(L) Re:Creators

[justpassingby]

Originally Posted by Endscape

They knew her as a meme, not as an actual character.

Let's see, Vegeta started foreshadowing Super Saiyans in chapter 280, and Goku actually became a Super Saiyan in chapter 318, so it took basically 38 chapters in 9 months time.

I trust you can tell the difference between that and a couple of novels belted out in 6 months.



Considering most of these characters are from fairly low powered universes, and Altair is powered by the force of a million memes, I doubt it.

Writing 38 chapters of light novel does not require 38 weeks with all the cliches that are available on this world for heroic deeds, and considering the stake of world destruction. With that many stuffs, whoever said it's just a couple of novels? And I was asking how many years it took from the time Goku started fighting Freeza to the time he became Super Saiya.

You just doubt it so that you can claim they don't have it. What stopping them from discovering ancient mecha that can match the power of God?

[xizro345]

Originally Posted by justpassingby

Well, we're using 2ch, and we're happy to write to him through his blog, if he even cared to read. If the staffs foreshadowed a terrible ending since the start of 2nd cour, he should've been receiving criticisms from that moment onward.

Why should 2ch hold a special merit? It's a board like another. Also, it makes my eyes bleed everytime I try to read a thread there, especially the gaming ones.
Though I do remember around the series halfway point that the comments weren't particularly "bad" (by 2ch standards, that is).

So what did Setsuna and Altair say about the mess and deaths caused by Altair?

I believe Setsuna clearly stated that it wasn't about "good and evil", "right or wrong", etc. during the discussion, which also had nothing to do with Altair's intentions or actions. If you noticed, Setsuna barely addressed what she was trying to do (only when she mentioned "the curse", which was rebutted by Altair).

But they did accept for a while for Selesia's power up in Ep 10. What stopping the fans to accept a super power up if it was life and death situation?

Only because Matsubara said it was "an idea" for a story.

Also, as someone else said, for all we know, the audience just noticed that "the staff used a meme character as a villain, I wonder how it will turn out?". Didn't something similar happen when Black Rock Shooter was made into an anime and a game, after all?

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

I still think the greatest backlash is caused by the story having the audacity to create an artificial fandom, disconnected from the real audience. Basically having the show praising itself for how good it is, and how many fake people loved it, all happening off screen where the real audience never saw it. People hate to be misrepresented, it is understandable that it offends.

You make no sense. We obviously haven't been exposed to Altair (or the other characters) the way the in-universe audience has. What you're doing is complaining that the "popular antagonist" is popular, while the "everyday Hollywood homely protagonist" isn't, in-universe, while RL polls say it should be the other way around.

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

Are you saying it is hard to explain why his story was bad? It wasn't, he broke so many rules of story telling that it is hard to fit it into twitter. But if he really want to write about fans and misrepresenting them, he should be prepared for anger. He wrote a story where fans powered up a villain because allegedly fans like watching villains win. I have no idea where he got that idea from.

Meteora said it an episode ago - to the audience, who has seen different things than we did, Altair is the protagonist. The one who overcame adversity in service of a just cause. Maybe that's on the writers (Matsubara and the others) who failed to convey Altair's villainy. It happens IRL too.

[Magewolf]

Originally Posted by Endscape

They knew her as a meme, not as an actual character.




Considering most of these characters are from fairly low powered universes, and Altair is powered by the force of a million memes, I doubt it.

But is she really? As I stated before if she is powered by a million memes with no one knowing anything about her why is she a world destroying edgelord instead of a cute girl playing with sheep and dancing to jpop? Which is what most of the memes shown were.

The fact of the matter is that the whole meme thing is just an excuse for her to pull powers out of her ass at will. The other creations all appear to have been pulled from the most popular versions, usually anime which is why they are not up to date on their manga or LN versions.

Altair seems to operate by her own rules set up so that the only outcome was the reward the psycho for being a villain ending. And that sticks in a lot of people's craw.

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by justpassingby

You just doubt it so that you can claim they don't have it. What stopping them from discovering ancient mecha that can match the power of God?

Good writing.

Originally Posted by Magewolf

But is she really? As I stated before if she is powered by a million memes with no one knowing anything about her why is she a world destroying edgelord instead of a cute girl playing with sheep and dancing to jpop? Which is what most of the memes shown were.

Because her original version is the edgelord. Memes came afterward.

[justpassingby]

Originally Posted by xizro345

I believe Setsuna clearly stated that it wasn't about "good and evil", "right or wrong", etc. during the discussion, which also had nothing to do with Altair's intentions or actions. If you noticed, Setsuna barely addressed what she was trying to do (only when she mentioned "the curse", which was rebutted by Altair).

Yeah, good job by Hiroe to sweep under the rug on those who died directly or indirectly caused by Altair.

Originally Posted by xizro345

Only because Matsubara said it was "an idea" for a story.

So why wasn't the idea implemented in the story? Hiroe forgot?

Originally Posted by xizro345

Why should 2ch hold a special merit? It's a board like another. Also, it makes my eyes bleed everytime I try to read a thread there, especially the gaming ones.
Though I do remember around the series halfway point that the comments weren't particularly "bad" (by 2ch standards, that is).

Read again. When the main threads are indistinguishable from the anti-threads, it just means this show is that bad.

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by justpassingby

Yeah, good job by Hiroe to sweep under the rug on those who died directly or indirectly caused by Altair.

Again, why does Setsuna and Altair having a moment invalidate the deaths of ovther people?

So why wasn't the idea implemented in the story? Hiroe forgot?

She got back her mech.

Read again. When the main threads are indistinguishable from the anti-threads, it just means this show is that bad.

Since when were 2chan threads an objective mark of a show's quality?

[justpassingby]

Originally Posted by Endscape

Good writing.

You're talking as if there has been a good writing for Re:Creators. Just because you like it, it doesn't mean it is good writing. Likewise, just because we don't like it, you can claim it's not bad writing.
So if Hiroe is a good writer, and even intended for the final battle to be a winnable for the heroes and not boring due to Altair bulldozing everyone, he could've easily written that.

[xizro345]

Originally Posted by justpassingby

Yeah, good job by Hiroe to sweep under the rug on those who died directly or indirectly caused by Altair.

Technically speaking she could be accountable only for having summoned Magane who killed someone and some collateral damage (no casualties reported) in the first episode, also in the second if you consider Mamika's actions. She was trying to erase the world but in practice only Meteora and the others knew.
Really, I don't see the issue here.

So why wasn't the idea implemented in the story? Hiroe forgot?

I believe it was addressed in the very following episode. They also gave her much more power in the festival, including adding Vogelchevalier back.

Read again. When the main threads are indistinguishable from the anti-threads, it just means this show is that bad.

It means nothing. I'm not as harsh as someone else, but for all intent and purposes 2ch is 4chan on steroids, so I don't hold their opinion in high regard.
For me, it's only good for the furage leaks and even there I have to endure thousands of posts of nothing in between.

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by justpassingby

You're talking as if there has been a good writing for Re:Creators.

And you're switching goalposts.

We were discussing what was stopping the authors writing in a power scale busting power up for the characters, with little to no foreshadowing in little to no time at all. I said good writing, which was even mentioned in series by the creators themselves.

Tell me how you think writing in that kind of power up could be good writing.

[justpassingby]

Originally Posted by xizro345

Technically speaking she could be accountable only for having summoned Magane who killed someone and some collateral damage (no casualties reported) in the first episode, also in the second if you consider Mamika's actions. She was trying to erase the world but in practice only Meteora and the others knew.
Really, I don't see the issue here.



I believe it was addressed in the very following episode. They also gave her much more power in the festival, including adding Vogelchevalier back.



It means nothing. I'm not as harsh as someone else, but for all intent and purposes 2ch is 4chan on steroids, so I don't hold their opinion in high regard.
For me, it's only good for the furage leaks and even there I have to endure thousands of posts of nothing in between.

She killed Alice and made Selesia and Charon killed each other.
But not enough power to defeat Altair, evidently.

Originally Posted by Endscape

Again, why does Setsuna and Altair having a moment invalidate the deaths of ovther people?



She got back her mech.



Since when were 2chan threads an objective mark of a show's quality?

So why is that a villain was rewarded while the others suffered? Why the fake audiences were touched by a villain getting what she wanted, but not at the other creations who did not want their fight to be ended in vain just because Hiroe said so? You can't even guarantee they will be resurrected in next episode. And like I said earlier, if they are revived, it would cheapen their death. If they're not, the villain sure get the better end of the stick.
It's 2ch by the way. Are you considering only sites that praised this show to be objective mark of a show's quality?

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by justpassingby

So why is that a villain while rewarded while the others suffered?

The point is not that Altair was rewarded, it's that the world was saved.

Was it done in the way that people might have hoped for? No. What matters is that it was done, and that has to be enough.

Why the fake audiences were touched by a villain getting what she wanted

Maybe they just want to see a touching emotional scene, regardless of who has it?

[xizro345]

Originally Posted by Endscape

Maybe they just want to see a touvhing emotional scene, regardless of who has it?

I think so. And as a "real" viewer, I think the scene was well done. I'm not a fan of villains doing 180s or "escaping" but in this anime the point was never about killing Altair.

[justpassingby]

So you're saying all those infodumps and planning that took most of the screen time, even more than what Altair had, was not about defeating Altair?

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by justpassingby

So you're saying all those infodumps and planning that took most of the screen time, even more than what Altair had, was not about defeating Altair?

It was about stopping Altair, and saving the world. Defeating her is a secondary goal.

[justpassingby]

The creations are not that stupid to think they can stop Altair and save the world without killing her or making her disappear , right?
Even Selesia's Infinite Gate and Selesia+Alice+Rui combo were intended to make her disappear forever.

You can throw all the flowery words you want, but the show is actually showing different things from what they think they've intended with Altair.
And all the flowery words from you or the stuffs won't absolve any of Altair's doings.
You can bet that the stuffs will not admit she was wrong in killing Alice and Mamika, and making Selesia and Charon killed each other. What are you going to do by then?
Agreeing with the stuffs that it was such a beautiful story?

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by justpassingby

The creations are not that stupid to think they can stop Altair and save the world without killing her or making her disappear , right?
Even Selesia's Infinite Gate and Selesia+Alice+Rui combo were intended to make her disappear forever.

Why is why as you yourself pointed out, they tried to do exactly that. It just didn't work out that way. That happens sometime.

And all the flowery words from you or the stuffs won't absolve any of Altair's doings.

No one was trying to absolve Altair of any crime she committed.

[justpassingby]

Originally Posted by Endscape

Why is why as you yourself pointed out, they tried to do exactly that. It just didn't work out that way. That happens sometime.

I was saying that most of the screen time was used to plan to kill Altair, as contrast to your claim that the show is not about killing Altair. So why even bother with the screen time showing they're planning to kill Altair, if the show is not about killing her?
And of course they failed to kill Altair. If they've succeeded, then Altair wouldn't be rewarded.

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by justpassingby

I was saying that most of the screen time was used to plan to kill Altair, as contrast to your claim that the show is not about killing Altair. So why even bother with the screen time showing they're planning to kill Altair, if the show is not about killing her?
And of course they failed to kill Altair. If they've succeeded, then Altair wouldn't be rewarded.

The plan was to save the world, killing Altair was just the most efficient way to do that, which is why that was the plan.

[justpassingby]

The plan was to kill Altair to save the world. There was no other enemy, and there was no other efficient way such as talking to Altair.
Saving the world is the end goal. They wished to reach there by planning power ups and attacks. They could've not planned to save the world by not planning
on how to kill Altair.