Aldnoah.Zero - Episode 23 Discussion / Poll

[setsunafseiei]

Originally Posted by Hidetoshi Nakata

Even if he beg for his life he would have killed.
Remember what he did with Trillram.

Nonono , you dont get it . Slaine is a complex and compassionate character he would not have shoot if Inaho have not retaliate . Heck even if he shoot its all for a good 'cause' .

Inaho is thorn on his path for him to achive his ultimate goal building a big water theme park on earth that is full of birds and blue roses .

[justinstrife]

Originally Posted by EternalSpringFlower

How does she know Lemrina is telling her the truth? She isn't very trustworthy. The maid couldn't have painted Slaine too dark because she obviously likes him.
Slaine was talking to Lemrina, not to Asseylum, why assume he was completely open and honest to her?
Asseylum never just asked him about it.

Asseylum doesn't know half of it.

Watching you spin and justify Slain's actions is truly painful to watch. Actions speak louder than words.

The Road to hell is paved with good intentions.

There are other quotes like this. They exist for a reason.

[EternalSpringFlower]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

Slaines statements and deeds are responsible for the need of the gun in the firrst place.

The statements which he gave to someone untrustworthy under questionable circumstances. The deeds with unclear reasons and equally unclear goals.

The only information she can trust is the information confirmed by her little maid, and that is the following: Slaine is continuing the war while rising in power and having Lemrina impersonate Asseylum. There can be a dozen theories built on this ground.

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

After all, actions speak louder than any pety excuse Slaine can deliver.

Slaine doesn't even think of himself as redeemable, he doesn't try to come up with excuses.

Originally Posted by vic-vic

You mean the dude who gleefully butchered Earth pilots, even those who clearly couldn't fight back, while taunting Slaine about this?

P.S. And Slalin's past manga reveal us that Trillram was a bully who tormented Slain

Don't you feel sorry for poor cute Trillram who was brutally and unjustly murdered by the power-hungry, blood-thirsty Slaine for no conceivable reason?

[Hidetoshi Nakata]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

Talking with Lemrina and her maid.
Talking with Slaine disguised as Lemrina.
Slaine made clear what he wants.


Slaine did what he did. His side of the story or just petty excuses are irrelevant because it doesn't change anything at all and nothing he sayes can justify what he did.

Eddelrittuo because she did not give this dramatic speech and wept in episodes 9 and 10, when she spoke to Asseylum and then along with Lemrina.,
dramatic crisis, only occurs episode 11.
We had 3 episodes, and she just opened her mouth in the second last.
Nor explained as Eddelrittuo, reached lunar base, and because she has changed so much for Slaine.
It can only be pressure VA
This can is related to the boycott of the Blu-Ray

[Hidetoshi Nakata]

Originally Posted by justinstrife

Watching you spin and justify Slain's actions is truly painful to watch. Actions speak louder than words.

The Road to hell is paved with good intentions.

There are other quotes like this. They exist for a reason.

Do not judge a book by its cover, but for its history.
Wolf in sheep's clothing

[monster]

Originally Posted by EternalSpringFlower

The deeds with unclear reasons and equally unclear goals.

What's unclear about it?

[lubczyk]

So, why would the Orbital Knights stop the war at this point? They have been in orbit since Heaven's Fall planning the takeover of Earth and it's resources for 15 years. They ignored the original order of the Emperor to return to Mars. They started the 2nd war right after Asseylum was attacked with no investigation. Even during Ray's temporary ceasefire, the Orbital Knights like Vlad continued to attack. Has the Emperor's death even been announced yet? Asseylum has yet to have her official coronation. The Orbital Knights would abandon their ambitions to acquire resources and expand their domains just because the new Empress said so? Even if they find out they've been lied to by Slaine, why abandon their efforts now? It wouldn't make any narrative sense.

[EternalSpringFlower]

Originally Posted by justinstrife

Watching you spin and justify Slain's actions is truly painful to watch. Actions speak louder than words.

I'm just trying to find the inner logic.

Imagine having one friend in the whole world while you were growing up. A single friend who was kind and loyal and told you fairytale-like stories. A friend whose gift you carried. A friend whose life you saved. A friend you deeply treasured. A friend whose name you screamed and moaned over and over while surfacing from a heavy almost deathlike sleep because... enter reason here.

And then you wake up and discover your friend is now Darth Vader and looks like death warmed over while you have no idea what happened when you were wounded. Would you care to find out what happened to him? What screwed him up that much? Would you be hurt and sad and worried and wanting to make him right again? Or would you shrug and say, whatever, it was nice to know you back when you were cute.

[Dauerlutscher]

Originally Posted by EternalSpringFlower

The statements which he gave to someone untrustworthy under questionable circumstances. The deeds with unclear reasons and equally unclear goals.

The only information she can trust is the information confirmed by her little maid, and that is the following: Slaine is continuing the war while rising in power and having Lemrina impersonate Asseylum. There can be a dozen theories built on this ground.


Slaine doesn't even think of himself as redeemable, he doesn't try to come up with excuses.

And that speaks for itself. Slaine clearly knows that he is in the wrong and won't make excuses. And with that Asseylum got the full picture.

Originally Posted by Hidetoshi Nakata

Eddelrittuo because she did not give this dramatic speech and wept in episodes 9 and 10, when she spoke to Asseylum and then along with Lemrina.,
dramatic crisis, only occurs episode 11.
We had 3 episodes, and she just opened her mouth in the second last.
Nor explained as Eddelrittuo, reached lunar base, and because she has changed so much for Slaine.
It can only be pressure VA
This can is related to the boycott of the Blu-Ray

There was no boucott.

[EternalSpringFlower]

Originally Posted by monster

What's unclear about it?

Why exactly did he start doing it? Did he have other routes to take and other choices to make or was his hand forced by other players or some kind of circumstances? What is his ultimate goal? How does he see Asseylum's part in all that? What was the opposite side doing, were they trying to make peace or were they also hostile all the time? Does he find this course of action desirable or satisfying or does he feel like he has no alternative means? Is he feeling good about himself? What exactly does he think about the new version of himself? Does he believe he can reach his goals? What is he planning to do with Vers after that? What was his original plan before the encounter in which Asseylum got shot? Is he happy doing what he's doing?

And that's just me typing for 1 minute without thinking much beforehand.

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

And that speaks for itself. Slaine clearly knows that he is in the wrong and won't make excuses. And with that Asseylum got the full picture.

Slaine never seemed to value himself highly, if anything that would have told her that he hasn't changed enough to think himself above all else.

[Dauerlutscher]

Originally Posted by EternalSpringFlower

Slaine never seemed to value himself highly, if anything that would have told her that he hasn't changed enough to think himself above all else.

You are making it more complicated than it really is.

Slaine did all this things. He had the chance to come clean and tell her his reasons even when it's clear that it won't change anything. But he did not and Asseylum has absolutely no reason to want to know all his possible petty excuses after what he did to her and the humans on earth. Case closed. So simple.

[monster]

Originally Posted by EternalSpringFlower

I'm just trying to find the inner logic.

Imagine having one friend in the whole world while you were growing up. A single friend who was kind and loyal and told you fairytale-like stories. A friend whose gift you carried. A friend whose life you saved. A friend you deeply treasured. A friend whose name you screamed and moaned over and over while surfacing from a heavy almost deathlike sleep because... enter reason here.

And then you wake up and discover your friend is now Darth Vader and looks like death warmed over while you have no idea what happened when you were wounded. Would you care to find out what happened to him? What screwed him up that much? Would you be hurt and sad and worried and wanting to make him right again? Or would you shrug and say, whatever, it was nice to know you back when you were cute.

If your friend is using your name to do something you feel is wrong, especially involving people's lives, then you would want to stop him first.

Originally Posted by EternalSpringFlower

Why exactly did he start doing it? Did he have other routes to take and other choices to make or was his hand forced by other players or some kind of circumstances? What is his ultimate goal? How does he see Asseylum's part in all that? What was the opposite side doing, were they trying to make peace or were they also hostile all the time? Does he find this course of action desirable or satisfying or does he feel like he has no alternative means? Is he feeling good about himself? What exactly does he think about the new version of himself? Does he believe he can reach his goals? What is he planning to do with Vers after that? What was his original plan before the encounter in which Asseylum got shot? Is he happy doing what he's doing?

Those are background/additional information that can be explored after a ceasefire has been achieved. Again, priorities.

The reason for his deeds remains clear in the way he stated it.

[janipani]

I think Slaene is perfect example of person who wants to proof himself in society he has been living his whole life disrespected by everyone. He isn't really one of Terra, but one of Vers, where being Terra of origin is lowest class you can be. And this is how you should understand his goals and backgrounds.

This works with all the immigrants who live closely connected to the new culture. They are not considered full members of the culture they live in, but they know even less about the culture of their origins. Therefore the people whose opinions matter to them aren't the people from their origins, but the people they have lived their whole lives with.

It's simple as that.

[EternalSpringFlower]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

Slaine did all this things. He had the chance to come clean and tell her his reasons even when it's clear that it won't change anything. But he did not and Asseylum has absolutely no reason to want to know all his possible petty excuses after what he did to her and the humans on earth. Case closed. So simple.

Her gun made it obvious she didn't care about his reasons.
And yes they could change things. He could have been forced into war. Like the old saying, if you can't avoid the fight, you have to win the fight.
It's even partially true because Slaine killed Saazbaum not just out of revenge or whatever but also because he needed to take control otherwise his situation was too risky and that included Asseylum's crystal coffin.

[Dauerlutscher]

You know, if a friend bangs your ass while you are in coma and when you wake up you get to know what he did to you and he will not even deny it, would you still consider him a friend? Would you want to know his reasons even when it's crystal clear that there is nothing that can justify what he did?

[Hidetoshi Nakata]

Originally Posted by janipani

I think Slaene is perfect example of person who wants to proof himself in society he has been living his whole life disrespected by everyone. He isn't really one of Terra, but one of Vers, where being Terra of origin is lowest class you can be. And this is how you should understand his goals and backgrounds.

This works with all the immigrants who live closely connected to the new culture. They are not considered full members of the culture they live in, but they know even less about the culture of their origins. Therefore the people whose opinions matter to them aren't the people from their origins, but the people they have lived their whole lives with.

It's simple as that.

They used something very similar to your description, a few years ago in MyAnimeList, the epoch they tried to justify the character Suzako the description was very alike.

[Dauerlutscher]

Originally Posted by EternalSpringFlower

Her gun made it obvious she didn't care about his reasons.
And yes they could change things. He could have been forced into war. Like the old saying, if you can't avoid the fight, you have to win the fight.
It's even partially true because Slaine killed Saazbaum not just out of revenge or whatever but also because he needed to take control otherwise his situation was too risky and that included Asseylum's crystal coffin.

Rubbisch.
He knows that she has every right to not care about his reasons.
All the things he did, he did them willingly.
Taking part in this war, planning a genocide, exploiting and betraying asseylum.

His reasosn are completely irrelevant. He did what he did.

No excuse he can make can justify what he did.

[EternalSpringFlower]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

You know, if a friend bangs your ass while you are in coma and when you wake up you get to know what he did to you and he will not even deny it, would you still consider him a friend? Would you want to know his reasons even when it's crystal clear that there is nothing that can justify what he did?

What if he saw it as the only way to save my life that was available?

[Dauerlutscher]

Originally Posted by EternalSpringFlower

What if he saw it as the only way to save my life that was available?

Genocide...

[Wolfpack]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

Well, it also means "Slaine deceived you. And can't deliver on his promises of activation rights." (Though he can, but I'm not sure how many know about Lemrina.)


He's likely to be prominent among the loyalists back on Mars. Marrying him will secure their support (especially necessary since Ray didn't progressively hand over power back when he himself was strong, the way he did with his son).

She doesn't say that though I guess that could be implied. Cruheto Jr. being popular hadn't occurred to me, but as a political angle it works. I'd believe if it was more his father's popularity than his own. Well that and Slaine's probably still the "filthy Terran" in many of the Knight's eyes so Cruheto Jr. is probably more preferable.

Originally Posted by fbi888

her engagement to cruheto was not to make her an 'effective' leader. it was more so to delegitimize slaine's authority over the knights. imagine the prideful royal knights following the orders of slaine with no power/royalty status, even if they want to conquer earth.

the princess is smarter than some of people here believe.

She has her moments, but it still seems a little abrupt. A little while ago "Asseylum" was marrying Slaine, but now she's marrying Cruheto Jr. How is it any different from what Cruheto Jr. pointed out in this episode about her suddenly changing her opinion would cause the Orbital Knights/citizens of Mars to lose faith in her?

I will acknowledge that he said her marriage to Slaine clinched the Orbital Knights loyalty, and that not all the prideful Orbital Knights might not want to follow Slaine now.

I just don't think she's lost that naivete she had since the first season. Then again, she's been in a coma so I guess she hasn't really had time to grow as an individual.

We'll see how much of an effect Asseylum's speech had next week. Likely, if the Knights abandon Slaine in his hour of need that'll be the end of his campaign, which given the episode count makes sense.

I'm still waiting to see if Slaine's endgame is really what he's preaching or if he has some kind of hidden plot like the destruction of the Orbital Knights via his campaign.