckless actions affect the progression of the plot in any way? Ultron Is Not A Compelling Villain True... IMO Remember Ronan? The guy who tries to destroy an entire planet or whatever for the sake of vengeance? Pretty sure I've seen a dozen of his kind in hundreds of action movies out there. Remember that guy from Trigun, who wants to destroy humanity or something because he's a megalomaniac nihilist who thinks humanity is better off dead (as nihilistic villains usually do in accordance with the super villain textbook)? Slap them together and what do you get? Ultron. Though in fact, you could construct this factory-produced machinery from just about dozens and maybe even hundreds of movie villains out there and you would get the same product. Humans need to be destroyed because they are flawed and self-destructive? Ermahgerd, I've never heard of that one before! 'Nuff said indeed, Stan. Why can't this just be a movie solely focusing on Tony facing his inner demons, something which never happened with Iron Man 2's adaptation of "Demon in the Bottle"? At least that would've been more interesting. By the way, Patrick was right in the video about the lack of build-up. Ultron just suddenly decided to wipe out humanity on a whim. Kinda like the soulless Skynet (a forgettable plot-device who also coincidentally fades into the background) from the Terminator movies. No Interesting Character Dynamics/Interaction - False While agreeable to a degree, I can't say that the entire film is devoid of ANY interesting dynamics, as the conversations between Steve and Tony are very interesting, despite setting up for Civil War. Hawkeye's interactions are often interesting. The implication that Steve Rogers might be worthy enough to wield the hammer was another plus (albeit disappointing when it turns out to be another guy who wields it by the end of the movie). So there are a few interactions here that are actually pretty good. Potentially Interesting Social Themes Overshadowed by Mindless Action - Very True The whole idea of Ultron destroying humanity isn't entirely bad. There is a saving grace to Tony making the same mistake Albert Einstein made in history. Humans are the most stupid creatures on Earth, as we don't evolve enough not to repeat history. The atomic bomb that's Ultron itself was created out of good intentions, but it unfortunately became a WMD. And all of that was thrown away for gratuitous action scenes. And of course, set-ups for future movies. Can't forget the latter. Instead of having dialogues of berate about Tony repeating one of history's worst mistakes, we have Thor in angst mode because he can't wait for his next movie, flying off before the good Captain could speak to him. The dialogues present in the movie could have been used to explore the themes of the story, and while it does that, it's done so to a minimum. While it's true that action speaks louder than words, and one shouldn't have to be told outright that creating an atomic bomb might not be the smartest idea, I feel like most of the script can be summed up to two things: - set-ups and references that will only matter in the next few MCU movies - plot-devices to progress the plot without any meaningful depth to the story Why can't we at least have one single mention of Einstein here? Maybe even by the man out of time, Steve Rogers himself? I can't be too harsh on this though, since he did 'hint' at it by talking about people who tried to win wars before they started. Maybe a reference to Einstein? Who knows. And then there's the theme of creating an AI. All we were told by the movie is that Ultron is evil and must be killed. Not incarcerated like a criminal - killed. Because he's just a machine churned out by Hollywood. There goes the potentially interesting storyline about the morality of killing artificial lifeforms. I guess the only time Marvel knows how to deal with these themes is when Netflix or the Russo Brothers work with them. Then their minds would 'click' and a light-bulb appears. It speaks length, really, that for every 5-8 Iron Man/Avengers/Guardians movies, there's only one Winter Soldier and one Daredevil series out there that will appease to the less superficial audiences. Character Interactions That Appear Seemingly Out of Nowhere (AKA Black Widow) - True Even if you have watched the other movies, and probably even the TV show, you won't know why Natasha suddenly has a hard-on for the big green... yeah, let's carry on before things get too crude around here. It's a PG-13 movie after all. Language! SHIELD is reformed like nothing happened - False Watch the TV show. You'll know what happens there. Laziness doesn't even begin to describe this. Bunch of Stupid Fanboys Who Will Eat Up Anything They Serve - Probably True This one opinion really depends on the kind of replies I'll receive after this, but I'm willing to bet it's going to be true anyway. Out of 10 times, I probably had a decent conversation about the good and bad parts of Marvel movies... 3 times maybe? This seems to be a trend among anything that's popular on a mass-global scale, so maybe it's just a case of the blind following the blind. Influence spreads like AIDs. For the record though, this doesn't merely apply to Marvel fanboys. Star Wars, DC, anime weeaboos, etc. There should really be a replacement term for 'weeaboo' that applies not just for anime, but for every single franchise out there (yes, I know weeaboo doesn't mean 'blind anime fanboy', but you know it's been used as such very often anyway). That's about all I have to say. I'll save this post as a draft for future discussions I have about Age of Ultron. As for whether if I'll continue supporting Marvel? Not likely. I told myself that Age of Ultron would be my last straw if it doesn't turn out to be good. Seeing the trailer that promised a darker and more meaningful story than "Alien invades New York or wherever" had me interested in future Marvel movies, but after this... not anymore. Even when Civil War comes out, I'll probably put it at a cautionary arm's length as I read reviews on what kind of movie I should expect, not how much the blinded fans praise their precious idol on the high pedestal. As Guardians of the Galaxy proves, the mass opinion might not be the accurate one.
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Last edited by OminousFlare; 2015-05-08 at 18:11. |
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2015-05-08, 17:00
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Link #348 | |
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Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
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2015-05-08, 17:24
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Link #349 | |
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Mizore-chan
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Moe Land
Age: 43
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2015-05-08, 17:56
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Link #350 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
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2015-05-08, 18:40
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Link #351 |
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Juanita/Kiteless
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: New England
Age: 40
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Age of Ultron definitely has flaws and MCU has some flaws (like how every movie has the final act being "everything goes BOOM"), but...heck, I still love MCU and have been enjoying it a lot. I know MCU is not perfect, but I'm definitely a fan of it and really into these movies. They are entertaining and often fun. I'm enjoying MCU. Avengers 2 was really cool with its action and good special effects. Great movie to see in theaters. I said it already, it isn't a very good movie, but it is good action movie. I was disappointed by Age of Ultron, but I intend to keep up with MCU movies as I have been. I anticipate Avengers 3 and hope it is better than Avengers 2.
Like I said, I'm an MCU fan who is enjoying MCU, but the only true gem with MCU movies is Captain America 2. Hands down the current champ for MCU movies. And Thor 2 sucks haha.
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2015-05-08, 18:41
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Link #352 | |
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Not Enough Sleep
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: R'lyeh
Age: 48
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as for Hulk movie, Could be universal wants to get paid without contributing anything.
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2015-05-09, 19:16
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Link #353 | |
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Junior Member
Join Date: May 2013
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2015-05-09, 23:00
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Link #354 | |
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: By that dark and bloody river called Ohio.
Age: 59
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For what it was, it was extremely fun and entertaining. And that's really all it probably should try to be. 
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2015-05-09, 23:24
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Link #355 | |
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Juanita/Kiteless
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: New England
Age: 40
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It may be hard for a future MCU movie to dethrone Captain America 2. It is possible that in the end, Cap 2 stands as the finest MCU movie. I own TWS on blu-ray. Definitely worth owning and having that blu-ray in one's collection. A future MCU movie could dethrone Captain America TWS. It could possibly be Captain America Civil War. I doubt Avengers 3 will. It'll probably be an awesome action movie (I know, split in two parts) and be very epic, but not all around a great movie. Unless they learn from mistakes found in Avengers 2. But I bet Avengers 3 will be pretty much all out action like Avengers 2. We can hope they don't repeat some of the mistakes they made with Avengers 2, though.
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2015-05-11, 00:19
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Link #356 |
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Logician and Romantic
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Within my mind
Age: 43
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An Avengers film can't do much with story, by its very nature it has too many characters. That had always been the case with crossovers. AoU did the best it could under the circumstances, but if you want more depth and polish the solo films are what you want.
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2015-05-11, 22:52
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Link #358 |
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User of the "Fast Draw"
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Canada
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I find it kind of hard to argue the point since I already rank a few of the MCU movies ahead of Winter Soldier. Not that I don't think Winter Soldier was a fantastic movie, because it absolutely was. But I still think the first Iron Man movie is one of the best Marvel has made, I enjoyed Guardians more than Winter Soldier so I'm putting it up there, and depending on how I feel the movie holds up on rewatching I might put AoU up there as well.
I don't think any of these movies are flawless, nothing is flawless. I'll just rate movies depending on how much I enjoyed them and let that be that.
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Signature courtesy of rikikai