(2018) Unknown Macross TV series News & Anticipation Thread

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by HirouKeimou

Spoiler for saving space:

Spoiler for This is off-topic at this point but I'll finish answering it anyway....:

I don't know enough about SEED (or its sequel); however, I'll argue I'm not talking about sequels! You're now bringing up Destiny and ignoring said fact. After all, in a competition of sequels, Macross has no direct sequels to any of its main series. To fans of Gundam like yourself, you could paint Macross in bad colors for not doing sequels but I'd argue it shows creativity and how its grown on each new entry and abandoned prior characters for new ones.

And 7, for its year, did alright. The fact, again, of Fire Bomber bringing cheer from fans of the franchise in general showcases how it's managed to gain an everlasting fanbase.

And I'll add here that overseas audiences are worthless counters here because Japan cares little about success overseas.



All those little points are your personal opinions on the movies themselves. The fanbase holds high regards (especially in Japan) for the movies of Macross. Do You Remember Love? is frequently brought up for its animation during its era and Plus' movie edition, too.

And FYI, Frontier's second movie is not a rehash/rewrite of the TV series' second half. The movie goes in a new direction entirely and ends on a painfully drearier side for all the protagonists versus its TV counterpart. And, arguable, it's commercial success is bigger than any Macross movie prior. (Ironically, I compare it sometimes to 00's movie because of its differences of endings for the main hero especially.)

You can love Gundam all you want but in my eyes it is not a very good franchise in general and all of its bad seeds glare spectacularly so if people believe Delta is so bad off, it's the first real blip Macross has really had as a franchise which has been made solely by the original studio (meaning Macross II does not qualify; and also, Zero is best described as marketing failure than plot issues because it's... pretty solid plot-wise).

----

And no, I'm not going to continue discussing this now. Not because I agree or disagree with your opinions; I'd simply care less about it and also believe we'll eventually attract mods because people consider this off-topic in this area (not that there is really a Macross/Gundam comparison thread...). So I'm dropping it now.

No, that's not my sole opinion on my post. Seed-Destiny (combined) being good means that more point for Gundam TV series. Gundam remakes movies that I mentioned before is also not a rehash entirely. Even the ending differs. And if you consider overseas fans worthless than that makes your argument even more questionable because Macross also thrive on overseas opinions. But hey, at this point, you don't listen to reason anymore, you just dislike Gundam, argument is futile.
.......

Now I'll go back to discussing the new Macross:

First, I hope there's no pressure to churn out as many series as possible coz that will really screw a series. Make one when you are ready to make one.

Second, they seriously need to talk things out with sponsors and other involved parties not to meddle much with the fixed script if it's already decided. Don't turn a movie into a series or vice versa. Plan things out better. Don't put too many cooks in the kitchen.

Third, needs more good use of a combination between valkyrie-battles, singing, and good main characters and good roles for them. Ditch the Love triangle if it's not necessary for the story.

Finally, my personal opinion, but I think Macross villains should be more otherworldly instead of copying human villains of other mecha series. That also makes more room for the protags to explore and develop their characters instead of being burdened with the obligation to develop the human-ish villains too if they're not up for it.

[HirouKeimou]

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

And if you consider overseas fans worthless than that makes your argument even more questionable because Macross also thrive on overseas opinions.

You misunderstood or misread me here:

Originally Posted by HirouKeimou

And I'll add here that overseas audiences are worthless counters here because Japan cares little about success overseas.

If Kawamori cared about overseas opinions, a new project legitimately would not be announced for a couple more years because of how negatively received Delta is for overseas fans.
(Also, if they did care, over here we've all been screaming for an official sub release of Frontier with no reply for years.)

It's very normal for Japan or any company to focus on the fanbase within their own country, and sales. Their concern for overseas fans is based on if it'll be worth sending their content in for a country to dub/sub it for release in their native tongue, that's it. Series which fail overseas don't always follow through in Japan; for instance, Guilty Crown has less negativity in Japan than it does overseas and gained an OVA. The OVA did not feature anything new in the area which sold best overseas, a.k.a. soundtrack, but Japan loved it.

The complaint on this isn't always Japan, though; you can attribute it to any country in general. If it fails overseas, they'll be less concerned than if it falls flat on its face in their own country.

Apparently, Delta sold enough within Japan for the Macross franchise to kick off a new TV series (unless other information reveals it's all planned ahead of time, which I'm biased about at this point). Kawamori believes enough in his fanbase in Japan that he has sold enough Blu-rays, albums, and merchandise so he can do a new project. The fact he's not falling on Aquarion, though... like he typically has once completing a new Macross ever since 2002... it's a big sign that Logos has not been received all too good in Japan too.

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

Ditch the Love triangle if it's not necessary for the story.

I don't know about this, because it's a stable piece for Macross each run; however, I'd love for a bit more focus on the Protoculture.

If there is a new alien species, let's focus on it more? Because, honestly, Frontier and Delta failed at really introducing new alien species. Aside from Windermere, Voldor had human-feline hybrids which are glossed over; and culture for their people is not really explained at all. Similar issue in Frontier, albeit less obvious, because Vajra culture is glossed over; eating fold quartz for survival, heart in belly, communicate via fold waves, and Aimo is love song--all good, but this does not tell us how the Vajra live outside of the hive mind or none of their habitat (in the TV series, the Queen lives on a barren rock field and in the movie she is in a crater surrounded by grass? excuse me, "summit" is a better word...).

I'm all for a new alien species as long as it's interesting...

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Apparently, Delta sold enough within Japan for the Macross franchise to kick off a new TV series (unless other information reveals it's all planned ahead of time, which I'm biased about at this point). Kawamori believes enough in his fanbase in Japan that he has sold enough Blu-rays, albums, and merchandise so he can do a new project. The fact he's not falling on Aquarion, though... like he typically has once completing a new Macross ever since 2002... it's a big sign that Logos has not been received all too good in Japan too.

By that argument, are you suggesting that Delta is the MOST successful Macross TV series ever, and that every other TV series are massive failures?

Because if you are saying the quick turn around is a sign of confidence, then you are directly suggesting 7, Fronter, and the first one too, are all "failures" for not spawning a brand new TV series two years later.

That's why I disagree with you. I believe from history, the franchise is meant to coax along for years between TV series. And that this sudden announcement is a vote of no confidence that claim Delta doesn't have sustainability in maintaining merchandise sales.

[HirouKeimou]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

By that argument, are you suggesting that Delta is the MOST successful Macross TV series ever, and that every other TV series are massive failures?

Because if you are saying the quick turn around is a sign of confidence, then you are directly suggesting 7, Fronter, and the first one too, are all "failures" for not spawning a brand new TV series two years later.

That's why I disagree with you. I believe from history, the franchise is meant to coax along for years between TV series. And that this sudden announcement is a vote of no confidence that claim Delta doesn't have sustainability in maintaining merchandise sales.

Not at all.
I'm only saying it sold enough for Kawamori, who did new things in Delta which are brave decisions, and now he is once again going with a bold decision of doing a new TV series within a year of the last TV series (has never been done for Macross prior).

See it as ambition or hopefulness on his side that if he continues on his "brave decisions" like he did with Delta by doing a new project right off the bat (and/or if planned ahead of time) that it could benefit him. Regardless if Delta sold like gold or not, it's all in his hopes of finding that "one thing" which will keep Macross, as a franchise, alive.

And I said eons ago that Delta did do risque things in terms of plot and sequences in the series which is... really "not Macross" but is all a sign he's trying to reinvent his franchise but more than likely is not entirely sold on how he could do it.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

It had been my belief that Macross is different from Gundam inherently, because it doesn't get a new series until those involved are sure they needed one. That they don't need to churn them out in rapid succession. That may be why I have negative feelings towards what they are doing, in that they are fundamentally changing how Macross is produced. And I have doubts that this is done because they think it would make a better end product. We have Sunrise proving repeatedly that rushed sequels suck.

[Obelisk ze Tormentor]

Originally Posted by HirouKeimou

You misunderstood or misread me here:

Your "overseas audiences are worthless counters" was a response to my "Macross 7 x Gundam Destiny" right? I mean, the point of my argument is this:
Macross 7: weak plot, generally loathed overseas, generally loved in Japan.
Gundam SEED Destiny: weak plot, generally loathed overseas, generally loved in Japan.

If you consider Macross 7 a good series (like in your comments), then I can say that Destiny is also a good series since both share similar traits. If Destiny is a good series then the combination of SEED+Destiny will make for a good series and that's a major plus for the Gundam TV series overall because it changed what many consider to be one of the worst series into a good series, and that means more edge for the "Gundam vs Macross" argument. We cannot have double-standard here.

Originally Posted by HirouKeimou

If Kawamori cared about overseas opinions, a new project legitimately would not be announced for a couple more years because of how negatively received Delta is for overseas fans.
(Also, if they did care, over here we've all been screaming for an official sub release of Frontier with no reply for years.)

It's very normal for Japan or any company to focus on the fanbase within their own country, and sales. Their concern for overseas fans is based on if it'll be worth sending their content in for a country to dub/sub it for release in their native tongue, that's it. Series which fail overseas don't always follow through in Japan; for instance, Guilty Crown has less negativity in Japan than it does overseas and gained an OVA. The OVA did not feature anything new in the area which sold best overseas, a.k.a. soundtrack, but Japan loved it.

The complaint on this isn't always Japan, though; you can attribute it to any country in general. If it fails overseas, they'll be less concerned than if it falls flat on its face in their own country.

Apparently, Delta sold enough within Japan for the Macross franchise to kick off a new TV series (unless other information reveals it's all planned ahead of time, which I'm biased about at this point). Kawamori believes enough in his fanbase in Japan that he has sold enough Blu-rays, albums, and merchandise so he can do a new project. The fact he's not falling on Aquarion, though... like he typically has once completing a new Macross ever since 2002... it's a big sign that Logos has not been received all too good in Japan too.

Not my point. Next...

Originally Posted by HirouKeimou

I don't know about this, because it's a stable piece for Macross each run;

At least don't let the love triangle become something that feels unnaturally tacked on or detrimental to the overall story.

Originally Posted by HirouKeimou

however, I'd love for a bit more focus on the Protoculture.

This, I agree.

Originally Posted by HirouKeimou

If there is a new alien species, let's focus on it more? Because, honestly, Frontier and Delta failed at really introducing new alien species. Aside from Windermere, Voldor had human-feline hybrids which are glossed over; and culture for their people is not really explained at all. Similar issue in Frontier, albeit less obvious, because Vajra culture is glossed over; eating fold quartz for survival, heart in belly, communicate via fold waves, and Aimo is love song--all good, but this does not tell us how the Vajra live outside of the hive mind or none of their habitat (in the TV series, the Queen lives on a barren rock field and in the movie she is in a crater surrounded by grass? excuse me, "summit" is a better word...).

I'm all for a new alien species as long as it's interesting...

I prefer them to focus on actual alien species that actually looks and feels alien. Please stop it with the cat-people and other tropy species. What is this? JRPG? We need more alien species & alien worlds that are never seen before. Not planets which are middle-east ripoff, iceland ripoff and Asgard ripoff (from Saint Seiya). I mean, this is supposed to be the far side of the galaxy yet they are using Norse names without even modifying them? Heck, they even used apples for the fruit that's supposed to be native from alien world! Where is the creativity here? Even I can come up with a made-up alien fruit without getting paid for the script. But the guys who were actually paid to write it came up with apples! Apples!! How lazy can they be?! They don't even came up with new-ish names like Zentradi or Protodeviln for the villains (they used the ordinary "Windermere" instead). And I think the Zolans and their parasitic/simbiotic pets are more interesting alien species compared to the discount-mermans in Delta (the less we talk about the cat-people the better). Lazy as heck. So yeah, more otherworldly-aliens (preferrably as villains) and less human-like aliens, please. This is not Star Trek, they can actually make a variety of imaginative and "out there" alien species without much budgetary constraints. But no, cat-people it is *sigh* I demand more creativity in the future Macross outings.

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

We have Sunrise proving repeatedly that rushed sequels suck.

In terms of Gundam, it looks like Sunrise actually learned something after the rushed Destiny. They let visionary writers & directors plan their Gundam series and Sunrise don't rush sequels anymore. Gundam 00 S2 & IBO S2 was pretty much planned ahead and resulted in a good outcome. But I dont know whether or not they have learned their lesson when it comes to Code Geass though. CG R2 was...not exactly good overall and the upcoming CG R3 looks like unnecessary cashgrab.

[ippus]

Originally Posted by obelisk ze tormentor

i prefer them to focus on actual alien species that actually looks and feels alien. Please stop it with the cat-people and other tropy species. What is this? Jrpg? We need more alien species & alien worlds that are never seen before. Not planets which are middle-east ripoff, iceland ripoff and asgard ripoff (from saint seiya). I mean, this is supposed to be the far side of the galaxy yet they are using norse names without even modifying them? Heck, they even used apples for the fruit that's supposed to be native from alien world! Where is the creativity here? Even i can come up with a made-up alien fruit without getting paid for the script. But the guys who were actually paid to write it came up with apples! Apples!! How lazy can they be?! They don't even came up with new-ish names like zentradi or protodeviln for the villains (they used the ordinary "windermere" instead). And i think the zolans and their parasitic/simbiotic pets are more interesting alien species compared to the discount-mermans in delta (the less we talk about the cat-people the better). Lazy as heck. So yeah, more otherworldly-aliens (preferrably as villains) and less human-like aliens, please. This is not star trek, they can actually make a variety of imaginative and "out there" alien species without much budgetary constraints. But no, cat-people it is *sigh* i demand more creativity in the future macross outings.

Thank. You.

[Tak]

But... but Obelisk!!! SDF pioneered green-haired alien babes, man! Windermere failed as a race when it proved unable to produce characters I could call oneesama and lick her foot!

Screw cat girls! Gimme a foxy lady! (and have her be voiced by Naomi Shindou in her native accent)

- Tak

[ippus]

Originally Posted by Tak

But... but Obelisk!!! SDF pioneered green-haired alien babes, man! Windermere failed as a race when it proved unable to produce characters I could call oneesama and lick her foot!

Screw cat girls! Gimme a foxy lady! (and have her be voiced by Naomi Shindou in her native accent)

- Tak

youonlysaythatbecauseyou'repositivelyjurassic

[Tak]

Originally Posted by ippus

youonlysaythatbecauseyou'repositivelyjurassic

*Drags ippus to the confession room*

And as punishment, yer gonna cosplay Milia...

- Tak

[magnuskn]

Well, I'm up for Macross 7-2 with Captain Alto and City Major Sheryl.

And Ranka as Sazapie

[BetoJR]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

Well, I'm up for Macross 7-2 with Captain Alto and City Major Sheryl.

I'd be all for that, myself.

[Darthtabby]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

Well, I'm up for Macross 7-2 with Captain Alto and City Major Sheryl.

Are you sure you want to see them engaging in petty bickering and acting like they hate each other?

I figure Alto and Sheryl's relationship might be a bit challenging at times, but I'd like to think its overall a happy one.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Darthtabby

Are you sure you want to see them engaging in petty bickering and acting like they hate each other?

Yeah, but if we are looking for a fun series, that'd be a major source of fun!!

- Tak

[magnuskn]

Happy couples normally are boring for television. While I'd also be happy to just see them in the background being happy, if they were to have any kind of storyline a bit of marital trouble after a few years would probably serve. Although I'm not sure if, to draw the analogy to Milia and Max further, Sheryl would pop out a dozen children.

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

Happy couples normally are boring for television. While I'd also be happy to just see them in the background being happy, if they were to have any kind of storyline a bit of marital trouble after a few years would probably serve. Although I'm not sure if, to draw the analogy to Milia and Max further, Sheryl would pop out a dozen children.

If it was up to me, they would have exactly one child, and it would be a boy who want to follow his dad into playing female roles in Japanese theatre.

[devilo96]

Gundam with okada=gundam series with death flag for ur favourite chara
Aquarion with okada=best girl will never win
And now if okada really join macross...just prepare ur heart

And what is macros delta? A food?
That series really mess up the last few eps(in term of plot and love triangle) at least the song is not really bad

[Gravitas Free Zone]

Originally Posted by magnuskn

Well, I'm up for Macross 7-2 with Captain Alto and City Major Sheryl.

And Ranka as Sazapie

The colony is landed. There's no way that anybody is going to keep Alto from flying through every nook and cranny on that planet, in everything from a VF-25 to a flying bicycle, three or four times over.

And while we're dispensing opinions, straight up series concept rehashes would bore the hell out of me.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Gravitas Free Zone

And while we're dispensing opinions, straight up series concept rehashes would bore the hell out of me.

While I appreciate new concepts like anyone else, one of the major reasons why I adore Frontier oh-so-very-much is due to the existence of good ol' ship-to-ship, fleet-to-fleet (both figuratively & literally) combat. Episode 24 of Frontier puts anything from Delta to shame.

- Tak

[Matts]

Originally Posted by Gravitas Free Zone

The colony is landed. There's no way that anybody is going to keep Alto from flying through every nook and cranny on that planet, in everything from a VF-25 to a flying bicycle, three or four times over.

And while we're dispensing opinions, straight up series concept rehashes would bore the hell out of me.

According to the VF 25 Messiah Master File Alto and Sheryl are actually touring together, in this book they describe Sheryl having a concert on Macross Olympia with Alto doing stunts. Ranka is also touring on her own.
http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...postcount=1210
I'm a nerd what can I say. In the Kiss in the Galaxy 4 manga he said they might break up for a short time but would end up together. At some point Kawamori even joked about their grandkids. You can find the translation online too (I actually own that volume myself).