AnimeSuki Forums

darkmanure · 2012-08-30, 05:00

Kishi chose the hardest route since it retcon tons of stuff.

The 9 tail attack was a year after his suppose death and he's a grown man while Kakashi is still a teenager at age 14.

He gained all that knowledge about the birth of Naruto, how to control the 9 tails, and how to bypass the security in a year? Not to mention his skill. He was a complete moron before, now he's a genius fighter?

Then there is the change in character...

ronin myael · 2012-08-30, 05:13

why is kakashi taking the chuunin exams with obito and rin? he supposedly passed the exams when he was six years old, right? the guy is a prodigy! and then there's the hokage faces on the mountain that someone else pointed out earlier. minato was made hokage after the war not before or during. obito-tobi angle aside, this chapter is fucking up the timelines big time! does kishi reread his old chapters? he should, so he wouldn't leave plot holes like these no matter how small or insignificant they may be for some.

Destined_Fate · 2012-08-30, 05:16

Well, Naruto has been going in for awhile. I guess Tobi was never meant to be Obito but to make it work retcons had to be done...

Whitemoon648 · 2012-08-30, 05:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by itachi-san314

yea. this was another point in obito theory since it echoes the student teacher relationships we have seen in the past. it is very cool. slight differences are that sarutobi knew it was orochimaru, jiraiya sort of knew what was going on but it wasn't clear and nagato wasnt even present, and minato simply did not know who he was fighting which is a bit weird and makes me think there is more to tobi than obito since obito should have said something at least slightly insinuating. also differences are that sarutobi sacrificed himself, jiraiya was beaten and minato actually won even though the kyuubi forced his sacrifice eventually

Well at lest one person mentioned it back then when they were fighting

. My quote from chapter 502 ( when they fought) :

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whitemoon648

I thought it was Awesome. I always thought Minato was overrated ( specially) after Tsunade flash back that naruto has surpassed him and Jiraya.

But now It showed us how strong Minato actually was.

He defeated Tobi/Madara so easily and countered Kubi's blast with ease. Imagine Him against Pain. It would probably end so fast ( Of course with Minato winning *_*).

Minato is so much more interesting than Naruto. Plus he seems to be very intelligent. He thinks every think very thoroughly and seems to figure out other people's justsu's very fast. Something Naruto can not do.

Also Tobi's identity came up again. I think there are some hints that he might be Obito. He was acting very familiar with Yondaime ( as if he knew him very well/ As maybe teacher and students know each other? ) as well. So who knows. Tobi might actually not be Madara.

Back then i called it. Imo Kishi gave us the hints back then when they fought ( though maybe very subtle) slowly and bits by bits. Tobi was talking as if he knew Minato ( Knew his personality, ...). Also he was very familiar with his techniques and how to deal with him. An example is when he brought his chain out was probably to counter him. Only people who knew Minato that well could talk/fight against him like that. Though i must include that it wasn't just from that chapter alone. I think based on previous chapters/clues and how i felt about chapter 501 and 502 i reached that conclusion. The way they talked, fought, ... ( And hints from previous chapters as well) made me conclude that back then i think. More like it made me lean toward Tobi=Obito theory. At least that's what i think was my thought process back then. It's been a long time i don't know

. That said there is no guarantee yet that Tobi is actually Obito. I am waiting till next chapter. The way this chapter ended ( Imo) was kind of suspicious. I don't think Kishi has confirmed it 100 percent yet . Looking forward to chapter 600.
P.S. Also the link http://forums.animesuki.com/showthre...88#post3143188

.

solidguy · 2012-08-30, 05:44

So what about 'good boy' tobi?

Shay · 2012-08-30, 06:36

Couldn't Obito just have been Madara's apprentice? Making it Madara who fought Minato and then later on simply handed the Mask and his plans down to Obito before he died? Meaning Tobi = Madara and Obito just at different times?

I don't know anymore, I'm so confused with the timelines...

yakumo-chan · 2012-08-30, 06:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shay

Couldn't Obito just have been Madara's apprentice? Making it Madara who fought Minato and then later on simply handed the Mask and his plans down to Obito before he died? Meaning Tobi = Madara and Obito just at different times?

I don't know anymore, I'm so confused with the timelines...

that is impossible since Tobi was using Kamui when he fought Minato....

Anyways,,, You guys should stop asking questions anymore,,

Ever since the Character Obito was made, the character Tobi was already planned. You guys should always remember that. Kishi is not trolling... everything that happened to tobi was only made so that we dont believe that Tobi is Obito...

Everything will be explained in the next chapters...

HasuMasu · 2012-08-30, 06:51

This doesn't change anything, I feel the same way about the Obito theory now as I always have.

I still don't like it.

ronin myael · 2012-08-30, 07:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by yakumo-chan

that is impossible since Tobi was using Kamui when he fought Minato....

Anyways,,, You guys should stop asking questions anymore,,

Ever since the Character Obito was made, the character Tobi was already planned. You guys should always remember that. Kishi is not trolling... everything that happened to tobi was only made so that we dont believe that Tobi is Obito...

Everything will be explained in the next chapters...

you think kishi had this all planned out? then answer this, why is minato already a hokage when obito was only 11 years old? according to the kakashi gaiden arc that kishi himself wrote, minato was only a jounin when obito, kakashi and rin were 13 years old, that's two years after the chuunin exams. even the drawing of the hokage faces in the kakashi gaiden is proof that minato wasn't hokage yet but in this chapter he's already been made hokage as the hokage faces suggest. and what about kakashi taking the chuunin exams along with obito and rin when he supposedly passed the chuunin exams at 6 years old? kakashi graduated from the ninja academy at 5 years old, he became chuunin at 6 and became jounin at 13, around the time the kakashi gaiden arc started. minato was made hokage after the war. check the kakashi gaiden chapters or your naruto wiki, it's there. if you're so sure kishi planned all this then why did he fuck up the timelines? if he had this all figured out then there wouldn't be mistakes like these.

i don't really care about the obito angle. if kishi manages to wiggle his way out of his tight corner then fine! if he doesn't, i don't really care. i'll probably just enjoy reading the posts here and cracking jokes about them. but my beef is with this chapter itself. it's just wrong. i don't mind the no-dialogues thing except for the fact that it made kishi's mistakes more obvious since i focused more on the images. i'm sure i'm not the only one who noticed this. this is the reason why this chapter irks me.

Dengar · 2012-08-30, 07:44

He obviously forgot about some of the details (Minato already being the Hokage isn't even the biggest plot hole here). That doesn't mean he wasn't planning on it being Obito from the very beginning. In fact, nothing suggest that this wasn't his plan all along. He just... Made a bunch of mistakes in the executions. That I will not deny.

Quote:

Originally Posted by itachi-san314

this is another reason that i think madara's spirit is in tobi as well. there's just no plausible way itachi could be fooled by obito. he's been shown as the most deductive ninja ever. he should have been able to easily spot a madara impersonator with the exception of izuna. i just cant see obito pulling a fast one on itachi. having long hair isnt enough to cut it when trying to fool the main genius ninja of the series.

Maybe, ok? Maybe. Although truth be trold I'm skeptical. It's kind of hard to accept the "Madara's spirit is in Obito" theory since Madara's spirit is obviously in his revived body right now. Perhaps if it's a technique similar to Orochimaru's curse-mark. But that doesn't mean that Madara's directly controlling him. Then there's the fact that when Madara was revived, he had very little idea of what was going on. If it really was Madara's spirit in there, he should know more.

Shay · 2012-08-30, 07:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by yakumo-chan

that is impossible since Tobi was using Kamui when he fought Minato....

Anyways,,, You guys should stop asking questions anymore,,

Ever since the Character Obito was made, the character Tobi was already planned. You guys should always remember that. Kishi is not trolling... everything that happened to tobi was only made so that we dont believe that Tobi is Obito...

Everything will be explained in the next chapters...

That just means they both used Obito's eye. Swapping back and forth when the need required...

Hunter · 2012-08-30, 08:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by yakumo-chan

You guys should stop asking questions anymore

Yes, in fact this should be the official slogan of the Tobito theories.
It's all about truthiness, not messy facts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by milan kyuubi

Hunter you were completely right. You have some powers or what.

I predicted a 16 pages flashback with the reveal Tobi=Obito at the end whereas it ended up to be a 15 pages flashback with a double page Tobi=Obito at the end so to be fair I wasn't completely right.
There is no need for super-powers, it's quite simple really: you just have to try to imagine the worse and most boringly obvious outcome you can possibly think of and you'd be unsurprised how often you'll be right.

Mists · 2012-08-30, 09:22

Anyone else think Kishi messed up with the Hokage statues? There are 4 in this chapter while in Kakashi Gaiden the 4th wasn't drawn.

Still looking for an explanation before passing judgement. Would be bad@$$ if Kishi does another flashback quickly explaining the events and how they were possible, because things don't make sense.

Perhaps we can still be surprised....I thought Kishi trolled the idea, but so far it turned out lame, but it keeps us on the edge of the seat on how this is possible or what is the twist. Tobi was even trending on twitter lol

Endbo · 2012-08-30, 11:00

How come when tobi/obito takes a big Rasengan to the face, he still stands op, like it was nohting?. Before when naruto was a kid, he could take out kabuto with a resengan to the stomach.

Dengar · 2012-08-30, 11:03

Fighting spirit.

itachi-san314 · 2012-08-30, 11:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronin myael

you think kishi had this all planned out? then answer this, why is minato already a hokage when obito was only 11 years old? according to the kakashi gaiden arc that kishi himself wrote, minato was only a jounin when obito, kakashi and rin were 13 years old, that's two years after the chuunin exams. even the drawing of the hokage faces in the kakashi gaiden is proof that minato wasn't hokage yet but in this chapter he's already been made hokage as the hokage faces suggest. and what about kakashi taking the chuunin exams along with obito and rin when he supposedly passed the chuunin exams at 6 years old? kakashi graduated from the ninja academy at 5 years old, he became chuunin at 6 and became jounin at 13, around the time the kakashi gaiden arc started. minato was made hokage after the war. check the kakashi gaiden chapters or your naruto wiki, it's there. if you're so sure kishi planned all this then why did he fuck up the timelines? if he had this all figured out then there wouldn't be mistakes like these

oddly enough, those mistakes really have nothing to do with fitting obito into tobi's role. changing when kakashi got chuunin and when minato got hokage really don't matter. they are just mistakes. they dont deny the probability that kishi always intended tobi to be obito. just the timing of kakashi gaiden and tobi's entrance as well as his name suggest that kishi planned his identity out from the getgo.

kishi is human and humans make mistakes, especially after years in between of events they wrote. what i really dont get is how there isn't some kind of QC editor to catch things like this and raikage's arm. we all noticed instantly and could have told kishi before the release of the chapter. i dont really get why nobody caught this. especially in one of the most important chapters of the series

Dengar · 2012-08-30, 11:08

You know, I didn't even notice the 4th head. I just noticed that all the Jounins we know suddenly graduated together even though Kakashi should've been way ahead of the rest of his team.

james0246 · 2012-08-30, 11:12

^Unless those mistakes are intentional to show that Tobi is not Obito, but he/it thinks he/it is.

.

Ulquiorra · 2012-08-30, 11:42

I guess we can throw away those pesky databooks.

I for one like that Kakashi was much older when he became a chuunin.

felix · 2012-08-30, 11:44

The no dialog part is particularly fishy.

2012-08-30, 05:13	Link #222
ronin myael lost ronin Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: in the recesses of my convoluted mind...	why is kakashi taking the chuunin exams with obito and rin? he supposedly passed the exams when he was six years old, right? the guy is a prodigy! and then there's the hokage faces on the mountain that someone else pointed out earlier. minato was made hokage after the war not before or during. obito-tobi angle aside, this chapter is fucking up the timelines big time! does kishi reread his old chapters? he should, so he wouldn't leave plot holes like these no matter how small or insignificant they may be for some. __________________ "Sometimes you wake up. Sometimes the fall kills you. And sometimes, when you fall, you fly."~ Neil Gaiman (The Sandman)

2012-08-30, 06:36	Link #226
Shay Monarch Programmer Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Liverpool Age: 42	Couldn't Obito just have been Madara's apprentice? Making it Madara who fought Minato and then later on simply handed the Mask and his plans down to Obito before he died? Meaning Tobi = Madara and Obito just at different times? I don't know anymore, I'm so confused with the timelines... __________________ Current Anime - Attack on Titan Current Manga - Naruto Current Book - Waiting for War of the Roses Current Album - Vessel by Twenty One Pilots

2012-08-30, 06:51	Link #228
HasuMasu Senior Member Artist Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: The Middle Way	This doesn't change anything, I feel the same way about the Obito theory now as I always have. I still don't like it. __________________

2012-08-30, 11:44	Link #240
felix sleepyhead Author Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: event horizon	The no dialog part is particularly fishy. __________________

2012-08-30, 05:00	Link #221
darkmanure Member Join Date: May 2011	Kishi chose the hardest route since it retcon tons of stuff. The 9 tail attack was a year after his suppose death and he's a grown man while Kakashi is still a teenager at age 14. He gained all that knowledge about the birth of Naruto, how to control the 9 tails, and how to bypass the security in a year? Not to mention his skill. He was a complete moron before, now he's a genius fighter? Then there is the change in character...

2012-08-30, 05:16	Link #223
Destined_Fate Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: "Sacrifice one to appease the few."	Well, Naruto has been going in for awhile. I guess Tobi was never meant to be Obito but to make it work retcons had to be done...

2012-08-30, 05:44	Link #225
solidguy I'm not a tumor Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: In the dreams of beautiful women Age: 31	So what about 'good boy' tobi?

2012-08-30, 09:22	Link #233
Mists Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2004	Anyone else think Kishi messed up with the Hokage statues? There are 4 in this chapter while in Kakashi Gaiden the 4th wasn't drawn. Still looking for an explanation before passing judgement. Would be bad@$$ if Kishi does another flashback quickly explaining the events and how they were possible, because things don't make sense. Perhaps we can still be surprised....I thought Kishi trolled the idea, but so far it turned out lame, but it keeps us on the edge of the seat on how this is possible or what is the twist. Tobi was even trending on twitter lol

2012-08-30, 11:00	Link #234
Endbo Member Join Date: Aug 2007	How come when tobi/obito takes a big Rasengan to the face, he still stands op, like it was nohting?. Before when naruto was a kid, he could take out kabuto with a resengan to the stomach.

2012-08-30, 11:03	Link #235
Dengar Kamen Rider Muppeteer Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Unknown Age: 39	Fighting spirit.

2012-08-30, 11:08	Link #237
Dengar Kamen Rider Muppeteer Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Unknown Age: 39	You know, I didn't even notice the 4th head. I just noticed that all the Jounins we know suddenly graduated together even though Kakashi should've been way ahead of the rest of his team.

2012-08-30, 11:12	Link #238
james0246 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: East Cupcake	^Unless those mistakes are intentional to show that Tobi is not Obito, but he/it thinks he/it is. .

2012-08-30, 11:42	Link #239
Ulquiorra Inactive Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: https://t.me/pump_upp	I guess we can throw away those pesky databooks. I for one like that Kakashi was much older when he became a chuunin.