(L) Last Exile -Fam, The Silver Wing-

[Joachim1167]

Originally Posted by ~BC~

If the writers wanted me to sympathize with Fam at that moment they should've left out the parts where she was being a tactless nitwit around the Augusta. Some decent character development wouldn't hurt either.

Yeah, Fam is just a lowly impulsive 16 year old orphaned Sky Pirate commoner who never has had any experience or formal training in court etiquette. Damn you Millia, you know this. Why did you bring her in the presence of the Augusta without thoroughly instructing her in the ways of the court? Well, she did apologize when she realized her mistakes, so we'll give you a pass this time Millia.

[~BC~]

Eh, I don't think she needed training in court etiquette. It was really just a matter of common sense.

[Joachim1167]

Originally Posted by ~BC~

Eh, I don't think she needed training in court etiquette. It was really just a matter of common sense.

Common sense? On who's part? Millia, knowing fully of Fam's personality, decides to bring her along anyway. Just saying...

Anyhoo, it turned out for the best. Sara gets inspired, Fam gets to eat a little humble pie. Now if they would only show the whole "Millia disciplining Fam thing". I sure would like to see that.

[Myssa Rei]

The thing is, Fam's concept of 'common sense' seems to have a different definition than the one everyone else is familiar with. The girl is completely guileless, meaning she's not only idealistic to an extreme usually associated with Shounen heroes, she's also honest to a fault and has no idea what tact is. She also seems to be an advocate of act first, think later. For example her leaping to Milia's defense during the alliance meeting was admirable, but it was ill-timed and not to mention impulsive.

[Joachim1167]

Originally Posted by Myssa Rei

The thing is, Fam's concept of 'common sense' seems to have a different definition than the one everyone else is familiar with. The girl is completely guileless, meaning she's not only idealistic to an extreme usually associated with Shounen heroes, she's also honest to a fault and has no idea what tact is. She also seems to be an advocate of act first, think later. For example her leaping to Milia's defense during the alliance meeting was admirable, but it was ill-timed and not to mention impulsive.

Not necessarily a bad thing. Ya think there would have been a Lasas rescue if, say, Gisey was in charge? Would there have been contact with the Silvius if Fam wasn't around? I really think Dio stuck around Kortoffel on his little recon/spy mission specifically because of Fam. He made a lot of positive comments about her to Tatiana and Alis. Like I said before, she makes things happen. The whole thing with Fam being in the Ades royal court - with Fam being impulsive throughout the series, then having her suddenly become introverted when the situation dictates it would really be inconsistent with her established character. She would seem really artificial then, wouldn't she? Hey, ya gotta take the good with the bad. If anything, I think Fam's philosophy on life would be Carpe Diem, which IMO makes her a pretty good adventure hero.

[DangerMouse]

Originally Posted by Joachim1167

Not necessarily a bad thing. Ya think there would have been a Lasas rescue if, say, Gisey was in charge? Would there have been contact with the Silvius if Fam wasn't around? I really think Dio stuck around Kortoffel on his little recon/spy mission specifically because of Fam. He made a lot of positive comments about her to Tatiana and Alis. Like I said before, she makes things happen.

The whole thing with Fam being in the Ades royal court - with Fam being impulsive throughout the series, then having her suddenly become introverted when the situation dictates it would really be inconsistent with her established character. She would seem really artificial then, wouldn't she? Hey, ya gotta take the good with the bad. If anything, I think Fam's philosophy on life would be Carpe Diem, which IMO makes her a pretty good adventure hero.

Totally agree with this and these are plenty of reasons to defend her and take the good with the bad as you say. Many of those types of key things that have been huge events and the potential alliances necessary for opposing Ades would not have even had openings if it were not for Fam making things happen, (and while impulsive and often willing to act on it in the heat of the moment/battle/conversation and not a real overly thinker-type like Gisey, she's also often been entirely capable of planning ahead like a Sky Pirate and will often do so and/or make plans with Gisey), nor as you said even the alliance with Anatoray thanks to Fam clearly impressing Dio (you can see it throughout their scenes in the opening 4 eps and through his praise to Tatiana and Alis) to the point where he stuck around and reconned through the pirates and ultimately wanted to bring her (and Giselle) to the Silvius to make a difference. As one of those who was part of the discussions that Dio was indeed nudging Fam in the right direction from the start due to his various actions (last of which out of everyone being the one to tell Fam the Silvius had been spotted knowing she'd go after it and subtly nudging them in right direction about the Silvius' design and to get Giselle to trust her skills) in the first four episodes, I totally agree with your deduction that Dio stuck around because of Fam.

Yeah.

[Cosmic Eagle]

Originally Posted by Joachim1167

I don't blame him. I can imagine a scene during the Grand Race at series end where a grinning Sorush (with happy tears coming out of his eyes) proclaims in a loud, lusty voice "the war is over!" as he gives a startled Dian and company a big bear hug...and promptly gets his teeth kicked in.

Seeing as he'd slaughtered a whole bunch of them, getting his teeth kicked in would be the least of his worries...



I wonder is Vasant trustworthy....she does seem to have good intentions but her influence on Sara isn't very.....healthy?

[Fandal]

Originally Posted by DangerMouse

Totally agree with this and these are plenty of reasons to defend her and take the good with the bad as you say. Many of those types of key things that have been huge events and the potential alliances necessary for opposing Ades would not have even had openings if it were not for Fam making things happen, (and while impulsive and often willing to act on it in the heat of the moment/battle/conversation and not a real overly thinker-type like Gisey, she's also often been entirely capable of planning ahead like a Sky Pirate and will often do so and/or make plans with Gisey), nor as you said even the alliance with Anatoray thanks to Fam clearly impressing Dio (you can see it throughout their scenes in the opening 4 eps and through his praise to Tatiana and Alis) to the point where he stuck around and reconned through the pirates and ultimately wanted to bring her (and Giselle) to the Silvius to make a difference. As one of those who was part of the discussions that Dio was indeed nudging Fam in the right direction from the start due to his various actions (last of which out of everyone being the one to tell Fam the Silvius had been spotted knowing she'd go after it and subtly nudging them in right direction about the Silvius' design and to get Giselle to trust her skills) in the first four episodes, I totally agree with your deduction that Dio stuck around because of Fam.

Yeah.

Isn't Dio's character pretty similar to Fam? When Fam is serious, she's probably going to be very scary to deal with. Why is so many people beating up on Fam's personality when Dio's is very similar? In supposedly serious situations, Dio's is even more crazy than Fam (see episode 1)!

[Myssa Rei]

The thing is, more than a few of us here are actually familiar with Dio, owing to watching the first series. We know he's a screwball, but there's actually something other than being a goof behind that facade of his, especially when we take into consideration his survival.

[Graveyard Duck]

The difference between Fam and Dio is that we're shown quite clearly that Dio is a deadly expert, while we see little evidence that Fam is particularly skilled at anything other than maneuvering a vespa to attack capital ships.

With Dio:

Spoiler for Dio in LE1:

The first time he enters combat, he makes a fool out of Claus. He then casually ignores Tatiana--the ace pilot--and lets Lucciola deal with her. After the lighthearted race, he nonchalantly boards the Sylvana while under heavy guard. We know he is an expert pilot, and we've been given reason to believe he's an expert combatant, an expectation that's well-justified after the rite of adulthood in the Guild.

Dio in LE2 is similarly an expert: He easily out-flies the other pirates in episode 1, and he appears to recognize the mysterious but powerful combatant Alauda. We see in episode 4 that he doesn't hesitate to mess with Tatiana, a pilot who's toying with Fam. We know shortly after that he is the leader of the Sylvius' vanship squad--a position that suggests great prowess.

Fam? Well, we see her diving capital ships on multiple occasions pretty easily, but that's it. She's a good racer, as we see in ep 6, but we haven't really see anything else out of her. Dio made her look bat in ep 1. Tatiana made a fool of her in ep 4. And even the Ades vanships managed to shoot her down. We just don't get the same sense of great deadliness behind a goofy exterior with Fam that we have with Dio.

On a different note:
This episode was a great tragedy for me, because

Spoiler for LE2 ep 15:

1. Dyan broke up with Fam, and

2. Fam starts off on the wrong foot with Dyan's other girlfriends.

[j4c06]

Why are we constantly shown Vasant's eye color? Is there any particular significance to the amethyst color other than here belonging to one of the nations (left behind by Exiles?).

Oh, and one other thing, she mentioned survival in the Ades wastelands after all the Exiles left. Is the Ades capital located in what was originally Keios territory? And why did they have to stay there if they basically had all the Earth to settle?

[Panzerklein]

One more thing, Dio is a war veteran and lost his closest friend, he know more war than Fam, Fam don't know how feel of ones who lost their homeland, their comrades, and family. Dio never speak nonsense how to stop war like Fam does (about Grand Race to bring peace in the hottest moment of war). In battle, Dio look like playing, but he is deadly serious (like a boss), while Fam is defeated easily and her role is reduce to Milia's driver.

Dian in this picture have funny mouth )

[Joachim1167]

Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle

Seeing as he'd slaughtered a whole bunch of them, getting his teeth kicked in would be the least of his worries...

Well, I hope nothing permanently disabling. Under that lecherous shell Sorush is surprisingly pragmatic, and of all the Ades generals he's the closest thing to comic relief. I like him.

I wonder is Vasant trustworthy....she does seem to have good intentions but her influence on Sara isn't very.....healthy?

Yeah. Her sudden, intense interest in the Silvius kinda threw up some red flags and it seems to me that she could be smothering at times. All in all though, as long as she doesn't fall into the Raving Rampage of Revenge (tm) trap, she'll be alright.

[Joachim1167]

Originally Posted by Graveyard Duck

The difference between Fam and Dio is that we're shown quite clearly that Dio is a deadly expert, while we see little evidence that Fam is particularly skilled at anything other than maneuvering a vespa to attack capital ships.

With Dio:

Spoiler for Dio in LE1:

The first time he enters combat, he makes a fool out of Claus. He then casually ignores Tatiana--the ace pilot--and lets Lucciola deal with her. After the lighthearted race, he nonchalantly boards the Sylvana while under heavy guard. We know he is an expert pilot, and we've been given reason to believe he's an expert combatant, an expectation that's well-justified after the rite of adulthood in the Guild.

Dio in LE2 is similarly an expert: He easily out-flies the other pirates in episode 1, and he appears to recognize the mysterious but powerful combatant Alauda. We see in episode 4 that he doesn't hesitate to mess with Tatiana, a pilot who's toying with Fam. We know shortly after that he is the leader of the Sylvius' vanship squad--a position that suggests great prowess.

Fam? Well, we see her diving capital ships on multiple occasions pretty easily, but that's it. She's a good racer, as we see in ep 6, but we haven't really see anything else out of her. Dio made her look bat in ep 1. Tatiana made a fool of her in ep 4. And even the Ades vanships managed to shoot her down. We just don't get the same sense of great deadliness behind a goofy exterior with Fam that we have with Dio.

Well, that kind of negates some people's arguments that "everything always goes Fam's way".

Let's see...

Fam manages to steal battleships, pull the Lasas and the princesses from the clutches of the Federation (during a battle no less), went after the Silvius when everyone else thought it was pretty much suicide, got words of praise from Tatiana (of all people) for her abilites, made an official Silvius crewmember by Tatiana (of all people) even though she is a recent outsider, yup-she's a good racer, saved the Sky Pirates from a Federation trap, gained the respect and friendship of a xenophobic Dian (by saving her wingmate), survived an encounter with 3 heavily armed Ades vanships while piloting a lone overloaded and unarmed Vespa, and a few other things that don't come to mind at the moment. All of this without having to kill anybody. That pretty badass in my book.

Fam and Dio are two sides of the same badass coin. She's the idealist, he's the killer...and both are going to be needed for what lies ahead.

On a different note:
This episode was a great tragedy for me, because

Spoiler for LE2 ep 15:

1. Dyan broke up with Fam, and

2. Fam starts off on the wrong foot with Dyan's other girlfriends.

I wouldn't worry too much. Dian seemed more pissed at Millia than Fam.

[Cosmic Eagle]

I want to see Dian fight alongside Dio either in ground or air combat....both are like siblings or something...

[azarhal]

Originally Posted by Joachim1167

got words of praise from Tatiana (of all people) for her abilites, made an official Silvius crewmember by Tatiana (of all people) even though she is a recent outsider

Tatiana gave her passing grades in flying. I wouldn't call that praises.

[Joachim1167]

Originally Posted by azarhal

Tatiana gave her passing grades in flying. I wouldn't call that praises.

She did say that "they were pretty skilled for a couple of lost birds" as she was looking at their first battleship capture. Okay, maybe I'm seeing too much into it, but I kinda figure getting ANY praise from Tatiana is pretty impressive.

Now that I think about it, getting Tatiana to personally come out after you in her vanship could be seen as a sign of some respect. After testing and seeing their mettle (holy crap, they actually managed to get inside the frickin' ship), Tatiana gave them the "steal 15 battleships alternative". I don't think she would have offered that if she though they couldn't do it. Fam and company eventually win her over with their skill (or at least their tenacity). Making an non-Anatoray outsider an official member of the Silvius crew is praise indeed.

[Joachim1167]

Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle

I want to see Dian fight alongside Dio either in ground or air combat....both are like siblings or something...

I'd like to see that too. I can imagine the cockpit-to-cockpit banter:

Dio: IMMELMANN TUUUURRRNNN!!!
Dian: (in stoic Russian) You crazy son of a b***h like Fam...but I like your taste in clothing.
Dio: Damn I miss my Starfish. I have no guns. How are we gonna stop that battleship?!
Dian: (in stoic Russian) Easy. Basic Glacian strategy: reduce target vehicle to component parts. *opens up with cannon fire*

[azarhal]

Originally Posted by Joachim1167

She did say that "they were pretty skilled for a couple of lost birds" as she was looking at their first battleship capture. Okay, maybe I'm seeing too much into it, but I kinda figure getting ANY praise from Tatiana is pretty impressive.

Tatiana is too bored to find anything impressive...well beside knowing somebody used an Exile as a weapon on a nation.

[Sinestra]

Originally Posted by azarhal

Tatiana gave her passing grades in flying. I wouldn't call that praises.

Exactly in Tatiana's world "passing grades in flying" meant they can at least keep the Vespa in the air. It was not much of a compliment at all.