AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2016-10-02, 00:32   Link #61
FlareKnight
User of the "Fast Draw"
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Canada
Send a message via AIM to FlareKnight Send a message via MSN to FlareKnight
It really is always Germany. Considering we're making up countries anyways, couldn't we go and make someone else the antagonist here ?

The only downside was that Izetta didn't really get any lines. Screaming "Princess!!!" over and over isn't much to work with.

It was alright. The WW2 drama was solid and Fine was definitely a solid character. Probably will end up liking her more than the witch anyways. Gutsy and willing to risk it all for her people.
__________________
FlareKnight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 00:42   Link #62
Kazu-kun
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
I thought Fine was kinda one-dimentional actually. I would have liked to see some more fragility along with her determination, to make her a more rounded character. The way she's now, there isn't much room for development and growth.
__________________
http://forums.animesuki.com/images/as.icon/signaturepics/sigpic39230_3.gif
Kazu-kun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 00:46   Link #63
Incest Emblem
Onii-sama!
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yamada II View Post
Eylstadt doesn't have much to offer so Finč is offering herself to Prince Henry. She's that desperate to save her country.
This is actually not true. The Britannian ambassador was primarily interested in securing the machining know-how of one particular Eylstadtian company. It seems that their expertise was sufficient that the ambassador would have wanted Britannia to at least prevent it from falling into the Germanian hands.

It was not that Eylstadt did not have enough to offer to interest Britannia in the geopolitical game. It was that securing the expertise of an obscure foreign company would have been grossly insufficient to sell it to the public and to the MPs who are accountable to the public--and possibly facing re-election. This is the type of reason that the Prime Minster and the cabinet would be keenly interested--presuming that Eylstadt is really that advanced--but it would have been very difficult to convince the public to support going to ward to die when the benefits would not be seen in the homeland--except to enrich the executives and shareholders of a few manufacturing companies.

The reason is certainly simple compared to the real world geopolitical considerations that go into wars, but there is only so much that can be crammed into an anime series. I am quite glad that they offered advanced technology as the reason to entice the ambassador, with the political marriage only as a backup to sell the war to the public. Hopefully this is not merely the writers expending their load on the 1st episode, but call me interested.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlareKnight View Post
It really is always Germany. Considering we're making up countries anyways, couldn't we go and make someone else the antagonist here ?
Yes, we need more of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUcg_0ouMMU

It actually took me a while to recognize the character design, but for about half the episode I kept thinking, "Princess Asuna". It was pretty distracting.
Incest Emblem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 01:19   Link #64
LoweGear
Secret Society BLANKET
*Graphic Designer
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: 3 times the passion of the usual flamenco
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
I thought Fine was kinda one-dimentional actually. I would have liked to see some more fragility along with her determination, to make her a more rounded character. The way she's now, there isn't much room for development and growth.
I'd argue that that kind of viewpoint on character growth is one-dimensional, since it assumes that character development and growth is always a net positive given time. Who's to say that she doesn't encounter a situation in the future that really tests her determined yet kind nature, especially now since we know that she has an emotional connection to Izetta?

It's only really the first episode, give it time.
__________________

On Flying: "For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and there you will long to return."
LoweGear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 01:52   Link #65
Kazu-kun
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoweGear View Post
Who's to say that she doesn't encounter a situation in the future that really tests her determined
There's a different between a situation that is so tough it tests a character's determination and a situation that tests their determination because it force them to face a previously established character flaw. Overcoming toughs situations doesn't equal character growth unless there's some emotional flaw to overcome as well.

For example, I compared Fine to Nogi Wakaba, right?
Spoiler for nogi wakaba wa yuusha de aru spoilers:
Fine, on the other hand, reads like an static character to me. She had an entire episode to herself and all we saw were strengths and positive qualities. No character flaws or emotional weaknesses, no room for development whatsoever.
__________________
http://forums.animesuki.com/images/as.icon/signaturepics/sigpic39230_3.gif

Last edited by Kazu-kun; 2016-10-02 at 02:08.
Kazu-kun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 01:52   Link #66
Kismet-chan
The Chaotic Dreamer
 
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: In a cruel yet beautiful world
Age: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoweGear View Post
It's only really the first episode, give it time.
^This. There's but only so much they can show all at one given time. I personally can't recall any recent shows I've seen where a fully well-rounded character was introduced and established in its first episode...? Perhaps my memory's just failing me at the moment.

Not to mention that there have been plenty of good shows that started out with seemingly really flat, crappy protagonists who got tons of development as the show went on. Which was likely intentional (in some cases, at least), to put greater emphasis on the person they become by the end of it all. For a very recent example... look at Re:Zero. Is the Subaru of Episode 1 is a more well-rounded protagonist than Fine in this premiere episode? Noooooot really. And even though I continued to hate him up until the last episode, I can't deny from an objective level that he got a ridiculous amount of development. We only have this one episode to go off of right now, but with time, something similar be in store for Fine as well.
__________________
Kismet-chan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 02:27   Link #67
Gan_HOPE326
Maddo Scientisto
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: UK
So, I considered for a split second the possibility of this sharing an universe with Code Geass given the name-dropping of Britannia. However I think that's not very likely all in all - if I remember correctly, in CG the timeline diverged when Queen Elizabeth I DID have children, which led to the Hannoverian dynasty never seating on the throne of Britain, which means the US revolution never happened, but then the royals escaped to the American colonies as a consequence of being invaded by Napoleon. Namely, by the time WW2 rolls around, Britannia should actually be America, basically, and modern day Britain be part of "Thermidoria" (though the remarkably French-revolution tied name makes one think). In fact it'd be possible that it was Napoleon to unite Europe in a single state in that universe, since he obviously was more successful than IRL.

So yeah, I imagine it's off the table. Would have been somewhat fun though.
__________________
----
What if Goku was super smart and had a thing for philosophy? Find out in The Optimised Wish Project!
----

My other fanfiction can be found here.
Gan_HOPE326 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 02:34   Link #68
Incest Emblem
Onii-sama!
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
Fine, on the other hand, reads like an static character to me. She had an entire episode to herself and all we saw were strengths and positive qualities. No character flaws or emotional weaknesses, no room for development whatsoever.
Putting aside LoweGear's excellent observation that demanding a character develop from a weak person to a strong one over the course of a series is narrow-minded, let us address Fine on your own terms: the need to develop greater strength.

It is false that all Fine has shown us is strength, resilience, and determination.

Consider Fine through most of the episode: While she was on a covert diplomatic mission, she showed strength. This is entirely consistent with a beloved member of royalty who has been entrusted with secretly negotiating with a world power to secure military aid. Fine is not a sheltered princess. She is the crown princess, heir to the throne, and future head of state, trained--and presumably experienced--in foreign affairs. If nothing else, she has to put up a brave front for her people. It would have been foolish to show her as inept or timid in this context. Contrast this with Millia from Last Exile: Fam the Silver Wing: She did not know quite how to comport herself, because she was the 2nd princess and not expected to succeed to the throne, and she was suddenly thrown into exile. Fine is, quite frankly, a better way to introduce a princess--not a sheltered and spoiled brat but a trained statesman.

Contrast this with Fine after she saw Izetta awaken. Here is someone who reminds her of her presumably more carefree childhood. Here is an old friend to whom she might have shown her personal side. Here is a link to a less hostile past. Almost as soon as Fine recognized Izetta, she fainted. Certainly this is someone an entirely human reaction after many days of a continuous and harrowing journey. Here is the human side to her, when she does not need to act the role of the unwaivering leader. Here is the side of the normal human that the series can expand upon in later episodes.

It is plainly false to claim that Fine is a one dimensional character, even from what we have seen thus far. She is a fine character even if we demand that she shows weaknesses.
Incest Emblem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 02:46   Link #69
xrick
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Portugal
Age: 30
Kazu-kun, you should check news and the like for whatever series you decide to watch beforehand.
From what has been presented of setting, synopsis and PVs, the story has always been what Ep01 delivered. At least, to me.
It's been only 1 episode, try to keep an open mind, ok?
__________________
Looking for suggestions of Portuguese (of Portugal) Publishers that might have an interest in publishing a LN-style Original Novel Series.
xrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 03:09   Link #70
Faux Mecha
robot looks impractical
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Office Building, Shopping Mall
thanks to Code Geass i will forever associate Britannia with the American landmass based Holy Empire & their fabulous giant robots instead of the British Isles, so far Strike Witches has almost a similar Britannia to this but hey.
Faux Mecha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 04:35   Link #71
Harry Dresden
Paranoid Zebra
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Demonreach
Episode 1

In a dark and grim not-past of a not-WW2 torn not-europe an evil empire of not-nazis is threatening the rest of not-europe's nations like not-france. In such a political climate, "a hime samaaaa" is running against the clock in trying to preserve the fragile peace.

Yeah, this is very blatantly WW2, but for some reason the show avoided the real historical names. The atmosphere and the tone fits WW2, the politics are somewhat competent so far. The music fits WW2. Even the nations you can literally see through the fake names and see their real world counterparts. It works so well as a WW2 show that all the alt-history and magic stuff genuinely feels weird an jarring with the rest of the story. I can understand all the witch premise(especially with all the WW1-WW2 unlawful experimentation that was going on), but the change of names and stuff feels baffling. Maybe there's some "and then that and that happened altering course of history" kind of twist here? Who knows, but that is about the only reason I could see justifying the name changes.

The episode was adequate, albeit it could have been better directed at times. It still managed to capture the tone and establish the protagonist well enough. Fine is likeable and competent, capable of doing things without too much reliance on those around here and I can only hope that those kinds of qualities remains through the show and the show does not go down the repetition route of the witch having to save her again and again. The show has a strong set up for Fine as competent character, so hopefully she remains capable and independent.

Writing-wise it really feels like the show is struggling with trying to avoid anime-tropes, but unlike 91 Days, it does not always succeeds, so we still some questionable decisions, however while jarring, they don't impact upon enjoyment of the show too much.

Overall a very strong start. Hopefully show manages to keep up the level of quality this episode has and does not devolve into a mess like most other shows written by Hiroyuki Yoshino. If the show avoids it's pitfalls and manages to retain at least this level of quality it might as well be one of better shows this season.
Harry Dresden is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 06:04   Link #72
Darthtabby
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Dresden View Post
Episode 1 Overall a very strong start. Hopefully show manages to keep up the level of quality this episode has and does not devolve into a mess like most other shows written by Hiroyuki Yoshino. If the show avoids it's pitfalls and manages to retain at least this level of quality it might as well be one of better shows this season.
Despite his reputation in western fandom, very few of the shows Yoshino has been the lead writer for have actually devolved into messes. In fact several of the projects he's been a lead writer for have been hugely successful.

This article provides an analysis of some of his work.
Darthtabby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 06:48   Link #73
IceHism
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Huh, it was a cute episode I guess. Hayamin as main lead is always satisfying.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
True. But Fine is really just like Wakaba. Her hair, her eyes color, her boobs, everything. Even her personality is kinda like Wakaba too. That's not criticism though. I really like Wakaba. I wish I liked Fine as much.
I can see wakaba but I'm more reminded of either Asuna or Sonoko instead lol. Can't find anyone that izetta has similarities to at least.
IceHism is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 07:55   Link #74
Faux Mecha
robot looks impractical
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Office Building, Shopping Mall
i could have sworn there was a witch character who uses a gun as her flying broomstick before but can't seem to recall from what series was that, the cliche vacuum cleaners do not count by the way.
Faux Mecha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 08:41   Link #75
MeoTwister5
Komrades of Kitamura Kou
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Age: 33
Cute girls in a semi-fictional 20th century war with a mythology background. I was asking myself why it felt like I was watching a more action typed SoRaNoWoTo, and lo and behold it's the same screenwriter.

I loved this pilot, and the last half was fantastic. I don't really care that we got less than 5 minutes of the titular character because this was just the start of the show. Great music to boot and excellent animation. It has a nice setting for a serious magic meets 20th century combat so I REALLY hope it stays the course and avoids the tendencies of the other, witch-based shows it will ultimately gain comparisons to.

And as someone who loves SoRaNoWoTo to death I have very high hopes for this show.
MeoTwister5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 09:12   Link #76
Gravitas Free Zone
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Global Sword 2 View Post
i could have sworn there was a witch character who uses a gun as her flying broomstick before but can't seem to recall from what series was that, the cliche vacuum cleaners do not count by the way.
The oldest thing that came to mind was proto-Gainax's now-legendary animation for Daicon IV.
Gravitas Free Zone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 12:05   Link #77
Psyco Diver
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
I enjoyed the first episode, Fine comes off as a fine MC so far. Seemingly strong, smart and determined, I will watch the next episode for sure
Psyco Diver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 13:55   Link #78
SPARTAN 119
Unleashing the Homu-Rage
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Dresden View Post
Episode 1

Yeah, this is very blatantly WW2, but for some reason the show avoided the real historical names. The atmosphere and the tone fits WW2, the politics are somewhat competent so far. The music fits WW2. Even the nations you can literally see through the fake names and see their real world counterparts. It works so well as a WW2 show that all the alt-history and magic stuff genuinely feels weird an jarring with the rest of the story. I can understand all the witch premise(especially with all the WW1-WW2 unlawful experimentation that was going on), but the change of names and stuff feels baffling. Maybe there's some "and then that and that happened altering course of history" kind of twist here? Who knows, but that is about the only reason I could see justifying the name changes.
As for the name changes, I have no idea save for the butterfly effect, which doesn't make much sense to me as you would have to change things a lot further back than World War II to rename all of Europe, and at that point, you can't even say that there would ever be a conflict analogous to World War II, as you would have changed so much. Still, I suppose it's possible that the names for some reason changed, while the geopolitics remained similar.

As for the politics of this world, I notice some similarities, but also some differences as discussed below.

From Fine's conversations with the pseudo-British ambassador, it seems the Brittanians are largely the same as the real-world British, essentially a constitutional monarchy with a parliamentary system.

The Germans (or "Germanians" by the name they are given in the show) are less clear- there is mention of an emperor, perhaps an analog to the German Kaiser, suggesting they may have a political structure like World War I Germany, where power was (I think) divided between the Kaiser and Reichstag. On the other hand, it is also possible that in this alternate universe, the emperor took absolute power by feeding on postwar resentments in similarly to the rise of Hitler in real life.

Westria is based on Switzerland. It's name implies its location west of their Austria analogue, Eylstadt. They are similar politically to real-world Switzerland as far as their neutrality.

Elystadt is clearly Austria, given its location. Based on what little we've seen, it appears to be some sort of (presumably constitutional) monarchy from what we've seen, with Fine as a beloved figurehead, whose role in diplomacy seems to be more informal, but nonetheless having a major impact- as the British ambassador said, her marriage to their prince would not officially cement an alliance, but the royal family would definitely have pull in parliament. Interestingly, as of the Germanian invasion of Thermidor/France, Eylstadt/Austria has not been annexed, unlike in real life.

Thermidor, or France is pretty much a mystery. The only parallel we know for sure is that the name Thermidor is, in real life, part of a (failed) new calendar enacted after the French Revolution, so we can probably assume that at least still happened. Also, obviously, they were invaded by the Germanians, so were probably similarly unprepared for blitzkrieg tactics.

As are most of the rest of the world, it is safe to assume a US analogue, if it exists, and neutral at this point, much as in real life. I am also curious about what a Russian analogue is like- particularly whether or not they are a true analogue to the USSR, or if some other form of government exists. If alternate Russia is communist, the three most likely possible scenarios are either continued Czarist absolute rule (IMO the least plausible, realistically speaking, at least assuming some form of WWI analogue did take place), a constitutional monarchy of some description, or some form of socialist, but not full on communist republic.
SPARTAN 119 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 14:23   Link #79
Kakurin
私は影の国の女王、異境、魔境の主
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by SPARTAN 119 View Post
Elystadt is clearly Austria, given its location. Based on what little we've seen, it appears to be some sort of (presumably constitutional) monarchy from what we've seen, with Fine as a beloved figurehead, whose role in diplomacy seems to be more informal, but nonetheless having a major impact- as the British ambassador said, her marriage to their prince would not officially cement an alliance, but the royal family would definitely have pull in parliament. Interestingly, as of the Germanian invasion of Thermidor/France, Eylstadt/Austria has not been annexed, unlike in real life.
That's not quite correct. Eylstadt encompasses only the western Austrian provinces of Vorarlberg and Tyrol, which is a small part of Austria. The vast majority of Austria is shown to be Germanian.
__________________
Kakurin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2016-10-02, 14:31   Link #80
Tenzen12
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Darn Britannia! It seems they sold not-Czechoslovakia in this world too. I don't get why princess thought she could get better results...
__________________
"I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it" (Charles R. Swindoll)
Tenzen12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
magic, war

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:48.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
We use Silk.