The Origins of Ragnarok Plan

[Bonzo]

It's simple, every mind connected with a single imperial mind, like a queen bee and the hive.
Charles wanted to use the collective unconscious "God" to format people brains and take the place of Jupiter, or God, call that thing how you want.

It's my theory, but if you think, is more reasonable, a world can be perfect if everybody is without the free will and a single person decide for everything and everybody how you want, then a "perfect world".
This can explain their promise to revive Euphemia, with that way they could pilot suzaku mind and give him the impulse Euphy live again, because to revive a dead person is out of way.
Charles kept Marianne body, but he didn't know again how to revive her....it was a bluff for try to stop Lelouch, or to buy time for ragnarok activation.

V.V plan was a little different, but the final result could be enough similar, the geass cult realizes about 200 geass children, or geass soldier, their duty (when the time was ready) was to take control of every important people, then to control every military, policy, economical movement and to create the "perfect world".
Lelouch destroy everything, then the reserve plan and V.V give his geass to the brother.

However, the anime gived always few or no explanatin about all that stuff, for example, all the children used for to create the geass army...

1)clones obtained by V.V and Charles DNA?

2)children taked in every place (orphans, kidnapped...) and used like experiment prototypes, I used that way in my story for Nonette revenge about her son used for one of those experiment.

3)maybe this was the motivation about the fact Charles had 108 women, children production for that project, then at last, Rolo could to be really a sort of half-brother for Lelouch.
But considering the bigger percentage of geass children had the same age....the third option is the most improbable.

[Kid Ying]

Originally Posted by Nobodyman9

Yep, that's exactly what Lelouch and Nunnally said in the last ep. Nunnally said the Damocles would be a symbol of everyone's hatred and Lelouch said she had the same idea he had. The only difference is that Schneizel would have stayed in power and ruled the world with an iron fleija fist and Lelouch chose to die in the end and give the world a fresh start.

But I think this might be OT.

I agree. Since they had the same plan and interest, they could even work together(well, Lelouch would never work together with Nunnally at the zero requiem, but...) to prevent those battles and stuff, but i don't know if Lelouch could've trusted Schneisel(at least in not a geassed state). What if Zero Requiem didn't have worked so well? Maybe Schneisel would try the same shit again, he has the capabilities after all. Besides, i don't think Schneisel would trust Lelouch either, so i guess the britannian triforce would be a big fail. The battle and zero requiem was inevitable when you got those leaders.

[zongetsu]

okay let us start with the first question.

Question one

There was only one reason why CC joined the vow, and i believe was that it was indeed to die. However it did not contradict the fact. The reasoning is was because she only wished to escape her current reality. And immortal existence.

THen he have the can she die part. It is my belief that a code bearer may take another persons code. It is clearly implied when Marrianne asks CC why "she didnt just give Charles her code" in the first place. I dont think he was going to grant her wish after the junction was complete but before. Did you not see him take her in r2 ep 15? She was to die right there.

After the ragnarok juction there is no death or even living. Everything is lets say, just together. Floating together, never changing. Imagine living the same minute over and over and over. Its like that except, everything and everyone who ever existed exists. That is why lelouch calls it "yearning for the past" because it never changes.

Then you got VV. Hes a rather simple little fellow. It is as you say, he can feel the gap between him and Charles grow and does not want to be left alone, by himself. Because that is the fate of all who bear the code. To see everyone disappear.

Question 2

Marianne did support the vow and everything that came with it. However it was only VV who was swayed.

The reason he killed Marianne was because he was afraid of being alone. And he knew that she was pulling charles away from him, so he had her killed. Adding a witness only made it more believable. That way charles would never find out who killed marianne other than "terrorist". But charles did find out and he knew the truth. He stated himself that he knew VV was lying but did nothing about it.

That is how Lelouch and Nunnally ended up being sent away. To "protect" them. Charles knew, yes he did.

Question 3

According to Charles, he had to do it in order to protect them. WIth his own words he states that he did that to nunnally to make sure she, and most likely lelouch never got close to the truth. IT was to "protect" them. I dont think VV felt safe lying to Charles, he only intention was to be his close brother again, with marianne out of the way it only made matters much easier.

Question 4

I think the reason why CC left was because she no longer had any connections to the plan. THe only real friend, reason why she was there was because of marianne. With her gone, she had no need to stay so she set out.

I think that she set out to explore for herself and perhaps to "live". Marianne also according to CC violated the contract between them.

THe answer is simple, the reason why marianne couldnt convice her was because deep down CC still wanted to find someone who would love her. IT was her deepest desire, her geass. SHe wanted to try once more.

Question 5

Beucase im short on time ill answer this quickly.

CC only gave herself to the emperor in ep 15 to protect lelouch. SHe only put on the mask so he could live, but lelouch could not. He wanted her to live as well and he made the promise with her to make her happy.

The second time, she just happened to be there when the world was going to end.

[Aostri]

a. sorry for the necro.
b. sorry for presenting our thoughts in a manner that does not directly follow the OP.

The initial idea Charles and V.V. had in regards to Ragnarok/Sword of Akasha wasn't a comic book villain plot to mind control the entire world, rather, it was to transform the collective subconsciousness into a collective consciousness, a gestalt mind.
To clarify this point:
A gestalt mind does not equal putting all of humanity on a permanent dose of refrain, without keeping track of the present state of the physical world it wouldn't take very long for all humans to physically die out.
Neither does a gestalt mind equal a single king ruling over a horde of zombie's, a single human mind simply won't have the capacity to effectively do so.
A gestalt mind is essentially a level of abstraction, separating high level comprehension of the world as a whole from low level operation of individual physical bodies. It doesn't even necessarily mean the destruction of individuality and free will, only the removal of a permanent connections between individual minds and individual bodies.

When C.C. joined she pointed out three problems:
The first which was what Charles and V.V. were already working on and why they sought C.C.'s help was whether such a feat was even possible to accomplish.
The second and least crucial one was whether a gestalt mind truly constituted a more advanced form of existence.
And the third and truly problematic one was that just like a single person, if the gestalt mind lacked cohesion and was full of hatred, resentment and loathing towards itself, it would likely go insane and quickly break apart.

As a possible solution for the third problem something along the lines of zero-requiem was put on the drawing board from before Leuluch was even born. And it was nothing other than his birth that started making things go off track.
Unlike all of Charles's other marriages which were done out of political necessity and convenience, Charles's marriage to Marianne was done out of true (and quite twisted) love. As a result of that they became blinded by the common parental belief that their child was a distilled and improved version of themselves and as such the ideal messiah to lead the world to salvation.

The only problem was that he wasn't, aside from being really good at chess he was just a fairly average royal kid.
As busy parents believing that their child would just magically shape up into what they wanted him to be, Charles and Marianne were blind to this.
Not being in any real hurry anywhere, C.C. didn't really care if, when and by whose hand the Ragnarok plan would be carried out.

For V.V. however this was a fairly serious issue. To begin with for a messiah to lead the world to salvation the world needed to be in a state where salvation was on the one hand possible and on the other hand necessary.
As the head of the Order's clandestine ops section most of the burden of keeping the world in an appropriate state of affairs fell on him.
What made things even more complex was that while the V.V. code kept V.V.s simulacrum avatar in the vague image of a child, his real body kept aging as normal. Aside from wishing to live to see Ragnarok's activation, this also posed a problem because if it turned out that the "destiny child" needed to save the world from within the shadows rather then the light, it would be inconvenient if the V.V. code would be in the possession of a fresh new V.V. that might be unwilling to just hand it over.
When Leuluch was of about the same age as Charles was when his and V.V.'s mother was killed, V.V. decided that it was about time to get things moving.
Also it is possible that he actually knew about Marianne's geass, if you consider the "women corrupting the hearts of men" from a slightly different angle, Marrianne's "post death" state was probably quite a bit more annoying for her than it was for Charles, which would motivate her to motivate not only Charles but also C.C. and would thus work out rather better than if she was simply dead.

C.C. left the Order ( assuming she really did ) because by that point most of the research and preparations for Ragnarok were mostly complete and Marianne asked her to discreetly watch over Leuluch and Nunnally for a while.

other stuff:

The children V.V. watches over - Using orphaned and homeless kids as recruits for underground and clandestine organizations is a process that has been going for centuries if not millennia.

V.V. getting the V.V. code - Similarly hosts to the V.V. code have been serving as the shadow hand behind Brittania's throne for centuries. If the previous V.V. decided that Charles was the most suitable candidate for the throne it would make sense for him to chose the current V.V. as his successor.

Messing with Nunnaly's memories and turning her into a cripple - This wasn't actually done by Charles, by that point in time the Order had plenty of geass agents. In fact It is also possible that at least two separate geass powers were used, one to slightly mangle her memories of what actually happened and another to block her ability to use her eyes (and maybe her legs too) . Farther V.V. motive for doing this might have not been so much to cover his tracks but instead to make Charles and Marianne relinquish her to his care so that he could make her into the next V.V.

C.C. joining the order in the first place - see post in the C.C. character thread.

C.C. captivity at Clovis's hands - In short, it wasn't.
After Leuluch and Nunnaly were delivered to the Ashfords care, C.C. no longer had that much to do while everybody involved waited for the "destiny child" to grow up a bit. When Clovis started poking his nose where he didn't need to it was decided that he would be a fine candidate for the post of the inept governor that would keep Area 11 dysfunctional until Leuluch came of age. After Clovis arrived in Area 11 C.C. agreed to keep him in check by allowing him to capture her and then play the role of a clueless immortal just out of the woods.

Leuluch being used as bait for C.C. - In short, he wasn't.
After their "destiny child" completely messed things up with the first black rebellion, Charles and Marianne had a rude awakening and switched to the 'humanities salvation is impossible, Ragnarok needs to be activated now' camp.
Conversely, after V.V. had a heart to heart chat with Nunnaly he realized that the two of them saw eye to eye and that she was the one to have the capacity to surpass Marianne, Charles and himself.
And so when C.C. insisted that activating Ragnarok in the world's current state would bring about a disaster and that Leuluch deserved another chance, V.V. unexpectedly supported hher and the stage for the second black rebelion was set.