Mahou Senki Lyrical Nanoha Force Manga Discussion

[Zero Hurricane]

Originally Posted by Akiyoshi

Still hoping to see Cypha suffering a villanous breakdown, just sayin xD

But still, I also wanted it happened to her.

Originally Posted by 00-Raiser

The Hucks do care about each other, though, so they'd likely make a sacrifice for one of their own.

Well, they care about each other outside, but only care about themselves inside.

Originally Posted by Kuze

If making a sacrifice always involved knowing exactly who it was they were doing it for, what would charity be in this world? No, the Hucks wouldn't know any of those people. That doesn't make them statistics.

That's because in the Huck's head they can't distinguish between dispose life with the senseless sacrifice. Although they have high intelligence, but morally, they actually dropped sharply. They know they feel guilty, but their guilty buried deeply with their stubborn and egocentric nature.

Originally Posted by Akiyoshi

A fair possibility but i think it won't work that easily. the Hucks aren't like the numbers, even if Curren is their leader she didn't brainwashed Cypha, Veyron or Deville into being killers without knowing the meaning or consequences of doing that. the Hucks aren't innocent people in the slightiest(with the possible exception of Stella) most of them are young adults very concsious of their actions and situation around them, each one has demonstrated it on separate ocassions(Cypha and Fortis give a lot of exposition about what an Eclipse Driver is, Veyron is all snarky about his killings and Deville flat out reject Fate's "we can understand each other" speech arguing that isn't necessary). Even if Curren is the head of the opperation all of them have a lot of responsibilities to answer for.

They may be forgetting themselves who they really are. They may have their brains are not washed, but philosophically they seemed to be taught about the hatred in this world. Most likely, Curren was the one who taught them about it.

Originally Posted by Akiyoshi

Fate and the younger Numbers were spared in part thanks because they are below legal age at the moment while the Wolks received decent tratement because of their cooperative behavior and willingness to pay for their crimes.

It's because of their willingness to change. Fate admit her mistakes and be a friend to Nanoha, especially as she prepared to help her friend who was in danger. The Wolkies a companion to Nanoha and Fate for their willingness to admit mistakes they did. Some younger Numbers (except Sette) admit their mistakes. They want to help the Bureau solve JS Incident cases voluntarily, and the results, some of them finally become a member of the Bureau.

The problem concerning Huckies, the average of them was probably around 20 to 30 years (save for Arnage and Stella). They may be under control physically, but mentally, they are down. They know that killing is wrong, but in conscience and mind from the eyes of their hearts, as if it was sealed tightly by their hungry nature as beasts. In my opinion, almost all of them all has fallen completely into the darkness.

Originally Posted by Akiyoshi

As we're discussed before Stella have the best opportunity out of the Hucks to be forgiven.

Perhaps the "gift" worthy for Stella is a spank in her butt with high-voltage stun rod coated with anti Eclipse vaccines, maybe?

Given the Subaru has a friendly nature of all the children she met, Subaru could have dedicated to face the "ignorant child" on this one. Heh, just kidding.

[Akiyoshi]

Originally Posted by 00-Raiser

Still, leaders giving themselves up in exchange for lesser punishments for their companions isn't unheard of.

I agree with lesser punishments, but i really really doubt Curren's maneuver will manage to convince the TSAB to let the rest of the Hucks "free to go".

Originally Posted by 00-Raiser

Hayate: You're all under arrest!

Curren: Oh come on, we helped you save the day.

Signum: ... Five minute head start.

Somehow i like this ending xD.

Wait, if the Hucks get cured, that don't leave them powerless? ...well, de-eclipsed at least(i wonder what kind of magic style each one of them used to practice before their infections).

[00-Raiser]

Originally Posted by Zero Hurricane

Well, they care about each other outside, but only care about themselves inside.

And you base this statement on what? There's been nothing to suggest that they don't truely care about each other. Curren even outright threatens Hayate by saying if she seriously tried to harm the others she would have killed her.

[Akiyoshi]

Curren have a higher ground of thinking on that issue.

Also, Raiser is correct in that we don't know the details yet, from the point of view i understand from Raiser and his "survival instinct" stance, i think the Hucks care about each other mainly because it's easier to survive if you hang out with people who have the same goal/mindset. After all, it all comes down to survive, the moment some of them must decide between his/her own life and the lives of their companions i'm pretty sure they will choose their own lives and leave their companions behind. After all it goes with their "screw other lives, i want to live" suppossed philosophy.

[00-Raiser]

You're right about the grouping together thing. Strength in numbers, and who better to understand you than people in the same boat as you. Those bonds are strengthened when you add an "us vs them" element to it. They're like a tightly knit clique.

I don't necessary agree with your thought that they'd abandon each other if it came down to it. The "screw others" thing is, again, directed at masses of strangers that mean nothing to them. But when it comes to their family members it's different. Those people actually matter to them.

If your brother needs a new vital organ and you're the only viable donor, you'd probably agree to do it. But if you were asked to donate to a complete stranger it's far less likely you'd do it, especially if it resulted in your own death. Is anyone here a registered donor? And I'm not talking about in the event of your death.

I'm sure if there was no other choice, one of them would stay behind to fight off waves of opponents while the others escaped.

[Akiyoshi]

Probably but i'm talking about being confronted to a real life or death situation, so far the have the luxury of confronting very non-threatening opponents, so confront Hayate or anyone else on Section Six isn't even a real danger for any of the Hucks. I wonder who will be the ones to past the test among them when they really find them in a situation where one of them must put his/her life and the live of another Huck on a scale. According with the "law of nature" you mentioned, self-preservation is the ultimate goal and the main reason behind the Huckebein's amoral and sociopathic behavior. They accepted to be like that because they don't want to die, then why waste their so preciated lives? If Curren is to be believed there are more Eclipse Drivers out there so maybe you can still be able to find new companions, so why bother about it? Fortis getting upset at Tohma's noble sacrifice for the sake of others is a good example of this, for Fortis, sacrificing your live for others is such a stupid descicion that it managed to upset him. I don't know about Veyron or Deville's feelings but i can feel a selfish and traitorus vibe coming from him.

But well, that's a common thing with villain teams, they're bonded by their own ambitions(in this case their ambition to survive above anyone else). Usually all falls appart the moment one of the villains wants to gain more than the others and becomes a menace for the goals of the other members. Still, Curren seems to be a very charismatic leader so at least will be interesting to see how she manage to avoid this, she's in charge of a farm filled with selfish beasts ready to kill whatever(and whoever) necessary to preserve their own lives but somehow she managed to make them avoid biting each other. Wonder how long she will be able to mantain this.

Originally Posted by 00-Raiser

I'm sure if there was no other choice, one of them would stay behind to fight off waves of opponents while the others escaped.

Curren, Arnage or Deville probably, i don't see any of the others doing such a thing xDU

[Koveras Alvane]

Originally Posted by Akiyoshi

Somehow i like this ending xD.

Because that's totally ripped off from Justice League Unlimited.

[Akiyoshi]

Originally Posted by Koveras Alvane

Because that's totally ripped off from Justice League Unlimited.

I know it, Raiser gives Batman's line to the goddamn Signum xD

[00-Raiser]

I felt Signum's serious character would be the most fitting equivalent for Batman's.

[Akiyoshi]

Signum is the closest to Batman in terms of behavior while Teana have the closest approach to his "badass detective" method of crime-fighting.

[Zero Hurricane]

Maybe Fate close with the Superman, both of them are the heroes fight for greater good.

[Akiyoshi]

I see Nanoha more akin to Superman, she's popular(Ace of Aces), righteous, tends to impose their ways on her opponents from time to time(Supes "righteousness" makes him to look like a somewhat prepotent guy sometimes), wear USA flag colourset and is the most prominent heroine among her group.

[Demi.]

Fate can be Flash, aka The Scarlet Speedster. ^.^

[Endscape]

Originally Posted by Demi.

Fate can be Flash, aka The Scarlet Speedster. ^.^

Nah, she's not happy go lucky enough, Fate would be more Wonder Woman

[Keroko]

Originally Posted by itanshi1

Just keeping people abridged of my opinion of the discussion

Round and round and round we go!

Originally Posted by Kuze

Then let's just get this out of the way once and for all: What did you make of Reinforce asking to be killed, and Nanoha and Fate agreeing to it?

Or should Reinforce have had the right to live, at the expense of how many planets again?

That would be a decent ending, if not for us knowing that there is a cure in the works. It'd be like killing of Reinforce while knowing she could be fixed.

Originally Posted by Kuze

On the side, if you erase the virus with all of its homicidal "go postal!" feelings and mind screwery, then the Huckebein are no longer the Huckebein after the fact and are in fact completely different people with the memories of someone else. Or tl;dr, the Huckebein are dead then anyways.

Asking for what Eins got at least allows them to have some cognition of how utterly screwed up they are, and at least try to do something about it.

Depends, if it only erases the murderous sentiment, the parts of their more peaceful personalities we've seen will still be the same. They'd be changed, but not completely different people. I don't see why they would desire a death when they now essentially have a new life to explore.

[Demi.]

Originally Posted by Endscape

Nah, she's not happy go lucky enough, Fate would be more Wonder Woman

Meh, that works too.

[00-Raiser]

Wonder Woman can be pretty ruthless at times, though. She did snap Max's neck.

Maybe Fate would be Captain Marvel

Partial raws up at the usual place:

Spoiler:

I think Thoma went Pred-vision again, but Lily fixed it.

Fate and Cinque meet with this official looking dude who twirls his pen. Not suspicious at all.

Two guys who are Eclipse infectees are travelling around with the 5th Strosek. They don't treat her very well.

They start attacking some village but Arnage and Veyron show up to stop them. They fight, Arnage shows off a new form for her guns and Veyron apparently kills one of the dudes by blowing off his head. After questioning the 2nd guy, they execute him as well.

So now we know: head shots are lethal to Eclipse infectees.

Veyron and Arnage take the Strosek with them.

[Akiyoshi]

Can you PM'me the usual place?

Originally Posted by 00-Raiser

Spoiler:

So now we know: head shots are lethal to Eclipse infectees.

It's official now: Signum's a dumbass...

Spoiler for DU'H:

...you cut on the wrong place you moron xDU

[green-link94]

you know cypha blocked that attack well tried to.

[00-Raiser]

Upon closer inspection I think Veyron actually punched through the guy's head.