General Eroge Impressions & Discussion

[Mazryonh]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Honestly... I think the port business is basically the same as it was back in the day, only the Platform of choice has changed. It was probably around the time that eroge anime adaptations started that people started realizing that porting 18+ games to all-ages/consoles was a good strategy because a) it could potentially release new audiences when tied to an anime/manga/etc., and b) people who really liked the original game would buy it again to get extra routes and/or the anime voice staff (as the case may be; Happiness had the same cast). I think the fundamental premise is still the same then and now, but the platform shifted from PS2 -> PSP (and some PS3) -> now PSV.

When exactly did the PSP craze for VNs start, anyway? I'm sure that at least one major developer hit it big by making VNs on portable gaming hardware, to the point that I'm sure many of them decided that it was no longer worth catering to the eroge players and just release VNs that were all-ages from the start, prompting everyone else to jump on the bandwagon.

Eroge anime adaptations usually had more famous seiyuus replacing the original 18+ version seiyuus to try and get more market appeal, assuming the original 18+ version even had voice clips; Kanon's and Utawarerumono's original versions weren't voiced to my knowledge, and games like Tsuyokiss and Princess Lover changed the seiyuus for their anime adaptations. I don't know when that trend ended and the original 18+ seiyuus started to move to the fore in the anime adaptations--I believe the anime adaptations for Happiness! and KimiAru were among the first to retain their 18+ version voice casts (though it's mainly the cast of the latter which has had mainstream success).

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

...In this case, I think they're banking a lot on nostalgia. Ko~cha's art has still held up pretty well over the years, and implementing the e:mote system gives it a new twist. So I think a straight port combining the two games in one SKU with upgraded graphics + e:mote plus a few nice bonuses/store extras will sell well enough to be worth the development cost. I know I'll probably buy it again, and even play at least some routes through again just out of nostalgia.

What's SKU stand for? Anyway, Ko~cha can't seem to draw very mature-looking characters to me, sadly. Eroge artists like Carnelian or Misaki Kurehito are a lot more proficient and versatile to me.

Please keep us updated on more details about the Happiness! re-make.

[relentlessflame]

Originally Posted by Mazryonh

When exactly did the PSP craze for VNs start, anyway? I'm sure that at least one major developer hit it big by making VNs on portable gaming hardware, to the point that I'm sure many of them decided that it was no longer worth catering to the eroge players and just release VNs that were all-ages from the start, prompting everyone else to jump on the bandwagon.

It basically started when PS2 became too old-hat for customers, but Sony et al didn't necessarily want a bunch of simplistic ports on the PS3. So, the PSP was the next best thing. It also meant that they could scale down the assets rather than up, which is less work, although in some cases they did have to come up with creative solutions for 16:9 cropping. I would say the switch from PS2 to PSP was probably happening in the 2008-2009 range. (ef was one of the last major PS2 ports I can remember, and that was 2010.)

Originally Posted by Mazryonh

What's SKU stand for?

Stock Keeping Unit -- I mean combining two products that were originally sold separately into one single product.

Originally Posted by Mazryonh

Anyway, Ko~cha can't seem to draw very mature-looking characters to me, sadly. Eroge artists like Carnelian or Misaki Kurehito are a lot more proficient and versatile to me.

Like all art styles, it's a matter of taste. I think that Windmill does a good job of creating games that complement the art style, namely worlds that are generally bright and colourful. That certainly doesn't take a way from the talent and skill of other artists, and game makers who also find ways to complement the story with the art.

[hyl]

Originally Posted by Mazryonh

Eroge anime adaptations usually had more famous seiyuus replacing the original 18+ version seiyuus to try and get more market appeal, assuming the original 18+ version even had voice clips; Kanon's and Utawarerumono's original versions weren't voiced to my knowledge, and games like Tsuyokiss and Princess Lover changed the seiyuus for their anime adaptations. I don't know when that trend ended and the original 18+ seiyuus started to move to the fore in the anime adaptations--I believe the anime adaptations for Happiness! and KimiAru were among the first to retain their 18+ version voice casts (though it's mainly the cast of the latter which has had mainstream success).

It's hard to say when it ended when adaptations of voiced eroges were not even that common before 2005. Besides H-animes the earlier ones that kept the original seiyuus were Green Green, Happiness, Lamune, School Days and To heart 2

[Cosmic Eagle]

Actually...mainstream seiyuu do CV for H-versions also. Just under pseudonym but obviously if it's the same voice on the CS version with their real names....

[hyl]

Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle

Actually...mainstream seiyuu do CV for H-versions also. Just under pseudonym but obviously if it's the same voice on the CS version with their real names....

Rarely. It's either that they did those roles before they were more wellknown (like Mizuhashi Kaori, Goto Yuko and many "beginner" seiyuus before they had a "break") or after they got less roles in the "mainstream" anime (like Shimizu Ai, Asakawa Yuu)

[Cosmic Eagle]

Originally Posted by hyl

Rarely. It's either that they did those roles before they were more wellknown (like Mizuhashi Kaori, Goto Yuko and many "beginner" seiyuus before they had a "break") or after they got less roles in the "mainstream" anime (like Shimizu Ai, Asakawa Yuu)

It's more common for male seiyuu it seems

[hyl]

Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle

It's more common for male seiyuu it seems

Even then, those more well known male seiyuus such as Norio Wakoto, Miki Shinichirou, Fujiwara Keiji don't appear all that much in eroges ( they usually voice supporting characters or antagonists in those stories ) because the central characters are most of the time the female heroines. Male protagonists are usually not voiced

[Cosmic Eagle]

You consider Junichi Suwabe, Maeda Takeshi, Yasumoto Hiroki etc well known?

[hyl]

Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle

You consider Junichi Suwabe, Maeda Takeshi, Yasumoto Hiroki etc well known?

Junichi Suwabe: who had 4 eroge roles in the last 2 years
Maeda Takeshi: imo barely has done any well known mainstream roles
Yasumoto Hiroki: hasn't done any eroge roles for the last 2 years

Any of these seiyuus that you mentioned have done less eroge roles in their whole career than let say Kiritani Hana in only 2013
edit: well Suwabe had slightly more than 26 roles in total, so i am wrong on that


The more known male seiyuus who do voice such roles take at best 3 roles in 1 year

[DorkingtonPugsly]

New Empress game's been announced! 5th project, the full reveal should be 1/31!Looking forward to it a lot.

[Mazryonh]

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

It basically started when PS2 became too old-hat for customers, but Sony et al didn't necessarily want a bunch of simplistic ports on the PS3. So, the PSP was the next best thing. It also meant that they could scale down the assets rather than up, which is less work, although in some cases they did have to come up with creative solutions for 16:9 cropping.

I don't know if the Keima-Katsuragi-types realize this, but PSP/Vita ports severely restrict the original artwork (assuming it was available on PC or an HD console to begin with). Take a look at these game CGs illustrated by Misaki Kurehito and Shinobu Kuroya from an eroge titled Suihei Sen Made Nan Mile.

Images

From the PC version

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Images

From the PSP version

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I think the difference should be obvious.

Originally Posted by relentlessflame

Like all art styles, it's a matter of taste. I think that Windmill does a good job of creating games that complement the art style, namely worlds that are generally bright and colourful. That certainly doesn't take a way from the talent and skill of other artists, and game makers who also find ways to complement the story with the art.

Windmill is definitely in the business of making "cute and moe" type of world and characters, then. It doesn't look like Ko~cha would be making much in the way of mature or dark characters; even the protagonist of Happiness! has an adoptive mother who looks childish.

Originally Posted by hyl

It's hard to say when it ended when adaptations of voiced eroges were not even that common before 2005. Besides H-animes the earlier ones that kept the original seiyuus were Green Green, Happiness, Lamune, School Days and To heart 2

To Heart 2 was a special case, partly because to my knowledge the all-ages PS2 port was released first (along with the anime to build hype) before the 18+ version was released on PC. I don't know of any other eroge title that had this release order.

Originally Posted by hyl

Even then, those more well known male seiyuus such as Norio Wakoto, Miki Shinichirou, Fujiwara Keiji don't appear all that much in eroges ( they usually voice supporting characters or antagonists in those stories ) because the central characters are most of the time the female heroines. Male protagonists are usually not voiced

This is because most ero-gamers don't care to hear (censored) noises from male seiyuus--as such, they aren't recorded most of the time. 18+ Otome/fujoshi gamers are the exception to the rule, of course. Hence, you get famous male seiyuus like Norio Wakamoto voicing minor roles in titles like Majikoi--they're not the ones making (censored) noises, after all. I have to wonder if Hiroshi Kamiya would have minded doing so for the Majikoi eroge series (he played Yamato Naoe in the Majikoi anime).

[hyl]

Originally Posted by Mazryonh

I don't know if the Keima-Katsuragi-types realize this, but PSP/Vita ports severely restrict the original artwork (assuming it was available on PC or an HD console to begin with). Take a look at these game CGs illustrated by Misaki Kurehito and Shinobu Kuroya from an eroge titled Suihei Sen Made Nan Mile.

I think the difference should be obvious.

And you are underestimating the psp for it's portability, each medium has it's own merits and demerits.
edit:
And if you wanted to make comparisons between CG's, then you should have atleast tried comparing the same 2 CG's

Originally Posted by Mazryonh

Windmill is definitely in the business of making "cute and moe" type of world and characters, then. It doesn't look like Ko~cha would be making much in the way of mature or dark characters; even the protagonist of Happiness! has an adoptive mother who looks childish.

Does that even matter in this case?

Originally Posted by Mazryonh

To Heart 2 was a special case, partly because to my knowledge the all-ages PS2 port was released first (along with the anime to build hype) before the 18+ version was released on PC. I don't know of any other eroge title that had this release order.

It was pretty much intended to get an 18+ version with that kind of seiyuu cast.
Little busters did a similar thing with bringing out an all ages version before a 18+ version.
Most likely Sengoku Koihime will follow that path as well seeing that it outsold any eroge last month as an 15+ game and that game has a stunning cast of very well known eroge seiyuus
The all ages Daitoshokan no Hitsujikai SD: Houkago no Shippo Days is also doing that, because the heroines from that game are getting H-scenes in the FD Dreaming Sheep

Originally Posted by Mazryonh

This is because most ero-gamers don't care to hear (censored) noises from male seiyuus--as such, they aren't recorded most of the time. 18+ Otome/fujoshi gamers are the exception to the rule, of course. Hence, you get famous male seiyuus like Norio Wakamoto voicing minor roles in titles like Majikoi--they're not the ones making (censored) noises, after all. I have to wonder if Hiroshi Kamiya would have minded doing so for the Majikoi eroge series (he played Yamato Naoe in the Majikoi anime).

What is your point on that remark? That's why i said these seiyuus were more likely voicing supporting characters or antagonists in my post. You are basically reconfirming what i said

[Mahou]

So~ I played a few routes Amatarasu Riddle Star. Well, first off: You need a huuuge degree of suspension of disblief as the fantasy setting is strong in this title. As a result miracle endings in one way or another are to be expected.
Nontheless, the VN feels lacking something in quite a few parts. I daresay that even the rabu-rabu couldn't quite make up for it and that says someone who can freaking love a VN with only rabu-rabu moments in it. The h-scenens may be its strongest part, though

Secondly, I played a bit into Ayame no Machi to Ohime-sama. It also left a rather average impression, but I love the ost of it. And from my memory, it's one of a few title with a lisping character in it *lol*. The drama in the route I played progressed in a narrative way which has been also rather uncommon based on my experience.

[blitz1/2]

Another Lass game being made? Yes!

[hyl]

Originally Posted by blitz1/2

Another Lass game being made? Yes!

The previous one (Shoujo Shin'iki , Shoujo Tengok) did fairly poorly though

[blitz1/2]

Originally Posted by hyl

The previous one (Shoujo Shin'iki , Shoujo Tengok) did fairly poorly though

I owe it to the lack of imouto love.

[hyl]

Originally Posted by blitz1/2

I owe it to the lack of imouto love.

Atleast Sana's route and the ending were different from than the other 3 routes, which were mostly the same

[Micchi]

Originally Posted by blitz1/2

I owe it to the lack of imouto love.

Be gentle with your imoutos!

[blitz1/2]

Originally Posted by Micchi

Be gentle with your imoutos!

Always was, that was why I was blaming Lass's game for lack of imouto loving for being the reason fir it's poor sales.

[Mahou]

On a slightly different note: There will apparently be an eventual adaption of Ushinawareta Mirai wo Motomete. I played the title a few years(?) ago and am not sooo sure if it's a great idea. The VN has a fixed route order and even ending order for each route and making this into an anime? Hopefully whoever picks it up finds a smooth way to do it.

Anyway, I played the trial of Koishiki Manual and had a fun time with it because if such a Riajuu test had been implemented in real life, I'm pretty sure that I would also have horribly failed at it And an okama as the teacher for the special riajuu class (more precisely, the class for those who scored the lowest at the test) is something you don't see very often .
-> So yeah, I light-hearted normal title please. And GLace, please I'd like more fitting bgm tracks. Timepiece Ensemble couldn't really transmit the right mood during its serious moments.