im trying to learn japanese

[gh0stmice]

so i need a series that speaks extremely slowly.....i can't stress enough when i say "EXTREMLY SLOWLY"....

it doesn't matter what its about....i really could care less, im just looking for some practice

keep in mind "EXTREMLY SLOWLY", cause it seems japanese people dont like to space out their words, so it all pretty much becomes one big incoherent mumble....
so anything that speaks very slowly ill be happy with


ive been using rosetta stone(really doesn't help that much), textbooks, audio learning tapes( for my car rides), and a couple of learning videos(has helped me the most)


i don't know anything about writing or reading characters or strokes, so if anyone finds something that will help me on writing and reading in japanese id also be very appreciative...which is more popular "hiragana or katakana"

[Maakasu]

me too i want to learn japanese and i'm a very slow learner when it comes to learning languages.

[gh0stmice]

well, rosetta stone is good for helping you learn "words" and words alone....but the best way to learn sentence structure is though learning videos and audio cassettes(i use these just to kinda reinforce what i already know)

japanese is nothing like any latin-based language.....so its much harder to learn than spanish, french, german, etc. Because those are somewhat similar to english and share alot of the same rules.....japanese is a whole diffrent beast

i used to think that those darn mexicans used to speak fast.....they got nothin on the japanese...dear god, its like a blurry of sounds. Each syllable rolls and slurs with the next....its tricky

[bruno321]

Go to classes. Japanese is a way too different language to learn by oneself-- at least, at the beginning.

You may think you're on the right track when you understand Japanese is composed of three different types of characters, but its difficulty is way beyond that. Like you say, Japanese is "a whole different beast".

Also, as a note: it is very rewarding when you can finally understand what you hear, or at least, you can make out the words and point out which parts of it you don't understand (or which grammatical structure). When you get there, self-learning gets possible.

EDIT: Oh, and for the show: Sora of Sketchbook: Full Color's speaks very slowly, you can perfectly make out what she says (it's the main character of the series). And you can try to understand Aso's Kansai-ben, but that's not really for a newcomer :P I'll think of some more.

[qtipbrit]

Originally Posted by bruno321

Go to classes. Japanese is a way too different language to learn by oneself-- at least, at the beginning.

No freaking way. Unless you're first language is Japanese, Korean, or Chinese, and you try to learn Vietnamese, then there's no language that's too difficult to learn, and learning Japanese characters isn't difficult at all, though time consuming, since you'll have to learn 80+ Hiragana and Katakana, their accented Dakuon forms, and Yoon with y- characters (the latter two are easy, as you add " as an accent to change the sound or a small y- kana), and afterwards, you learn Kanji (which isn't as scary as you think, though it still is quite fear-instilling)

Hiragana is used for classical Japanese words and often names.
Examples: Higurashi, Haruhi, Kokoro, and used instead of Kanji if you don't know them or don't need to use them.
Katakana is used for loanwords and sometimes as the Japanese form of italics or emphasis.
Examples: Kokoro (often used to emphasise the word), Sutoroberi (Strawberry), Furutsu (Fruit[s]), Chakku Norisu (Chuck Norris), Rurushu (Lelouche), etc.
Actually, I began learning to write and pronounce Japanese characters through wikipedia quite easily.
I learned Hiragana through wikipedia, actually, they show you the characters and have the stroke orders for characters as well.
This site is amazingly helpful if you want to learn it without classes and such (my experience is that it's not really that hard to learn the Kana without a teacher if you put your mind to it and whatever other cliche-type things people are spouting these days.)
http://www.saiga-jp.com/
Scroll down to Japanese Learning, where you'll find "Basic Pronunciation", "Japanese Learning", and "Kanji Dictionary" very useful (in that order).
I still recommend wikipedia's Hiragana page for learning Hiragana and Katakana, though, click on each individual character for more info and such. (I suggest learning Hiragana then Katakana, as they also do in Japan, and try to have a firm grasp on Hiragana before continuing)
It takes a while to learn it as efficiently as your first language, I remember struggling in reading Hiragana for a while, then being able to read it mildly easily (maybe a second-pause between each kana at most), after a month or so, it'll come a bit easier, but it could take a while for you to really be able to read quickly and flowingly (not to mention Kanji).
After learning the basics, your tapes, videos, books, etc. will be much more helpful.

Good luck, I've had a midly decent experience learning Japanese without a teacher, and since I define "lazy", you'll probably fare much better.

[Spectacular_Insanity]

Er, if I may say so, no anime is really suited to teaching you how to speak or listen.

However, if you want one where people speak slowly, check out Death Note. L talks pretty slow most of the time, but he tends to mumble a lot.

Edit: Banner of the Stars might be a good idea too, but they use a lot of technical terms, but when they're not in battle, they speak quite slow. When they ARE in battle... well, good luck, lol.

[bruno321]

Just for the record, I myself am a student of Japanese (for two years now) which has advanced a lot through self-study. But complete self-study can lead to mannerisms which could easily be corrected by a teacher. Also, classes provide a reasonable guide through your study.

For a good resource on Japanese I'd point out the Japanese forum at wordreference.

[tripperazn]

Watch Kimikiss, I haven't touched one of those subbed since...well, like the first episode. Childishly easy vocabulary and grammar, no technical terms. Although, I wouldn't try this if you haven't studied for more than 2 years. Anime and manga are for intermediate learners for sure.

[Phantasmagoria]

Always master Hiragana first, then move on to Katakana.

As for learning strokes, I used Minna no Nihongo or Japanese for Busy People. (They also have learning examples and grammar notes, essentials.)

They provide you with the correct strokes(example), and boxes for you to fill it out yourself.

Anime for reference? Try out those targeted at children/family, like Chibi Maruko-chan, etc.

[minhtam1638]

Using anime to learn Japanese? Best you can get out of that is particular words and what they mean. Not to throw you off, but the Japanese grammatical structure is way different. Instead of subject/verb/object, you get subject/object/verb, and there's like tons of particles in between that distinguish these parts of speech.

I'd say either take a class, self-teach yourself through visual and kinesthetic means rather than watch anime and try to learn through auditory means. As a neophyte, Japanese is just too hard to learn through auditory means.

I know some particular words such as "lie" and "thanks" and "riddle" and sometimes even more complicated words. It means nothing if I can't put them together to make a straightforward sentence.

Then there's the hirigana, katakana, and kanji problem as well. As much as I would like to read the Shakugan no Shana novels, the kanji is too advanced, and I'd have to have years of kanji training to read them.

[ThoHell]

Learning to read and write is way to hard, therefore classes needed for that.

But as to learning the language, you have to become immerse in it. To learn from watching anime, it's best to watch something you like and to over load your watching dosage. I found Roseta stone to be very bad. For basic greetings, counting, time, things which won't help you to properly communicate Roseta did the job for that.

I know I'm saying some obvious stuff like becoming immerse in the language, but it's absolutely true. Watch an anime, listen to their word usage, take mental note of how other translator translate words, order of word usage, attempt to translate words yourself. When it all comes down to it, it's not about just listen and write but rather completely analyzing each phrase/line/word spoken at the time it is spoken. Pretty much an attempt to replace every English usage with Japanese.

Watching anime to learn to speak Japanse is just as good as almost anything else. It depends on your effort. Taking classes will help you fully understand why certain words and phrases are used the way and order they are. I'm speaking through 1st hand experience. I first started learning from watching anime, it just absorbed it subconsciously but when I attempted to consciously absorb it, learning rate increased drastically. I'm a primary English major with a secondary major in Japanese. Watching animes put me far ahead of my classmate by several years (in terms or speaking and word usage but not in reading and writing).

[gh0stmice]

you forget that im not trying to learn japanese through watching anime.....ive got plenty of material that i use (i mean plenty of learning material) i just want to use the anime as a means of re-enforcing what i already know...seeing i dont have another person to speak japanese with, i thought this might be a decent substitute....


i understand that its difficult, and it would be alot easier if i had formal education in japanese. But i do not. Because of my work schedule and my school schedule i have very little time to attend anymore classes....so im left with the option of "self-study" and thats what im going to do

i learn pretty quickly...last night i did not know hirigana, today i have memorized half of the characters and tonight i plan on memorizing the last half....(flash cards are "bomb")

i have a ton of training videos that i watch(to make up for my lack of class room instruction)...i listen to japanese lessons on tape while i drive....i have plenty of text books which i use


im not trying to learn the whole language from anime....that would be very very impractical....
im just trying to test myself and see what words phrases and sentences i can pull from the shows....

so plz recognize my initiative and deication, opposed to bashing the fact that i dont have the priveledge to attend a japanese class

[qtipbrit]

Originally Posted by minhtam2448

Using anime to learn Japanese? Best you can get out of that is particular words and what they mean. Not to throw you off, but the Japanese grammatical structure is way different. Instead of subject/verb/object, you get subject/object/verb, and there's like tons of particles in between that distinguish these parts of speech.

It's not really that difficult to understand once you understand and kind of get a feel for it, though I agree that it's very different, especially since "I" phrases often leave out the subject altogether, and are often object/particle/verb.
Ahh.

Originally Posted by gh0stmice

you forget that im not trying to learn japanese through watching anime.....ive got plenty of material that i use (i mean plenty of learning material) i just want to use the anime as a means of re-enforcing what i already know...seeing i dont have another person to speak japanese with, i thought this might be a decent substitute....


i understand that its difficult, and it would be alot easier if i had formal education in japanese. But i do not. Because of my work schedule and my school schedule i have very little time to attend anymore classes....so im left with the option of "self-study" and thats what im going to do

i learn pretty quickly...last night i did not know hirigana, today i have memorized half of the characters and tonight i plan on memorizing the last half....(flash cards are "bomb")

i have a ton of training videos that i watch(to make up for my lack of class room instruction)...i listen to japanese lessons on tape while i drive....i have plenty of text books which i use


im not trying to learn the whole language from anime....that would be very very impractical....
im just trying to test myself and see what words phrases and sentences i can pull from the shows....

so plz recognize my initiative and deication, opposed to bashing the fact that i dont have the priveledge to attend a japanese class

Ah, sorry. Still, Wikipedia is your friend for learning Hiragana and Katakana.
I would watch some children's anime, though. I reckon that they use an easier vocabulary and more basic Japanese, seeing as they are for children, and you might learn a few things from it.

[cerrian]

Originally Posted by gh0stmice

so i need a series that speaks extremely slowly.....i can't stress enough when i say "EXTREMLY SLOWLY"....

it doesn't matter what its about....i really could care less, im just looking for some practice

...
...

i don't know anything about writing or reading characters or strokes, so if anyone finds something that will help me on writing and reading in japanese id also be very appreciative...which is more popular "hiragana or katakana"

Check out www.japanesepod101.com

They are a subscription based service, although they do have free stuff, and their stuff is tailored for those of us with busy schedules that want to learn it at our own pace.

If you subscribe to the basic service you'll have access to at least their audio lessons (done by native Japanese in normal speed, slow speed, and then broken down/translated speed) + transcrips (in kanji, kana, romanji, and english) + a bunch of other tools. IIRC, they've been producing 10-15 min lessons every work day for the last 3 years....so they have a sizable library now. One thing that I should acknowledge, they do something that other teaching services or sources don't, they spend a lot of time on informal, day-to-day, and slang language. They'll point it out and have a side discussion with their staff (who are all native Japanese) about the nuances of it and other quirky stuff.

On the link I provided above, there's a flash video at the bottom of the page that kinda gives you a tour of their services

[kjk8288]

Here's a good suggestion for u, save up money and go to japan. Where else a better place to learn japanese than japan itself? For someone with english as their first language, the grammar structure is way too different to learn just by watching anime.

[Irenicus]

Originally Posted by kjk8288

For someone with english as their first language, the grammar structure is way too different to learn just by watching anime.

Grammar can be learned anywhere; many a foreigner writes near-perfect English in terms of grammatical correctness.

What *can't* be learned from the textbooks and other resources are the nuances of the language, the accents, and the idiosyncrasies that break the grammatically correct textbook norm. English is, in fact, a prime culprit in this manner. Grammatically correct but "unnatural"-sounding English is one of the biggest problems a non-native user of English faces, thanks to the fact that "natural" English is as complicated as most languages and even more contradictory.

To achieve that final level of fluency, actually living in Japan is probably needed. It's also going to be easier to achieve an intermediate level of fluency if you are also in a "total immersion" situation like that.

Also, I'm probably the only one who questions the level of "challenge" a different set of fundamental approaches to language actually poses. Perhaps it's because English isn't my first language, but is now my primary language, and my first language is actually something entirely different to English in many of its concepts that I find it *normal* to face that challenge when you learn a different language. You Latin languages speakers are just complacent with your similar alphabets and your similar grammar.

And finally, anime isn't the best idea in general unless you are concurrently or better yet before that exposed to the language as it is actually used in real life. Simply put, just look at American cartoons: their way of speaking are drastically different to normal humanly use of English in many, many ways, most subtle but important. No, those VA's in their roles don't speak the most natural of Japanese, and you don't want to sound like a cartoon, so yeah.

It can be fun trying to watch an episode without subs on your own though.

[qtipbrit]

Originally Posted by kjk8288

Here's a good suggestion for u, save up money and go to japan. Where else a better place to learn japanese than japan itself? For someone with english as their first language, the grammar structure is way too different to learn just by watching anime.

First off, I doubt that a nineteen-year-old can easily afford to travel to Japan and stay there for an extended period of time.
Second, if you know very little Japanese, just going to Japan won't be particularly helpful, but after you've learned the basics, it would probably be the best way to continue learning the language.

Originally Posted by Irenicus

Also, I'm probably the only one who questions the level of "challenge" a different set of fundamental approaches to language actually poses. Perhaps it's because English isn't my first language, but is now my primary language, and my first language is actually something entirely different to English in many of its concepts that I find it *normal* to face that challenge when you learn a different language. You Latin languages speakers are just complacent with your similar alphabets and your similar grammar.

And finally, anime isn't the best idea in general unless you are concurrently or better yet before that exposed to the language as it is actually used in real life. Simply put, just look at American cartoons: their way of speaking are drastically different to normal humanly use of English in many, many ways, most subtle but important. No, those VA's in their roles don't speak the most natural of Japanese, and you don't want to sound like a cartoon, so yeah.

It can be fun trying to watch an episode without subs on your own though.

Ah, English is actually only partly Latin-based. There's a great deal of Anglo-saxon roots as well, that's why it's a difficult language to learn fluently, though it's a language that requires only a basic understanding for common usage, especially since we Americans often only use basic English when speaking.

And I agree that learning Japanese through anime isn't the best idea. You could probably learn a lot of vocab, some helpful phrases, maybe some slang, etc., but it won't actually help in learning the language's grammar and construction. Though I've spent a decent amount of time teaching myself the language, I will probably have to actually take some sort of guided classes to continue studying it.

[gh0stmice]

its an alternative to talking to somone else in japanese thou.....

i don't have a study partner, i dont have someone to practice with. so watching anime would be a way i would be able to practice by myself.

yea of course saving up money and going to japan would be nice.....but im currently a full time student working less than full time hours( so thats not a realistic expectation, at all)

i believe i would learn more practical japanese words if i were to pull it from some japanese shows opposed to reading the japanese dictionary. If i learned strictly textbook style, my japanese might become stiff and to formal, ie-like a foriegner coming up to you in america and saying "how do you do?", i think i might laugh my a** off if that happend. But if i have a nice combination of textbook knowledge and practical knowledge that will lead me to a well balanced japanese vernacular...

[geki~]

You can try watching Kamichama Karin. Himeka speaks very slowly.
You can watch a part of episode 2 here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GodeMlvnwPA

[Rembr]

Most animes are easy to understand. If you can't follow the basics of what goes on during any show, you should probably go back to the books again.