StarCraft 2

[LoweGear]

Originally Posted by SaintessHeart

Is it done by the same group which did Gundam Century for SC1?

It's a different person. Stuart Ng aka Kurenaijiku - the person who made the original Gundam Century mod for SC:BW - hasn't been heard from since he left years ago.

[-Sho-]

Awesome gundam Hope WC3's great editor will make their custom map in SC2 too .

Originally Posted by paladinenvec

Hmm i keep losing at zerg players that goes for a speedling/baneling/muta builds i dunno its easy to counter at first but when marines and tanks get raped by banelings the mutas get the rest of the job done, any effective way to counter them?...this happens when attacking mostly not that much when defending since they take a while to destroy the wall, but stay on the defensive in this game its... well, death.

Well if you turtle , it's pretty sure that you lose .
Mix units against Speedling/Baneling/Muta like :

Make many helions (important + upgrade blue fire), some Marauders to slow down + many Marines with stimpack and some thors to support . Add some Medivacs & VCS to repair . I don't take tank cuz it can kill you .

Or you can make MMM and play hit&run with stimpack (if only he doesn't make infestor)


Anyway , epic replay FFA with

Huk (Pink) Protoss
LiquidJinro (Yellow) Terran
Heosat (Light Pink) Zerg
TheLittleOne (Purple) Terran
NonY (Light Blue) Protoss
ret (Orange) Zerg
Nazgul (Red) Protoss

That was hilarious .
Nazgul = Cannon rush ret
Huk = Fast carriers
TLO = Mass ravens
Jinro = Nuke powaaa

Nice game .

[SoldierOfDarkness]

Played a practice with a Terran today.

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/8...#rd:buildorder

It reminded me of why some terrans hate playing against other terrans but it gave me some ideas to think about if I ever play at the ladder again

But I think after playing with Zerg I got a better idea of the macro (Like saturating your minerals) which allowed me to field forces much faster than I use to though I could still do better.

Mix units against Speedling/Baneling/Muta like :

The best option are Thors/Marines/Medevas/Hellions.

Hellions will burn the speedlings away.

Thors will absorb any attacks by banelings but they have to be at the front and will attack the Mutas.

Marines are for support and attack mutas.

Medevacs are just there to look cool.

[paladinenvec]

Man ,thanks for your recommendations! i found the problem thanks to you guys, it was that i was using an opening of 4 rax reaper rush that didnt done that well vs zerg for some reason, and i invested so much in a gas early unit that did not have enough gas for other things like thors, i switched to hellions/fabric opening as -Sho- recommended and well its better that way, the hellions have more effective micro coz the AoE =).

[Reckoner]

So a protoss guy tried to proxy me yesterday, and managed to uh make me move my base. And hes till loses. lol

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/8...defined;markup

So yeah. He calls me a noob, yet he lost. Funny.

[Qikz]

Wow, Huk vs QXC IEM Semi's New York Game 3.

Just wow.

[Who]

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

Played a practice with a Terran today.

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/8...#rd:buildorder

It reminded me of why some terrans hate playing against other terrans but it gave me some ideas to think about if I ever play at the ladder again

But I think after playing with Zerg I got a better idea of the macro (Like saturating your minerals) which allowed me to field forces much faster than I use to though I could still do better.



The best option are Thors/Marines/Medevas/Hellions.

Hellions will burn the speedlings away.

Thors will absorb any attacks by banelings but they have to be at the front and will attack the Mutas.

Marines are for support and attack mutas.

Medevacs are just there to look cool.

The way I figured that unit composition worked was for the Hellions to fight the speedlings and tank the Banelings, being that they're cheaper (and easier to mass) than Thors, and bulkier than Marines; plus they have AoE to damage multiple Banelings at once. The Thors and Marines, being DPS units, need to stay further in the back.

I do agree with your thoughts on playing Zerg. I found that the Zerg's intensive macro demand makes it much easier to keep on top of minerals and unit/tech production with other races. Plus, it's just so fun, I think I might be pulling a Morrow.

[SoldierOfDarkness]

The whole purpose of the Thor is to tank for your army.

IMO Thors are what the Terrans need to deal with the Zerg.

If the Zerg has a lot of banelings you want them to attack the Thors. The marines and hellions stay in the back and provide fire support.

Generally speaking an upgraded marine force with medevac should be able to handle the mutas themselves with fire support from the Thors.

This is of course if the Zerg goes banelings/lings which are devastating against the MMM.

If he pumps out roaches/hydras, then the MMM is the better option.

[ddwkc]

Originally Posted by Reckoner

So yeah. He calls me a noob, yet he lost. Funny.

I feel like it's a double win when the opponent calls me a noob when he loses. :P

[Hooves]

Originally Posted by ddwkc

I feel like it's a double win when the opponent calls me a noob when he loses. :P

1 win for the match
and 1 win for making him angry

[Who]

Originally Posted by SoldierOfDarkness

The whole purpose of the Thor is to tank for your army.

IMO Thors are what the Terrans need to deal with the Zerg.

If the Zerg has a lot of banelings you want them to attack the Thors. The marines and hellions stay in the back and provide fire support.

Generally speaking an upgraded marine force with medevac should be able to handle the mutas themselves with fire support from the Thors.

This is of course if the Zerg goes banelings/lings which are devastating against the MMM.

If he pumps out roaches/hydras, then the MMM is the better option.

I tend to disagree on that point about tanking. It's true that their health is 400 HP, compared to the Hellion's 90, but Hellions, in my opinion are just so much more effective at combating Banelings; their effectiveness scales by a lot the better your micro is. The cost and build time of a single Thor, to me, is just not worth sending it up there to tank Banelings and possibly get torn apart by the rest of the ground army.
There are other reasons why I'd pick a Hellion over a Thor to fight Banelings. First one being that Thors, although they attack almost twice as fast, attack one at a time. Two Hellions (200/4 in comparison to 300/200/6 for a Thor) can one shot a Baneling, especially with the upgrade (which makes it 350/150/4 total for Hellions with the research factored in), but Hellions can hit multiple units at once. The ability to take out multiple Banelings is just too valuable for me. Of course, in a battle, you'll have other units mixed it to help kill them off but this is theorycrafting. The second reason is that although the Thor has 400 health and 1 more base armor than Hellions, they're still extremely prone to damage from other sources. And they can't escape from danger as readily as Hellions on their own.
Additionally, Marauders aren't bad at tanking hits from Banelings either. Keep the Marauders out in front of Marines to soak damage, and with Medevacs, their durability is enhanced. With Concussive Shells, they can slow down incoming Banelings and with Stim and proper micro, you can save several Marauders long enough for them to tank once more.

Edit:
Not saying your method is wrong because I can see it working, just I'm too ingrained into how I play against Zerg to try and implement this any time soon.

[brocko]

You don't want to have the Thor alive. You're using it as just a meat-shield, most of your damage should be coming from elsewhere. Just send a lone Thor ahead of yoru main army and let it tank the banelings. One Thor can tank over 5 times as many banelings as any other unit. Reason why you don't want the hellions or any other units for that matter to be tanking or trying to kill the banelings up front (or by themselves for that matter) is if you don't kill them in time, you're gonna lose a big chunk of your army since the banelings splash. With the Thor, you render the baneling splash relatively useless and it buys you a little extra time to kill the banelings before they blow up half your army. Always a good idea to mix in atleast one Thor into your army imo.

[HurricaneHige]

Banelings r counters to bioball, the only way to effectively counter that if you have a bioball is to learn to micro, split your force 3 way or even 2 way when banelings rolls in effectively cut your losses from them, and remaining forces should be enough to take out whatever mutas he/she has.

Thors are expensive and requires a different tech tree, meaning you are cutting into your econ for upgrades/more units, simply getting thors because you don't want to micro won't work in higher level play.

Basically, learn to do something other than stimpack->attack-move.

Also, anyone with half a brain with banelings wont blow themselves up against a thor, it's not cost effective since lings rapes thors.

O...also, banelings are pretty resilient against hallion fire.

[Ithekro]

In the campaign I would use a Thor or three with SCV support backed up by five or six tanks. The Thors could take on any air units easily while the tanks set up to keep the zerglings and Banelings back. I imaging that doesn't work so good elsewhere. Of course in campaign you have other advantages you don't have elsewhere...including rebuilding fallen Thors in the field.

In game it seems that a basic defense at the ramp (bunkers, turrets, and tanks) followed by vikings and banshees seem to be fairly effective...if you can survive into a longer game that is. This seems to work best with mixed Terran/Protass forces where the Terran does the static defense for the base (with a few early photon cannons here and there for added support) and dark templar for mobile ground defense/attack....also massed void rays to add to the viking/banshee offensive.

If it takes too long in a stalemate...Battlecrusiers and Carriers should finish the job (perhaps cloaked by a Mothership for extra advantage).

But that is mostly against the computer.

[brocko]

Originally Posted by HurricaneHige

Banelings r counters to bioball, the only way to effectively counter that if you have a bioball is to learn to micro, split your force 3 way or even 2 way when banelings rolls in effectively cut your losses from them, and remaining forces should be enough to take out whatever mutas he/she has.

Thors are expensive and requires a different tech tree, meaning you are cutting into your econ for upgrades/more units, simply getting thors because you don't want to micro won't work in higher level play.

Basically, learn to do something other than stimpack->attack-move.

Also, anyone with half a brain with banelings wont blow themselves up against a thor, it's not cost effective since lings rapes thors.

O...also, banelings are pretty resilient against hallion fire.

I'll give you the expensive bit, but I'd rather throw away 300 min and 200 gas as opposed to half my bio ball army which in most likely hood would be worth more than 300 min and 200 gas by far. Also adding a Thor into the mix is not being lazy, it's called unit composition. Sometimes you just don't have the space to make a good split or kite the banelings (eg: backed up in a choke for one of your expo's). You can still micro, split your rines and all that good jazz even with a Thor in your army so that micro and stim comment of yours seems like you're purposely trying to be condescending here. If your opponent is smart enough to run his banelings past the Thor, at the very least, you've got an earlier than usual scout of his attack, it'll serve as a giant wall to disrupt his ground movement a little and make him work that little bit extra in battle. Every inche counts and you take what you can get.

Also if you're getting a bio ball, chances are you're gonna get Medivacs too so that means all you gotta do is just put a tech lab on the Fact. and the only thing missing is the the armory which you'll get for lvl 2 infantry upgrades so it's not that big of a detour up the tech tree.

I agree with the banelings being rather resilient against hellions though.

Marauders can tank banelings surprinsly well too. They can take about 3 or 4 baneling hits on full health and very possibly even more with medivacs healing them.

[Hooves]

I always thought Zerglings were the optional choice against mechball. Banelings were mostly used against infrantry.

[brocko]

I dunno bout mech, but against infantry why not just get both? Bio have to clump together against lings and spread out against banelings, so what you gonna do now bioball? lol

[Hooves]

Originally Posted by brocko

I dunno bout mech, but against infantry why not just get both? Bio have to clump together against lings and spread out against banelings, so what you gonna do now bioball? lol

Thats really a tough question bioball is useless against Zerglings and Banelings

[SoldierOfDarkness]

Originally Posted by HurricaneHige

Banelings r counters to bioball, the only way to effectively counter that if you have a bioball is to learn to micro, split your force 3 way or even 2 way when banelings rolls in effectively cut your losses from them, and remaining forces should be enough to take out whatever mutas he/she has.

Thors are expensive and requires a different tech tree, meaning you are cutting into your econ for upgrades/more units, simply getting thors because you don't want to micro won't work in higher level play.

Basically, learn to do something other than stimpack->attack-move.

Also, anyone with half a brain with banelings wont blow themselves up against a thor, it's not cost effective since lings rapes thors.

O...also, banelings are pretty resilient against hallion fire.

The Thors aren't just gonna be standing there doing nothing.

And while the banelings and zerglings are trying to get around it'll give the hellions a chance to fry them.

[gummybear]

ZOMG a very cute pic of a zerg family XD

http://yfrog.com/631286691159274j