Psycho-Pass - Episode 4 Discussion / Poll

[garbage]

^ ops sorry i didn't mean mastermind=main antagonist of the series , I meant mastermind=genius /brilliant diabolic plan maker :P. sorry wasn't clear on that.
but yes the leader was shown in the ep1 prologue, so he does seem to be the main antagonist of this arc at least. for the other definition ... he seems to be able to employ anti-psychopass detection headgear. and as you said those Dominator detectors, but we don't really know if it really is that hard to make such detectors in their society (i'll accept the headgear tho), debatable of course. And of course in their world it's pretty obvious Dominators are even better guages/badges of the "police" than their ID's.since we can at least be somewhat sure detectives and enforcers are the only ones authorized to carry them. That means any group/organization specifically aiming to go against them would do their best to have such detectors. basic yes?
As i've said IMO , not enough to show at the moment that they are "masterminds" (of the second kind)

Originally Posted by totoum

,the fact that law enforcement didn't even consider that such detectors can exist makes me think this might be the first group that has one

or it could just be incompetence...,as i've said before it's glaring how they can rely so much on 1 thing,1 weapon (Dominator) without even a back-up weapon. It might be they just never thought anyone would ever try to detect them by detecting their Dominators. Seems pretty normal to me, but yes it's a different world they are used to, a different breed of criminals ...guess we will know next episode.

I guess i'll be Latent Criminal in their world thinking like this ^^

[Lenneth4]

Did we saw already Spooky Boogie in the first episode ?

[Dark Wing]

Originally Posted by Lenneth4

Did we saw already Spooky Boogie in the first episode ?

I don't think so...

[Guardian Enzo]

Gen is the biggest name involved the star of the series for me thus far is the Animation Director and Character Designer Asano Kyoji, who’s worked in similar roles on Guilty Crown and GitS: SAC, among other series. The character designs and film noir sets are spectacular enough, but Asano-san really impressed this week with the most interesting virtual world I've seen since Summer Wars, full of spectacular avatars and surreal locations, which he brought to life in a RL meet-up in Roppongi that was just as impressively envisioned. Artistically this is great stuff.

We've certainly been down this road before with Gen. There don’t appear to be any clean hands in the story – the flaws in the dystopian establishment are clear enough, but he has little sympathy for the deviants it targets and the thrust of this arc is that those who seek escape through the virtual world are sheep being led astray by frauds and charlatans who prey on their desperate longing for the sake of their own egos. The fundamental bleakness of Gen’s worldview seems to come through in everything he does, and no one seems to suffer more than the pure of heart, who are punished dearly for their decency. What’s interesting is that the theoretical lamb in this den of wolves, Akane, doesn’t seem like such an innocent herself – she’s a wolf in sheep’s clothing, a bit of a rebel and someone who’s desperately longing for a way to give voice to the part of her that sees the system that created her as morally bankrupt. If there’s a bigger story that emerges from the little pieces, I expect that to be the spine of it.

[kk2extreme]

I don't like this future at all, you get shot just by going to a costume party...

[Terizent]

Originally Posted by kk2extreme

I don't like this future at all, you get shot just by going to a costume party...

Their crime coefficients weren't that high in the first place (only about 110 or 140). The rapist was over 300 and the robot guy was 265. And you have to take into consideration that it was a offline meeting of anarchists (or, at least supporters of Spooky Boogie's anarchist community) and the added surprise/stress when all their costumes were hacked at once, which startled most of the clubbers.

Also, as it has been said before, just being at the end of a gun would probably cause your coefficients to rise slightly.

[HandofFate]

I wouldn't be surprised if most anime fans CO or hue was above average lol.

Thought I was watching Accel World for a few moments this episode.

[whitecloud]

in this episode we're being given illustration of virtual world where the identity at internet is just as precious/important as real ID, as we see now in real life we are heading to that way as well with facebook and all.

so what do you guys think with the idea that somebody could assume your ID on the net and do activity despite your real ID is most likely "dead"...

i think it is scary, with us now essentially leading "double life" with there is us here and us on the net and there is essentially no possible way to know who is the one we're chatting with, is it the one we want to chat with or just a person impersonating the said person (unless maybe family, somebody close)..

can you imagine all sort of problem it could cause...

[Lenneth4]

Originally Posted by Dark Wing

I don't think so...

Ok
since she said she knew akane , or maybe i misunderstood

[Triple_R]

Excellent and fascinating episode. Probably my favorite Psycho-Pass episode so far.

I agree with Guardian Enzo on the creativity shown for the virtual world avatars. That was very well-done, and offers up a lot of possibly telling symbolism. For example, Ginoza's avatar being an American coin is an interesting and puzzling choice on his part.

What I'm going to do now is reflect a bit on the spicy, little details that Episode 4 gives us about the world of Psycho-Pass:

1) Talisman appears to be a much more colorful and futuristic version of advice columnist Ann Landers. And he must have been a very popular one at that given the audience he enjoyed in this episode, and the fact he was living in considerable comfort, due in no small part to earnings he made as Talisman.

But more pertinent is how many people in this world (even including government agents, like Police Inspector Akane!) feel the need to turn to anonymous advice-givers for the problems in their life. In a world where psychiatric health clearly counts for a helluva lot, it is pretty eyebrow-raising how there are barely any mental health professionals to be seen.

I wonder what that might say about the state of the mental health profession in the world of Psycho-Pass. Is the "therapy" offered in this world entirely automated and/or AI-driven? Are human psychiatrists considered obsolete? Or did Sibyl (and/or humans) determine that such a profession was too mentally dangerous for any human to enter into since it would put one at a severe, continuous risk of "contamination"? Or maybe they're just having a hard time finding people willing to risk that contamination, hence a shortage of mental health professionals.

Other viewers here have astutely commented on how the police force here seems a bit understaffed. Is that similarly because people tend to shy away from police and police-related professions because it would put you in contact with a lot of "contaminated" criminals? I can't help but wonder if one or more of these Enforcers are like that. Was Masaoka once an Inspector himself, who snapped one day, hence downgrading himself to an Enforcer? There's a certain calmness, confidence, and coolness to Masaoka that makes him really stand out amongst the other Enforcers, imo. And the way he dresses even has this "professional Inspector/Detective" feel to it.

Anyway, just throwing out a lot of questions here for consideration. It went a bit longer than I anticipated.


2) One new pro and one new con (although, both are debatable) arises about this world...

Pro: Extremely low unemployment rate. Akane was shocked at the very thought that a man in his 30s could be unemployed "in this day and age". Now, while Akane often comes across as having led a sheltered life until her current employment, it's notable here that nobody contradicted her over her statement. In other words, her statement was probably a largely accurate assessment of the world of Psycho-Pass - Whatever the unemployment rate is, it's extremely low. It may be as low as 1% or even lower.

Given how high unemployment is a problem currently vexing countries everywhere from America to Canada to much of Europe, I have a very hard time seeing exceptionally low unemployment as a negative. So I'm listing this as a pro, and I even wonder if part of this society's appeal to its own people is how it keeps people employed. I'm not sure what year Psycho-Pass is taking place in, but if it's not too far in the future, I imagine older generations in Psycho-Pass probably find this contrast comforting - "Given what the world was like when I was growing up, it's good to see a world where nobody has a hard time finding work".

Con: Strict surveillance society. "When a person goes out of their apartment, there's a record left in the street scanners" - Ginoza. Not the most comforting thought to me. In fairness, though, much of society is moving steadily and strongly in this direction (some schools having metal detectors on their doors, surveillance cameras all over the place in cities, etc...).

I'll admit that this is a bit of a subjective con, and others might not mind it so much. In any event, it does give us one reason why a certain someone may be a 1984 fan.


A couple more random notes:

- A lot of the criminals/victims so far have been single middle-aged men. The demographic is frequent enough that I begin to wonder if there's something to it.

- In fact, one thing that really stands out for me so far is the general lack of kids and teenagers in this show. What we're seeing is very much the adult world, and little else. That's quite different for anime.


Anyway, I'll leave it at that for now. Hope somebody found this an interesting read, at least.

[Kanon]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

I wonder what that might say about the state of the mental health profession in the world of Psycho-Pass. Is the "therapy" offered in this world entirely automated and/or AI-driven? Are human psychiatrists considered obsolete? Or did Sibyl (and/or humans) determine that such a profession was too mentally dangerous for any human to enter into since it would put one at a severe, continuous risk of "contamination"? Or maybe they're just having a hard time finding people willing to risk that contamination, hence a shortage of mental health professionals.

In episode, we saw a glimpse of the therapy session the victim from episode was undergoing, and there was a doctor with her, so it's not entirely AI-driven. I think humans are still very much in control of the Sibyl System and not the other way around. It would be very worrisome if only machines could psychoanalyze a person and pass judgement.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Other viewers here have astutely commented on how the police force here seems a bit understaffed. Is that similarly because people tend to shy away from police and police-related professions because it would put you in contact with a lot of "contaminated" criminals? I can't help but wonder if one or more of these Enforcers are like that. Was Masaoka once an Inspector himself, who snapped one day, hence downgrading himself to an Enforcer? There's a certain calmness, confidence, and coolness to Masaoka that makes him really stand out amongst the other Enforcers, imo. And the way he dresses even has this "professional Inspector/Detective" feel to it.

I think it's pretty obvious Masaoka used to be an inspector. What he told Akane in the first episode and then in this one strongly hinted at it. Futhermore, he is incredibly talented when it comes to detective work and as you said, he just gives off an "inspector" vibe. I think Kogami might be the same, what Masaoka said about him implied he used to be normal before he "stared at the abyss too long". He might have been involved in some very nasty case.

If it is indeed common for inspectors to downgrade to enforcers, then it would definitely explained why they are understaffed. Being labeled a latent is pretty much the worst thing that can happen to you in that world, so nobody would want to take such a risky job.

[Anh_Minh]

Yeah. I wonder if Ginoza's going to fall? The man seem very tense. That can't be good for his hue.

[Allium]

I found this episode weird at first, but it became more interesting as it progressed further. We have virtual reality and murder cases intertwined, with Akane, somehow, in the middle. Looks like this is going to be a longer case, and I didn't expect Shougo to show up that soon, so it seems things will start to pick up from here.

Other than the setting, we also get bits of information and hints on the characters. From Akane's conversation with Masaoka, we get a hint of Kougami's past, which is possibly linked to Masaoka's enforcer background as well. Episode 4 also carries forward the focus given to Ginoza in Episode 3, where we see him reacting strongly against the enforcers' methods. Like Guardian Enzo mentioned, Akane doesn't come off to me that innocent; there seems to be more to her than meets the eye.

At the moment, I can't tell which direction P-P is heading to, but it looks like it's going to be an interesting ride from now on. Things are beginning to build up, and it's only a matter of time before the blocks come tumbling down.

[Triple_R]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Yeah. I wonder if Ginoza's going to fall? The man seem very tense. That can't be good for his hue.

I have a vague theory that might relate to this.

Keeping with the theory that Masaoka used to be an Inspector, perhaps Ginoza was once to Masaoka what Akane is now to Ginoza.

Ginoza saw Masaoka do a lot of great Detective work. And then he saw Masaoka snap one day and get downgraded to a mere Enforcer. That's when Ginoza became the veteran Inspector in charge.

Maybe a part of Ginoza thought "Masaoka still has a smooth and effective mind for police work, so there's no reason why I should treat him as one of these mere hunting dogs. I'll continue to rely on him for advice."

And then, one day, that advice caused a case to blow up badly in Ginoza's face. So philosophically, Ginoza did a bit of an 180.


When Ginoza told Akane about "People learning from history vs. People learning from experience" back in Episode 3, perhaps Ginoza was speaking as "a person who learned from experience" himself.

So Ginoza now puts complete trust in Sibyl, and the way his society works. Because when he went against it (in treating Masaoka like a peer rather than a mere hunting dog), it blew up in his face. He doesn't want that to happen to Akane.


Also, at some level, Ginoza might be fearful that he's fated to end up like Masaoka, and that the only way to avoid that is to do things in strict accordance with the System.

You know, I wonder if the "Veteran Inspector, Rookie Inspector, Several Enforcers" setup is due to how "the Veteran Inspector" often becomes an Enforcer himself/herself. So it's a self-perpetuating system, ensuring that someone is always there at the ready to take over for the Veteran Inspector role if/when the current one "snaps" and becomes an Enforcer...

There are certain similarities between this and the Puella Magi system of Madoka Magica... so yeah, I can definitely see Gen going with this.

[Haak]

Gotta liked the way they brought in the virtual world/social networking elements, though it clearly wasn't an idealistic view of one. Typical Urobuchi Gen: Whilst Hosada pays tribute to the power of the internet, Gen decides to portray its darker elements.

Akane's fate was clearly foreshadowed when Masaoko said Akane's coefficient could becomes corrupted trying to understand Shinya but it's also possible that the reverse could happen since in this episode we clearly saw her giving a piece of her world view to the Enforcers. Though I guess that's being optimistic...

[Dengar]

Originally Posted by Triple_R

But more pertinent is how many people in this world (even including government agents, like Police Inspector Akane!) feel the need to turn to anonymous advice-givers for the problems in their life. In a world where psychiatric health clearly counts for a helluva lot, it is pretty eyebrow-raising how there are barely any mental health professionals to be seen.

I wonder what that might say about the state of the mental health profession in the world of Psycho-Pass. Is the "therapy" offered in this world entirely automated and/or AI-driven? Are human psychiatrists considered obsolete? Or did Sibyl (and/or humans) determine that such a profession was too mentally dangerous for any human to enter into since it would put one at a severe, continuous risk of "contamination"? Or maybe they're just having a hard time finding people willing to risk that contamination, hence a shortage of mental health professionals.

I do feel the need to point out that an advice columnist and a mental health expert really are two completely different things. I sure as hell wouldn't visit a therapist just for some problems I've been having with a coworker. That's more of a life's question than a mental health thing.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

Pro: Extremely low unemployment rate. Akane was shocked at the very thought that a man in his 30s could be unemployed "in this day and age". Now, while Akane often comes across as having led a sheltered life until her current employment, it's notable here that nobody contradicted her over her statement. In other words, her statement was probably a largely accurate assessment of the world of Psycho-Pass - Whatever the unemployment rate is, it's extremely low. It may be as low as 1% or even lower.

That's not too surprising to me. It's the logical result really. For everyday life stuff, the system is probably the most wonderful thing ever. What I wouldn't give to have some computer system tell me where my strengths lie. Then I wouldn't have wasted 10 years (and counting) searching for the right career.

[Quadratic]

Funny how I mentioned comparing the internet to the Sibyl system for the reason of original intent, but now it seems more comparable than that (though there are still obvious differences).
You can be tracked by surfing the net = flagged by street scanners
Antivirus program + data repair = Psycho-pass/Police/rehabilitation
IP spoofing = Impersonating another person (only on the net, though...).

Anyway, it's clear no one has still bothered to fix the internet in the future, so what does that mean for Sibyl?

And lol at Akane taking the shape of her jellyfish(?) creature as her avatar.

Originally Posted by Lenneth4

Ok
since she said she knew akane , or maybe i misunderstood

She knew Akane prior to their graduation since they had been in the same class.
Their paths diverged (order and chaos...?), yet both wish to dabble into the "other" side, perhaps because "justice" lies in the middle? We know what happens when you betray chaos.

Originally Posted by Triple_R

A couple more random notes:

- A lot of the criminals/victims so far have been single middle-aged men. The demographic is frequent enough that I begin to wonder if there's something to it.

- In fact, one thing that really stands out for me so far is the general lack of kids and teenagers in this show. What we're seeing is very much the adult world, and little else. That's quite different for anime.

There were 2 females "pure" victims (and maybe Akane will become another...).
Men are dirty criminals, females are angels! /joke

We also haven't heard of parents (eg. Kagari never said anything about his parents regarding being flagged a latent criminal at such a young age).

[Kaioshin Sama]

All the internet avatars in this episode were really great and creative. They almost make the AW/SAO ones from the summer look simplistic by comparison, more like costumes than avatars. I think my favorite is a toss-up between big head Akane and Liberty Kogami, but Spooky Boogie gets points for legitimately creeping me out.

So we've got a rather clever group going around and slowly but surely stealing and replacing avatars of influential people on the internet. I can see how that could eventually be highly problematic to the establishment since if you can use those peoples influence on the net but start planting your own ideas in other peoples heads it's possible to very quickly start a movement and if I had to guess this group is looking to foment anarchy and possibly start some sort of revolution. This looks big, possibly main plotline big that'll span the whole show but might not necessarily come up all in episodic order.

[klare]

a cool episode, competition in gaining popularity via virtual world should be common in the future, Akane's choice of avatar is very suitable for her

remember that white haired guy appeared in the first episode, most likely will be the final boss

oh i always knew blender is a very useful tool

[Cosmic Eagle]

So Mardock like, this ep...All those handle names plus Shougo somehow reminds me of Shell.

The team sent in to catch that otaku creep. They outnumbered him, yet only Akane went ahead when they could have followed her and remained in close contact without activating the Dominator. Close combat works well too you know...